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The world without the US - 10/24/2016 1:14:47 PM   
tamaka


Posts: 5079
Status: offline 		An interesting read whether or not you agree with the religious aspect.

https://realtruth.org/articles/120416-001.html
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RE: The world without the US - 10/24/2016 1:23:09 PM   
thompsonx


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ORIGINAL: tamaka

An interesting read whether or not you agree with the religious aspect.

I find nothing interesting in a regurgitation of cold war rhetoric. the man is an ignorant moron. His claim that amerika "won" ww2 or the influence of the english language or his total ignorance of china all compound his fools epistle.

(in reply to tamaka)
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RE: The world without the US - 10/24/2016 1:52:03 PM   
vincentML


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tamaka

An interesting read whether or not you agree with the religious aspect.

https://realtruth.org/articles/120416-001.html

Thanks for posting this article. I agree it is quite interesting. I can pretty much agree with the descriptions of America's role in the world these past sixty-six years along with the comments about the beneficial role of English language nations (empires) But then, I am not a native under the yoke of the Raj. Caution has to be given to anyone who reads Robert Kagan without being aware of his NeoConservative imperialism. . . . spreading democracy by military action. China and Russia have historically been isolationist and defensive nations. Stalin was an exception I think. However, it is troubling to watch their current outreaches to the world. China in particular has enjoyed considerable success in Africa (that eternally plundered continent)

The inclusion of biblical prophecy in the latter half of the opinion piece was vomit inducing for me. Otherwise, the article would have had credibility.

_____________________________

vML

Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter. ~ MLK Jr.

(in reply to tamaka)
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RE: The world without the US - 10/24/2016 2:36:04 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline 		that guy is delusional when he talks about america being the great peace envoy of the world, when nothing could be further from the truth. They (and mama britian) started every war on the planet bar none to advance their agenda.

They started ww2 in conjunction with mama britain and then offered all the solutions at great profits and land grabs I might add.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sah_Xni-gtg



_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

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RE: The world without the US - 10/24/2016 3:13:53 PM   
freedomdwarf1


Posts: 6845
Joined: 10/23/2012
Status: offline 		I agree with thompson.

But I thought I'd just pick out just a few bits from the beginning...

Imagine a world with no United States. No cheeseburgers. No ice-cream sundaes. No McDonald’s. No Ferris wheels. No iPhones or iPads. No Hollywood, pop music, or blue jeans.

Let's see -
  • No cheeseburgers
    It is argued that the Germans invented the traditional 'hamburger', not the Americans.
    Did the Americans invent the putting a slice of cheese on top??
    Even if they did, I'm sure it wouldn't have taken someone else too long to do it.
    So nothing lost there then.
  • No ice-cream sundaes
    Ice cream (iced milk recipe) originated in China circa AD613.
    Over time, recipes for ices, sherbets, and milk ices evolved and served in the fashionable Italian and French royal courts.
    America didn't get it until late 17th century.
    The fact that your stupid pious pilgrims banned the selling of soda on Sunday forced them to serve a style of ice cream only on a Sunday and attached a name to it hardly puts the Americans at the forefront of ice cream invention.
  • No McDonald’s
    Many hate the 'greasy spoon' of burger bars.
    They are all independent franchises anyway and I'm sure the franchise owners would relish the ability to cater for other things not provided on the McD's restricted menu.
    Again, nothing much lost here.
  • No Ferris wheels
    Is that such a loss? Really??
    There are better rides out there than any Ferris Wheel.
  • No iPhones or iPads
    I hate i-anything. I really hate all Apple products and always have done since the brand was invented - and I'm not alone.
    Whatever they 'invent', someone else does it better and cheaper with more options than Apple.
  • No Hollywood, pop music
    I wouldn't miss it and I know many others that wouldn't.
    It also depends what you call 'pop' music.
    In its strictest sense, 'popular' music was around long before the US was discovered.
    Many would argue that the best pop music didn't come from the US.
  • No blue jeans
    Denim was around long before 'jeans'.
    Never liked them and never owned a pair.
    Who the heck would want to wear trousers made from tent canvas???

    And that's just the opening sentence!

    He later says: “…the United States has been the creator and sustainer of the current order of open trade and democratic government—an order that has been benign and beneficial for the vast majority of humankind.”
    Really?

    Open trade has been very popular since before the Romans.
    The Silk Road was also extremely popular for centuries from AD130.
    And, yanno, the king of the seas (yeah, Britannia, that tiny little island just off the European coast) was trading long before the Americas were discovered.

    As for 'Democratic government' claims.... ppfffftttt!!!
    The US is probably the worst style of democratic systems since democracy was invented (and that wasn't in the US).
    The US is one of the few democratic places in all of the OECD countries where most decisions are kicked down the road until there is no choice but to resolve it because of a deadlock.
    Many times the whole government has been stalled to a standstill.
    I wouldn't call that effective democracy.

    And now to modern times....
    Just about everywhere in the world where the US has intervened to 'help' a situation since WWII has been a complete and utter disaster.
    Many are blaming the US directly for the problems in Iraq, Iran, Syria, Libya and Afghanistan to name just a few.
    And on the home front, the US history of gun crimes/deaths is utterly deplorable.
    It is actually worse than some war zones - so nothing to be proud of.


    I'm not even going to address the rest of it - it's crap.
    And I didn't even get to the religious part of it.
    The whole thing is pure delusional fantasy.


    To address the title of the thread...
    A better, safer, more peaceful and amicable world.


    _____________________________

    “If liberty means anything at all, it means the right to tell people what they do not want to hear.”
    George Orwell, 1903-1950


    (in reply to tamaka)
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    RE: The world without the US - 10/24/2016 3:14:49 PM   
    bounty44


    Posts: 6374
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    quote:

    ORIGINAL: tamaka

    An interesting read whether or not you agree with the religious aspect.

    https://realtruth.org/articles/120416-001.html


    tamaka I think some claims to be the fulfillment of prophecy can be quite an interpretive reach to grasp.

    that aside, im surprised the author of this piece didn't mention dinesh D'Souza's recent book "America: imagine a world without her."

    I haven't it read it yet but I just recently picked it up at a book sale.

    if you like the sort of thing the author's talking about, you might enjoy "the light and the glory" by peter marshall.

    im reading a book right now called "the conservatarian manifesto" and the author, a brit, is discussing the tension between isolationism and interventionism.

    (in reply to tamaka)
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    RE: The world without the US - 10/24/2016 3:17:51 PM   
    bounty44


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    quote:

    ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1
    To address the title of the thread...
    A better, safer, more peaceful and amicable world.


    ruled by....lets see---stalin or hitler...take your pick.




    (in reply to freedomdwarf1)
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    RE: The world without the US - 10/24/2016 3:27:12 PM   
    tamaka


    Posts: 5079
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    quote:

    ORIGINAL: bounty44


    quote:

    ORIGINAL: tamaka

    An interesting read whether or not you agree with the religious aspect.

    https://realtruth.org/articles/120416-001.html


    tamaka I think some claims to be the fulfillment of prophecy can be quite an interpretive reach to grasp.

    that aside, im surprised the author of this piece didn't mention dinesh D'Souza's recent book "America: imagine a world without her."

    I haven't it read it yet but I just recently picked it up at a book sale.

    if you like the sort of thing the author's talking about, you might enjoy "the light and the glory" by peter marshall.

    im reading a book right now called "the conservatarian manifesto" and the author, a brit, is discussing the tension between isolationism and interventionism.


    Ok thank you for the suggestions. I'll check them out.

    (in reply to bounty44)
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    RE: The world without the US - 10/24/2016 3:30:24 PM   
    freedomdwarf1


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    quote:

    ORIGINAL: bounty44

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1
    To address the title of the thread...
    A better, safer, more peaceful and amicable world.


    ruled by....lets see---stalin or hitler...take your pick.


    Ruled by a democracy, not a dick-tater, dickhead.


    _____________________________

    “If liberty means anything at all, it means the right to tell people what they do not want to hear.”
    George Orwell, 1903-1950


    (in reply to bounty44)
    Profile   Post #: 9
    RE: The world without the US - 10/24/2016 3:31:23 PM   
    BamaD


    Posts: 20687
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    quote:

    ORIGINAL: bounty44

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1
    To address the title of the thread...
    A better, safer, more peaceful and amicable world.


    ruled by....lets see---stalin or hitler...take your pick.





    Either one would have collected our guns so that would be a good thing.
    But what woul he do without America to hate?

    _____________________________

    Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

    People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

    (in reply to bounty44)
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    RE: The world without the US - 10/24/2016 3:34:05 PM   
    BamaD


    Posts: 20687
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    quote:

    ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1


    quote:

    ORIGINAL: bounty44

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1
    To address the title of the thread...
    A better, safer, more peaceful and amicable world.


    ruled by....lets see---stalin or hitler...take your pick.


    Ruled by a democracy, not a dick-tater, dickhead.


    And here I didn't think you could be funny.

    _____________________________

    Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

    People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

    (in reply to freedomdwarf1)
    Profile   Post #: 11
    RE: The world without the US - 10/24/2016 3:47:19 PM   
    bounty44


    Posts: 6374
    Joined: 11/1/2014
    Status: offline     		"dickhead??"

    with that post im kinda moving him over to the vile critter parts and Thompson troll category...

    (in reply to BamaD)
    Profile   Post #: 12
    RE: The world without the US - 10/24/2016 3:50:58 PM   
    bounty44


    Posts: 6374
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    quote:

    ORIGINAL: tamaka


    quote:

    ORIGINAL: bounty44


    quote:

    ORIGINAL: tamaka

    An interesting read whether or not you agree with the religious aspect.

    https://realtruth.org/articles/120416-001.html


    tamaka I think some claims to be the fulfillment of prophecy can be quite an interpretive reach to grasp.

    that aside, im surprised the author of this piece didn't mention dinesh D'Souza's recent book "America: imagine a world without her."

    I haven't it read it yet but I just recently picked it up at a book sale.

    if you like the sort of thing the author's talking about, you might enjoy "the light and the glory" by peter marshall.

    im reading a book right now called "the conservatarian manifesto" and the author, a brit, is discussing the tension between isolationism and interventionism.


    Ok thank you for the suggestions. I'll check them out.


    my pleasure---I read the light and the glory years ago and really enjoyed it.

    ive only got 30 pages left in the book im presently in, when im finished, i'll start reading D'Souza's book and post some things here from it.

    im pretty sure he also had a movie made from the book.

    (in reply to tamaka)
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    RE: The world without the US - 10/24/2016 4:24:27 PM   
    dcnovice


    Posts: 37282
    Joined: 8/2/2006
    Status: offline     		FR

    Given that the U.S. is just 240 years old, there's a fair bit of history as to what a world without it was like.

    _____________________________

    No matter how cynical you become,
    it's never enough to keep up.

    JANE WAGNER, THE SEARCH FOR SIGNS OF
    INTELLIGENT LIFE IN THE UNIVERSE

    (in reply to bounty44)
    Profile   Post #: 14
    RE: The world without the US - 10/24/2016 4:42:36 PM   
    Real0ne


    Posts: 21189
    Joined: 10/25/2004
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    quote:

    ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1


    quote:

    ORIGINAL: bounty44

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1
    To address the title of the thread...
    A better, safer, more peaceful and amicable world.


    ruled by....lets see---stalin or hitler...take your pick.


    Ruled by a democracy, not a dick-tater, dickhead.




    yeh a PARLIMENTARY DEMOCRACY, which means the rulers vote amongst themselves, its a BIG CLUB AND YOU AINT IN IT!

    and its the same big club they have in england.

    and please dont tell me you get to vote for your nre rulers, hence that is why its a democracy, that not the reason, I just gave the reason and it has nothing to do with the voting public, except they are clueless about gubmint structure.



    _____________________________

    "We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

    Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

    Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

    "No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

    (in reply to freedomdwarf1)
    Profile   Post #: 15
    RE: The world without the US - 10/24/2016 4:47:44 PM   
    bounty44


    Posts: 6374
    Joined: 11/1/2014
    Status: offline     		that's a nice segue into what I was going to post anyways from the book im reading, but just before that, as to what life in the world was like for the most part (prior to global powers/particularly England early on), to paraphrase hobbes, "it was poor, nasty brutish and short."

    cooke's (the conservatarian manifesto) contention is that America was more or less thrust into the position of global power/influence by the tolls taken on Britain by WWII.

    "given the longevity of british-american power, it is tempting to imagine that international affairs exist naturally in their current state: that, as a matter of course, the seas open, global trade is protected, and the worst instincts of anti-western actors are kept in check. sadly, this is not the case. were the united states to disengage from the world in a serious way, someone else would almost certainly step in to fill the void. would we like them? almost certainly not. who, I like to ask anybody who gripes about American hegemony, would you wish to see instead? china? Russia? france? and which of our previous adversaries do you wish were still around to balance America out? the soviet union? the ottoman empire? the romans?"

    he quotes Rubio saying "think high taxes and regulations are bad for our economy", they should wait until they see "global instability and the spread of totalitarianism."

    "'a world without US primacy," the political scientist Samuel huffington wrote in 1993, 'will be a world with more violence and disorder and less democracy and economic growth than a world where the US continues to have more influence than any other country in shaping global affairs. The sustained international primacy of the US is central to...the future of freedom, democracy, open economies and international order in the world.'" --p206-7.

    < Message edited by bounty44 -- 10/24/2016 4:49:29 PM >

    (in reply to dcnovice)
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    RE: The world without the US - 10/24/2016 5:08:16 PM   
    BamaD


    Posts: 20687
    Joined: 2/27/2005
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    quote:

    ORIGINAL: bounty44

    "dickhead??"

    with that post im kinda moving him over to the vile critter parts and Thompson troll category...

    Took you long enough.

    _____________________________

    Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

    People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

    (in reply to bounty44)
    Profile   Post #: 17
    RE: The world without the US - 10/24/2016 5:35:07 PM   
    freedomdwarf1


    Posts: 6845
    Joined: 10/23/2012
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    quote:

    ORIGINAL: bounty44

    "dickhead??"

    with that post im kinda moving him over to the vile critter parts and Thompson troll category...

    What did you expect when your only offering were two long-dead dictators and I was referring to democracy??


    _____________________________

    “If liberty means anything at all, it means the right to tell people what they do not want to hear.”
    George Orwell, 1903-1950


    (in reply to bounty44)
    Profile   Post #: 18
    RE: The world without the US - 10/24/2016 5:48:51 PM   
    Real0ne


    Posts: 21189
    Joined: 10/25/2004
    Status: offline     		you dont seriously think that a so called democracy is incapable of operating precisely as a dictatorship?

    _____________________________

    "We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

    Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

    Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

    "No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

    (in reply to freedomdwarf1)
    Profile   Post #: 19
    RE: The world without the US - 10/24/2016 5:52:06 PM   
    BamaD


    Posts: 20687
    Joined: 2/27/2005
    Status: offline
    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Real0ne

    you dont seriously think that a so called democracy is incapable of operating precisely as a dictatorship?

    If the people are sheep, like in the UK.

    _____________________________

    Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

    People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

    (in reply to Real0ne)
    Profile   Post #: 20
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