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RE: Why do raceplayers get so much crap from everyone - 12/28/2016 2:26:16 AM   
longwayhome


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quote:

ORIGINAL: NerdsThunderCat

Pedophilia or paedophilia is a psychiatric disorder in which an adult or older adolescent experiences a primary or exclusive sexual attraction to prepubescent children.[1][2] Although girls typically begin the process of puberty at age 10 or 11, and boys at age 11 or 12,[3] criteria for pedophilia extend the cut-off point for prepubescence to age 13.[1] A person who is diagnosed with pedophilia must be at least 16 years old, but adolescents must be at least five years older than the prepubescent child for the attraction to be diagnosed as pedophilia.[1][2]

Pedophilia is termed pedophilic disorder in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM-5), and the manual defines it as a paraphilia involving intense and recurrent sexual urges towards and fantasies about prepubescent children that have either been acted upon or which cause the person with the attraction distress or interpersonal difficulty.[1] The International Classification of Diseases (ICD-10) defines it as a sexual preference for children of prepubertal or early pubertal age.


Although it's a bit legalistic, that will do perfectly well as a description of paedophilia for me.

I just don't see the problem with the distinction between having an age play kink and being a paedophile. One involves enjoying being in a parental or child-like mental space with another person with complementary needs/desires; the other involves having a actual child as the explicit object of your sexual arousal.

There is as big a gap between those two as between any number of forms of play, such as rape play (and actual rape), enjoying physical abuse in a consensual context (and being beaten at home or in the street non-consensually) and race play (and treating people of other races in a derogatory or discriminatory way in "real" life").

I get that people may find age play, rape play, consensual violence and race play disturbing, based on their individual histories or preferences, but it is surely the ability to understand the distinctions between consensual activity and abuse that is the bedrock of BDSM.

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RE: Why do raceplayers get so much crap from everyone - 12/28/2016 2:40:11 AM   
longwayhome


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quote:

ORIGINAL: NerdsThunderCat

I am no longer a raceplayer because of all the kink shaming I had to deal with. Also it is soo much stress on a relationship to have to be kinky, and hide your kink for other kinky people. in fear of rejection and being cast away .


even more on my mind tho .... what makes people believe it's ok to engage in verbal raceplay with some who just. Simply Announced that they are interested in that sort of kink. like why is it so much more of a taboo, and a huge portal for abuse from strangers?

And something I feel is almost impossible to get other people of color to understand or not judge?


I had an ex-girlfriend who took great joy from having a white "fuck-boy" and engaged quite heavily in what I could only call race play with me.

That came from a place where we were both deeply culturally aware and respectful of each other's history and identity. There was therefore a level of humour and irony in it but not always.

I think that people just miss all the subtlety and assume that there is an underlying prejudice in any situation. The truth is that because discrimination and prejudice is an everyday part of life, you cannot entirely ignore it in your personal relationships or else they become false and shallow.

Understanding those dynamics as an observer of a relationship or play situation is difficult and made worse by the taboo, but there are things other than race play which people do which mess with taboos as well. I suppose if you mess with a taboo, you can expect some kind of fall out, even from within the supposedly non-judgemental BDSM community.

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RE: Why do raceplayers get so much crap from everyone - 12/28/2016 2:49:26 AM   
Greta75


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quote:

ORIGINAL: NerdsThunderCat

Pedophilia or paedophilia is a psychiatric disorder in which an adult or older adolescent experiences a primary or exclusive sexual attraction to prepubescent children.

It's only a psychiatirc disorder because it involves underage kids. IF this was some kink, for example, like race play, which does not involve underage kids. It wouldn't be classified as a psychiatric disorder.

I mean, many pedophiles who may enjoy the kink of fucking little kids can have self-restrain because it's against the law. They don't have to act on the urge.

As with anybody. Just like people with rape fetish can have self-restrain to actually not rape a woman.

Just like gay people in countries where being gay is illegal and against the law will have to self-restrain from not fucking their own gender.

Some countries even consider it a psychiatric disorder that needs psychiatric treatment.

I mean there are actually official government approved therapy to "ungay" yourself, especially if you are living in countries where being gay is illegal. And guess what? If you broke the law, you are going into jail and therapy to fix your "psychiatric problem". Which is what happens to Pedophiles.

So Pedophilia is illegal. Natural to be listed as a psychiatric disorder. Doesn't mean it is not a kink.




< Message edited by Greta75 -- 12/28/2016 2:55:05 AM >

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RE: Why do raceplayers get so much crap from everyone - 12/28/2016 4:52:48 AM   
DocStrange


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

quote:

ORIGINAL: DocStrange

No, The consensus is that kink for little kids is not a kink. It is illegal, immoral and wrong.

But so is the kink for rape. And the kink for slavery.
I'd argue those are illegal, immoral and wrong. But in BDSM, we find consensual adults to play out those kinks, so that they can be legal. That is the basis of BDSM, and why it is taboo, because IT IS filled with illegal, immoral stuffs!

I mean some of those bruises on some of those women, could be criminal offences, IF they reported their dominant inflicting those on them!

I'd also argue that encouraging Pedophiles to play out their fantasies or kink on legally aged women who look like little kids and are sized like little kids, WILL discourage them to aim for real little kids.

It should actually be encouraged as a BDSM kink for them to have an outlet to play it out, rather than repress it and then actually harm a real kid.

Besides Dizzy is a mom herself of a baby. In no way is she saying people with Pedophilia kinks should indulge in underage kids. But to say it's not a kink is being dishonest. To me, it is a kink too!



Greta,
I have been extremely clear on this. A kink for little kids is not a kink. Age play between consenting adults is a kink. I already said that early on. Dizzy's editing purposely left that out of her response.

Similarly, Rape is not a kink. Rape play between consenting adults is a kink.

Slavery is not a kink. Slave play between consenting adults is kink.

I have no problem with fantasy play between consenting adults. Whether that be Nazi interrogation, Mother/son, Aunt/nephew, Black owner/white slave, White owner/ black slave, Doctor/patient, Nurse patient, Adult baby, or insert you favorite role play scene. But that is not what was stated by Dizzy. Dizzy is playing a word game and she could easily have stated any time the play was between consenting adults. But she has chosen not to. So I will re-iterate that a kink for little kids is not a kink.



< Message edited by DocStrange -- 12/28/2016 4:53:39 AM >

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RE: Why do raceplayers get so much crap from everyone - 12/28/2016 5:25:06 AM   
ThatDizzyChick


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quote:

I have been extremely clear on this. A kink for little kids is not a kink.

Yes, so you have said, and yet you have been unable to explain why that is.
quote:

Dizzy is playing a word game and she could easily have stated any time the play was between consenting adults.

No she is not, it is you that is. You may want to take note of the fact that Dizzy never said anything about play of any sort, you added that detail, so you could pretend that the kink in question required actually physically interacting with little kids. Which it doesn't. Here, lets take the Wkipedia entry for Kink (sexual) shall we?
quote:

In human sexuality, kinkiness is any unconventional sexual practices, concepts or fantasies.

Please take note of the last three words there. So, obviously play is not required.

And equally obviously there is no law against concepts or fantasies of any sort, so the criminality of child abuse also has no bearing on it either.

Now lets look at a dictionary, shall we?
quote:

bizarre or unconventional sexual preferences or behavior.

http://www.dictionary.com/browse/kink

Again note the word "preferences". Once again no play is required to have preferences, and there are no laws against preferences, so you are going to have to come up with some other flimsy excuse to exclude it as a kink.

But really, you shouldn't waste your time, because the simple fact of the matter is that you are wrong, and a "kink (bizarre or unconventional sexual preference) for little kids" is indeed a kink, by definition, and you refuse to "respect the kink", and thus Dizzy is, in fact, 100% correct, and has been all along. The whole idea of you respecting other people's kinks is indeed just bullshit peddled by the "community" to make themselves feel better about themselves, because you clearly do not respect all kinks, only the ones that don't make you too uncomfortable.

Thank you for playing along at home, but next time, save yourself a lot of time and angst and do just what Greta did; pay attention to what has been said.

< Message edited by ThatDizzyChick -- 12/28/2016 5:29:05 AM >

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RE: Why do raceplayers get so much crap from everyone - 12/28/2016 5:27:54 AM   
NerdsThunderCat


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Status: offline 		Read what it says a pedophile is again


Please and then explain to me how

Taking part in a kink for consenting adults

Has anything to do with the wanting of a prepubescent child


Now if you want to make that the point then I believe that pedophilia or pedophile is the wrong word and maybe

Ephebophilia because in some cases it can be done with consenting early adults


But what I believe makes a difference is that a pedophile is unable to enjoy a sexual act with anyone who is not of the early to mid prepubescent pieord of their life b or earlier

That is what makes it wrong and why it's listed as a mental illness because it requires someone to need a child sexually for their own sexual gratification





The word pedophilia comes from the Greek: παῖς, παιδός (paîs, paidós), meaning "child", and φιλία (philía), "friendly love" or "friendship".[20] Pedophilia is used for individuals with a primary or exclusive sexual interest in prepubescent children aged 13 or younger.[1][2] Nepiophilia (from the Greek: νήπιος (népios) meaning "infant" or "child," which in turn derives from "ne-" and "epos" meaning "not speaking"), sometimes called infantophilia, is a sub-type of pedophilia; it is used to refer to a sexual preference for infants and toddlers (ages 0–3 or those under age 5).[9][21] Hebephilia is defined as individuals with a primary or exclusive sexual interest in 11- to 14-year-old pubescents.[22] The DSM-5 does not list hebephilia among the diagnoses; while evidence suggests that hebephilia is separate from pedophilia, the ICD-10 includes early pubertal age (an aspect of hebephilia) in its pedophilia definition, covering the physical development overlap between the two philias.[13] In addition to hebephilia, some clinicians have proposed other categories that are somewhat or completely distinguished from pedophilia; these include pedohebephilia (a combination of pedophilia and hebephilia) and


ephebophilia (though ephebophilia is not considered pathological)

And this is I believe because it can be done with consenting young adults by definition 18-19 yearolds would be a targeted group of people for a ephebophila and would make it not against the law and gives a "paedophiles" of that title (ephebophila) a warm place within. Kink


Because it's with adults who are consenting


And no I don't feel gay people are Ill and need help


But for the classes of "pedophile who need to be sexually gratified by small prepubescent children or infants toddlers anyone under the age of 18 and I'll even go as far to say 1u because in most places in the world I believe that is a year more than the age of consent they need help not treatment but maybe to try and evolve into ephebophila vs pedophilia and I'd gladly welcome them in to kink

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RE: Why do raceplayers get so much crap from everyone - 12/28/2016 5:33:41 AM   
ThatDizzyChick


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quote:

Please and then explain to me how

Taking part in a kink for consenting adults

Has anything to do with the wanting of a prepubescent child

There is no need for consenting adults for there to be a kink, the existence of an unconventional sexual preference is sufficient for a kink to be a kink, and a preference requires only one person and consent has no bearing on a preference.

I will say it one more time: Pay attention.

< Message edited by ThatDizzyChick -- 12/28/2016 5:34:26 AM >

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RE: Why do raceplayers get so much crap from everyone - 12/28/2016 5:39:20 AM   
ThatDizzyChick


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quote:

a pedophile is unable to enjoy a sexual act with anyone who is not of the early to mid prepubescent pieord of their life b or earlier

I suggest you read your own definition.

let me help you.
quote:

individuals with a primary or exclusive sexual interest in prepubescent children aged 13 or younger.

quote:

it is used to refer to a sexual preference for infants and toddlers

please note the bolded words. Thus it is clear that it is indeed possible that a given pedophile can enjoy a sexual act with anyone at all. Not all of them, but some of them, and thus your statement is incorrect.

You really, really do need to pay attention, not only to my words, but also to your own.


< Message edited by ThatDizzyChick -- 12/28/2016 5:40:26 AM >

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RE: Why do raceplayers get so much crap from everyone - 12/28/2016 5:41:25 AM   
NerdsThunderCat


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Ephebophilia
Ephebophilia is the primary or exclusive adult sexual interest in mid-to-late adolescents, generally ages 15 to 19.[1][2] The term was originally used in the late 19th to mid 20th century.[2] It is one of a number of sexual preferences across age groups subsumed under the technical term chronophilia. Ephebophilia strictly denotes the preference for mid-to-late adolescent sexual partners, not the mere presence of some level of sexual attraction.

In research environments, specific terms are used for chronophilias: for instance, ephebophilia to refer to the sexual preference for mid-to-late adolescents,[1][3] hebephilia to refer to the sexual preference for earlier pubescent individuals, and pedophilia to refer to the sexual preference for prepubescent children.[3][4] However, the term pedophilia is commonly used by the general public to refer to any sexual interest in minors below the legal age of consent, regardless of their level of physical or mental development





This I find interesting

The term ephebophilia comes from the Ancient Greek: ἔφηβος (ephebos) variously defined as "one arrived at puberty", "a youth of eighteen who underwent his dokimasia and was registered as a citizen (Athens)", and "arriving at man's estate"; and φιλία (-philia) "love".[6] It has been used by Dutch psychologist Frits Bernard as far back as 1950,[7] and reprinted in 1960 in the gay support magazine Vriendschap under the pseudonym Victor Servatius,[8] crediting the origin of the term to Magnus Hirschfeld with no exact date given.[9] The word was in fact first used in French (éphébophilie), in Georges Saint-Paul's 1896 book, Tares et Poisons: Perversion et Perversité Sexuelles.[10]

The term has been described by Frenchman Félix Buffière in 1980,[11] and Pakistani scholar Tariq Rahman,[12] who argued that ephebophilia should be especially used with regard to homosexuality when describing the aesthetic and erotic interest of adult men in adolescent boys in classical Persian, Turkish, or Urdu literature. The term was additionally revived by Ray Blanchard to denote adults who sexually prefer 15- to 19-year-olds

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RE: Why do raceplayers get so much crap from everyone - 12/28/2016 5:43:17 AM   
ThatDizzyChick


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quote:

And no I don't feel gay people are Ill and need help

So some sexual preferences are fine and natural, and others are illnesses. I don't suppose you could explain the criteria by which you make that determination?
How about a sexual preference for animals?
Or a sexual preference for shit?

Are those illnesses?

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RE: Why do raceplayers get so much crap from everyone - 12/28/2016 5:44:00 AM   
NerdsThunderCat


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Status: offline 		I said that I believe that they can't I can believe what I want to and have any opinions just. As the people who choose to look down on my choice of kink

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RE: Why do raceplayers get so much crap from everyone - 12/28/2016 5:45:56 AM   
DocStrange


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDizzyChick

quote:

I have been extremely clear on this. A kink for little kids is not a kink.

Yes, so you have said, and yet you have been unable to explain why that is.
quote:

Dizzy is playing a word game and she could easily have stated any time the play was between consenting adults.

No she is not, it is you that is. You may want to take note of the fact that Dizzy never said anything about play of any sort, you added that detail, so you could pretend that the kink in question required actually physically interacting with little kids. Which it doesn't. Here, lets take the Wkipedia entry for Kink (sexual) shall we?
quote:

In human sexuality, kinkiness is any unconventional sexual practices, concepts or fantasies.

Please take note of the last three words there. So, obviously play is not required.

And equally obviously there is no law against concepts or fantasies of any sort, so the criminality of child abuse also has no bearing on it either.

Now lets look at a dictionary, shall we?
quote:

bizarre or unconventional sexual preferences or behavior.

http://www.dictionary.com/browse/kink

Again note the word "preferences". Once again no play is required to have preferences, and there are no laws against preferences, so you are going to have to come up with some other flimsy excuse to exclude it as a kink.

But really, you shouldn't waste your time, because the simple fact of the matter is that you are wrong, and a "kink (bizarre or unconventional sexual preference) for little kids" is indeed a kink, by definition, and you refuse to "respect the kink", and thus Dizzy is, in fact, 100% correct, and has been all along. The whole idea of you respecting other people's kinks is indeed just bullshit peddled by the "community" to make themselves feel better about themselves, because you clearly do not respect all kinks, only the ones that don't make you too uncomfortable.

Thank you for playing along at home, but next time, save yourself a lot of time and angst and do just what Greta did; pay attention to what has been said.

Well if we are talking true definitions then sexual attraction to kids is not kink but Pedophilia which I did state earlier. So you are wrong again. Pedophilia, by definition, does not require the person have interactions with a kid only the sexual intent. And once again, that is not a kink.

Pedophilia:
Pedophilia or paedophilia is a psychiatric disorder in which an adult or older adolescent experiences a primary or exclusive sexual attraction to prepubescent children.[1][2] Although girls typically begin the process of puberty at age 10 or 11, and boys at age 11 or 12,[3] criteria for pedophilia extend the cut-off point for prepubescence to age 13.[1] A person who is diagnosed with pedophilia must be at least 16 years old, but adolescents must be at least five years older than the prepubescent child for the attraction to be diagnosed as pedophilia.

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RE: Why do raceplayers get so much crap from everyone - 12/28/2016 5:46:00 AM   
NerdsThunderCat


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If you are of age and can give verbal or written consent to the sexual act then it's all good

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RE: Why do raceplayers get so much crap from everyone - 12/28/2016 5:49:51 AM   
ThatDizzyChick


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quote:

I said that I believe that they can't I can believe what I want to and have any opinions just.

True, you can indeed believe whatever you want, and in this case what you choose to believe is disproved by the evidence you provided to support your belief. When this happens, rationale people modify their beliefs. there is a word for people who refuse to so, but I won't bother mentioning it, because that too is a word that most people simply do not know the meaning of.

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RE: Why do raceplayers get so much crap from everyone - 12/28/2016 6:01:35 AM   
NerdsThunderCat


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Status: offline 		Again it's a word thing yes pedophiles can have a kink for children that is probably only expected among other pedophiles like when you hear about the people trading children porn I'm sure thy each have their own taste of specific displays of prepubescent children witch makes it by definition a kink




But not BDSM not the same as they way people in the bdsm community think of kinky or the word kink because we are all about consent and adults and thinks like safe sane and consensual and consensual risk awareness and things like that


So within the world or sick and wrong and pedophilia I'm sure they have their own kinks for how they enjoy abusing or fantasizing about children







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RE: Why do raceplayers get so much crap from everyone - 12/28/2016 6:06:11 AM   
ThatDizzyChick


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quote:

I'm sure thy each have their own taste of specific displays of prepubescent children witch makes it by definition a kink

No, that is not what makes it a kink. This has been explained, please pay attention.

quote:

But not BDSM not the same as they way people in the bdsm community think of kinky or the word kink because we are all about consent and adults and thinks like safe sane and consensual and consensual risk awareness and things like that

Oh spare us the bullshit.
You are still making red herring arguments.

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RE: Why do raceplayers get so much crap from everyone - 12/28/2016 6:08:39 AM   
NerdsThunderCat


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Status: offline 		So the point of people getting upset about a kink for kids yes your so completely right why would people not be upset about it be and because the vanilla world is not always so opened to our lifestyle choices

If we started to be all for pedophiles seeking help within our community. We would just be further misunderstood and lookd at sideways

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RE: Why do raceplayers get so much crap from everyone - 12/28/2016 6:09:50 AM   
NerdsThunderCat


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Status: offline 		And maybe even labeled all the same

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RE: Why do raceplayers get so much crap from everyone - 12/28/2016 6:10:38 AM   
ThatDizzyChick


Posts: 5490
Status: offline 		Pedophilia is a kink, just like any other, and you refuse to respect that kink, and therefore you really have no grounds to complain that other people don't respect your kink. Why don't many people 'respect" your race kink? for the same reason you don't "respect" people's kiddie kink. It fucking squicks them out.

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RE: Why do raceplayers get so much crap from everyone - 12/28/2016 6:11:58 AM   
ThatDizzyChick


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quote:

If we started to be all for pedophiles seeking help within our community. We would just be further misunderstood and lookd at sideways

Completely fucking irrelevant.

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