What is it with the hysteria? (Full Version)

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Musicmystery -> What is it with the hysteria? (2/8/2017 8:44:10 AM)

Are people this gullible, or just drama queens, or just determined to be unhappy and find the blame elsewhere?

What's with all the hysteria? Not just difference of opinion -- hysteria.

Nor is it new:

- They're stealing our Christmas!
- They're ruining marriage!
- Obama is coming for your guns!
- Muslims are ready to attack at any moment!

To be fair, sure, there's hysteria on the left as well. But it's not this organized consistent talking point official hysteria: "Go riot now!"

It's...nutty, really. Willingfully ignoring factual evidence to the contrary.

Maybe it's what I do. In politics, I have opinions, like everyone else, but professionally, I have to be correct--or at least able to course correct--so that my clients see positive results. That means I'm actually *looking* for information indicating I might be off course, so I can correct early. Same thing financially -- I don't want to insist my predictions are correct: I want to be catching signs showing whether it's true or not, or has changed, so that I can adjust and continue to enjoy success.

But in politics, so many people seem committed to defending indefensible nonsense, and respond to factual evidence by:
- claiming the source is no good, so nothing there could possibility be accurate, even in part
- claiming to "know" the "truth" is just "not reported" or "under-reported" or "mis-reported" ("fake news" with no evidence it's fake)
- clinging to whatever original position they had, no matter what, no matter the evidence, no matter new information
- "refuting" primarily by sweeping dismissals (liberals, conservatives, political party, voting blocks)
- making up bizarre straw men to prop up their beliefs (ignoring anything showing otherwise).
- "Well what about _______," inserting any tangent whatsoever to avoid taking on the evidence presented (essentially meaning they can't actually refute it), but doubling down on their belief they are correct, even when this situation indicates that's unlikely.

That alone would be problematic, as no discussion or solutions will happen that have any basis in reality.

But it's not simply the stubborn close-mindedness -- it's the hysteria about insisting on it: "If we don't do this, Muslims will overrun our country, Obama will take our guns, marriage will be destroyed, Christmas will be gone, and so forth," without any justification.

Remember "Iraq has weapons of mass destruction!" Except...no, they didn't. Or "We have to be wary of Leninist/Soviet style authoritarian propagandist Russia!" while today Bannon is a self-proclaimed Leninist and Trump openly admires Putin's authoritarian style.

Was Hobbes right? Are people too weak to have democracies? Do they require kings? Trump's supporters, as a recent article shows (posted elsewhere in this forum), favor authoritarian approaches -- even as this treads on the Constitution (and defending it has become Liberal -- didn't that used to be Conservative?). And yet, aren't these the people crying "the problem is government?" Hysteria is actually ensuring that big government will become MORE of a problem.

It makes no sense. Of course, hysteria never does.

But I can't see that it furthers anyone's interests, other than convincing themselves of their own misinformation.

And that does not yield successful results.




BoscoX -> RE: What is it with the hysteria? (2/8/2017 9:00:58 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Are people this gullible, or just drama queens, or just determined to be unhappy and find the blame elsewhere?

What's with all the hysteria? Not just difference of opinion -- hysteria.

Nor is it new:

- They're stealing our Christmas!
- They're ruining marriage!
- Obama is coming for your guns!
- Muslims are ready to attack at any moment!

To be fair, sure, there's hysteria on the left as well. But it's not this organized consistent talking point official hysteria: "Go riot now!"

It's...nutty, really. Willingfully ignoring factual evidence to the contrary.

Maybe it's what I do. In politics, I have opinions, like everyone else, but professionally, I have to be correct--or at least able to course correct--so that my clients see positive results. That means I'm actually *looking* for information indicating I might be off course, so I can correct early. Same thing financially -- I don't want to insist my predictions are correct: I want to be catching signs showing whether it's true or not, or has changed, so that I can adjust and continue to enjoy success.

But in politics, so many people seem committed to defending indefensible nonsense, and respond to factual evidence by:
- claiming the source is no good, so nothing there could possibility be accurate, even in part
- claiming to "know" the "truth" is just "not reported" or "under-reported" or "mis-reported" ("fake news" with no evidence it's fake)
- clinging to whatever original position they had, no matter what, no matter the evidence, no matter new information
- "refuting" primarily by sweeping dismissals (liberals, conservatives, political party, voting blocks)
- making up bizarre straw men to prop up their beliefs (ignoring anything showing otherwise).
- "Well what about _______," inserting any tangent whatsoever to avoid taking on the evidence presented (essentially meaning they can't actually refute it), but doubling down on their belief they are correct, even when this situation indicates that's unlikely.

That alone would be problematic, as no discussion or solutions will happen that have any basis in reality.

But it's not simply the stubborn close-mindedness -- it's the hysteria about insisting on it: "If we don't do this, Muslims will overrun our country, Obama will take our guns, marriage will be destroyed, Christmas will be gone, and so forth," without any justification.

Remember "Iraq has weapons of mass destruction!" Except...no, they didn't. Or "We have to be wary of Leninist/Soviet style authoritarian propagandist Russia!" while today Bannon is a self-proclaimed Leninist and Trump openly admires Putin's authoritarian style.

Was Hobbes right? Are people too weak to have democracies? Do they require kings? Trump's supporters, as a recent article shows (posted elsewhere in this forum), favor authoritarian approaches -- even as this treads on the Constitution (and defending it has become Liberal -- didn't that used to be Conservative?). And yet, aren't these the people crying "the problem is government?" Hysteria is actually ensuring that big government will become MORE of a problem.

It makes no sense. Of course, hysteria never does.

But I can't see that it furthers anyone's interests, other than convincing themselves of their own misinformation.

And that does not yield successful results.


Coming from you, this is priceless [sm=happy-smiley58.gif]




Musicmystery -> RE: What is it with the hysteria? (2/8/2017 9:05:11 AM)

Right on cue, as described above.




mnottertail -> RE: What is it with the hysteria? (2/8/2017 9:42:02 AM)

You forgot "They are trying to take our slaves away!!"
They actually said that.




tj444 -> RE: What is it with the hysteria? (2/8/2017 9:57:27 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Are people this gullible, or just drama queens, or just determined to be unhappy and find the blame elsewhere?

What's with all the hysteria? Not just difference of opinion -- hysteria.

Nor is it new:

- They're stealing our Christmas!
- They're ruining marriage!
- Obama is coming for your guns!
- Muslims are ready to attack at any moment!

To be fair, sure, there's hysteria on the left as well. But it's not this organized consistent talking point official hysteria: "Go riot now!"

It's...nutty, really. Willingfully ignoring factual evidence to the contrary.

Maybe it's what I do. In politics, I have opinions, like everyone else, but professionally, I have to be correct--or at least able to course correct--so that my clients see positive results. That means I'm actually *looking* for information indicating I might be off course, so I can correct early. Same thing financially -- I don't want to insist my predictions are correct: I want to be catching signs showing whether it's true or not, or has changed, so that I can adjust and continue to enjoy success.

But in politics, so many people seem committed to defending indefensible nonsense, and respond to factual evidence by:
- claiming the source is no good, so nothing there could possibility be accurate, even in part
- claiming to "know" the "truth" is just "not reported" or "under-reported" or "mis-reported" ("fake news" with no evidence it's fake)
- clinging to whatever original position they had, no matter what, no matter the evidence, no matter new information
- "refuting" primarily by sweeping dismissals (liberals, conservatives, political party, voting blocks)
- making up bizarre straw men to prop up their beliefs (ignoring anything showing otherwise).
- "Well what about _______," inserting any tangent whatsoever to avoid taking on the evidence presented (essentially meaning they can't actually refute it), but doubling down on their belief they are correct, even when this situation indicates that's unlikely.

That alone would be problematic, as no discussion or solutions will happen that have any basis in reality.

But it's not simply the stubborn close-mindedness -- it's the hysteria about insisting on it: "If we don't do this, Muslims will overrun our country, Obama will take our guns, marriage will be destroyed, Christmas will be gone, and so forth," without any justification.

Remember "Iraq has weapons of mass destruction!" Except...no, they didn't. Or "We have to be wary of Leninist/Soviet style authoritarian propagandist Russia!" while today Bannon is a self-proclaimed Leninist and Trump openly admires Putin's authoritarian style.

Was Hobbes right? Are people too weak to have democracies? Do they require kings? Trump's supporters, as a recent article shows (posted elsewhere in this forum), favor authoritarian approaches -- even as this treads on the Constitution (and defending it has become Liberal -- didn't that used to be Conservative?). And yet, aren't these the people crying "the problem is government?" Hysteria is actually ensuring that big government will become MORE of a problem.

It makes no sense. Of course, hysteria never does.

But I can't see that it furthers anyone's interests, other than convincing themselves of their own misinformation.

And that does not yield successful results.


Yeah, its what you do.. looking at things objectively vs non-objectively.. Yes, these hysterical people (from both sides) look for articles, faux news etc that back up their bias & viewpoint.. Silly you, professionally, you look for info etc that tells you to look closer, re-examine etc and possibly change your viewpoint or at least have a Plan B ready... see, thats where you are going "wrong".. [:D] Hope that helped ya.. [;)]




MrRodgers -> RE: What is it with the hysteria? (2/8/2017 2:05:28 PM)

Whatever we do, we must speak in a language that brings hate and derision to those with whom...we disagree.

The strategy is...to create chaos. Observers are to demonize the opposition.

Paraphrasing...who said that ?

The vehicle is faction, the result is...greater faction.

The end then, becomes closer.





jlf1961 -> RE: What is it with the hysteria? (2/8/2017 2:17:54 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX


Coming from you, this is priceless [sm=happy-smiley58.gif]


This coming from a person that is so politically ignorant he does not know the difference between fascism, socialism, nationalism and the historic examples of each.






WickedsDesire -> RE: What is it with the hysteria? (2/8/2017 2:39:09 PM)

What is it with the hysteria. I am led to believe he is an utter nutter - president monster - a cacophony of made up hateful lie after lie after lie ...ad finnum...enabled by fractured beings beyond the end of all hope

Nightwish anyone https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=84aIX8UPklI dont like that one so here is another https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5EeDG9NoO04

last ride of the day indeed planet earth :))) Ghost love score will forever be my favourite :) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0VF0BlXP-0Y





tamaka -> RE: What is it with the hysteria? (2/8/2017 3:30:13 PM)

Well our biggest concern today is that Nordstrom's pulled Ivanka's line.




Aylee -> RE: What is it with the hysteria? (2/8/2017 4:11:55 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: tamaka

Well our biggest concern today is that Nordstrom's pulled Ivanka's line.



Yeah, Seattle is going nuts. They city has cut ties with Wells Fargo bank also.




bounty44 -> RE: What is it with the hysteria? (2/8/2017 4:35:09 PM)

just recently read that the ceo of under armour said something positive about trump and so the collectivist whack jobs are calling for boycotts of that.




Greta75 -> RE: What is it with the hysteria? (2/8/2017 4:43:34 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery
- They're stealing our Christmas! TRUE, as "Merry Christmas" signs are forbidden, I'd say, they are trying to shut down Christmas. I'm an atheist and I think that's terrible. Around here, we don't even see Christmas as a Christian Celebration but a folklore celebration of Santa Claus and Presents, it's fun for kids. And see no religious meaning in "Merry Christmas" signs. So don't understand what's the west non christians making such a big fuss about
- They're ruining marriage! (I don't remember much hysteria about legalisation of gay marriage, since it was done in liberal states)
- Obama is coming for your guns! He was pretty anti-gun.
- Muslims are ready to attack at any moment! True, and we don't know when it's gonna happen





Greta75 -> RE: What is it with the hysteria? (2/8/2017 4:47:21 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

You forgot "They are trying to take our slaves away!!"
They actually said that.

I thought historically, Dems were the pro-slaves owning party.




vincentML -> RE: What is it with the hysteria? (2/8/2017 4:48:37 PM)

quote:

What's with all the hysteria? Not just difference of opinion -- hysteria.

It is the way a demagogue shepherd guides his sheep. [:'(]




vincentML -> RE: What is it with the hysteria? (2/8/2017 4:59:41 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery
- They're stealing our Christmas! TRUE, as "Merry Christmas" signs are forbidden, I'd say, they are trying to shut down Christmas. I'm an atheist and I think that's terrible. Around here, we don't even see Christmas as a Christian Celebration but a folklore celebration of Santa Claus and Presents, it's fun for kids. And see no religious meaning in "Merry Christmas" signs. So don't understand what's the west non christians making such a big fuss about
- They're ruining marriage! (I don't remember much hysteria about legalisation of gay marriage, since it was done in liberal states)
- Obama is coming for your guns! He was pretty anti-gun.
- Muslims are ready to attack at any moment! True, and we don't know when it's gonna happen



There is no law prohibiting "Merry Christmas"

The Defense of Marriage Act was passed into law in 1996 and struck down by SCOTUS last year.

Islamic bastards attacked the Twin Trade Towers in 1993 and in 2001.

Try to keep up.




vincentML -> RE: What is it with the hysteria? (2/8/2017 5:01:04 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

You forgot "They are trying to take our slaves away!!"
They actually said that.

I thought historically, Dems were the pro-slaves owning party.

Things change.

Really, try to keep up. [8|]




bounty44 -> RE: What is it with the hysteria? (2/8/2017 5:06:19 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

You forgot "They are trying to take our slaves away!!"
They actually said that.

I thought historically, Dems were the pro-slaves owning party.


greta, if you will allow me to help you.

the better question to ask mnottertroll is, "can you please provide a reference for that?"

and then you get to sit back and watch him do one of three things:

say that he did indeed hear someone say that but simply cannot find the reference for it.

provide some vague reference in which the material in question is not present.

or engage in vulgar spewing.

although I could be wrong; we'll see...




jlf1961 -> RE: What is it with the hysteria? (2/8/2017 5:31:15 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery
- They're stealing our Christmas! TRUE, as "Merry Christmas" signs are forbidden, I'd say, they are trying to shut down Christmas. I'm an atheist and I think that's terrible. Around here, we don't even see Christmas as a Christian Celebration but a folklore celebration of Santa Claus and Presents, it's fun for kids. And see no religious meaning in "Merry Christmas" signs. So don't understand what's the west non christians making such a big fuss about

Neither the democrats or any other political party tried to outlaw/abolish or otherwise impact Christmas in any way.
As for "Merry Christmas" signs being forbidden, that is utter and complete horseshit, very common for your posts.

What has happened is that people have begun saying 'happy holidays' out of defference to the fact that not only is christmas celebrated at that time of year, but Hanukkah and Kwanza as well.

The big point the GOP is fussing about is Christian Christmas displays on publicly or city/county/state/federal owned properties as that it violates the separation of church and state in the Constitution.

And it is not really the Democrats making the fuss about that (although they get the blame) but a minority of Democrats who happen to be atheists.

In point of fact, 87% of American Baptists are Democrat, as well as 75% of members of the Church of God in Christ. So it is beyond stupid to blame all Democrats for any lawsuits concerning Christmas displays on publicly owned lands.


- They're ruining marriage! (I don't remember much hysteria about legalisation of gay marriage, since it was done in liberal states)
I guess you forgot that a predominately Conservative Supreme Court ruled in favor of gay marriage making it legal in all 50 states as well as all US territories.
Selective Amnesia?


- Obama is coming for your guns! He was pretty anti-gun.
Actually he was anti assault weapon, although that type of weapon was used least in all mass shootings in the US. He also wanted stricter background checks and mandatory sharing of information by state and local courts and law enforcement agencies so the already existing restrictions for who can and cannot buy a gun could be universally enforced.

- Muslims are ready to attack at any moment! True, and we don't know when it's gonna happen


With the exceptions of the two attacks on the world trade center, most of the Islamic related terrorist attacks came not from people who immigrated legally to the US as adults but were either born here in the US or raised here growing up as children, and of those, none of them came from families with radical Muslim sympathies.

Something the Department of Justice was saying during the Bush administration as well as the Obama administration.

Also, the Muslim extremist who was responsible for the bombings in New York city and New Jersey, his own father tried to get him arrested as a possible threat to the US as he had been saying things that made it clear he sympathized with ISIS.

When the man was first investigated, the father was informed that it was not illegal for him to say those things, and since there was no evidence of his intent to commit acts of terror, he could not be arrested at that time.

You understand that unless there is court admissible proof of intent to commit a crime, people cant be arrested in the US for anything they say.





In other words, you really need to quite reading the right wing bullshit and actually look into the facts before you start typing, because as it is, you really make yourself look stupid.





Greta75 -> RE: What is it with the hysteria? (2/8/2017 6:04:04 PM)

FR

NONE of you guys repudiated the points of Muslims could attack any moment.

Since you consider 9/11 the only "attacks" Muslims ever made.

Lone Wolves are the new tactics of ISIS these days, as it's more difficult to orchestrate another 9/11.

Unpredictable Lone Wolves are the NEW Muslims could attack from any where, any moment. Could be a US citizen. Could be an Immigrant. Any moment!

War on Christmas was about people getting offended with "Merry Christmas". It's absolutely ridiculous! And the whole political correct encouragement of using "Happy Holidays".

I can't even imagine if I wish a Muslim, "Happy Holidays" on their Hari Raya. Or "Happy Holidays" to Hindus on their Deepavali. They would be like, Why can't I say, "Happy Hari Raya!" or "Happy Deepavali!"

It is THE MOST ridiculous thing ever!

Again, where is the Hoo Ha about legalising of gay marriages?

None. It really turn out to become not such a big deal.

The drama is people getting pissed off at minority of Christians for refusing to serve gay people, but it is their religious right. But it is also the company's right to get rid of employees who can't keep their religion out of their job. But if they are owners of their own company, they can do whatever they want.

As for guns, I'm pretty sure Obama is for a gun-free America. But it is against the 2nd amendment for America to ever be gun-free. So basically he can't get his wish.




dcnovice -> RE: What is it with the hysteria? (2/8/2017 6:04:51 PM)

quote:

It makes no sense. Of course, hysteria never does.

Then again, it's a handy tool for distracting, scaring, and subduing an electorate. Hypothetically, of course.

More seriously, I suspect that the 24-hour news cycle and social media--which can produce a constant barrage of fake and real information along with endless opinions and half-baked memes--play a role in ratcheting up the political temperature.




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