quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

also from two years ago:

This is long, but hopefully worthwhile. Some more "myths and falsehoods" from totally "non-credible sources:"

http://townhall.com/columnists/danielpipes/2015/01/21/draft-n1945776/page/full

This one is particularly interesting because the author regrets his prior use of the phrase “no go zones” and would rather call them “semi-autonomous sectors.” However, he nevertheless acknowledges “police enter only warily and in force, and Muslims get away with offences illegal for the rest of population.

“The Rotherham, England, child sex scandal offers a powerful example. An official inquiry found that for sixteen years, 1997-2013, a ring of Muslim men sexually exploited – through abduction, rape, gang rape, trafficking, prostitution, torture – at least 1,400 non-Muslim girls as young as 11. The police received voluminous complaints from the girls' parents but did nothing; they could have acted, but chose not to.”

In the article, the author, who is a prize winning columnist and runs the Middle East Forum (a think tank that is not credible) mentions he has traveled to these places in Athens, Berlin, Brussels, Copenhagen, Malmö, and Stockholm---first hand eye witness testimony bah!

http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/3816/losing-malmo

“Fire and emergency workers refuse to enter Malmo's mostly Muslim Rosengaard district without police escort...

“The police and other emergency personnel are viewed as agents of the non-Muslim state. Their presumptuousness in entering the Islamic enclave and acting under the color of Swedish law is taken as an affront to Islamic sovereignty.”

The gatestone institute is an international policy think tank, chaired by John Bolton, former US ambassador to the UN. Also among their members is Alan Dershowitz, a constitutional law expert who “published more than 1000 articles in magazines, newspapers, journals and blogs such as The New York Times Magazine, The Washington Post, The Wall Street Journal, The Harvard Law Review, the Yale Law Journal, Huffington Post, Newsmax, Jerusalem Post and Ha’aretz. Others in the institute are of the same caliber.

But they don’t know anything about the state of the world, or Islam.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslims_Against_Crusades

“Muslims Against Crusades maintain that Muslims are not "obliged to obey the law of the land in whatever country they reside".[5] In 2011 the group proposed that Muslims should set up independent emirates in select cities in the UK, operating under sharia (Islamic law) entirely outside British law. The group suggested the towns of Bradford, Dewsbury, and Tower Hamlets in the East End of London as the possible first test beds for these entities.[6] The group has often clashed with the English Defence League.[7][8] Home Secretary Theresa May banned the group from midnight on 11 November 2011, making membership or support of the group a criminal offence.”

The article was written with research from 25 sources, almost all of them local newspapers and news sites. So they, or the author, don’t know anything they are talking about!

https://actforamericahouston.wordpress.com/2011/07/21/britains-islamic-emirates-project/

“One of the group’s strategy documents, “Islamic Prevent 2011: Preventing Secular Fundamentalism and the Occupation of Muslim Land,” provides insights into the religious and/or philosophical mindset behind the Islamic Emirates Project. For example, Chapter 1 states: “The Only Identity for Muslims is Islam … In no shape or form can a Muslim support any form of nationalism such as promoting Britishness.”
Chapter 4 states: “A Muslim can only abide by Sharia and is not allowed to obey any man-made law.” Chapter 5 states: “Muslims must reject secularism and democracy,” terms which are “completely alien to Islam and against the basic tenets of Islam.” Chapter 10 states: “Every Muslim must call for Sharia to be implemented wherever they are.” Chapter 12 states: “It is not allowed for Muslims to integrate with a non-Islamic society.” Chapter 13 states: “Muslims should set up Islamic Emirates in the United Kingdom.” Chapter 14 states: “Any Muslim who opposed the policies in this pamphlet should be confronted.” Chapter 16 states: “Any Muslim who has been affected by the Western way of life need to be rehabilitated.”

The author is Soeren Kern, who is a university professor in spain, teaching international relations and who is an analyst, essayist and commentator for a large variety of organizations, publications and news agencies. He doesn’t know anything about how Islam is playing out around the world however and he must be making up those quotes.

http://www.cbn.com/cbnnews/world/2014/April/Native-French-under-Attack-in-Muslim-Areas/

“Violent crime can happen anywhere and to anyone and for many reasons, but in Muslim-controlled parts of France, it has become especially dangerous to be white.

“Surveillance camera video shows white French being beaten up by predominantly Muslim immigrant gangs in the Metro and on the street.

“Islamic immigrants consider it their territory and whites enter at their own risk. The French call them "sensitive urban zones" -- no-go zones where the police don't enter or don't enforce the law.

“Some call them little Muslim caliphates inside the borders of France.

"The French people are increasingly living in fear. They fear the imposition of Islamic law and the organized violence against any French person, including the police," Cassen said.

"More and more Islamists threaten riots, assault, and try to impose Sharia (Islamic law). They attack the police," Tasin added.

"The republic is in danger," Tasin warned.”

Well, that was from CBN, and we certainly cannot trust Christians to tell the truth and I suspect the French citizens really never said those things.


http://townhall.com/columnists/walterewilliams/2015/01/21/will-the-west-defend-itself-n1945100/page/full

“Several European countries have what are called "no-go zones." No-go zones function as microstates governed by Shariah. The host countries' authorities have lost control over these areas. In some cases, they are unable to provide even police, firefighting and ambulance services.

“In France, no-go zones are officially called Zones Urbaines Sensibles, or Sensitive Urban Zones. According to some reports, there is hardly a city in France that does not have at least one ZUS. There are estimated to be more than 750 such zones in France. According to The Washington Times, "France has Europe's largest population of Muslims, some of whom talk openly of ruling the country one day and casting aside Western legal systems for harsh, Islam-based Shariah law.

“No-go zones have also emerged in Germany, Belgium, the Netherlands and Italy.”

Walter Williams has a PhD in economics and is a Distinguished Professor of Economics at George Mason University. He must be making things up too. And TownHall will just let any old thing appear in print so they cannot be trusted.

So---i’ll just go on believing no such places exist and that everything is hunky dory in the western world.

quote:

ORIGINAL: PeggyO

Mr. Williams's assertions have been roundly debunked. I have personally spent significant amounts of time in the ZUS at various points over the past 7 years. He has misinterpreted what the ZUS are and has been called on it repeatedly. I wonder if he actually speaks enough French to actually read the documentation on what the ZUS are. See, I have not only read the information in its original language, I've been to many of them. I assure you, they look no different than other parts of Paris I've been to. Certainly I was never confronted. The hospital my father spent his last weeks in is situated in the middle of one. I went there daily during his last illness.

Sorry, but this guy is flat out wrong and has been proved such repeatedly. However, I understand that some guy with a PhD certainly had more credibility than me and my French family with our personal experiences have when it feeds confirmation bias.

quote:

As a throng of Muslim families crowd around him, Abu Izzadeen speaks in a quiet voice of his plans for the future of Britain. The tall, bearded 36-year-old — who was recently freed from prison after serving a term for funding terrorism — is telling, in chilling detail, how he wants to impose Islam’s strict Sharia law on this country...

Today, Izzadeen, the self-styled ‘Director for Waltham Forest Muslims’, will march with his supporters — many of them new young recruits to Islam — as part of their campaign to make the suburban borough into Britain’s first Sharia-law zone.

Under his brutal set of rules, there would be a ban on alcohol, gambling, drugs, music, smoking and homosexuality, as well as on men and women mixing in public.

This is all part of Izzadeen’s concerted campaign to defeat ‘Western decadence’ and turn large parts of Britain — where, his supporters say, ‘people live like animals in a jungle’ — into an Islamic Emirate.

Already, 20,000 yellow leaflets have been printed by Islamic activists, saying ‘You are entering a Sharia controlled zone. Islamic rules enforced.’ The leaflets have been stuck onto lamp-posts, put up in shop windows and on pillar boxes. As fast as the police and council officials tear them down, more go up...

Izzadeen says: ‘This is the first step towards turning Britain into an Islamic state. There are nearly three million Muslims in this country. Islam is a sleeping giant that is waking. We have moved on from the debate about the provision of halal meat to more political issues.


‘Twenty-five areas around Britain have large Muslim populations, including Bradford, Dewsbury, Leicester and Luton. We want to turn them all into Islamic Emirates, where the excesses of Western civilisation are not tolerated.’..

Eighty-five Sharia courts now operate nationwide, parallel to traditional courts, with justice dispensed by Islamic judges on domestic rows, divorce, financial disputes and an increasing number of minor criminal acts, such as theft.

There is also a separate Islamic financial system which conforms to Sharia banking industry restrictions, including a ban on interest payments on loans.

According to this year’s Global Islamic Finance Report, Britain is now the main centre for Islamic finance outside the Muslim world.

quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

I presume the people---the police, the citizens, other travelers who have been there, and in some cases the muslims themselves---who give personal testimonies supporting the notion of "no go zones" would disagree with you and your family.

to me its not a question of how the ZUS is interpreted, or even officially designated by the French government, its the nature of the places in relationship to sharia.

and its not just france.

and all of that post was not from walter Williams.

quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX

The more Muslims, the more Islamic law. It is the heart and soul of the cult, everybody must be enslaved for the pleasure of bloodthirsty Allah

quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX

quote:

ORIGINAL: PeggyO

Mr. Williams's assertions have been roundly debunked. I have personally spent significant amounts of time in the ZUS at various points over the past 7 years. He has misinterpreted what the ZUS are and has been called on it repeatedly. I wonder if he actually speaks enough French to actually read the documentation on what the ZUS are. See, I have not only read the information in its original language, I've been to many of them. I assure you, they look no different than other parts of Paris I've been to. Certainly I was never confronted. The hospital my father spent his last weeks in is situated in the middle of one. I went there daily during his last illness.

Sorry, but this guy is flat out wrong and has been proved such repeatedly. However, I understand that some guy with a PhD certainly had more credibility than me and my French family with our personal experiences have when it feeds confirmation bias.

Who are you, some anonymous Islamist apologist on the Internet

You are nobody

quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

old, but to the point (I posted some of this a while back too):

"As Islamic extremists declare Britain's first Sharia law zone, the worrying social and moral implications"

quote:

As a throng of Muslim families crowd around him, Abu Izzadeen speaks in a quiet voice of his plans for the future of Britain. The tall, bearded 36-year-old — who was recently freed from prison after serving a term for funding terrorism — is telling, in chilling detail, how he wants to impose Islam’s strict Sharia law on this country...

Today, Izzadeen, the self-styled ‘Director for Waltham Forest Muslims’, will march with his supporters — many of them new young recruits to Islam — as part of their campaign to make the suburban borough into Britain’s first Sharia-law zone.

Under his brutal set of rules, there would be a ban on alcohol, gambling, drugs, music, smoking and homosexuality, as well as on men and women mixing in public.

This is all part of Izzadeen’s concerted campaign to defeat ‘Western decadence’ and turn large parts of Britain — where, his supporters say, ‘people live like animals in a jungle’ — into an Islamic Emirate.

Already, 20,000 yellow leaflets have been printed by Islamic activists, saying ‘You are entering a Sharia controlled zone. Islamic rules enforced.’ The leaflets have been stuck onto lamp-posts, put up in shop windows and on pillar boxes. As fast as the police and council officials tear them down, more go up...

Izzadeen says: ‘This is the first step towards turning Britain into an Islamic state. There are nearly three million Muslims in this country. Islam is a sleeping giant that is waking. We have moved on from the debate about the provision of halal meat to more political issues.


‘Twenty-five areas around Britain have large Muslim populations, including Bradford, Dewsbury, Leicester and Luton. We want to turn them all into Islamic Emirates, where the excesses of Western civilisation are not tolerated.’..

Eighty-five Sharia courts now operate nationwide, parallel to traditional courts, with justice dispensed by Islamic judges on domestic rows, divorce, financial disputes and an increasing number of minor criminal acts, such as theft.

There is also a separate Islamic financial system which conforms to Sharia banking industry restrictions, including a ban on interest payments on loans.

According to this year’s Global Islamic Finance Report, Britain is now the main centre for Islamic finance outside the Muslim world.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2020382/You-entering-Sharia-law-Britain-As-Islamic-extremists-declare-Sharia-law-zone-London-suburb-worrying-social-moral-implications.html

hopefully I can pre-empt this by saying "now watch some lefty "scholar" come in and "LOL" because its the dailymail."

yes, I get it, you wont be able to deal with the content.

quote:

As a throng of Muslim families crowd around him, Abu Izzadeen speaks in a quiet voice of his plans for the future of Britain. The tall, bearded 36-year-old — who was recently freed from prison after serving a term for funding terrorism — is telling, in chilling detail, how he wants to impose Islam’s strict Sharia law on this country...

Today, Izzadeen, the self-styled ‘Director for Waltham Forest Muslims’, will march with his supporters — many of them new young recruits to Islam — as part of their campaign to make the suburban borough into Britain’s first Sharia-law zone.

Under his brutal set of rules, there would be a ban on alcohol, gambling, drugs, music, smoking and homosexuality, as well as on men and women mixing in public.

This is all part of Izzadeen’s concerted campaign to defeat ‘Western decadence’ and turn large parts of Britain — where, his supporters say, ‘people live like animals in a jungle’ — into an Islamic Emirate.

Already, 20,000 yellow leaflets have been printed by Islamic activists, saying ‘You are entering a Sharia controlled zone. Islamic rules enforced.’ The leaflets have been stuck onto lamp-posts, put up in shop windows and on pillar boxes. As fast as the police and council officials tear them down, more go up...

Izzadeen says: ‘This is the first step towards turning Britain into an Islamic state. There are nearly three million Muslims in this country. Islam is a sleeping giant that is waking. We have moved on from the debate about the provision of halal meat to more political issues.


‘Twenty-five areas around Britain have large Muslim populations, including Bradford, Dewsbury, Leicester and Luton. We want to turn them all into Islamic Emirates, where the excesses of Western civilisation are not tolerated.’..

Eighty-five Sharia courts now operate nationwide, parallel to traditional courts, with justice dispensed by Islamic judges on domestic rows, divorce, financial disputes and an increasing number of minor criminal acts, such as theft.

There is also a separate Islamic financial system which conforms to Sharia banking industry restrictions, including a ban on interest payments on loans.

According to this year’s Global Islamic Finance Report, Britain is now the main centre for Islamic finance outside the Muslim world.

quote:

ORIGINAL: alphabottom

quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX

quote:

ORIGINAL: PeggyO

Mr. Williams's assertions have been roundly debunked. I have personally spent significant amounts of time in the ZUS at various points over the past 7 years. He has misinterpreted what the ZUS are and has been called on it repeatedly. I wonder if he actually speaks enough French to actually read the documentation on what the ZUS are. See, I have not only read the information in its original language, I've been to many of them. I assure you, they look no different than other parts of Paris I've been to. Certainly I was never confronted. The hospital my father spent his last weeks in is situated in the middle of one. I went there daily during his last illness.

Sorry, but this guy is flat out wrong and has been proved such repeatedly. However, I understand that some guy with a PhD certainly had more credibility than me and my French family with our personal experiences have when it feeds confirmation bias.

Who are you, some anonymous Islamist apologist on the Internet

You are nobody

A person who has lived in France for a significant amount of time and has family in France is credible I would say. Pointing out factual errors hardly makes someone an Islamist apologist. It merely makes someone a person who wants facts to be correct. However, I realize that dismissing soneone as such makes it easier to dismiss the facts and experiences. If there were actually these no go zones in France and if one had negative experiences after being in one of those purported zones, people would have said so.

quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX

You can claim anything on the Internet, doesn't make anything you post true, or credible.