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The Rule of Law - 3/14/2017 12:27:43 AM   
vincentML


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ARTICLE

Ferguson, Missouri was called out not too long ago by the Justice Department for running a protection racket on its citizens, mostly poor people of color. The police would issue a ticket for some minor traffic infraction with a high price tag: $302 for a single manner of walking incident; $531 for high Grass and Weeds; $777 for resisting arrest; $793 for failure to obey; and $527 for Failure to Comply.

If the citizen could not pay the fine in full a hearing date was set by the municipal court. At the hearing a payment deadline was imposed. Failure to meet the deadline resulted in more fines, added fees and costs, more deadlines, and jail time, then release and more deadlines; the citizen was caught in a penal cycle. . . in jail for poverty; the American equivalent of a poor house gaol.

One woman’s car was parked crookedly. She was given a parking ticket which levied a fine of $151. She was not able to pay in full. During the next seven years she spent six days in jail, incurred more fines and fees, and paid $550. She still owes the city $541.

And here’s a police captain, in March 2012, writing to the Ferguson city manager to boast of record collections to the tune of $235,000 for the month. “The [court clerk] girls have been swamped all day with a line of people paying off fines today,” he wrote the city official. “Since 9:30 this morning there hasn’t been less than 5 people waiting in line and for the last three hours 10 to 15 people at all times.” The city manager was, again, overjoyed at the revenues bolstering city coffers, lauding the police and court staff for their “great work.”

[SNIP]

And when people couldn’t pay, they were arrested. Around 21,000 people live in Ferguson. But in 2013, the city’s municipal court issued a staggering 32,975 arrest warrants for minor offenses, according to Missouri state records.

In 2014 the city collected $2.3 million from citations. Total revenues were more than $19 million.

In 2012 the population of Ferguson was 67% African-American. The people arrested were 93% African-American. From 2008 – 2012 one neighborhood had a poverty rate of 13.1%. The others had poverty rates that fell between 19.8 and 33.3% according to census data. There were five census tracts.

In Ferguson Police and Courts waged a financial persecution against its indigent population.

Other cities in St. Louis County have been accused of similar behavior.

When Michael Brown was fatally shot in 2014 by a white cop there were 50 white and 3 black police officers on the Ferguson Force.

Police corruption is not new but Ferguson is one story that tells me the American Justice System remains broken. I don’t see the substantive fairness called for in the Constitution. I wonder if anyone was fired?

Your thoughts?


< Message edited by vincentML -- 3/14/2017 12:35:17 AM >


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vML

Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter. ~ MLK Jr.
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RE: The Rule of Law - 3/14/2017 1:21:00 AM   
tweakabelle


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What is the difference between Ferguson style policing and a protection racket/extortion?

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RE: The Rule of Law - 3/14/2017 7:05:23 AM   
thompsonx


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ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

What is the difference between Ferguson style policing and a protection racket/extortion?


The difference is that the doj has documented the furgestan extortion racket with data from public records.

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RE: The Rule of Law - 3/14/2017 8:03:48 AM   
vincentML


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Joined: 10/31/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

What is the difference between Ferguson style policing and a protection racket/extortion?

There is none according to the author of the linked article.

I posted this thread because there are people on this forum and in RL who think that everything is hunky dory under the American Constitution, and if its not for some people than they are to blame for being poor, for living in a criminal neighborhood, for being addicted to drugs, for being lazy and shiftless, etc. The critics think that their rights are protected because they are educated, affluent, and white, and of course they are mostly correct most of the time. That is the essence of "white privilege."

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RE: The Rule of Law - 3/14/2017 8:16:22 AM   
Aylee


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quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

Your thoughts?



1. This is happening in cities and towns all over. I cannot remember the name of the guy that ended up dead, but he was selling single cigarettes. Well, NY City has extremely high taxes on packs of cigarettes (as revenue enhancement), so people go a state over, purchase lower taxed cigarettes and sell them as singles. This irritates NY City because they are losing tax revenue. So they fine people on top for selling and buying single cigarettes. Policies are made which (by design possibly) create a black market. Then they can go after the small timers on the black market.

In the cases being discussed in the article, fines are raised to unpayable levels. People do not pay them. Pay fail to go to court. More fines and fees are added. Warrants are issued. More people end up in jail which needs more money to operate. Fines are raised to provide this money. Now, why can't community service be done to pay off fines for those who cannot afford them?

2. I really think that you should add Civil Asset Forfeiture as a form of this corruption. Unless tired by a jury of your peers and found guilty, assets should not be taken from you. I do understand confiscating drug money or whatever. But it should go into "evidence" and if no charges are filed or no guilty verdict, it needs to be returned. The same with property like cars and buildings.

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RE: The Rule of Law - 3/14/2017 8:20:08 AM   
BoscoX


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Ferguson and NYC have one major thing in common

They're bot ran by alt left control freaks

Or ctrl-left as you say

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RE: The Rule of Law - 3/14/2017 8:39:49 AM   
vincentML


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Joined: 10/31/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee


quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

Your thoughts?



1. This is happening in cities and towns all over. I cannot remember the name of the guy that ended up dead, but he was selling single cigarettes. Well, NY City has extremely high taxes on packs of cigarettes (as revenue enhancement), so people go a state over, purchase lower taxed cigarettes and sell them as singles. This irritates NY City because they are losing tax revenue. So they fine people on top for selling and buying single cigarettes. Policies are made which (by design possibly) create a black market. Then they can go after the small timers on the black market.

In the cases being discussed in the article, fines are raised to unpayable levels. People do not pay them. Pay fail to go to court. More fines and fees are added. Warrants are issued. More people end up in jail which needs more money to operate. Fines are raised to provide this money. Now, why can't community service be done to pay off fines for those who cannot afford them?

2. I really think that you should add Civil Asset Forfeiture as a form of this corruption. Unless tired by a jury of your peers and found guilty, assets should not be taken from you. I do understand confiscating drug money or whatever. But it should go into "evidence" and if no charges are filed or no guilty verdict, it needs to be returned. The same with property like cars and buildings.

Thank you, Aylee . . . your words are worth reposting. Eric (I can't breathe) Garner was attacked by five or six cops in Staten Island.



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vML

Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter. ~ MLK Jr.

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RE: The Rule of Law - 3/14/2017 8:44:48 AM   
BoscoX


Posts: 11243
Joined: 12/10/2016
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML


Thank you, Aylee . . . your words are worth reposting. Eric (I can't breathe) Garner was attacked by five or six cops in Staten Island.




Right. Killed by agents of big government enforcing welfare state tax code

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RE: The Rule of Law - 3/14/2017 8:48:10 AM   
BamaD


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Joined: 2/27/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML


quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee


quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

Your thoughts?



1. This is happening in cities and towns all over. I cannot remember the name of the guy that ended up dead, but he was selling single cigarettes. Well, NY City has extremely high taxes on packs of cigarettes (as revenue enhancement), so people go a state over, purchase lower taxed cigarettes and sell them as singles. This irritates NY City because they are losing tax revenue. So they fine people on top for selling and buying single cigarettes. Policies are made which (by design possibly) create a black market. Then they can go after the small timers on the black market.

In the cases being discussed in the article, fines are raised to unpayable levels. People do not pay them. Pay fail to go to court. More fines and fees are added. Warrants are issued. More people end up in jail which needs more money to operate. Fines are raised to provide this money. Now, why can't community service be done to pay off fines for those who cannot afford them?

2. I really think that you should add Civil Asset Forfeiture as a form of this corruption. Unless tired by a jury of your peers and found guilty, assets should not be taken from you. I do understand confiscating drug money or whatever. But it should go into "evidence" and if no charges are filed or no guilty verdict, it needs to be returned. The same with property like cars and buildings.

Thank you, Aylee . . . your words are worth reposting. Eric (I can't breathe) Garner was attacked by five or six cops in Staten Island.



And there was no conviction because the DA grossly overcharged.

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

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RE: The Rule of Law - 3/14/2017 8:49:17 AM   
vincentML


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Jesus, Bosco, if you are going to reply please give us something intelligent and of substance.

Giuliani and Bloomberg were not Democrats. Giuliani particularly persecuted people of color with his stop and frisk police tactics.

In Ferguson, Mayor James Wallace Knowles III is a Republican.



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vML

Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter. ~ MLK Jr.

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RE: The Rule of Law - 3/14/2017 8:50:58 AM   
BoscoX


Posts: 11243
Joined: 12/10/2016
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

And there was no conviction because the DA grossly overcharged.


Alt left radicals want it both ways. They want all of this big government, they want it to control and micromanage everyone's' life... But when they see it played out on the street, they want to convict the very government agents they empowered themselves, for hate crimes

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RE: The Rule of Law - 3/14/2017 8:56:49 AM   
BoscoX


Posts: 11243
Joined: 12/10/2016
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

Jesus, Bosco, if you are going to reply please give us something intelligent and of substance.

Giuliani and Bloomberg were not Democrats. Giuliani particularly persecuted people of color with his stop and frisk police tactics.

In Ferguson, Mayor James Wallace Knowles III is a Republican.




You don't have to call me Jesus, lord god will do

It doesn't matter who the mayors used to be once upon a time, they are extremely "liberal" cities



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RE: The Rule of Law - 3/14/2017 9:00:13 AM   
vincentML


Posts: 9980
Joined: 10/31/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD


quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML


quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee


quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

Your thoughts?



1. This is happening in cities and towns all over. I cannot remember the name of the guy that ended up dead, but he was selling single cigarettes. Well, NY City has extremely high taxes on packs of cigarettes (as revenue enhancement), so people go a state over, purchase lower taxed cigarettes and sell them as singles. This irritates NY City because they are losing tax revenue. So they fine people on top for selling and buying single cigarettes. Policies are made which (by design possibly) create a black market. Then they can go after the small timers on the black market.

In the cases being discussed in the article, fines are raised to unpayable levels. People do not pay them. Pay fail to go to court. More fines and fees are added. Warrants are issued. More people end up in jail which needs more money to operate. Fines are raised to provide this money. Now, why can't community service be done to pay off fines for those who cannot afford them?

2. I really think that you should add Civil Asset Forfeiture as a form of this corruption. Unless tired by a jury of your peers and found guilty, assets should not be taken from you. I do understand confiscating drug money or whatever. But it should go into "evidence" and if no charges are filed or no guilty verdict, it needs to be returned. The same with property like cars and buildings.

Thank you, Aylee . . . your words are worth reposting. Eric (I can't breathe) Garner was attacked by five or six cops in Staten Island.I don't see how you



And there was no conviction because the DA grossly overcharged.

I don't see how you can possibly know the reason; the strangler was cleared by secret grand jury proceedings which resulted in "no bill." Even "cleared"is not a proper term. The city awarded the widow $2.4M in a settlement. That says a lot about not wanting to air the dirty linen in public.

Selling "loosies" should not carry a death penalty. You accept that, right?


< Message edited by vincentML -- 3/14/2017 9:21:11 AM >


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Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter. ~ MLK Jr.

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RE: The Rule of Law - 3/14/2017 9:01:40 AM   
vincentML


Posts: 9980
Joined: 10/31/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX


quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

Jesus, Bosco, if you are going to reply please give us something intelligent and of substance.

Giuliani and Bloomberg were not Democrats. Giuliani particularly persecuted people of color with his stop and frisk police tactics.

In Ferguson, Mayor James Wallace Knowles III is a Republican.




You don't have to call me Jesus, lord god will do

It doesn't matter who the mayors used to be once upon a time, they are extremely "liberal" cities



What does that mean? Extremely liberal cities?

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vML

Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter. ~ MLK Jr.

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RE: The Rule of Law - 3/14/2017 9:05:17 AM   
thompsonx


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Joined: 10/1/2006
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ORIGINAL: BoscoX



You don't have to call me Jesus, lord god will do

Dumbass pig phoquer is more accurate.

It doesn't matter who the mayors used to be once upon a time, they are extremely "liberal" cities

What color is the sun where you live?
Jesus you are phoquing stupid.





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RE: The Rule of Law - 3/14/2017 9:16:16 AM   
BoscoX


Posts: 11243
Joined: 12/10/2016
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

Selling "looselies" should not carry a death penalty. You accept that, right?



No extremist "liberal" alt left tax laws should be enforced, ever. If people want to smoke, let them smoke. Try to be liberals, rather than leftists

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RE: The Rule of Law - 3/14/2017 9:22:35 AM   
vincentML


Posts: 9980
Joined: 10/31/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX


quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

Selling "looselies" should not carry a death penalty. You accept that, right?



No extremist "liberal" alt left tax laws should be enforced, ever. If people want to smoke, let them smoke. Try to be liberals, rather than leftists

New York State has a Supreme Court to judge the fairness of a tax. I thought the Right believed in the Rule of Law.

What is a "liberal?" What is a "leftist?"



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vML

Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter. ~ MLK Jr.

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RE: The Rule of Law - 3/14/2017 9:26:42 AM   
BoscoX


Posts: 11243
Joined: 12/10/2016
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML


quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX


quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

Selling "looselies" should not carry a death penalty. You accept that, right?



No extremist "liberal" alt left tax laws should be enforced, ever. If people want to smoke, let them smoke. Try to be liberals, rather than leftists

New York State has a Supreme Court to judge the fairness of a tax. I thought the Right believed in the Rule of Law.

What is a "liberal?" What is a "leftist?"




Fine, have it your way. Tackle that fat motherfucker for making a buck

Make up your fucking mind, your trolling is tiresome

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RE: The Rule of Law - 3/14/2017 9:32:02 AM   
BamaD


Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD


quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML


quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee


quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

Your thoughts?



1. This is happening in cities and towns all over. I cannot remember the name of the guy that ended up dead, but he was selling single cigarettes. Well, NY City has extremely high taxes on packs of cigarettes (as revenue enhancement), so people go a state over, purchase lower taxed cigarettes and sell them as singles. This irritates NY City because they are losing tax revenue. So they fine people on top for selling and buying single cigarettes. Policies are made which (by design possibly) create a black market. Then they can go after the small timers on the black market.

In the cases being discussed in the article, fines are raised to unpayable levels. People do not pay them. Pay fail to go to court. More fines and fees are added. Warrants are issued. More people end up in jail which needs more money to operate. Fines are raised to provide this money. Now, why can't community service be done to pay off fines for those who cannot afford them?

2. I really think that you should add Civil Asset Forfeiture as a form of this corruption. Unless tired by a jury of your peers and found guilty, assets should not be taken from you. I do understand confiscating drug money or whatever. But it should go into "evidence" and if no charges are filed or no guilty verdict, it needs to be returned. The same with property like cars and buildings.

Thank you, Aylee . . . your words are worth reposting. Eric (I can't breathe) Garner was attacked by five or six cops in Staten Island.I don't see how you



And there was no conviction because the DA grossly overcharged.

I don't see how you can possibly know the reason; the strangler was cleared by secret grand jury proceedings which resulted in "no bill." Even "cleared"is not a proper term. The city awarded the widow $2.4M in a settlement. That says a lot about not wanting to air the dirty linen in public.

Selling "loosies" should not carry a death penalty. You accept that, right?


Selling loosies should not be a crime. They went for murder. there was misconduct on the part of the first officer, but murder was ridiculous.

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to vincentML)
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RE: The Rule of Law - 3/14/2017 9:56:18 AM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline

ORIGINAL: BamaD

They went for murder. there was misconduct on the part of the first officer, but murder was ridiculous.


Is it possible for that to have been the plan...overcharge ...no conviction...cops get off again.

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