RE: Trump's ignorance embarrasses the US and offends its allies (Full Version)

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Termyn8or -> RE: Trump's ignorance embarrasses the US and offends its allies (5/28/2017 2:33:22 AM)

quote:

don't blame other countries for the inabilities of your politicians


Try reading the lines, not between the lines, even though what you claim is not there either. I agree that they do healthcare right. For one their politicians are not on the payroll of drug companies and other investors in the medical industry.

Take that half a fucking trillion (which is due to go up if it already hasn't) and instead of using it to support oil companies, use it to support healthcare, which would include building hospitals run by the government to provide some competition. When they see empty beds they will change their tune.

Someone here asked, may have been you, how many countries have European and other countries invaded and all this, which the US does. Well they haven't of course. What makes them a target is their alliance with the US and I would not doubt that a few regret it.

You have terrorist attacks all over the place and the reason is the countries attacked are allied with the US. Do you see many nations in NAM getting attacked ? (Non Aligned Members)

Upon leaving NATO, nothing would stop the US from helping other countries. It's just we would not owe to do it. Talk about other countries' contributions to the US' effort ? Minimal. Someone mentioned that they don't trust the US. They say it is because of Trump. That is bullshit. The coalition of the willing is sorry they were willing. They found out that the Iraq invasion was based on lies. They found out Assad did not use the gas. They found out it was our own FBI that attacked the WTC the first time in 1993. They found out the US was spying on their leaders, and when Angela Merkel bitched about it I don't know what they said to her but she shut the fuck up very quickly. I wonder if they ever got the rest of their gold back, first of all it was supposed to be there, until they asked for it. Then they said it was "leased out" and then they changed their story again. Even Pearl Harbor, how come the RADAR didn't work ? Well it was hard to get anything out of them and then they said they were expecting a shipment. From fucking Japan which we were REALLY crippling and starving out with that embargo ? Gimme a fucking break. Anyone with a brain in the world already did not trust the US.

And now being under the US' wing has become a curse.

But then, I guess the US has used a standard business model, create a need and fill it. Do you think they built the interstate system for their health ? Bullshit, that was done to facilitate more business and thus more tax revenue. They didn't care if people had to drive on fucking dirt roads all the way from California to New York.

And again, that cold war was the biggest scam ever. And the US did not win really, Russia went broke and the US went into debt. But Russia did not go broke because of the cold war, they went broke because the USSR oppressed the People who began saying "They pretend to pay us so we pretend to work". Production went up, but with a very unacceptable level of defects.

Tell me why was there a cold war with an ally with whom we fought side by side against Hitler ? They villified socialism/communism to get the people not to vote them out over this shit. Instead of admitting to stealing our money to build the biggest military in the world for the real purpose of exploiting other countries' natural resources by force, they invented a "red" bogieman.

So they sold NATO as a deterrent so that another Hitler "would never happen again". What a bunch of bullshit. They just wanted forward eyes and ears to see how their exploits were going. Now that we have satellites, this thing is pretty much obsolete. Drones make it even more obsolete.

If we get out of NATO, just what do you think will happen ? You think someone will attack the US ? Really ? They know that is not too smart. Even KIm Jong Whatever knows that. Have any idea what a ICBM costs ? I doubt the whole GDP of North Korea could afford even one. And they ain't never going to get subs close enough to do anything.

Nope, this time Trump is right.

T^T




WickedsDesire -> RE: Trump's ignorance embarrasses the US and offends its allies (5/28/2017 3:23:41 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Edwird

quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or
Those allies don't pay their fair share. That is one of the reasons they can have health care and a better infrastructure.

Fuck them. Trump is right.


How many European countries instigated and led foundless invasion of the Middle East; increased terrorism and refugee crises all over Europe and around the world via such cage-rattling thereby; irresponsibly allowed numerous mega-bank mergers and then even more irresponsibly deregulated all financial institutions and OTC trading whole-hog, politically and financially destabilizing the whole situation as exists today? And, icing on the cake, revitalized Russian imperialist aspirations in the ME and Balkans?

-This is just the bull in the china shop insisting that the owners 'pay their fair share' for breakage.-

And the oil war hog* US Sec. State Tillerson (Exxon) saying, in effect; "We just want all the profit, but the Europeans should increase our net earnings by paying more of the cost of our own actions." ("Otherwise, US tax payers might actually get pissed off at the oil companies, or something.")

I think somebody snuck something 'unfriendly' into your bong, there;

"Fuck them. Trump is right."

-Fuck the wrecking ball idiots.- Trump is wrong.

*War Pigs- Black Sabbath

"Oilmen gathered in their masses

Just like witches at Black Masses"




I don't normally use quotes but well said.

Bosocx why are you blithering on about affordable energy http://www.macrotrends.net/1369/crude-oil-price-history-chart

It should be as cheap as fuk or in theory near 1950s etc price - factor in a few costs.

But its not because big business, and tax dodgers like trump and the properly elite likes its share of the pie, and then one pie isnt enough, so it wants 2, then 30, then 300, then 3000 etc On and on it goes.





blnymph -> RE: Trump's ignorance embarrasses the US and offends its allies (5/28/2017 3:58:38 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

quote:

don't blame other countries for the inabilities of your politicians


Try reading the lines, not between the lines ...


That's why I posted the link to the G 7 documents. Or rather, the G 6 and someone who thought this was a personality show documents ...


quote:


Someone here asked, may have been you, how many countries have European and other countries invaded and all this, which the US does. Well they haven't of course. What makes them a target is their alliance with the US and I would not doubt that a few regret it.

No wasn't me. If, I would have mentioned the Anglo-French Suez adventure in 1956 ...



quote:



You have terrorist attacks all over the place and the reason is the countries attacked are allied with the US. Do you see many nations in NAM getting attacked ? (Non Aligned Members)


Yes. Mali, Nigeria, Chad, to name just a few. Maybe not covered by your media.

quote:




Upon leaving NATO, nothing would stop the US from helping other countries. It's just we would not owe to do it. Talk about other countries' contributions to the US' effort ? Minimal. Someone mentioned that they don't trust the US. They say it is because of Trump. That is bullshit. The coalition of the willing is sorry they were willing. They found out that the Iraq invasion was based on lies. ...


US officials were informed before GWB arranged the fake news show at the UN that Saddam's WMD were invented by a taxi driver who tried to sell his "informations" to the German and French intelligence services, checked, and found being a fanciful inventor of oriental stories.


Trump is only the peak of a rare assortment of politicians that are nothing anyone could be proud of in past and present. jmho

quote:


...

But then, I guess the US has used a standard business model, create a need and fill it. Do you think they built the interstate system for their health ? Bullshit, that was done to facilitate more business and thus more tax revenue. They didn't care if people had to drive on fucking dirt roads all the way from California to New York.




Is it the kind of infrastructure the quality of which you lament about?

quote:


And again, that cold war was the biggest scam ever. And the US did not win really, Russia went broke and the US went into debt. But Russia did not go broke because of the cold war, they went broke because the USSR oppressed the People who began saying "They pretend to pay us so we pretend to work". Production went up, but with a very unacceptable level of defects.

Tell me why was there a cold war with an ally with whom we fought side by side against Hitler ? They villified socialism/communism to get the people not to vote them out over this shit. Instead of admitting to stealing our money to build the biggest military in the world for the real purpose of exploiting other countries' natural resources by force, they invented a "red" bogieman.

So they sold NATO as a deterrent so that another Hitler "would never happen again". What a bunch of bullshit. They just wanted forward eyes and ears to see how their exploits were going. Now that we have satellites, this thing is pretty much obsolete. Drones make it even more obsolete.


Including those operated from Ramstein airbase ...?

quote:



If we get out of NATO, just what do you think will happen ? ...


Celebrations and lots of laughter in Russia and China. Probably in the US too: The money spared in the US might be divided among insurances, oil companies, building contractors - not only those of course: you 'll be allowed to celebrate and admire some more for draining your pocket. All with a good show put on of course.

More to follow in parts of the world you neither know nor care about.




WickedsDesire -> RE: Trump's ignorance embarrasses the US and offends its allies (5/28/2017 6:06:48 AM)

Thusfar:

6 have said Yes - he may begrudgingly admit it is real, or teeny bit in it and best err on the side of caution whilst trying to save face, and best put in framework to do something to combat it/minimise it. And he will therefore sign the Paris Accord.

6 have said No - he will not admit to it being a tremendously real thing and stuff, and therefore he will not sign the Paris Accord.

I have not one iota of respect for the lying fuk imbecile. But part of me thinks surely he cannot not sign it? Which is why I voted yes. But the more I thought about it, since his ego tweet, and his following tweets, - I Donald will decide, the more uncertain I became. And after witnessing him lurch about on the world stage hes not going to sign it is he?





Termyn8or -> RE: Trump's ignorance embarrasses the US and offends its allies (5/29/2017 1:10:49 AM)

You voted yes on what ?

Get back in your kilt and start blowing those bagpipes. Just do it over there and don't annoy us with that shit.

T^T




blnymph -> RE: Trump's ignorance embarrasses the US and offends its allies (6/2/2017 1:05:05 AM)

"We don't want other countries laughing at us".

Another T failure - he does all he can to achieve exactly that.




bondageerone -> RE: Trump's ignorance embarrasses the US and offends its allies (6/2/2017 1:51:50 AM)

dear Donnie, the world has been laughing at you from the day you started the elections, even funnier and you look just like a third rate actor, in a b movie. but have a nice day. USA> xxx




blnymph -> RE: Trump's ignorance embarrasses the US and offends its allies (6/2/2017 5:19:51 AM)

USA new allies (non signatory states of the Paris accord):
Nicaragua
Syria

(no the list doesn't get any longer)






Musicmystery -> RE: Trump's ignorance embarrasses the US and offends its allies (6/2/2017 5:52:44 AM)

quote:

Trump's ignorance embarrasses the US and offends its allies


Former allies.




BoscoX -> RE: Trump's ignorance embarrasses the US and offends its allies (6/2/2017 5:59:07 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

quote:

Trump's ignorance embarrasses the US and offends its allies


Former allies.


The global warming cult is sooo much like Islam

Fall on your face in worship, learn to recite the Koran and "we let you live"

Quit the cult and "you die"





blnymph -> RE: Trump's ignorance embarrasses the US and offends its allies (6/2/2017 6:22:07 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

quote:

Trump's ignorance embarrasses the US and offends its allies


Former allies.


The global warming cult is sooo much like Islam

Fall on your face in worship, learn to recite the Koran and "we let you live"

Quit the cult and "you die"







ooooooooooooooooooo - of course;

no thread without mooooooooooooooslim conspiracy

194 states on the globe - all mooooooooooooooooooooooooooslim


only 3 that are not - well Syria ... maybe






BoscoX -> RE: Trump's ignorance embarrasses the US and offends its allies (6/2/2017 6:27:19 AM)


You know what they say

If the thick heavy black burka enslavement device fits...




blnymph -> RE: Trump's ignorance embarrasses the US and offends its allies (6/2/2017 7:05:37 AM)

all muslims here too of course:

http://fortune.com/2017/06/01/apple-google-facebook-trump-stay-paris-accord/




Musicmystery -> RE: Trump's ignorance embarrasses the US and offends its allies (6/2/2017 7:45:23 AM)

His complete lack of embarrassment over the profoundly stupid things he says never ceases to amaze me.

Entertainment central, for sure.




WhoreMods -> RE: Trump's ignorance embarrasses the US and offends its allies (6/2/2017 8:27:47 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

His complete lack of embarrassment over the profoundly stupid things he says never ceases to amaze me.

Entertainment central, for sure.

Well, just look at his base: self awareness probably isn't very high on their list of perceived virtues, is it?




heavyblinker -> RE: Trump's ignorance embarrasses the US and offends its allies (6/2/2017 9:13:34 AM)

Trump's America-- hated in 195 countries!

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/06/02/world/us-climate-world-reacts/index.html




BoscoX -> RE: Trump's ignorance embarrasses the US and offends its allies (6/2/2017 9:16:19 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

Trump's America-- hated in 195 countries!

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/06/02/world/us-climate-world-reacts/index.html


"Everybody keep hysterically panicking"

[sm=runaway.gif]






blnymph -> RE: Trump's ignorance embarrasses the US and offends its allies (6/2/2017 9:39:36 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

Trump's America-- hated in 195 countries!

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/06/02/world/us-climate-world-reacts/index.html


not hated ...

just declared a certain politician impersonator talking and acting sh.. - on a global scale

in case nobody noticed yet




Musicmystery -> RE: Trump's ignorance embarrasses the US and offends its allies (6/2/2017 9:47:07 AM)

Colin Powell and Condoleezza Rice both lament the ongoing blowback the US got from leaving the Kyoto agreement. And more conservatives even -- George Schultz and even Rex Tillerson -- think leaving Paris was a bad idea.

History repeats itself yet again. It will take a couple years for the full withdrawal to happen, and decades to undo the damage.

Trump Has No Idea What He Just Did or the Backlash That Awaits

Despite claiming that he's been "hearing from a lot of people," Trump doesn't appear to have any more detailed knowledge of climate change or the 2015 deal now than when he first pledged to cancel it on the campaign trail. The "lots of people" he's heard from include a disproportionate number of climate change deniers, even though there are far more leaders in industry and on both sides of the aisle advocating for the US to remain in the agreement. They have argued that the Paris deal is important to the US, not just for its environmental merits, but also so that the country is not excluded from the rest of the world, both economically and politically.

His months of hints and delays on a decision have drawn more than one comparison to The Bachelor reality show, but one with the highest of stakes. He recently went to the strongest US allies at the G-7 without a clear answer, leading the G-6 to isolate the US when it issued its communiqué that reaffirmed the agreement. As Washington Post columnist Greg Sargent noted, Trump’s nationalist case to exit Paris "does not allow space for recognition of what the Paris deal really is, which is constructive global engagement that serves America’s long term interests, as part of a system of mutually advantageous compromises."

Trump doesn't have any sense of the backlash that's coming for him and the US now that he's kickstarted the process of pulling out, which won't be official for another three years. Two factors will especially hurt the US: First, the world has been dealing with the US as an unreliable partner on climate change for more than two decades, and leaders still well remember the other times the US reversed course on its promises; second, the world has never been more aligned in favor of action, making climate change a much bigger factor in the US relationship with its allies in non-climate related issues—from trade to defense to immigration—than it once was.

Trump officials might have taken note of the consequences of US inconsistency with the 1997 Kyoto climate treaty. President Bill Clinton signed the treaty, which had binding targets, but never submitted it to the Senate for ratification. In 2001, Bush officials declared Kyoto dead and withdrew the US from the agreement. International backlash ensued. Some in the Bush administration, which like Trump's was split on how to handle Kyoto, came to regret how it was handled for the damage it did to the standing of the US in the world.

"Kyoto—this is not talking out of school—was not handled as well as it should have been," Bush's Secretary of State* Colin Powell said in 2002. "And when the blowback came I think it was a sobering experience that everything the American president does has international repercussions."

In her 2011 memoir, then-national security adviser Condoleezza Rice detailed the reaction Bush faced in meetings with European leaders. Because of the way the administration handled the abrupt withdrawal, "we suffered through this issue over the years: drawing that early line in the sand helped to establish our reputation for 'unilateralism.' We handled it badly." Rice called it a "self-inflicted wound that could have been avoided."

US withdrawal also shifted the power dynamics across the world and gave Russia, which signed the agreement, greater leverage in international affairs. Russia's ratification became pivotal to the treaty entering into force, and in turn, it used its ratification to gain Europe's backing to enter the World Trade Organization, even while the US still had outstanding concerns. President Vladimir Putin noted in 2004 that the "EU has met us halfway in talks over the WTO and that cannot but affect positively our position vis-a-vis the Kyoto Protocol." Paris has already met the threshold needed to go into effect, but Russia is still pursuing a similar role and reaffirmed its commitment to the Paris accord today, seasoned with some light trolling: "Of course the effectiveness of implementing this convention without the key participants, perhaps, will be hindered," a Kremlin spokesperson told CNN. "But there is no alternative as of now."

We're decades away from the Kyoto treaty now, but many experts expect a US exit from Paris not to weaken the world's resolve in addressing climate change as much as it will create a power vacuum other countries might be eager to fill. Andrew Light, a senior fellow with the World Resources Institute, says it is "definitely going to hurt the US with respect to other countries sitting down and negotiating on anything the US is interested in." Light, who was a State Department climate official in the Obama administration, argued, "We're creating a vacuum in parts of the world where we have very clear security interests, not just climate, but security in North Africa, the Middle East, and Southeast Asia. It creates an opening that China, the EU, and even India can step in and fill."

Conservatives have issued similar warnings.

In a New York Times op-ed earlier this month, George Shultz, a former Cabinet member of the Reagan and Nixon administrations, and Climate Leadership Council's Ted Halstead wrote, "Global statecraft relies on trust, reputation and credibility, which can be all too easily squandered. The United States is far better off maintaining a seat at the head of the table rather than standing outside. If America fails to honor a global agreement that it helped forge, the repercussions will undercut our diplomatic priorities across the globe, not to mention the country's global standing and the market access of our firms."

It's little surprise that Trump's own secretary of state, Rex Tillerson, agrees, preferring the US to retain a seat at the table.

To find the kind of momentum it eventually gained to enter into force in record time, negotiators in Paris had to bridge differences between developing and industrialized nations. "One of the great achievements of Paris, but sometimes overlooked, is it gave a very strong signal that climate change is no longer an isolated area of diplomacy," Light says. For example, climate change and renewable energy became building blocks in the US relationship with India, leading eventually to a bilateral commitment on climate change in the run-up to Paris.

While the US retreats, other nations are going to be building bridges with China as it curbs its sizeable greenhouse gas footprint. That's already happening: This week, the EU and China engaged in a climate summit where they signaled their "highest political commitment" to Paris, just as Trump pulls out. This will also not help the US president in his much-vaunted fight against terrorism. He's losing goodwill not just with Europe, but with partners in developing nations that stood to benefit from the $3 billion commitment the US had made to climate finance—another commitment that Trump won't deliver on. That means losing one of the main ways the US has built friendly relationships with countries that can otherwise be fraught with tension. Former EPA Administrator Gina McCarthy offers China as an example: "The South China Sea. Human rights. Trade. Currency manipulation. When U.S.-China relations are discussed we often ascribe these issues some level of tension. However, our countries’ cooperation has historically been more cordial and productive in one area: environmental protection."

More: http://www.motherjones.com/environment/2017/05/trump-will-regret-leaving-paris-climate-deal-0

Big on the Bluster.

Short on the thinking and Strategy.




heavyblinker -> RE: Trump's ignorance embarrasses the US and offends its allies (6/2/2017 9:56:35 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX


quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

Trump's America-- hated in 195 countries!

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/06/02/world/us-climate-world-reacts/index.html


"Everybody keep hysterically panicking"

[sm=runaway.gif]


You say this because it's all you have.
There is no panic here.

The last time the right had power, they destroyed the economy and started a ridiculously expensive series of wars that will never really end.

This time, they're going to finish the job.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/donald-trump-us-power-to-collapse-predicted-ussr-fall-johan-galtung-a7460516.html




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