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RE: New to the scene - 7/31/2006 4:11:44 PM   
Pimpernell


Posts: 198
Joined: 12/10/2005
Status: offline 		Well, thanks to Focus50 a few of us now know not to ask any questions on this forum

(in reply to OsideGirl)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: New to the scene - 7/31/2006 5:20:42 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline 		Pimpernell, you can ask all the questions you want, or anyone else for that matter.
It's just very difficult to start from scratch with a new Dom!
We could fill this thread with 1,000 messages like nothing!

(in reply to Pimpernell)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: New to the scene - 8/1/2006 1:41:04 AM   
Focus50


Posts: 3962
Joined: 12/28/2004
From: Newcastle, Australia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Pimpernell

Well, thanks to Focus50 a few of us now know not to ask any questions on this forum

Certainly not if you can't handle a bit of honesty and straight talking, no! 
 
Forums are for diverse opinions; most 30yo's are mature enough to appreciate that - at least, they orta be.... 
 
For those who aren't, the topic is contained in the first post atop page 1 of any thread.  Feel free to offer your own thoughts, or do you just snipe with "drive-by" posts?
 
Focus.

(in reply to Pimpernell)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: New to the scene - 8/1/2006 3:24:32 AM   
Pimpernell


Posts: 198
Joined: 12/10/2005
Status: offline 		"they're skipping too many basic life lessons in being here right now"

That's the line that pissed me off.  On a bad day the translation is: Get off this site, loser.  Leave the young girls to me.

I don't see how looking at a website is stopping you having "basic life experiences."

I agree with almost all of your comments.  He has got to start somewhere.  I know certain people that are abusive to anyone who has not been a member of the armed forces or a mercenary, as if the military "life skills" are the only valid ones, so when people talk about "life skills" I sometimes wonder how much they mean "similar experiences to mine".

Yes, he needs to experience life.  It doesn't mean he shouldn't be asking questions until he reaches a mythical score of *Life Skills: 12* or whatever.  I'd rather he learns about being a dom as he learns about life, not trying to tack it on later.

The "gentleman" question and basic dom behaviour doesn't mean the same thing to you as it does to him.  He's dealing with a situation where being a nice guy gets you treated like crap from girls his age after being told girls like nice guys.  He's also first learning how confused a lot of girls are after being told how strong and independant every single one of them is.

Considering the number of boys being raised without male role models and with a school system and culture that is virulently anti-male, expect more basic questions.  By all means chime in with your constructive comments as most of what you wrote was spot on, just the tone could be misinterpretted.

I did overreact to your comments, but I have seen too many times people get downright abusive in response to a valid question.


< Message edited by Pimpernell -- 8/1/2006 3:32:08 AM >

(in reply to Focus50)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: New to the scene - 8/1/2006 5:09:21 AM   
Focus50


Posts: 3962
Joined: 12/28/2004
From: Newcastle, Australia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Pimpernell

"they're skipping too many basic life lessons in being here right now"

That's the line that pissed me off.  On a bad day the translation is: Get off this site, loser.  Leave the young girls to me.

I don't see how looking at a website is stopping you having "basic life experiences."

I agree with almost all of your comments.  He has got to start somewhere.  I know certain people that are abusive to anyone who has not been a member of the armed forces or a mercenary, as if the military "life skills" are the only valid ones, so when people talk about "life skills" I sometimes wonder how much they mean "similar experiences to mine".

Yes, he needs to experience life.  It doesn't mean he shouldn't be asking questions until he reaches a mythical score of *Life Skills: 12* or whatever.  I'd rather he learns about being a dom as he learns about life, not trying to tack it on later.

The "gentleman" question and basic dom behaviour doesn't mean the same thing to you as it does to him.  He's dealing with a situation where being a nice guy gets you treated like crap from girls his age after being told girls like nice guys.  He's also first learning how confused a lot of girls are after being told how strong and independant every single one of them is.

Considering the number of boys being raised without male role models and with a school system and culture that is virulently anti-male, expect more basic questions.  By all means chime in with your constructive comments as most of what you wrote was spot on, just the tone could be misinterpretted.

I did overreact to your comments, but I have seen too many times people get downright abusive in response to a valid question.

Other than you're either his/their official spokesman or you just love generalising about what strangers may or may not think or have experienced, this is a pretty good reply....
 
Don't know about the military (I always sucked at taking orders so didn't risk it) but, to me, "life skills" can be anything that teaches you responsibility, pride, respect, humility etc.  Struggling to pay the rent; dragging yourself to a job you loathe in order to pay that rent and still possibly face eviction; the cold fury of coming home to a burgled house; looking after a sick rellie or dealing with the consequences of disability; raising a child that won't stop crying; feeling like the World is against you but still you battle on....  These things and/or at least a hundred I can't think of right now all mould character and set you up for life - to define the person you become.  And it takes time....
 
But the "gentleman" question????  I acknowledged he's deserving of points for his candour but that is still one scarey red flag for anyone to wave.  And my question still stands and remained unanswered - why is he even in the lifestyle if he's unsure if it's ok to be a decent fella towards women?  This from (I think) a 24yo, NOT a pre-pubescent!
 
Respect is earnt - if you'd posted this first then taken your shot at me, you might have gotten some respect back.  But I still don't see my answers as abusive; merely unpopular with some.  Truth is like that - it cuts, often deep....
 
Focus.

(in reply to Pimpernell)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: New to the scene - 8/1/2006 10:01:38 PM   
strata


Posts: 6
Joined: 7/24/2006
Status: offline 		Okay guys, I appreceate everything you have posted, But please, Lets not start some sort of conflict in this thread...  Its not needed, and quite franking, not helping anyone. I see what may be fine to one person, might be overly harsh to others who read it that way. Ive been doing some reading, and still trying to really get my footing.. Now the tricky part.. for me atleast.. finding someplace that i can go see in person..

(in reply to Focus50)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: New to the scene - 8/2/2006 10:35:17 AM   
FirmhandKY


Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: strata

Okay guys, I appreceate everything you have posted, But please, Lets not start some sort of conflict in this thread...  Its not needed, and quite franking, not helping anyone. I see what may be fine to one person, might be overly harsh to others who read it that way. Ive been doing some reading, and still trying to really get my footing.. Now the tricky part.. for me atleast.. finding someplace that i can go see in person..


I have higher respect for strata's people skills and earnestness than I do for some other dominants that apparently have a lot of "life skills".

I think one of the first, most important parts about learning how to "be" a dom is to not let others' pissy attitude discourage you from your goal. 

In the end, we all educate ourselves, anyway, and people just provide us our lessons.

I see a great lesson in this thread, about how a "dom-in-the-making" has shown the restraint and good sense that a good dom needs.

I think he is well on his way.

Luck to you, sir.

FHky




_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to strata)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: New to the scene - 8/3/2006 4:54:38 AM   
Focus50


Posts: 3962
Joined: 12/28/2004
From: Newcastle, Australia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

I have higher respect for strata's people skills and earnestness than I do for some other dominants that apparently have a lot of "life skills".

I think one of the first, most important parts about learning how to "be" a dom is to not let others' pissy attitude discourage you from your goal. 

In the end, we all educate ourselves, anyway, and people just provide us our lessons.

I see a great lesson in this thread, about how a "dom-in-the-making" has shown the restraint and good sense that a good dom needs.

I think he is well on his way.

Luck to you, sir.

Pissy attitude?  Perhaps you're right, instead of offering diverse opinions maybe we should all gather around for group hugs; sing uplifting folk songs and with misted eyes encourage each other to be anything we wanna be; even President of the US of A!
 
Mate, you don't hafta like my opinions but suck it up and respect I still have the right to proffer them with the sincerity I've done.  I hear what you say but only because it's hard to ignore any loud-mouth barracking from the bleachers.  Hell, lawyers and used car salesmen have "people skills"....
 
Focus.

(in reply to FirmhandKY)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: New to the scene - 8/3/2006 6:29:20 AM   
FirmhandKY


Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline 		Focus50,

Sometimes, it's not what we say, but how we say it. 

FHky


_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to Focus50)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: New to the scene - 8/3/2006 6:58:57 AM   
spankmepink11


Posts: 1310
Joined: 9/28/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Focus50

Perhaps you're right, instead of offering diverse opinions maybe we should all gather around for group hugs; sing uplifting folk songs and with misted eyes encourage each other to be anything we wanna be; even President of the US of A!
 


That actually works for me , with  some recreational pain and beatings thrown in for good measure......anyone care to join me in a chorus of "i'd like to teach the world to sing" ?

But...in regards to the OP it's been only in recent months  that i've been laying aside my views that the very young can't possibly know enough about themselves and life to  know  what  they are..or what they seek. 
 The younger generations have much more information readily available to them that  help explain their feelings and desires  than those of us who were not given the information to better understand ourselves , as we were maturing. I do agree however,  that time and life experience are invaluable.
I've yet to completely dispel my own misgivings about those who want to "learn to be a Dominant"   because i can't help but feel that it should come naturally, but i try to equate it with a very artistic person taking art lessons....or someone with a natural flair for music taking  music lessons. 

I agree with those who have suggested that the OP read as much as possible and observe other Dominants interacting with submissives.

Good Luck

(in reply to Focus50)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: New to the scene - 8/4/2006 4:07:15 AM   
Focus50


Posts: 3962
Joined: 12/28/2004
From: Newcastle, Australia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: spankmepink11

quote:

ORIGINAL: Focus50

Perhaps you're right, instead of offering diverse opinions maybe we should all gather around for group hugs; sing uplifting folk songs and with misted eyes encourage each other to be anything we wanna be; even President of the US of A!
 


That actually works for me , with  some recreational pain and beatings thrown in for good measure......anyone care to join me in a chorus of "i'd like to teach the world to sing" ?

But...in regards to the OP it's been only in recent months  that i've been laying aside my views that the very young can't possibly know enough about themselves and life to  know  what  they are..or what they seek. 
The younger generations have much more information readily available to them that  help explain their feelings and desires  than those of us who were not given the information to better understand ourselves , as we were maturing. I do agree however,  that time and life experience are invaluable.
I've yet to completely dispel my own misgivings about those who want to "learn to be a Dominant"   because i can't help but feel that it should come naturally, but i try to equate it with a very artistic person taking art lessons....or someone with a natural flair for music taking  music lessons. 

I agree with those who have suggested that the OP read as much as possible and observe other Dominants interacting with submissives.

Yes, anyone now starting out in BDSM has a huge leg-up via the Net and it's unrivalled resources as well as society's more liberal attitudes in general....  However, I still maintain that access to resources does NOT bestow wisdom or maturity!  But rather than be the anti-youth ogre some have tried to portray me as in this thread, I'm here to be educated, too! 
 
So for my future reference, I'd actually be interested in knowing exactly what brings a teenager to an alternative lifestyle; what void in his everyday life and relationships went unfulfilled?  Until I hear otherwise, my worldly experiences and predjudices tell me a teen dom is here on an ego trip; is being "the man" or proving what a warrior he is; is "shirking the hard work and basic training of infantry to go straight to officer training school".  There's no 20yo generals in any army, what justifies or qualifies teen doms to take responsibility over another, other than they can now legally access adult sites?
 
I'd genuinely like to know but (not aimed at you, spankme) if it's just gonna be more drive-by cheap shots, I can deal with those, too!
 
Focus.

(in reply to spankmepink11)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: New to the scene - 8/4/2006 4:26:33 AM   
RavenMuse


Posts: 4030
Joined: 1/23/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Focus50
I'd actually be interested in knowing exactly what brings a teenager to an alternative lifestyle; what void in his everyday life and relationships went unfulfilled?


OK whilst I am now far far from those teen years. I've been doing what we do for the last 25 years.... yep, I was a teen when I found D/s, so am going to interject a little here.

Does maturity and experience count for a lot? Hell yes, but is it everything? No.
Being a Dom comes from within. I know there are those who try to say otherwise, but from my point of view if it doesn't come from within, fine, your a Top.

I was 15 when a young lady introduced me to the concepts of BDSM and D/s. Whilst BDSM was fun, D/s was 'comming home', it was OK to simply act naturaly, to take control of that which I cared about, to break past the social conditioning which tried to dictate 'equality' and impose its definition of what that ment. D/s was simply part of who I am, how I naturaly react in a relationship with a girl I care for.

Whilst since then maturity and experience have helped me learn more about who I am, how I 'tick', helped me refine my methods and skills. But essentialy I am the same person now as I was then, the same drives and mostly similar attitudes.

Like yourself Focus, I am somewhat skeptical of many youngsters comming into this, especialy on the Dom side. But then I remember who I was when I started, how I approached it, the responsibilitys I took up (As well as the multitude of mistakes I made and learned from) and take a step back. It may make it less likely for them to be doing this for the right reasons, but it doesn't make it impossible.

Everyone starts somewhere.


_____________________________

This above all: to thine own self be true,
And it must follow, as the night the day,
Thou canst not then be false to any man.

Owner of metalmiss

(in reply to Focus50)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: New to the scene - 8/4/2006 4:56:33 AM   
BillsGalSusan


Posts: 69
Joined: 7/18/2006
Status: offline 		At the risk of being branded a Luddite, I see a disadvantage here for young kinksters of the D/s persuasion in the easy access to the often misleading information on the web. It's not that I don't see the advantages, too. It really is terrific that those of us who have those leanings can see that we are not alone or entirely weird.

The problem I see is that IRL, as we discover and explore these parts of our personality, we tend to grow incrementally and, from a developmental point of view, incorporate what we are learning about ourselves in one area into the mix of things we are learning about ourselves in other areas. We don't tell ourselves that we somehow become a dominant or a submissive by doing or saying X,Y, or Z and then talking about it in a chat room or on a BBS.

My sense is that all of this actually does work itself out, over time, and that ultimately people who really are dominant or submissive actually are more helped by this than harmed, but I do sorta feel sorry for people like the OP who don't have the opportunity to grow into their dominance (or submission) in what I see as perhaps a more natural way. I freely admit that this is a POV based mainly on my own experience as Bill and I grew together as a D/s couple beginning when we were in our late teens.

Another Susan

(in reply to RavenMuse)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: New to the scene - 8/4/2006 4:58:42 AM   
Elorin


Posts: 970
Joined: 8/22/2004
From: San Antonio, TX
Status: offline 		News for a new Dom:

Don't act a certain way. So many stereotypical attitudes and "ways to behave" that you see around the net are nothing more than stereotypes and assumptions. I know very vew Doms that are respected in the local scene who behave this way.

So how do you act? Behave as you would around your friends. The only person you have a right to tell what to do is a sub who has agreed to give you control. Being overbearing or controlling towards all subs, or worse, towards other Doms, is inappropriate and obnoxious.

Use manners. When you tell a sub to do something, and they do it, say thank you. Say excuse me when you interrupt someone. When asking someone to look at their toys, say please. Manners are grease that helps the world function smoothly, and there is nothing that is incompatiible with dominance and manners.

By all means, be a gentleman. My dom insists on opening doors for me and walking closest to traffic when we are in a parking lot or on the street. Insisting that I wait for him to open the door was a control measure that took me months to learn to obey, as I'm so used to opening my own doors. Walking closest to traffic is an expression of his protective nature, protecting his property (me). Anything that you do with a submissive, if you insist upon it, becomes a control measure. If you insist upon being a gentleman, then it is part of your dominance. And, in my opinion, something to be admired.

The best dominants, the one I respect the most both as owned property and as a Domme in my own right, are those who know how to listen to others with more experience, and learn from them; those who are not afraid to admit mistakes, and learn from them; those who are aware of their own flaws, and not ashamed to admit them to their subs; those who accept responsibility for all of their actions, which means taking the blame if they had a bad idea and wallowing in the praise when they had a good idea; those who can relax and hang out w/out having their dominant personality conflict with a good conversation; those who are willing to show others their skills, yet know whether they have enough skill to teach others; those who aren't afraid to say "back off, I'm busy" if they are interrupted at an appropriate time; those who do not act superior and talk down to others because they are new, or young, even though they may see that youth or newness might end up being a downfall.

Don't be afraid to be yourself. Don't pretend to be something you are not. Don't be afraid to learn from someone more experienced, whether Dom/me or sub. Realize that there IS a lot for you to learn, about the lifestyle, and the younger that you are, about life. Take people who make assumptions about what you can possibly know, or your motivations, in stride. Time will tell with everything. Rather than defend yourself against those who cry "you are so young!" admit "yes, I am young, and I want to learn, I know I will make mistakes along the way, but I want to be good at what I do, and this is something I want to do."

Good luck. Learning to whip someone, flog someone, spank, pierce, tie someone - you can pick up those skills. Learning how to be a dominant is the art of learning to be comfortable with who and what you are, learning to want to improve yourself so that you will be a better dominant for your submissive, and learning to take control gracefully from those who offer it, rather than demanding it from those who have not.

(in reply to RavenMuse)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: New to the scene - 8/4/2006 5:13:51 AM   
Mavis


Posts: 828
Joined: 2/8/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Focus50
 "shirking the hard work and basic training of infantry to go straight to officer training school". 

 
Sorry Sir, but the US army, that's exactly how it works.  The officers go directly into officer training, they don't start out as enlisted, then "rank up" to command.  There are two ladders, you get on the officer ladder or the enlisted ladder. They'll both have a measure of leadership and authority, but one ladder will always outrank the same respective rung on the other ladder.

quote:

There's no 20yo generals in any army, what justifies or qualifies teen doms to take responsibility over another, other than they can now legally access adult sites?
 


No Sir.  They're 20 year old lieutenents. Which outrank 40 year old Sgt Majors.    But, when there is stuff to learn,  a smart Lt will ask advice of the highest enlisted man (or woman!)  around, respecting their time in grade and life experince.
 
i think most submissives understand a Dom has to start somewhere, but still, most of us will look for time in grade, OR some evidence of maturity that makes up for a lack of time to develop.

(in reply to Focus50)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: New to the scene - 8/4/2006 5:17:35 AM   
Mavis


Posts: 828
Joined: 2/8/2004
Status: offline 		Elorin, well said. i like you already.  :)

(in reply to Mavis)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: New to the scene - 8/4/2006 5:44:57 AM   
WillowRain


Posts: 191
Joined: 6/18/2006
Status: offline 		Elorin has offered sage and practical advice.

I would add in, join a local group and pick something you are really drawn to that you can learn. If you adore rope, then that, flogging strikes you as elegant and beautiful, start there. It will give you something to share with others who are learning, top and bottom - a way to start conversations, a skill set that you can become acomplished in.You can go to classes, pratice and learn. Her sugestion for a mentor is a rocking good one. Look for someone who's submissives are really happy, respectful. loyal, and have been with that dominant for over a year. Making something work short time, or part time, is not at all the same skill set as full time, over time. Dominants will sometimes talk all kinds of smack about their skills, or abilitites, sometimes real, sometimes imagined, look to their girls/boys. The ability of the Dominant will show there. Best of luck!

(in reply to Elorin)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: New to the scene - 8/5/2006 3:21:45 AM   
Focus50


Posts: 3962
Joined: 12/28/2004
From: Newcastle, Australia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RavenMuse

quote:

ORIGINAL: Focus50
I'd actually be interested in knowing exactly what brings a teenager to an alternative lifestyle; what void in his everyday life and relationships went unfulfilled?


OK whilst I am now far far from those teen years. I've been doing what we do for the last 25 years.... yep, I was a teen when I found D/s, so am going to interject a little here.

Does maturity and experience count for a lot? Hell yes, but is it everything? No.
Being a Dom comes from within. I know there are those who try to say otherwise, but from my point of view if it doesn't come from within, fine, your a Top.

I was 15 when a young lady introduced me to the concepts of BDSM and D/s. Whilst BDSM was fun, D/s was 'comming home', it was OK to simply act naturaly, to take control of that which I cared about, to break past the social conditioning which tried to dictate 'equality' and impose its definition of what that ment. D/s was simply part of who I am, how I naturaly react in a relationship with a girl I care for.

Whilst since then maturity and experience have helped me learn more about who I am, how I 'tick', helped me refine my methods and skills. But essentialy I am the same person now as I was then, the same drives and mostly similar attitudes.

Like yourself Focus, I am somewhat skeptical of many youngsters comming into this, especialy on the Dom side. But then I remember who I was when I started, how I approached it, the responsibilitys I took up (As well as the multitude of mistakes I made and learned from) and take a step back. It may make it less likely for them to be doing this for the right reasons, but it doesn't make it impossible.

Everyone starts somewhere.

Not quite what I'm looking for....
 
With all due respect, you may have been an active teen dom, but that doesn't qualify you to answer from that perspective *25 years* later.  We all evolve, mature and subtly change over time, and the memory certainly becomes both deceptive and selective - looking back with "rose coloured" glasses, so to speak, is not a true appraisal of how it once was....
 
Focus.

(in reply to RavenMuse)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: New to the scene - 8/5/2006 3:43:08 AM   
Focus50


Posts: 3962
Joined: 12/28/2004
From: Newcastle, Australia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mavis

quote:

ORIGINAL: Focus50
 "shirking the hard work and basic training of infantry to go straight to officer training school". 
 
 Sorry Sir, but the US army, that's exactly how it works.  The officers go directly into officer training, they don't start out as enlisted, then "rank up" to command.  There are two ladders, you get on the officer ladder or the enlisted ladder. They'll both have a measure of leadership and authority, but one ladder will always outrank the same respective rung on the other ladder.

Ok, maybe not such a great example on my part but I still find it hard to believe officer cadets apparently don't do some form of basic training at least?
quote:

There's no 20yo generals in any army, what justifies or qualifies teen doms to take responsibility over another, other than they can now legally access adult sites?
 
quote:

No Sir.  They're 20 year old lieutenents. Which outrank 40 year old Sgt Majors.    But, when there is stuff to learn,  a smart Lt will ask advice of the highest enlisted man (or woman!)  around, respecting their time in grade and life experince.

i think most submissives understand a Dom has to start somewhere, but still, most of us will look for time in grade, OR some evidence of maturity that makes up for a lack of time to develop.

I can't help thinking the 40yo Sgt Major is respecting the rank in this instance, not it's 20yo bearer.  Which is not true of the lifestyle - "promoting" oneself to dom status doesn't get you respect; nor should it!  Still, coulda been worse, you could've hit me with Alexander the Great!  lol
 
Focus.

(in reply to Mavis)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: New to the scene - 8/5/2006 4:14:03 AM   
RavenMuse


Posts: 4030
Joined: 1/23/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Focus50
Not quite what I'm looking for....
 
With all due respect, you may have been an active teen dom, but that doesn't qualify you to answer from that perspective *25 years* later.  We all evolve, mature and subtly change over time, and the memory certainly becomes both deceptive and selective - looking back with "rose coloured" glasses, so to speak, is not a true appraisal of how it once was....


OK now THAT was nothing more than arrogant bullshit Focus. Yes it is 25 years later and the wording is from my mindset now, however the other thing I have learned in that 25 years is how NOT too look back at my past through "Rose coloured glasses". Maybe you do so with your past, do not assume that to be true for everyone.

I am better, a LOT better at being a Master than I was then, however that is where it began and in an honest apprasal, who *I* was at 15, I was a lot better than I normaly give young folks credit for when seeing them come into this for the first time. Just because I am a cynical old goat doesn't mean my misgivings are justified about ALL of them (Though I would join you in placing money on the fact that it is quite justified in the majority of cases)


_____________________________

This above all: to thine own self be true,
And it must follow, as the night the day,
Thou canst not then be false to any man.

Owner of metalmiss

(in reply to Focus50)
Profile   Post #: 40
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