quote:

ORIGINAL: Milesnmiles

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75
FR
Let's remember that God SENT Katrina too! So he better be sending the "jeep, a truck, a boat, and a helicopter" to fix the mess and devastation he made!

Do you realy think that God has nothing better to do than sit around deciding what our weather is going to be from day to day?
So no, God did not SEND any of the Katria.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75
Natural Disasters like what happened in Noah's Ark, is 100% God's work of destruction of his creations whenever he throws a tantrum.

The flood of Noah's day was not a Natural Disaster, that flood was sent by God for a very specific reason.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75
I just feel like Christians always only acknowledge the "good stuffs" their God did. But fail to acknowledge that he is capable of destroying anything that he is not happy with as well.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75
It has always been his SOP.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75
It's his Universe. He does whatever he wants as he please. (Let's not forget, according to Christianity, the goal of Christians is to save as many people as possible by converting them to Christianity, before the end of the world. Apparently, according to the bible, this earth has a limited life span. And God gave it a dateline and will destroy all again.)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75
The conundrum here is.
IS natural disaster caused by climate change? Or is it caused by God who just feels like doing it at his wimp?
There is no other answer.
It's either, "Human's fault aka Climate Change", or God's Fault aka, it's beyond human control, he is controlling it.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75
Well, another super Christian country who keeps getting terrorized by natural disaster is the super holy Philippines.
But the Vatican City seem safe!
So, oh well.

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods
My understanding of Job is that everything that happens (including the weather) is too God's fault as that whole book of the old testament makes it clear that God is deliberately tormenting the poor bastard to prove a point to Satan. He says as much when he finally deigns to answer Job's very justified tantrum towards the end, doesn't He?

quote:

ORIGINAL: itsSIRtou

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

my goodness greta please...

I'm wondering if greta has heard of the Westboro Baptist Church.

Now that you've mentioned that, it's weird how these hurricanes seem to concentrate on hitting red states during republican presidencies, isn't it?

Well, red states DO tend to be in the SE US and hurricanes tend to hit......guess where?

Of course, but rational explanations supported by centuries of observation and scientific enquiry are a lot less fun than suggesting that God is picking on somebody, aren't they?

but rational explanations supported by centuries of observation and scientific enquiry also doesn't get butts in the pews and/or on the TV & cell phone, and subsequently making donations to support religious leaders driving around in expensive cars, owning their own private jets, and living in McMansions ether.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Milesnmiles

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods
My understanding of Job is that everything that happens (including the weather) is too God's fault as that whole book of the old testament makes it clear that God is deliberately tormenting the poor bastard to prove a point to Satan. He says as much when he finally deigns to answer Job's very justified tantrum towards the end, doesn't He?

Once again I'm amazed that people who want to criticize the God of the Bible, will do so on hearsay and not on what the Bible actually says. If you were to actually read the account you reference, you might notice that God not torment the "poor bastard".

quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX
Leftists are literally all insane howlers.

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD
Yes, it does me. And Christians far more forcefully denounce Westbrook than Moslems denounce Jihadists.

Really? They've mostly been very quiet indeed about that.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44
"allowing" things to occur is not the same as "causing" them to occur.

To me it's the same thing. IF he had the power to save people, rather than wait till shit happen and then sent all that helicopters or red cross to rescue people. It's like, WTF God? WTF? He already made a decision in advance who will survive and who will die.

One thing I always learn about Christianity is that, although he claims to give "free will", BUT let's face it. He does choose when to interfere and when not to interfere. When a miracle happens, like some miracle some person who faced extreme situation in this disaster should have died, but somewhat survived. People say it's because of God's doing. THAT IS interfering. So end of the day, he has full control on everything that happens. He save those who he wanted to continue living.

The complication in believing in a creator is, that he does whatever he wants, how he wants it. But I don't have to agree with his decision making. In Katrina and in Texas, his decision was, let them suffer first. I will send "rescue teams in later" to save those who survive.

Imagine if you were a creator of a product and it contains defects, aka, natural disasters, in normal human understanding, you would be liable for that "defect". But if you were all powerful and nobody can really do anything to you. It's like, whatever. Do whatever! No consequences, except those who suffered from it.

End of the day, if men were made in God's image. And men are fallible. Clearly, God don't make perfect decisions all the time too. Except, he is the most powerful being in the Universe. Thus, whoever has the most power calls the shot.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Milesnmiles
You continue to condemn God on hearsay and seem to be happy with that state of affairs but that doesn't make what you say about God right or true.

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods

quote:

ORIGINAL: Milesnmiles

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75
FR
Let's remember that God SENT Katrina too! So he better be sending the "jeep, a truck, a boat, and a helicopter" to fix the mess and devastation he made!

Do you realy think that God has nothing better to do than sit around deciding what our weather is going to be from day to day?
So no, God did not SEND any of the Katria.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75
Natural Disasters like what happened in Noah's Ark, is 100% God's work of destruction of his creations whenever he throws a tantrum.

The flood of Noah's day was not a Natural Disaster, that flood was sent by God for a very specific reason.

So who sent all the other floods in history without warning or reason if it wasn't God?
Bear in mind that arguments about a fallen world aren't very convincing in this case as the events of the flood and the tower of Babel took place at least three or four generations after mankind's fall from grace and exile from Eden, but God made a point of admitting full responsibility for both of these.
It isn't like insurance companies describe natural disasters as "acts of God" or anything, after all...

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods

quote:

ORIGINAL: Milesnmiles

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods
My understanding of Job is that everything that happens (including the weather) is too God's fault as that whole book of the old testament makes it clear that God is deliberately tormenting the poor bastard to prove a point to Satan. He says as much when he finally deigns to answer Job's very justified tantrum towards the end, doesn't He?

Once again I'm amazed that people who want to criticize the God of the Bible, will do so on hearsay and not on what the Bible actually says. If you were to actually read the account you reference, you might notice that God not torment the "poor bastard".

I've read Job several times, and nothing would have happened to the poor bastard if God hadn't agreed to let Satan torment him. The whole set up makes it clear that Satan can do nothing in the physical (or if you prefer "fallen") world without God's permission: arguing that it was Satan not God who abused Job is like claiming that Osama bin Laden bore no responsibility for the events of 11/9 because he had other people carry out the suicide attacks for him rather than doing them himself.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Milesnmiles

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD
Yes, it does me. And Christians far more forcefully denounce Westbrook than Moslems denounce Jihadists.

Really? They've mostly been very quiet indeed about that.

Well, they wouldn't have to do much to be more forceful than Moslems denouncing Jihadists.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Milesnmiles

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods

quote:

ORIGINAL: Milesnmiles

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods
My understanding of Job is that everything that happens (including the weather) is too God's fault as that whole book of the old testament makes it clear that God is deliberately tormenting the poor bastard to prove a point to Satan. He says as much when he finally deigns to answer Job's very justified tantrum towards the end, doesn't He?

Once again I'm amazed that people who want to criticize the God of the Bible, will do so on hearsay and not on what the Bible actually says. If you were to actually read the account you reference, you might notice that God not torment the "poor bastard".

I've read Job several times, and nothing would have happened to the poor bastard if God hadn't agreed to let Satan torment him. The whole set up makes it clear that Satan can do nothing in the physical (or if you prefer "fallen") world without God's permission: arguing that it was Satan not God who abused Job is like claiming that Osama bin Laden bore no responsibility for the events of 11/9 because he had other people carry out the suicide attacks for him rather than doing them himself.

Great you can read, too bad you didn't work on reading comprehension while you were at it.

The "whole set up" only shows that there are things that Satan cannot do to God's servants without God allowing it, other than that there lots of things Satan can do in the physical world.

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods

quote:

ORIGINAL: Milesnmiles
You continue to condemn God on hearsay and seem to be happy with that state of affairs but that doesn't make what you say about God right or true.

It's called "faith" when something positive is being said about God on hearsay. Given that God refuses to provide any evidence for His existence, the whole Bible and everything else that has ever been written about Him is hearsay, isn't it? It seems strange that you're not allowing condemnation the same leeway as the other gets.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Milesnmiles

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods

quote:

ORIGINAL: Milesnmiles
You continue to condemn God on hearsay and seem to be happy with that state of affairs but that doesn't make what you say about God right or true.

It's called "faith" when something positive is being said about God on hearsay. Given that God refuses to provide any evidence for His existence, the whole Bible and everything else that has ever been written about Him is hearsay, isn't it? It seems strange that you're not allowing condemnation the same leeway as the other gets.

Who calls "faith" that? Because the Bible certainly doesn't.

God refuses to provide "any evidence for His existence"? Just because you don't want to accept the evidence God has provided doesn't mean he hasn't provided it.

Strange? What I called hearsay is when someone spouts a distorted version of what the Bible is supposed to say because they are repeating someone's distorted version of what the Bible says rather than talking directly about what the Bible actually says. Do you really think that "leeway" should be allowed for that?

Also, if you want to talk about whether the Bible is "hearsay" or not, we can discuss that as well.

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods

quote:

ORIGINAL: Milesnmiles

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods

quote:

ORIGINAL: Milesnmiles

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods
My understanding of Job is that everything that happens (including the weather) is too God's fault as that whole book of the old testament makes it clear that God is deliberately tormenting the poor bastard to prove a point to Satan. He says as much when he finally deigns to answer Job's very justified tantrum towards the end, doesn't He?

Once again I'm amazed that people who want to criticize the God of the Bible, will do so on hearsay and not on what the Bible actually says. If you were to actually read the account you reference, you might notice that God not torment the "poor bastard".

I've read Job several times, and nothing would have happened to the poor bastard if God hadn't agreed to let Satan torment him. The whole set up makes it clear that Satan can do nothing in the physical (or if you prefer "fallen") world without God's permission: arguing that it was Satan not God who abused Job is like claiming that Osama bin Laden bore no responsibility for the events of 11/9 because he had other people carry out the suicide attacks for him rather than doing them himself.

Great you can read, too bad you didn't work on reading comprehension while you were at it.

The "whole set up" only shows that there are things that Satan cannot do to God's servants without God allowing it, other than that there lots of things Satan can do in the physical world.

God specifically gives Satan a free hand with the world around Job and Job's family, but is warned bot to kill Job himself.
You can't grasp that and you're making snotty digs at my comprehension?
Cute.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Milesnmiles

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods

quote:

ORIGINAL: Milesnmiles

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods

quote:

ORIGINAL: Milesnmiles

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods
My understanding of Job is that everything that happens (including the weather) is too God's fault as that whole book of the old testament makes it clear that God is deliberately tormenting the poor bastard to prove a point to Satan. He says as much when he finally deigns to answer Job's very justified tantrum towards the end, doesn't He?

Once again I'm amazed that people who want to criticize the God of the Bible, will do so on hearsay and not on what the Bible actually says. If you were to actually read the account you reference, you might notice that God not torment the "poor bastard".

I've read Job several times, and nothing would have happened to the poor bastard if God hadn't agreed to let Satan torment him. The whole set up makes it clear that Satan can do nothing in the physical (or if you prefer "fallen") world without God's permission: arguing that it was Satan not God who abused Job is like claiming that Osama bin Laden bore no responsibility for the events of 11/9 because he had other people carry out the suicide attacks for him rather than doing them himself.

Great you can read, too bad you didn't work on reading comprehension while you were at it.

The "whole set up" only shows that there are things that Satan cannot do to God's servants without God allowing it, other than that there lots of things Satan can do in the physical world.

God specifically gives Satan a free hand with the world around Job and Job's family, but is warned bot to kill Job himself.
You can't grasp that and you're making snotty digs at my comprehension?
Cute.

Since your "comprehension" is so "outstanding" why you don't explain what is actually going on in this "whole set up"?

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods

quote:

ORIGINAL: Milesnmiles

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods

quote:

ORIGINAL: Milesnmiles
You continue to condemn God on hearsay and seem to be happy with that state of affairs but that doesn't make what you say about God right or true.

It's called "faith" when something positive is being said about God on hearsay. Given that God refuses to provide any evidence for His existence, the whole Bible and everything else that has ever been written about Him is hearsay, isn't it? It seems strange that you're not allowing condemnation the same leeway as the other gets.

Who calls "faith" that? Because the Bible certainly doesn't.

God refuses to provide "any evidence for His existence"? Just because you don't want to accept the evidence God has provided doesn't mean he hasn't provided it.

Strange? What I called hearsay is when someone spouts a distorted version of what the Bible is supposed to say because they are repeating someone's distorted version of what the Bible says rather than talking directly about what the Bible actually says. Do you really think that "leeway" should be allowed for that?

Also, if you want to talk about whether the Bible is "hearsay" or not, we can discuss that as well.

I'm talking about faith in God as hearsay, not the rest.
But you're big on evasion, so i can appreciate that you don't want to address that.

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods

quote:

ORIGINAL: Milesnmiles

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods

quote:

ORIGINAL: Milesnmiles

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods

quote:

ORIGINAL: Milesnmiles

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods
My understanding of Job is that everything that happens (including the weather) is too God's fault as that whole book of the old testament makes it clear that God is deliberately tormenting the poor bastard to prove a point to Satan. He says as much when he finally deigns to answer Job's very justified tantrum towards the end, doesn't He?

Once again I'm amazed that people who want to criticize the God of the Bible, will do so on hearsay and not on what the Bible actually says. If you were to actually read the account you reference, you might notice that God not torment the "poor bastard".

I've read Job several times, and nothing would have happened to the poor bastard if God hadn't agreed to let Satan torment him. The whole set up makes it clear that Satan can do nothing in the physical (or if you prefer "fallen") world without God's permission: arguing that it was Satan not God who abused Job is like claiming that Osama bin Laden bore no responsibility for the events of 11/9 because he had other people carry out the suicide attacks for him rather than doing them himself.

Great you can read, too bad you didn't work on reading comprehension while you were at it.

The "whole set up" only shows that there are things that Satan cannot do to God's servants without God allowing it, other than that there lots of things Satan can do in the physical world.

God specifically gives Satan a free hand with the world around Job and Job's family, but is warned bot to kill Job himself.
You can't grasp that and you're making snotty digs at my comprehension?
Cute.

Since your "comprehension" is so "outstanding" why you don't explain what is actually going on in this "whole set up"?

Why bother? You're obviously unwilling to consider any interpretation besides the one you favour yourself.