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[Poll]

Are cakes art?


No: thinking that they are is really gay
  35% (10)
No: of course they're not
  3% (1)
Don't know
  0% (0)
Don't care
  17% (5)
Maybe if they're really good cakes
  7% (2)
Yes: anybody who can charge for a made to order cake is an artisan
  28% (8)
Yes: if Haring and Koon's smug whiffle is art, so's a fancy cake
  7% (2)


Total Votes : 28
(last vote on : 9/27/2017 6:35:01 AM)
(Poll will run till: -- )
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RE: Are cakes art? - 9/24/2017 10:56:29 PM   
heavyblinker


Posts: 3623
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75


quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker
Where are they refusing to serve you pork? Is this something that is happening in a non-Islamic food restaurant in America?

Why does it have to happen in "Non-Islamic restaurants"?

The baker is a Christian Bakery. So that's why they don't serve cakes to gay people.

Islamic restaurants is a Islamic Restaurant. That's why they don't serve pork to non-muslims.


I have already explained this.

If the restaurant serves food from a specific country, then it isn't about honoring religion, it is about offering people food from their home country. This is how they can get around the 'discrimination' thing-- by offering a certain type of cuisine.
You don't go to a Subway store and demand they serve you a quarter chicken dinner, you don't go to a Chinese restaurant and demand they serve you a hamburger, and you don't go to an Iranian restaurant and demand they serve pork... if you do, you're an idiot.

But a bakery that serves decorated cakes has to serve decorated cakes. If they make cakes for straight weddings but not gay weddings, it isn't because they don't have the ingredients or because they don't know how to do it. The only reason they have for not doing it is that they don't cater to gay people. That is discrimination.
If they refuse to serve the cake based on their intolerance someone's sexual orientation or protected religious beliefs, then they are being discriminatory.

And this isn't about Christianity... as I said, Christianity includes denominations that practice gay marriage. My family's church practices and advocates for gay marriage... so that means it isn't a real church???
You can believe what you want, but you don't OWN God.

(in reply to Greta75)
Profile   Post #: 301
RE: Are cakes art? - 9/24/2017 11:04:14 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tamaka

No but each person could establish their own religion for his/her own beliefs so.... what we are really discussing underneath the guise of 'religion' is individuals' rights to have their own conscience and not be forced to act against themself/their conscience.





But its not the guise of religion it is 'religion'.

If you cant exercise your theology, dogma, philosophy, conscience or whatever you base your moral compass on, and put it into practice then you do not have a religion, you have nothing more than a useless meaningless ethics or philosophical model because you have no ability to act on anything outside prescription created by someone else.

Hence to be a religion you must have your personal model if you will and then you must 'practice it' and only then is it a religion.

In other words if you believe its not proper to to murder everyone around you and you go into public and do not murder everyone around you based upon that premise that in fact is an operative element of your religion.

Here from the aclu:

Freedom of religion or freedom of belief is a principle that supports the freedom of an individual or community, in public or private, to manifest religion or belief in teaching, practice, worship, and observance. It also includes the freedom to change one's religion or belief.






_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to tamaka)
Profile   Post #: 302
RE: Are cakes art? - 9/24/2017 11:07:38 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker


I have already explained this.

If the restaurant serves food from a specific country, then it isn't about honoring religion, it is about offering people food from their home country.


Same goes for the christian serving cake from their christian bakery, its not about offering services and cakes for other religions.



_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to heavyblinker)
Profile   Post #: 303
RE: Are cakes art? - 9/24/2017 11:11:44 PM   
heavyblinker


Posts: 3623
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne


quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker


I have already explained this.

If the restaurant serves food from a specific country, then it isn't about honoring religion, it is about offering people food from their home country.


Same goes for the christian serving cake from their christian bakery, its not about offering services and cakes for other religions.


The Muslim restaurant will serve Muslim cuisine to non-Muslims who are looking for Muslim cuisine.
The Christian cake store will not serve cake to Christians who practice gay marriage and are looking for a cake.
It isn't the same thing.

I also don't think it's a 'Christian' bakery... I think it's just a normal bakery that happens to be owned by a bigoted 'Christian'.

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 304
RE: Are cakes art? - 9/24/2017 11:13:25 PM   
Greta75


Posts: 9968
Joined: 2/6/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker
If the restaurant serves food from a specific country, then it isn't about honoring religion, it is about offering people food from their home country.

Dude in my country, Italian Food, American Food, French Food, all have no pork, if sold by Muslims. Same with Pizza Hut, MacDonalds, Wendys etc. All of them refuse to serve me pork because Muslims run them.

They sure aren't "Food from Muslim countries".

Please help me protest their discrimination.

I only wish it was "restaurant serving food from their country".

I would never go into a middle eastern restaurant and expect pork.

But I do want my BLT from subways or bacon cheeseburger from Wendys!

(in reply to heavyblinker)
Profile   Post #: 305
RE: Are cakes art? - 9/24/2017 11:13:40 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne


quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker


I have already explained this.

If the restaurant serves food from a specific country, then it isn't about honoring religion, it is about offering people food from their home country.


Same goes for the christian serving cake from their christian bakery, its not about offering services and cakes for other religions.


The Muslim restaurant will serve Muslim cuisine to non-Muslims who are looking for Muslim cuisine.
The Christian cake store will not serve cake to Christians who practice gay marriage.
It isn't the same thing.

(oh why oh why didn't I just ignore you)



bravo, great misrepresentation of the premise of the case.

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to heavyblinker)
Profile   Post #: 306
RE: Are cakes art? - 9/24/2017 11:15:30 PM   
heavyblinker


Posts: 3623
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75


quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker
If the restaurant serves food from a specific country, then it isn't about honoring religion, it is about offering people food from their home country.

Dude in my country, Italian Food, American Food, French Food, all have no pork, if sold by Muslims. Same with Pizza Hut, MacDonalds, etc.

They sure aren't "Food from Muslim countries".

Please help me protest their discrimination.


This isn't about your country, and I already have enough to do.

(in reply to Greta75)
Profile   Post #: 307
RE: Are cakes art? - 9/24/2017 11:16:32 PM   
tamaka


Posts: 5079
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne


quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker


I have already explained this.

If the restaurant serves food from a specific country, then it isn't about honoring religion, it is about offering people food from their home country.


Same goes for the christian serving cake from their christian bakery, its not about offering services and cakes for other religions.


The Muslim restaurant will serve Muslim cuisine to non-Muslims who are looking for Muslim cuisine.
The Christian cake store will not serve cake to Christians who practice gay marriage and are looking for a cake.
It isn't the same thing.

I also don't think it's a 'Christian' bakery... I think it's just a normal bakery that happens to be owned by a bigoted 'Christian'.


The Muslim restaurant wouldn't serve gay Muslims at all...lol

(in reply to heavyblinker)
Profile   Post #: 308
RE: Are cakes art? - 9/24/2017 11:16:52 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline 		FR


Federal Court Ruling Extends Equal Protection Rights To Atheists
By Shadee Ashtari


A federal district court in Oregon has ruled in favor of an atheist inmate who filed suit against the Federal Bureau of Prisons in April for rejecting his requests to form a humanist study group on grounds that humanism was not listed as a religious affiliation under existing prison classifications.

In a decision issued Thursday, Senior District Judge Ancer Haggerty ruled that prison officials violated inmate Jason Holden’s constitutional rights under the First and Fifth Amendments, and moved to recognize secular humanism as a religion for “Establishment Clause purposes.”

The case, co-filed by the American Humanist Association, marks a victory for secular groups seeking access to the same legal rights afforded to Buddhists, Christians, Hindus, Jews and Muslims — all of whom are permitted to organize under the current federal prison system.

“As humanists, we believe in the ability of mankind to transcend their differences and to reach some common ground and make the world a better place,” Holden, who is currently serving time at the Federal Correctional Institution in Sheridan, Oregon, explained in an Uptown Radio interview in May. “We simply want the same thing other religious groups are provided.”

In siding with the plaintiffs, Haggerty cited a 1961 U.S. Supreme Court ruling in Torcaso v. Watkins, which referred to “Secular Humanism” [Atheism] as a religion in its landmark decision to prohibit state and federal governments from passing any laws that impose religious requirements on holding public office.

“The court finds that Secular Humanism is a religion for Establishment Clause purposes,” Haggerty, a Bill Clinton appointee, concluded on Thursday. “Allowing followers of other faiths to join religious group meetings while denying Holden the same privilege is discrimination on the basis of religion.”

Earlier this year, the U.S. Army also moved to include “Humanist” as a religious affiliation, allowing the 3.6 percent of Army members who identify as humanists to organize formally and gain access to secular chaplains and services.

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 309
RE: Are cakes art? - 9/24/2017 11:16:53 PM   
heavyblinker


Posts: 3623
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne


quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne


quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker


I have already explained this.

If the restaurant serves food from a specific country, then it isn't about honoring religion, it is about offering people food from their home country.


Same goes for the christian serving cake from their christian bakery, its not about offering services and cakes for other religions.


The Muslim restaurant will serve Muslim cuisine to non-Muslims who are looking for Muslim cuisine.
The Christian cake store will not serve cake to Christians who practice gay marriage.
It isn't the same thing.

(oh why oh why didn't I just ignore you)



bravo, great misrepresentation of the premise of the case.


This is why I should ignore you.
You don't actually respond with a counter-argument, you just make baseless claims without explaining them.
After that, you start throwing around insults.

Pointless.

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 310
RE: Are cakes art? - 9/24/2017 11:19:00 PM   
Greta75


Posts: 9968
Joined: 2/6/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker
This isn't about your country, and I already have enough to do.

Subways in the UK have refused to serve pork to non-Muslims now. How about that! Fellow white nation, maybe you can help protest against that!

(in reply to heavyblinker)
Profile   Post #: 311
RE: Are cakes art? - 9/24/2017 11:19:59 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker


quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne


quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne


quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker


I have already explained this.

If the restaurant serves food from a specific country, then it isn't about honoring religion, it is about offering people food from their home country.


Same goes for the christian serving cake from their christian bakery, its not about offering services and cakes for other religions.


The Muslim restaurant will serve Muslim cuisine to non-Muslims who are looking for Muslim cuisine.
The Christian cake store will not serve cake to Christians who practice gay marriage.
It isn't the same thing.

(oh why oh why didn't I just ignore you)



bravo, great misrepresentation of the premise of the case.


This is why I should ignore you.
You don't actually respond with a counter-argument, you just make baseless claims without explaining them.
After that, you start throwing around insults.

Pointless.



because I have already explained them in countless fucking threads and you are too fucking stoopid to get it.

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to heavyblinker)
Profile   Post #: 312
RE: Are cakes art? - 9/24/2017 11:21:03 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75


quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker
This isn't about your country, and I already have enough to do.

Subways in the UK have refused to serve pork to non-Muslims now. How about that! Fellow white nation, maybe you can help protest against that!



for what reason?

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to Greta75)
Profile   Post #: 313
RE: Are cakes art? - 9/24/2017 11:27:53 PM   
heavyblinker


Posts: 3623
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

because I have already explained them in countless fucking threads and you are too fucking stoopid to get it.


Oh right, I'm supposed to go through all of the threads to make sure that what you posted there isn't as wrong as what you posted here.
Why are you even responding to me if you're not going to bother to reply when I make a point?

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 314
RE: Are cakes art? - 9/24/2017 11:30:22 PM   
Greta75


Posts: 9968
Joined: 2/6/2011
Status: offline 		I think this is relevant to post here:

http://www.todayonline.com/world/asia/muars-muslims-only-laundromat-sparks-controversy-social-media

Photographs of the shop's signboard with the words - "For Muslim customers only. Muslim-friendly. Leave your shoes outside" - placed at the laundromat entrance have gone viral on Facebook.

Indra Aditya, meanwhile, urged people to look at the issue positively.

"A majority of his customers may have complained about being uncomfortable in sharing the usage (of the equipment) with non-Muslims.

"This is not about being racist or about any religion...this is business," said Indra Aditya.


(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 315
RE: Are cakes art? - 9/24/2017 11:31:57 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline 		as usual klinker is full of shit.



An Oregon couple fined $135,000 for refusing to make a cake for a lesbian wedding appeared before the Oregon Court of Appeals for the first time on Thursday, in an effort to have the judgment overturned.

In one of the most notorious religious liberty cases in recent years, Aaron and Melissa Klein, owners of Sweet Cakes by Melissa, were found guilty of discrimination in 2013 of for refusing to bake a wedding cake for a same-sex couple because it violated the tenets of their Christian faith.

The court sentenced the Christian couple to a fine of $135,000 for the “emotional damage” they had allegedly caused the lesbian pair.

Rachel Cryer-Bowman and Laurel Bowman-Cryer had accused the Kleins of “mental rape,”

adding that they had suffered a “loss of appetite” and “impaired digestion” from the ordeal,

which remarkably led to simultaneous “weight gain.”

In 2015, Oregon Labor Commissioner Brad Avakian slapped a gag order on the Kleins, following the couple’s interview with Family Research Council’s Tony Perkins. During the interview, Aaron said among other things, “This fight is not over. We will continue to stand strong.”

“The Commissioner of the Bureau of Labor and Industries hereby orders [Aaron and Melissa Klein] to cease and desist from publishing, circulating, issuing or displaying, or causing to be published … any communication to the effect that any of the accommodations … will be refused, withheld from or denied to, or that any discrimination be made against, any person on account of their sexual orientation,” Avakian wrote.

“This effectively strips us of all our First Amendment rights,” wrote the Kleins on their Facebook page. “According to the state of Oregon we neither have freedom of religion or freedom of speech.”

“We lost everything we loved and worked so hard to build,” she said.

From the beginning, the Kleins have made it clear that they have never refused service to anyone based on sexual orientation, but their religious convictions did not permit them to participate in a gay wedding, which they believe to be immoral.

“When we opened our bakery, we loved serving all customers who came into the shop, regardless of their identity or beliefs. My cakes were my canvas,” Melissa said. “My bakery wasn’t just called ‘Sweet Cakes Bakery,’ it was ‘Sweet Cakes by Melissa’ because I pour my passion and heart into each cake I make. My faith is a part of that.”

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to heavyblinker)
Profile   Post #: 316
RE: Are cakes art? - 9/24/2017 11:31:59 PM   
Greta75


Posts: 9968
Joined: 2/6/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne
for what reason?

To appease their Muslim customers who doesn't like having pork ham or pork bacon anywhere near their sandwich venue.

See above I posted too, laundromat, also forced to ban non-muslim customers due to Muslims complaining about having to share a washing machine with non-muslim clothes.

But you know what. I'd just not go to that laundromat. No biggie.



(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 317
RE: Are cakes art? - 9/24/2017 11:33:06 PM   
heavyblinker


Posts: 3623
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75
quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker
This isn't about your country, and I already have enough to do.

Subways in the UK have refused to serve pork to non-Muslims now. How about that! Fellow white nation, maybe you can help protest against that!


I don't live in the UK either, and I also don't feel particularly bound to them simply because of my race.

Regardless, my analogy wasn't the best since pork-eating isn't on the same level as homosexuality.
One is about what you enjoy eating, the other is more about who you are as a person.

Anyways, if it upsets you that Muslims are refusing to serve pork, why are you arguing in favor of the bakers?

(in reply to Greta75)
Profile   Post #: 318
RE: Are cakes art? - 9/24/2017 11:33:47 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

I think this is relevant to post here:

http://www.todayonline.com/world/asia/muars-muslims-only-laundromat-sparks-controversy-social-media

Photographs of the shop's signboard with the words - "For Muslim customers only. Muslim-friendly. Leave your shoes outside" - placed at the laundromat entrance have gone viral on Facebook.

Indra Aditya, meanwhile, urged people to look at the issue positively.

"A majority of his customers may have complained about being uncomfortable in sharing the usage (of the equipment) with non-Muslims.

"This is not about being racist or about any religion...this is business," said Indra Aditya.





ok so they have their own private club, fine with me

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to Greta75)
Profile   Post #: 319
RE: Are cakes art? - 9/24/2017 11:35:59 PM   
heavyblinker


Posts: 3623
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

I think this is relevant to post here:

http://www.todayonline.com/world/asia/muars-muslims-only-laundromat-sparks-controversy-social-media

Photographs of the shop's signboard with the words - "For Muslim customers only. Muslim-friendly. Leave your shoes outside" - placed at the laundromat entrance have gone viral on Facebook.

Indra Aditya, meanwhile, urged people to look at the issue positively.

"A majority of his customers may have complained about being uncomfortable in sharing the usage (of the equipment) with non-Muslims.

"This is not about being racist or about any religion...this is business," said Indra Aditya.




And you support the Muslims here?
I know I don't.

It's essentially the same as segregation.

(in reply to Greta75)
Profile   Post #: 320
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