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California reduce penalties for knowingly exposing part... - 10/8/2017 5:02:45 AM   
Greta75


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http://edition.cnn.com/2017/10/07/health/california-hiv-bill-signed/index.html

Leftie State, WTF!

HIV acceptance does not start with lowering the criminal seriousness of knowingly infecting a partner with HIV without their consent!

WTF California!

This just means, you guys are saying it's okay to lie!

I mean, we are still talking about potentially AIDS that still has no cure. It's a death sentence!

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RE: California reduce penalties for knowingly exposing ... - 10/8/2017 6:00:27 AM   
JstAnotherSub


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/10/07/health/california-hiv-bill-signed/index.html

Leftie State, WTF!

HIV acceptance does not start with lowering the criminal seriousness of knowingly infecting a partner with HIV without their consent!

WTF California!

This just means, you guys are saying it's okay to lie!

I mean, we are still talking about potentially AIDS that still has no cure. It's a death sentence!




HIV is a manageable disease now and it is possible to keep your numbers to levels that almost entirely eliminate the chance of infecting a partner.

Not sure how I feel about this law change, but I am completely in agreement that some of the stigma needs to be gone for those who do follow their treatment schedule as they should and are living long, full healthy lives.

Someone like you screaming it is a death sentence promotes ignorance. But of course, that is what I have come to expect from you anyhow.

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RE: California reduce penalties for knowingly exposing ... - 10/8/2017 6:07:26 AM   
Greta75


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AIDS is a death sentence. There is no cure.

I understand that HIV doesn't mean just AIDS.

But AIDS is part of HIV!

So there is no ignorance here.

If somebody had sex with me and he had AIDS without informing me. And I get infected because of his fucking lies, I'd be fucking pissed and crying murder.

He has practically transferred a disease to me.

And seriously! If somebody got Sars or other fatal diseases, and if they transferred to me without warning me.

I'd be just as fucking pissed.

This is about protecting liars! WTF is this law!

And people who lie about having HIV in order to get sex, WILL NOT STOP LYING AND INFECTING OTHERS! Despite reducing a 8 yr sentence to a 6 months sentence.

This is extremely stupid.

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RE: California reduce penalties for knowingly exposing ... - 10/8/2017 6:11:12 AM   
JstAnotherSub


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Nowhere did I see AIDS mentioned in that bill.

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RE: California reduce penalties for knowingly exposing ... - 10/8/2017 6:11:47 AM   
Greta75


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AIDS is Part of HIV!

They don't have to mention AIDS.

Someone on here was mentioning that Herpes has no cure too. There are non-life threatening diseases that has no cure too!

And point is, if you have a disease. That is contagious. You shouldn't be allowed to spread to other people without their permission.


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RE: California reduce penalties for knowingly exposing ... - 10/8/2017 6:13:01 AM   
JstAnotherSub


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Actually, HIV could more likely be a part of AIDS if we are going to debate it, but they are 2 entirely different things.

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RE: California reduce penalties for knowingly exposing ... - 10/8/2017 6:16:31 AM   
Greta75


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quote:

ORIGINAL: JstAnotherSub

Actually, HIV could more likely be a part of AIDS if we are going to debate it, but they are 2 entirely different things.


Totally not two different things!!!

HIV stands for human immunodeficiency virus. It is the virus that can lead to acquired immunodeficiency syndrome, or AIDS, if not treated. Unlike some other viruses, the human body can’t get rid of HIV completely, even with treatment. So once you get HIV, you have it for life.

https://www.hiv.gov/hiv-basics/overview/about-hiv-and-aids/what-are-hiv-and-aids

Definitely No CURE! So it's not okay to infect others with HIV without their consent!

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RE: California reduce penalties for knowingly exposing ... - 10/8/2017 6:49:06 AM   
JstAnotherSub


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good grief, your own post says can lead to if not treated....hell diabetes can lead to loss of sight or limb, but if you take care of your self that will not happen. There are cases where HIV has been totally eliminated from people, and medical science is close to a cure they believe.

Again, I am not saying I agree or disagree with the law, I am saying that people like you that equate having AIDS with being HIV+ are part of the problem with the discrimination against anyone who is HIV positive.

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RE: California reduce penalties for knowingly exposing ... - 10/8/2017 7:03:04 AM   
WhoreMods


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quote:

ORIGINAL: JstAnotherSub
hell diabetes can lead to loss of sight or limb, but if you take care of your self that will not happen.

You can't give somebody diabetes by shagging them bareback or sharing a needle, though, and the management programme for HIV is a lot more expensive than that for diabetes.
Destigmatising those who are infected is one thing, but minimising deliberately infecting somebody is quite another. If it has to be a separate legal offence (rather than coming under GBH where it would seem to belong) it probably should remain a felony rather than becoming a misdemeanour.

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RE: California reduce penalties for knowingly exposing ... - 10/8/2017 7:19:05 AM   
JstAnotherSub


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https://www.cdc.gov/hiv/policies/law/states/exposure.html

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RE: California reduce penalties for knowingly exposing ... - 10/8/2017 7:35:35 AM   
BlackSinMaster


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Would you like them publicly flogged or hanged, or perhaps both?

You have tainted the article by screaming that's leftists for you and scary lack of knowledge by making wild statements such as: AIDS is part of HIV, stating they are a death sentence etc

Is AIDS stigmatized – Yes.
Can it be controlled to the point there is almost no chance of infecting another – yes.

However from the article it did not take that into account and the degree of maliciousness involved.

I don’t agree with the change in California law and I thought 8 years was too soft (means 4 with good behavior). And that is because of malicious intent.

But then I must think a little deeper and have come up with Is infecting someone deliberately, or via probability, with the flu malicious? Could it result in another person(s) death?
What about not vaccinating your children?


I don’t like it being stigmatized but it still is, and for all intent purposes vanished from the news.

Jesus
Mother Theresa
Prince Diana - her with AIDS/HIV particularly
To name but three.

You should be ashamed of what you said Greta75. I cannot believe you said what you said.


< Message edited by BlackSinMaster -- 10/8/2017 7:36:40 AM >

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RE: California reduce penalties for knowingly exposing ... - 10/8/2017 7:46:34 AM   
bounty44


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greta, it used to be a death sentence, now its less so.

HIV is less virulent, less contagious and more treatable. not everyone exposed to it will get it, and not everyone who gets it will develop AIDS and not everyone who gets that will die.

though I cannot say for sure, I suspect that's some of the reasoning behind the recent penal changes.

im all for jail time for someone who willfully exposes another to a deadly virus without the other person's knowledge. six months seems too little.

id also be for the former having to pay the latter's medical expenses consistent with the condition for the rest of their lives.

and id say the same thing with less std's.

< Message edited by bounty44 -- 10/8/2017 7:48:40 AM >

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RE: California reduce penalties for knowingly exposing ... - 10/8/2017 8:02:20 AM   
BlackSinMaster


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"id also be for the former having to pay the latter's medical expenses consistent with the condition for the rest of their lives.

and id say the same thing with less std's."

I agree (I know).

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RE: California reduce penalties for knowingly exposing ... - 10/8/2017 9:59:35 AM   
heavyblinker


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Given what HIV has become (in a medical/physical sense, not socially), it makes sense that the penalties for exposing someone to it are closer to the penalties for exposing someone to other STDs... but I really don't think these two were taking the effects of the stigma into account.

Passing a bill isn't going to eliminate that stigma in people who still don't understand, and aside from potential medical costs (assuming you catch it early), the stigma around HIV is absolutely enormous.

Unfortunately, Greta is probably closer to the norm than we would all like to admit.

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RE: California reduce penalties for knowingly exposing ... - 10/8/2017 11:06:19 AM   
DesideriScuri


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https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billTextClient.xhtml?bill_id=201720180SB239

I found the webpage incredibly difficult to read and didn't want to fuck up any other page settings, so I downloaded the pdf, "10/6/2017 - Chaptered" (most recent) version. I assume it's the same as the webpage.

    quote:

    legislative counsel’s digest

    SB 239, Wiener. Infectious and communicable diseases: HIV and AIDS:
    criminal penalties.
    (1)  Existing law makes it a felony punishable by imprisonment for 3, 5,
    or 8 years in the state prison to expose another person to the human
    immunodeficiency virus (HIV) by engaging in unprotected sexual activity
    when the infected person knows at the time of the unprotected sex that he
    or she is infected with HIV, has not disclosed his or her HIV-positive status,
    and acts with the specific intent to infect the other person with HIV. Existing
    law makes it a felony punishable by imprisonment for 2, 4, or 6 years for
    any person to donate blood, tissue, or, under specified circumstances, semen
    or breast milk, if the person knows that he or she has acquired
    immunodeficiency syndrome (AIDS), or that he or she has tested reactive
    to HIV. Existing law provides that a person who is afflicted with a
    contagious, infectious, or communicable disease who willfully exposes
    himself or herself to another person, or any person who willfully exposes
    another person afflicted with the disease to someone else, is guilty of a
    misdemeanor.
    This bill would repeal those provisions. The bill would instead make the
    intentional transmission of an infectious or communicable disease, as
    defined, a misdemeanor punishable by imprisonment in a county jail for
    not more than 6 months if certain circumstances apply, including that the
    defendant knows he or she or a 3rd party is afflicted with the disease, that
    the defendant acts with the specific intent to transmit or cause an afflicted
    3rd party to transmit the disease to another person, that the defendant or the
    afflicted 3rd party engages in conduct that poses a substantial risk of
    transmission, as defined, that the defendant or the afflicted 3rd party
    transmits the disease to the other person, and if the exposure occurs through
    interaction with the defendant and not a 3rd party, that the person exposed
    to the disease during voluntary interaction with the defendant did not know
    that the defendant was afflicted with the disease. The bill would also make
    it a misdemeanor to attempt to intentionally transmit an infectious and
    communicable disease, as specified, punishable by imprisonment in a county
    jail for not more than 90 days. This bill would make willful exposure to an
    infectious or communicable disease, as defined, a misdemeanor punishable
    by imprisonment in a county jail for not more than 6 months, and would
    prohibit a health officer, or a health officer’s designee, from issuing a
    maximum of 2 instructions to a defendant that would result in a violation
    of this provision. The bill would impose various requirements upon the
    court in order to prevent the public disclosure of the identifying
    characteristics, as defined, of the complaining witness and the defendant.
    By creating new crimes, the bill would impose a state-mandated local
    program(2)  Under existing law, if a defendant has been previously convicted of
    prostitution or of another specified sexual offense, and in connection with
    the conviction a blood test was administered, as specified, with positive test
    results for AIDS, of which the defendant was informed, the previous
    conviction and positive blood test results are to be charged in any subsequent
    accusatory pleading charging a violation of prostitution. Existing law makes
    the defendant guilty of a felony if the previous conviction and informed test
    results are found to be true by the trier of fact or are admitted by the
    defendant.
    This bill would delete that provision. The bill would also vacate any
    conviction, dismiss any charge, and legally deem that an arrest under the
    deleted provision never occurred. The bill would also authorize a person
    serving a sentence as a result of a violation of the deleted provision to
    petition for a recall or dismissal of sentence before the trial court that entered
    the judgment of conviction in his or her case. The bill would require a court
    to vacate the conviction and resentence the person to any remaining counts
    while giving credit for any time already served.
    (3)  Existing law requires the court to order a defendant convicted for a
    violation of soliciting or engaging in prostitution for the first time to
    complete instruction in the causes and consequences of acquired
    immunodeficiency syndrome (AIDS) and to submit to testing for AIDS.
    Existing law requires such a defendant, as a condition of either probation
    or participating in a drug diversion program, to participate in an AIDS
    education program, as specified.
    This bill would repeal those provisions.
    (4)  The bill would also make other conforming changes.
    (5)  The California Constitution requires the state to reimburse local
    agencies and school districts for certain costs mandated by the state. Statutory
    provisions establish procedures for making that reimbursement.
    This bill would provide that with regard to certain mandates no
    reimbursement is required by this act for a specified reason.
    With regard to any other mandates, this bill would provide that, if the
    Commission on State Mandates determines that the bill contains costs so
    mandated by the state, reimbursement for those costs shall be made pursuant
    to the statutory provisions noted above


My issue with the legislation is the reduction of the criminalizing of knowingly putting someone else at risk without their consent. That's the part that gets me. JstAnotherSub's link in Post#10 brings up the point that "all states have general criminal laws—such as assault and battery, reckless endangerment, and attempted murder—that can and have been used to prosecute individuals for any of the above-mentioned behaviors."

Criminalizing knowingly exposing someone to HIV, without a requirement that HIV status wasn't shared, should be wrong. A woman I know was infected with HIV from a blood transfusion. Had she not shared her status with future intimate partners, I could see her being in the wrong, but if she did share her HIV status with future intimate partners prior to their being intimate partners, then there should be no criminalization.

I understand that HIV status shouldn't be criminalized, but I wouldn't agree that exposure without consent shouldn't be criminalized.

As HB put it (my emphasis): "Passing a bill isn't going to eliminate that stigma in people who still don't understand, and aside from potential medical costs (assuming you catch it early), the stigma around HIV is absolutely enormous. "

The part that I think is most important, is that when you catch HIV+ status early, treatment options are good and control of the virus is pretty good. But, if you're exposed without your knowledge and consent, what are the odds that finding out you're HIV+ will be early?

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RE: California reduce penalties for knowingly exposing ... - 10/8/2017 12:19:21 PM   
BlackSinMaster


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Not good enough do better – I really do want to leave here you know, it is a matter of time and I will miss half of you.

The point of the change in law was what? I whole heartily disagree with that.

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RE: California reduce penalties for knowingly exposing ... - 10/8/2017 12:32:47 PM   
BlackSinMaster


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You do not strike me as someone who hates anything other than inequality (and you let them almost them all get away with that the other night fri-sat- I was half awake and laughed and laughed).

It is important you know they drowned in their cacophony of diarrhea whilst asking for second and thirds.


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RE: California reduce penalties for knowingly exposing ... - 10/8/2017 1:36:09 PM   
JVoV


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HIV/AIDS, though still scary as hell, is not the automatic death sentence it once was.

There are medications available to ward off the disease completely (PReP), and treatments for every stage of the disease to help patients get better. And California makes if as easy as possible to get PReP, and HIV/AIDS medications. https://www.eqca.org/how-to-get-prep-to-prevent-hiv/

But all of the state programs that keep PReP affordable are in jeopardy, as Republicans continue to make every attempt to repeal or destroy Obamacare. This will kill hundreds of thousands of people, and eventually millions, just due to the lack of funds for HIV/AIDS treatment.

Quite frankly, anyone that is sexually active with more than one partner, or even a new partner, has a risk of being exposed to HIV, along with numerous other sexually transmitted diseases. PReP is an important part of safer sex, no different than condoms, or 'the pill'.

There is also research about a specific DNA mutation, Delta32, that makes people almost completely immune from HIV infection, as it may have done with the plague and other such diseases throughout history. Testing for that is available, though not always cheap or covered by insurance.

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RE: California reduce penalties for knowingly exposing ... - 10/8/2017 1:53:05 PM   
BlackSinMaster


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And who are you refuting other than you own mess. Call me wanker or fuk off

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RE: California reduce penalties for knowingly exposing ... - 10/8/2017 2:15:05 PM   
JVoV


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I'm responding to the thread topic. You know, trying to have an adult conversation about something of interest to me. That's why there's actual information in my post, and not useless insults to anyone.

But if you continue being a twatwaffle, that can change.

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