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ORIGINAL: BoscoX


Why do you ask, when leftists such as yourself pretend to believe that borders are racist and immoral blah blah blah stupidity

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ORIGINAL: Wayward5oul

FR
And if Catalonia gets independence, the Basque province will immediately move for the same, and Navarre could follow the Basque country with a little encouragement. And history has shown that there are those among the Basque that will resort to violence in pursuit of their independence. If Catalonia were recognized as independent, and the Basque country was not, I would expect more ETA activity.

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ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

quote:

ORIGINAL: Wayward5oul

FR
And if Catalonia gets independence, the Basque province will immediately move for the same, and Navarre could follow the Basque country with a little encouragement. And history has shown that there are those among the Basque that will resort to violence in pursuit of their independence. If Catalonia were recognized as independent, and the Basque country was not, I would expect more ETA activity.

I understand that ETA is inactive at the moment. I could be wrong but I think I heard somewhere that they announced they were disarming and disbanding too. Anyway ETA are not a force to be reckoned with as things stand. There appears to be little or no support among Basques for a resumption of violent resistance to Madrid.

While Catalonian independence would fan the forces of separatism elsewhere in Spain, I cannot see Catalonia obtaining 100% independent status - the opposition from Madrid appears uncompromising and I don't think Catalans want to resort to an armed struggle to obtain their goals.

So from where I sit, some form of confederation seems the most likely outcome. How the Spanish negotiate the difficult terrain between where we are now, and confederation remains up in the air. Hopefully they can accomplish that outcome without any side resorting to violence.

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ORIGINAL: Drakvampire
Was it undemocratic not to allow the rest of Spain to vote in the referendum?

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the one in Catalonia was staged by an organisation that the Spanish government does not recognise

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ORIGINAL: tweakabelle
After weeks of turmoil and uncertainty, Catalonia's Parliament voted to declare independence tonight. The independence motion was passed by 70 votes to 10. In response, the Spanish Senate voted to implement Article 155 of the Spanish Constitution, which allows the central Govt in Madrid to impose direct rule on Catalonia.
The pro-independence vote was taken after weeks of inaction by the Catalonian Govt which seemed reluctant to take the final irreversible step to declare independence from Spain. Catalans voted overwhelmingly in favour of independence in a recent referendum, a referendum denounced as illegal by the central Govt.
The central Govt's response to Catalonian demands for separation has been negative and uncompromising. The central Govt enjoys the support of most Spaniards, who have shown little sympathy for Catalan demands. It seems likely that the central Govt will impose its authority over the region and in particular, the region's police and security services in an effort to thwart the independence declaration. Such moves are likely to provoke angry reactions from Cataloni's pro-independence majority.
All this amounts to the biggest constitutional challenge in Spain since a failed coup some years ago. It is uncharted territory for all concerned. Can Catalonia succeed in forming an independent sovereign State? Will the central Govt succeed in thwarting the moves? Can rule from Madrid succeed in quelling the restive province? Will the situation be resolved without recourse to violence? How will the rest of the EU react?

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

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ORIGINAL: ThatDizzyChick

quote:

the one in Catalonia was staged by an organisation that the Spanish government does not recognise

So in other words a grass roots democratic effort. Good on 'em.

quote:

It seems likely that the central Govt will impose its authority over the region and in particular, the region's police and security services in an effort to thwart the independence declaration. Such moves are likely to provoke angry reactions from Cataloni's pro-independence majority.