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RE: New GOP Tax Plan - 11/9/2017 4:40:49 PM   
DesideriScuri


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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse
I said I think (know) that Obama failed. He had 8 years. The liberals that hate Trump think he's done after 9 months. Trump is doing fine. 7 more years and America will be great again.


Only because that means the next guy/gal up has had 4 years to work on it.

I completely agree that Trump hasn't been granted enough time yet before he's been deemed a failure by those on the Left (and some on the Right). The big problem is that Trump is still learning about 'how' to be President and what needs to be done by a President. He can't do things the same way he has as a business owner. I truly believe that's Trump's biggest issue so far. If he can figure that out, he'll be fine. If not, he'll continue to be a twittering fool.

Regardless, America will be fine. In the long run, Trump's Presidency will likely matter as a historical lesson.


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to servantforuse)
Profile   Post #: 81
RE: New GOP Tax Plan - 11/9/2017 5:04:21 PM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

I said I think (know) that Obama failed. He had 8 years. The liberals that hate Trump think he's done after 9 months. Trump is doing fine. 7 more years and America will be great again.

What has he done so far that’s “fine”?

(in reply to servantforuse)
Profile   Post #: 82
RE: New GOP Tax Plan - 11/9/2017 5:56:17 PM   
servantforuse


Posts: 6363
Joined: 3/8/2006
Status: offline 		How about consumer confidence to start. The stock market has soared. S & P up 25% GDP up 2.5 % unemployment rate at 4.1 %,lowest in 17 years. This is just the start.

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 83
RE: New GOP Tax Plan - 11/9/2017 5:57:41 PM   
MasterDrakk


Posts: 321
Status: offline 		nice little bubble going on without the fundamentals being there to underpin it, but it has been soaring since Obama and record profits, so thats nothing exactly new.

(in reply to servantforuse)
Profile   Post #: 84
RE: New GOP Tax Plan - 11/9/2017 6:05:25 PM   
servantforuse


Posts: 6363
Joined: 3/8/2006
Status: offline 		It didn't take long for someone to say this is because of Obama's economic policies. Believe me, this isn't a bubble. I guess we shall see.

(in reply to MasterDrakk)
Profile   Post #: 85
RE: New GOP Tax Plan - 11/10/2017 12:40:36 AM   
MasterDrakk


Posts: 321
Status: offline 		who said it was because of Obamas policies. It certainly isn't because of Bush's and its been going up to record highs before Trump ever became prez.

(in reply to servantforuse)
Profile   Post #: 86
RE: New GOP Tax Plan - 11/10/2017 7:54:35 AM   
Musicmystery


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Joined: 3/14/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

How about consumer confidence to start. The stock market has soared. S & P up 25% GDP up 2.5 % unemployment rate at 4.1 %,lowest in 17 years. This is just the start.

Just how do you figure Trump caused this?

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Profile   Post #: 87
RE: New GOP Tax Plan - 11/10/2017 8:12:11 AM   
Hillwilliam


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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

unemployment rate at 4.1 %,lowest in 17 years. This is just the start.

Who was POTUS 17 years ago?
Were you singing his praises?

_____________________________

Kinkier than a cheap garden hose.

Whoever said "Religion is the opiate of the masses" never heard Right Wing talk radio.

Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

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Profile   Post #: 88
RE: New GOP Tax Plan - 11/10/2017 8:32:35 AM   
WhoreMods


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery


quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

I said I think (know) that Obama failed. He had 8 years. The liberals that hate Trump think he's done after 9 months. Trump is doing fine. 7 more years and America will be great again.

What has he done so far that’s “fine”?


?

_____________________________

On the level and looking for a square deal.

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 89
RE: New GOP Tax Plan - 11/10/2017 3:40:00 PM   
AtUrCervix


Posts: 2111
Joined: 1/15/2016
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Curious at what point you’d consider Trump to have failed. His term is 20% over already.

30%? 50%? 88.2%?

The very fact that you (and others) are urging we give him a chance reinforces that so far, it’s not a success.



Many people on the Republican side also said and did the same with Obama.

It's like that old saying..."why in the world would you want the pilot to fail.....he's in charge of your ride".

There's always going to be gnashing of teeth from one side or the other but, I think for at least 3 years, most folks not only resigned themselves to his presidency, they largely wanted him to succeed.

So...he got 3 years or so of grace (largely I suspect because no one was unclear he got handed a bit of a shit storm), but after that, yep....he was met with significant headwinds.

We all know we're in deep doo doo with debt, skyrocketing SSI and medicare issues.....and Trump, as obnoxious as he is, is in fact aiming to deal with some of those issues.

I think 10 months is hardly enough time to say "shut the guy down" if in fact, like Obama, he finds (and is finding) the task a smidge larger than anticipated.

Me...I rather bring the pilot a Pepsi while we're still in the air.

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 90
RE: New GOP Tax Plan - 11/10/2017 3:42:20 PM   
AtUrCervix


Posts: 2111
Joined: 1/15/2016
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse
I said I think (know) that Obama failed. He had 8 years. The liberals that hate Trump think he's done after 9 months. Trump is doing fine. 7 more years and America will be great again.


Only because that means the next guy/gal up has had 4 years to work on it.

I completely agree that Trump hasn't been granted enough time yet before he's been deemed a failure by those on the Left (and some on the Right). The big problem is that Trump is still learning about 'how' to be President and what needs to be done by a President. He can't do things the same way he has as a business owner. I truly believe that's Trump's biggest issue so far. If he can figure that out, he'll be fine. If not, he'll continue to be a twittering fool.

Regardless, America will be fine. In the long run, Trump's Presidency will likely matter as a historical lesson.



Desi, there hasn't been a single President since George Washington who didn't spend the first 2 years figuring out "how to be president".


(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 91
RE: New GOP Tax Plan - 11/10/2017 4:10:12 PM   
bounty44


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Joined: 11/1/2014
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Curious at what point you’d consider Trump to have failed. His term is 20% over already.

30%? 50%? 88.2%?

The very fact that you (and others) are urging we give him a chance reinforces that so far, it’s not a success.



by contrast, I suspect I wouldn't be the only person to think that no matter how well trump does, you would never be able to see it, and that for two reasons: one is, because you wouldn't agree with the metrics used, and two, youre a bent out of shape partisan hack.

so your question is really meaningless.

the "give him a chance" sentiment has less to do with any significant failures on his part, and more to do with the lefts incessant petty griping about everything, and actual desire to see him fail.

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 92
RE: New GOP Tax Plan - 11/11/2017 3:49:12 AM   
MasterDrakk


Posts: 321
Status: offline 		but he hasnt done well, has he? so that is clearly a fantasy hypothetical that will never come to fruition based on nothing more than howling by the demented deranged rightwing nutjobs.

(in reply to bounty44)
Profile   Post #: 93
RE: New GOP Tax Plan - 11/11/2017 7:05:19 AM   
MasterJaguar01


Posts: 2340
Joined: 12/2/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

the "give him a chance" sentiment has less to do with any significant failures on his part, and more to do with the lefts incessant petty griping about everything, and actual desire to see him fail.




Just out of curiosity. Do you see any "significant failures" on his part?

A legitimate question.

(in reply to bounty44)
Profile   Post #: 94
RE: New GOP Tax Plan - 11/12/2017 5:22:14 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: AtUrCervix
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse
I said I think (know) that Obama failed. He had 8 years. The liberals that hate Trump think he's done after 9 months. Trump is doing fine. 7 more years and America will be great again.

Only because that means the next guy/gal up has had 4 years to work on it.
I completely agree that Trump hasn't been granted enough time yet before he's been deemed a failure by those on the Left (and some on the Right). The big problem is that Trump is still learning about 'how' to be President and what needs to be done by a President. He can't do things the same way he has as a business owner. I truly believe that's Trump's biggest issue so far. If he can figure that out, he'll be fine. If not, he'll continue to be a twittering fool.
Regardless, America will be fine. In the long run, Trump's Presidency will likely matter as a historical lesson.

Desi, there hasn't been a single President since George Washington who didn't spend the first 2 years figuring out "how to be president".


The difference between Trump and the rest of them, he hasn't been a politician, so he's a couple steps behind the rest, right off the bat. Trump's learning curve is much higher than the rest, and he's narcissistic, egotistical, and obstinate enough that his learning curve is going to be much longer than it has to be.


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to AtUrCervix)
Profile   Post #: 95
RE: New GOP Tax Plan - 11/12/2017 8:13:11 PM   
MrRodgers


Posts: 10542
Joined: 7/30/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery
bounty, does the thought of cuts to pay for this ever enter the GOP/conservative/alt-right minds????
Because there's nothing but "I have faith the economy will magically grow to generate more than the foregone revenue."
A faith based on nothing but a belief in an already oft-discredited ideology.
It is NO different than the "comrades" wanting services with no idea how to fund them.
BOTH are mindless, simplistic, frankly child-like ideologies.
And this "plan" is a prime example.


The GOP always offers cuts to spending. It's cuts to spending growth (this is also how the Democrats do it, too).

Stated: "We're axing spending by $500B on XYZ!"

Reality: Spending was going to increased by $1T over 10 years, but now, it's "only" going to increase $500B!

Plus, they have all these "cuts" backloaded over 10 years, so most of them won't even be there when it comes time to cut. Plus, by that time, there will be a hue and cry to not cut "my" spending and the cuts-that-aren't-really-cuts end up not happening then, either.

Not cutting revenues (if you look at the revenues under Bush, his tax cuts didn't result in reduced revenues) is almost enabling Government to continue to waste money left and right (figurative figure of speech, and also indicative that both sides are guilty of it, btw).


quote:

Not cutting revenues (if you look at the revenues under Bush, his tax cuts didn't result in reduced revenues)

Not according to these people and others.

The surplus in the fiscal 2001 federal budget was $127 billion. The 2010 budget had a budget deficit of $1.3 trillion. The long-term national debt more than doubled from $5.6 trillion in 2000 to $13.6 trillion in 2010, mostly under Bush’s watch.
Federal tax receipts in 2010 were 14.9 percent of gross domestic product. In 2000 it was as high as 20 percent.
Department of the Treasury, usgovernmentrevenue.com

_____________________________

You can be a murderous tyrant and the world will remember you fondly but fuck one horse and you will be a horse fucker for all eternity. Catherine the Great

Under capitalism, man exploits man. Under communism, it's just the opposite.
J K Galbraith

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 96
RE: New GOP Tax Plan - 11/12/2017 8:18:13 PM   
MrRodgers


Posts: 10542
Joined: 7/30/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01


quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

the "give him a chance" sentiment has less to do with any significant failures on his part, and more to do with the lefts incessant petty griping about everything, and actual desire to see him fail.




Just out of curiosity. Do you see any "significant failures" on his part?

A legitimate question.

But to the extent and honestly beyond the usual policy issues that 'the lefts incessant petty griping about everything,' an actual desire to see him fail' was learned from the right after 8 years each of incessant petty griping about everything, and actual desire to see [him] fail for Clinton and Obama even stating as much.

The dems have their problems, the repubs are verging on beyond help.

_____________________________

You can be a murderous tyrant and the world will remember you fondly but fuck one horse and you will be a horse fucker for all eternity. Catherine the Great

Under capitalism, man exploits man. Under communism, it's just the opposite.
J K Galbraith

(in reply to MasterJaguar01)
Profile   Post #: 97
RE: New GOP Tax Plan - 11/13/2017 1:22:28 AM   
Edwird


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Joined: 5/2/2016
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quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

its difficult to believe a lot of the "scoring" that goes on because they often don't state the assumptions inherent in forecasting, and we often don't look for them.

what little I have heard says its deficit neutral if one considers the economic growth that comes as a result from it.


This last data coming from, where?

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Profile   Post #: 98
RE: New GOP Tax Plan - 11/13/2017 6:45:43 AM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01


quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

the "give him a chance" sentiment has less to do with any significant failures on his part, and more to do with the lefts incessant petty griping about everything, and actual desire to see him fail.




Just out of curiosity. Do you see any "significant failures" on his part?

A legitimate question.

And after EXPLICIT intent to see Obama fail . . .

Fucking bunch of clowns, the lot of them.

Anyway, when we’re all done feeling sorry for Trump’s inept ass —

The GOP Tax Plan sucks. They can’t even get enough GOP votes to pass it, FFS.

So yeah, totally the left’s fault, for not believing in a Trump fantasy.

Roughly, it would be like budgeting a household by saying “Well, if we cut our income, it will stimulate the economy, and that will cause our income to rise.”

And FTW does that even mean, to “give him a chance”? I don’t hope he fails — I just observe that he’s indeed not succeeding.

So does much of the GOP as well, frankly.

(in reply to MasterJaguar01)
Profile   Post #: 99
RE: New GOP Tax Plan - 11/13/2017 7:08:49 AM   
BoscoX


Posts: 11227
Joined: 12/10/2016
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01


quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

the "give him a chance" sentiment has less to do with any significant failures on his part, and more to do with the lefts incessant petty griping about everything, and actual desire to see him fail.




Just out of curiosity. Do you see any "significant failures" on his part?

A legitimate question.

And after EXPLICIT intent to see Obama fail . . .

Fucking bunch of clowns, the lot of them.

Anyway, when we’re all done feeling sorry for Trump’s inept ass —

The GOP Tax Plan sucks. They can’t even get enough GOP votes to pass it, FFS.

So yeah, totally the left’s fault, for not believing in a Trump fantasy.

Roughly, it would be like budgeting a household by saying “Well, if we cut our income, it will stimulate the economy, and that will cause our income to rise.”

And FTW does that even mean, to “give him a chance”? I don’t hope he fails — I just observe that he’s indeed not succeeding.

So does much of the GOP as well, frankly.


Obama's least-transparent administration in history had the stated mission to "fundamentally transform" this country, or in plain English he was referring to enslaving us to communism

Yeah, we wanted him to fail.

President Trump is patriotic, and believes in law and order, capitalism, the freedom necessary for capitalism to thrive, in short believes in making America great again

So... We can see why leftist trash want him to fail

_____________________________

Thought Criminal

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 100
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