RE: More allegations of misconduct (Full Version)

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DaddySatyr -> RE: More allegations of misconduct (11/14/2017 7:51:48 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

I didnt say you did say that
your hate, is all you have, enjoy it.



Of course you didn't SAY I said that. That would be too direct for a gutless coward such as yourself. Better to be passive-aggressive (and ambiguous) than to be direct, no?

No, you prefer to be very subtle; hell, I'd call it "sneaky" about how you try to discredit and dehumanize.

I'll bet your parents would be proud!

As an aside: when it comes to things that keep me warm at night, my loathing of you and all of your ilk doesn't hold a candle to the important "things" which I do have.







Awareness -> RE: More allegations of misconduct (11/14/2017 7:55:02 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic
your hate, is all you have, enjoy it.
Now that's irony, right there.




Lucylastic -> RE: More allegations of misconduct (11/14/2017 7:55:26 AM)

No, Im outwardly aggressive to people who are fuckwits. Decent people dont get treated like fuckwits do.
There's so many of them about.





Lucylastic -> RE: More allegations of misconduct (11/14/2017 7:56:32 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic
your hate, is all you have, enjoy it.
Now that's irony, right there.


ooooh thats an exciting comeback from you...did it take you all week to come up with that?




DaddySatyr -> RE: More allegations of misconduct (11/14/2017 7:57:17 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

No, Im outwardly aggressive to people who are fuckwits. Decent people dont get treated like fuckwits do.
There's so many of them about.




Yes, and if you ever leave the site, there'll be one less fuckwit.







Awareness -> RE: More allegations of misconduct (11/14/2017 7:59:10 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic


quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic
your hate, is all you have, enjoy it.
Now that's irony, right there.


ooooh thats an exciting comeback from you...did it take you all week to come up with that?
*laugh* Don't be ludicrous Lucy - I think MUCH more quickly than you do.

I realise you're kinda slow on the uptake, but you really should try and pay better attention.




Awareness -> RE: More allegations of misconduct (11/14/2017 8:00:22 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

No, Im outwardly aggressive to people who are fuckwits. Decent people dont get treated like fuckwits do.
There's so many of them about.




Yes, and if you ever leave the site, there'll be one less fuckwit.




Dude, with 40,000 posts she ain't leaving unless they drag her away... and even then her fingernails will be scrabbling desperately at the keyboard.




Lucylastic -> RE: More allegations of misconduct (11/14/2017 8:04:13 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic


quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic
your hate, is all you have, enjoy it.
Now that's irony, right there.


ooooh thats an exciting comeback from you...did it take you all week to come up with that?
*laugh* Don't be ludicrous Lucy - I think MUCH more quickly than you do.

I realise you're kinda slow on the uptake, but you really should try and pay better attention.

LOL not in the slightest...Yet another one who claims shit they cant back up.
Gather round boys, you need mutual affection against the nasty woman...
oooh the shame




DaddySatyr -> RE: More allegations of misconduct (11/14/2017 8:13:00 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness
Dude, with 40,000 posts she ain't leaving unless they drag her away... and even then her fingernails will be scrabbling desperately at the keyboard.


I live in hope.



Michael




Awareness -> RE: More allegations of misconduct (11/14/2017 8:48:43 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic
Gather round boys, you need mutual affection against the nasty woman...
oooh the shame
Now that's irony considering you were part of a cabal who used to post all over each other's opponents - even going so far as to try and organise mass postings in email.

Don't try and deny it Lucy, your post history is there for all to see. Especially that nice little section when you were supporting ArPig and his fake personalities so virulently.




Lucylastic -> RE: More allegations of misconduct (11/14/2017 8:53:47 AM)

LOL oh the same accusation as michael, without any prooof, evidence or facts.....
what a lying dickhole
How did I support arpig?





DaddySatyr -> RE: More allegations of misconduct (11/14/2017 8:55:13 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness
Now that's irony considering you were part of a cabal who used to post all over each other's opponents - even going so far as to try and organise mass postings in email.

Don't try and deny it Lucy, your post history is there for all to see. Especially that nice little section when you were supporting ArPig and his fake personalities so virulently.



With the behavior that's been going on around here, lately, I am starting to look back on the Arpig days with some measure of nostalgia.



Michael




bounty44 -> RE: More allegations of misconduct (11/14/2017 11:57:20 AM)

Michael, ive seen him referenced occasionally, but he was before my joining the forums. can you catch me up on the story?




DaddySatyr -> RE: More allegations of misconduct (11/14/2017 12:57:29 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

Michael, ive seen him referenced occasionally, but he was before my joining the forums. can you catch me up on the story?


Very briefly:

Arpig (Bob) was a super-intelligent guy, but he was also nuttier than a squirrel turd. I mean certifiable.

He had an army of sock puppets that included four (or five) lesbian/bisexual girls who all lived to serve his every need.

The trouble is, the posting styles and actual wording were pretty dissimilar. Bob had a lot of people fooled, but others were on to him and tried to get management to do something about it.

The head moderator at the time kept defending Bob and doing nothing about the chaos caused on the boards and the "real life" damage Bob was doing to the people he'd fooled (hurt feelings, etc.).

I will have to try and hunt around for the thread where the aforementioned head mod allowed Bob to come back and "face his accusers" (even that thread was a train wreck, but reading it; ALL of it will "catch you up")..



Peace,


Michael



Edit: Found it! http://www.collarchat.com/m_3994202/mpage_1/tm.htm







cloudboy -> RE: More allegations of misconduct (11/14/2017 1:11:54 PM)


Moore offered a sixteen year old girl a ride home, but instead of taking her home, he drove to a dark parking lot and started groping and pushing her to have sex. The sixteen year old was locked in his car at the time, and he was 30+ years old.

One theory behind this behavior is the evangelical, religious view that minor girls are fair game for sex and marriage.

The irony is Moore running his candidacy as a moralist.




WhoreMods -> RE: More allegations of misconduct (11/14/2017 1:16:35 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy


Moore offered a sixteen year old girl a ride home, but instead of taking her home, he drove to a dark parking lot and started groping and pushing her to have sex. The sixteen year old was locked in his car at the time, and he was 30+ years old.

One theory behind this behavior is the evangelical, religious view that minor girls are fair game for sex and marriage.

The irony is Moore running his candidacy as a moralist.

Well yes, but that's those evil queers, isn't it?
He'd never molest a sixteen year old boy into saying yes after near as dammit abducting them because that would be wrong. The bible says you should stick to jailbait that sits down to piss.




bounty44 -> RE: More allegations of misconduct (11/20/2017 6:04:07 AM)

thank you. its fascinating stuff in a way.

meanwhile, this is bound to go over really well with the comrades.

"Roy Moore, the Moms, and the Yearbook Signature"

quote:

Three out of the four Moms of the teen daughters who now claim sexual harassment or worse by Roy Moore 40 years ago, trusted him implicitly with their daughters at the time in question. Shockeroo!

According to the Washington Post article that unleashed sexual predator zombie accusations against the Alabama Senate candidate, Debbie Gibson was 17 in 1981 when Moore asked her out. She asked her Mom what she’d say if she wanted to date a 34 year old man named Roy Moore. Gibson quotes her Mom: “I’d say you were the luckiest girl in the world.” The two dated a few times, says Ms. Gibson, and Moore kissed her once. Kissing while dating is now sexual assault doncha know.

Another Mom in the Post hit piece was “really, really strict” according to her then 19 year old daughter, Gloria Thacker Deason, but let her stay out past her 10:30 curfew with Moore because “she just felt like I would be safe with him… she thought he was good husband material.” She dated Moore a few times in 1979 and she told the paper their physical relationship “did not go further than kissing and hugging.” The man was a monster!

Deason’s Mom likely approved of her daughter dating Moore because he was a hometown hero; a much-admired West Point grad, and a Vietnam vet with a bright future as an assistant district attorney. Certainly neither Deason’s nor Gibson’s Mom had reason to think their daughters were in any danger from the town’s golden boy or they would never have enthusiastically welcomed his attentions to the young women.

Yet to read the volcanic spew of articles and horrified accusations from the High Foreheads of MediaWorld, Republicans and Democrats alike, you’d think that a man who dates a teenager when he’s in his 30’s is a raging pervert. Case closed. No discussion allowed.

Even in the sole case in which sexual misconduct is alleged against Moore involving 14 year old Leigh Corfman, her Mom showed enormous trust in the assistant district attorney from the moment they met. The girl and her Mom, Nancy Wells, were sitting outside a courtroom in Etowah County, Alabama, awaiting a custody hearing in Wells’ divorce case when Moore came up to them and offered to watch Leigh while her Mom was in the hearing. The Post quotes Wells, now 71, “He said, ‘Oh, you don’t want her to go in there and hear all that. I’ll stay out here with her.’” Wells wasn’t the least suspicious, but instead says, “I thought, how nice for him to want to take care of my little girl.” Had they met before – or had Moore introduced himself as an assistant d.a.? The Post doesn’t say.

...Corfman and Moore chatted; she found him “charming and smiley” and gave him her phone number. When he called, they made plans for him to pick her up around the corner from her house. “I was kind of giddy, excited, you know? An older guy, you know?”

She says he might have given her alcohol, and while they sat and talked, she told him she was 14. Moore kissed her, whereupon she felt nervous and asked him to take her home, which he did. Yet she met him again and they again went to his place “in the woods.”

Corfman seems to have been an adventurous girl eager to explore the unknown. “This was a new experience, and it was exciting and fun and scary,” Corfman told the Post, explaining why she saw him again. “It was just like this roller-coaster ride you’ve not been on.”

She said they went back to his house and says “before long she was lying on a blanket on the floor.” Moore left the room and according to her, returned wearing nothing but “tight white underwear” as he kissed her, removed her pants and shirt, and, she claims, touched her through her bra and panties while “he guided her hand to his underwear.” She thought, “I don’t want to do this – I’ve got to get out of here,” and she got dressed. Then she asked Moore to take her home, which he did.

And that’s it. No attempted rape, no violent sexual assault, not even any forced nudity. Of course, if it happened, it’s awfully icky and yes wrong and unlawful that a grown man would handle a 14 year old in such a manner. If it happened. And even if it did, is it worth 40 long years later, ruining a man’s reputation built over four decades of service to his state and nation, and destroying his hard-fought prospects to become a useful, productive U.S. Senator?

Plus, if Moore did this unsavory thing, for which there is no actual proof, only he said/she said, he was a Democrat at the time; he didn’t become a Republican until 1992. Hmmm.

The attacks on Moore have nothing to do with sudden moral outrage, not when Majority Leader McConnell and his GOP cronies spent 30 million dollars to eviscerate this fellow Republican in the primaries even before any sex-related allegations surfaced. And why once he won the primary, did the Republican High Command - McConnell, House Speaker Paul Ryan, John McCain, even Mike Lee and Ted Cruz - condemn him as a predatory deviant, again with stunning lack of proof? And why did Colorado Senator Cory Gardner, the Republican Senate Campaign Committee Chair in charge of the money, cut off GOP funds for Moore, abandoning him to be outspent by his Democrat opponent 11 to 1. Then Gardner even threatened to “expel” Moore from the Senate if elected by Alabama voters. How reprehensible.

But why, when Moore would have easily defeated the Democrat in red-state Alabama and kept the Republican majority – why would they all circle round and tear bloody chunks off the man like a pack of snarling dingoes in a National Geographic special? Because Moore is a rebel who has proved he can’t be bought or controlled by the powers that be. And then there’s his radical God thing.

What would Moore say to the leadership’s price tag on a committee assignment that demands a new Senator pay hundreds of thousands of dollars to the Republican (or Democrat) campaign war chest? As exposed in Colorado Congressman Ken Buck’s sobering book, Drain the Swamp, chairing an important committee can cost a member over a million dollars! Moore would doubtless raise holy Hades at the pay-to-play that infects Congress and the valuable time members must spend money-raising instead of doing the peoples’ business.

Senator Moore would refuse to play the Washington game. He would vote his conscience, not in lockstep with demands from on high. He might even start a revolt -- and they can’t have that kind of insubordination in Congress! But the people of Alabama chose Moore as their nominee despite the GOP’s $30 million to defeat him, just as they twice elected him Chief Justice of the Alabama Supreme Court even after he had been kicked off the bench for standing up for his Ten Commandments monument and traditional, man/woman marriage. Side note to ACLU: a carved frieze of Moses holding the stone tablets of the Ten Commandments actually looks down on the Supreme Court Justices from the south wall of the courtroom as they dispense their verdicts.

So now comes professional outrage-monger Gloria Allred, Godmother of Victimhood. Having run out of Trump accusers (where did they all go anyway?) her “client” this time is one Beverly Young Nelson who dry-sobbed her way through her salacious accusations since to go all tearful would be to carve a Mississippi River into her elaborately troweled face. Nelson complains that when she was Moore offered to drive her home from the restaurant where she waitressed but instead took her behind the establishment and attacked her in his car.

She and Gloria offered the only “proof” in all the accusations that Moore and the woman even knew each other – Nelson’s 1977 high school yearbook allegedly signed “Love, Roy Moore, D.A.” It’s come to light that “D.A.” were the initials of Judge Moore’s longtime assistant and secretary, Delbra Adams, who says she habitually added them to his official signature, as proved by a divorce document he signed years later with the identical D.A. initials – coincidentally, a divorce decree in the case of none other than the very same Beverly Young Nelson.

That’s a big problem for Allred and Nelson since there’s no way that Moore would have added his assistant’s “D.A.” initials to a personal 1977 yearbook signature (also he was an Assistant D.A., then a judge, never a D.A.) AND especially since Ms. Adams didn’t start working for Judge Moore until 1989, 12 years later. And there are other big doubts about the validity of the Moore signature.

But the most damning evidence of forgery comes from Allred herself. When CNN’s Wolf Blitzer asked her directly: “Can you say flatly to our viewers that the signature is not a forgery?” Allred refused to answer his persistent question. She told Blitzer she would only release the yearbook for examination by hand-writing experts if and when a Senate committee calls a special hearing. Which she knows perfectly well they will not do for a candidate -- and time-wise it’s impossible prior to the December 12 Alabama election.

Allred and her client have exposed themselves as serial liars. The Republicans would rather have a Democrat in the Senate than a man who would help bolster their majority and President Trump’s agenda. And Roy Moore is being mercilessly savaged by political assassins on the basis of nothing more than 40-year-old she-said passing for proof. Oh, and the latest is some woman accusing him of grabbing her butt while her mother was present. Yeah, that happened.

All America awaits the December 12 election to see if Alabama citizens will stand up for their voting rights or bow the knee to the bullies of D.C.


https://townhall.com/columnists/joyoverbeck/2017/11/20/roy-moore-the-moms-and-the-yearbook-signature-n2411630

please note the author is a woman---but a traitor to the cause no doubt right?

yes of course there is more to the story...




Hillwilliam -> RE: More allegations of misconduct (11/20/2017 6:07:54 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

thank you.

meanwhile, this is bound to go over really well with the comrades.

"Roy Moore, the Moms, and the Yearbook Signature"

quote:

Three out of the four Moms of the teen daughters who now claim sexual harassment or worse by Roy Moore 40 years ago, trusted him implicitly with their daughters at the time in question. Shockeroo!

According to the Washington Post article that unleashed sexual predator zombie accusations against the Alabama Senate candidate, Debbie Gibson was 17 in 1981 when Moore asked her out. She asked her Mom what she’d say if she wanted to date a 34 year old man named Roy Moore. Gibson quotes her Mom: “I’d say you were the luckiest girl in the world.” The two dated a few times, says Ms. Gibson, and Moore kissed her once. Kissing while dating is now sexual assault doncha know.

Another Mom in the Post hit piece was “really, really strict” according to her then 19 year old daughter, Gloria Thacker Deason, but let her stay out past her 10:30 curfew with Moore because “she just felt like I would be safe with him… she thought he was good husband material.” She dated Moore a few times in 1979 and she told the paper their physical relationship “did not go further than kissing and hugging.” The man was a monster!

Deason’s Mom likely approved of her daughter dating Moore because he was a hometown hero; a much-admired West Point grad, and a Vietnam vet with a bright future as an assistant district attorney. Certainly neither Deason’s nor Gibson’s Mom had reason to think their daughters were in any danger from the town’s golden boy or they would never have enthusiastically welcomed his attentions to the young women.

Yet to read the volcanic spew of articles and horrified accusations from the High Foreheads of MediaWorld, Republicans and Democrats alike, you’d think that a man who dates a teenager when he’s in his 30’s is a raging pervert. Case closed. No discussion allowed.

Even in the sole case in which sexual misconduct is alleged against Moore involving 14 year old Leigh Corfman, her Mom showed enormous trust in the assistant district attorney from the moment they met. The girl and her Mom, Nancy Wells, were sitting outside a courtroom in Etowah County, Alabama, awaiting a custody hearing in Wells’ divorce case when Moore came up to them and offered to watch Leigh while her Mom was in the hearing. The Post quotes Wells, now 71, “He said, ‘Oh, you don’t want her to go in there and hear all that. I’ll stay out here with her.’” Wells wasn’t the least suspicious, but instead says, “I thought, how nice for him to want to take care of my little girl.” Had they met before – or had Moore introduced himself as an assistant d.a.? The Post doesn’t say.

...Corfman and Moore chatted; she found him “charming and smiley” and gave him her phone number. When he called, they made plans for him to pick her up around the corner from her house. “I was kind of giddy, excited, you know? An older guy, you know?”

She says he might have given her alcohol, and while they sat and talked, she told him she was 14. Moore kissed her, whereupon she felt nervous and asked him to take her home, which he did. Yet she met him again and they again went to his place “in the woods.”

Corfman seems to have been an adventurous girl eager to explore the unknown. “This was a new experience, and it was exciting and fun and scary,” Corfman told the Post, explaining why she saw him again. “It was just like this roller-coaster ride you’ve not been on.”

She said they went back to his house and says “before long she was lying on a blanket on the floor.” Moore left the room and according to her, returned wearing nothing but “tight white underwear” as he kissed her, removed her pants and shirt, and, she claims, touched her through her bra and panties while “he guided her hand to his underwear.” She thought, “I don’t want to do this – I’ve got to get out of here,” and she got dressed. Then she asked Moore to take her home, which he did.

And that’s it. No attempted rape, no violent sexual assault, not even any forced nudity. Of course, if it happened, it’s awfully icky and yes wrong and unlawful that a grown man would handle a 14 year old in such a manner. If it happened. And even if it did, is it worth 40 long years later, ruining a man’s reputation built over four decades of service to his state and nation, and destroying his hard-fought prospects to become a useful, productive U.S. Senator?

Plus, if Moore did this unsavory thing, for which there is no actual proof, only he said/she said, he was a Democrat at the time; he didn’t become a Republican until 1992. Hmmm.

The attacks on Moore have nothing to do with sudden moral outrage, not when Majority Leader McConnell and his GOP cronies spent 30 million dollars to eviscerate this fellow Republican in the primaries even before any sex-related allegations surfaced. And why once he won the primary, did the Republican High Command - McConnell, House Speaker Paul Ryan, John McCain, even Mike Lee and Ted Cruz - condemn him as a predatory deviant, again with stunning lack of proof? And why did Colorado Senator Cory Gardner, the Republican Senate Campaign Committee Chair in charge of the money, cut off GOP funds for Moore, abandoning him to be outspent by his Democrat opponent 11 to 1. Then Gardner even threatened to “expel” Moore from the Senate if elected by Alabama voters. How reprehensible.

But why, when Moore would have easily defeated the Democrat in red-state Alabama and kept the Republican majority – why would they all circle round and tear bloody chunks off the man like a pack of snarling dingoes in a National Geographic special? Because Moore is a rebel who has proved he can’t be bought or controlled by the powers that be. And then there’s his radical God thing.

What would Moore say to the leadership’s price tag on a committee assignment that demands a new Senator pay hundreds of thousands of dollars to the Republican (or Democrat) campaign war chest? As exposed in Colorado Congressman Ken Buck’s sobering book, Drain the Swamp, chairing an important committee can cost a member over a million dollars! Moore would doubtless raise holy Hades at the pay-to-play that infects Congress and the valuable time members must spend money-raising instead of doing the peoples’ business.

Senator Moore would refuse to play the Washington game. He would vote his conscience, not in lockstep with demands from on high. He might even start a revolt -- and they can’t have that kind of insubordination in Congress! But the people of Alabama chose Moore as their nominee despite the GOP’s $30 million to defeat him, just as they twice elected him Chief Justice of the Alabama Supreme Court even after he had been kicked off the bench for standing up for his Ten Commandments monument and traditional, man/woman marriage. Side note to ACLU: a carved frieze of Moses holding the stone tablets of the Ten Commandments actually looks down on the Supreme Court Justices from the south wall of the courtroom as they dispense their verdicts.

So now comes professional outrage-monger Gloria Allred, Godmother of Victimhood. Having run out of Trump accusers (where did they all go anyway?) her “client” this time is one Beverly Young Nelson who dry-sobbed her way through her salacious accusations since to go all tearful would be to carve a Mississippi River into her elaborately troweled face. Nelson complains that when she was Moore offered to drive her home from the restaurant where she waitressed but instead took her behind the establishment and attacked her in his car.

She and Gloria offered the only “proof” in all the accusations that Moore and the woman even knew each other – Nelson’s 1977 high school yearbook allegedly signed “Love, Roy Moore, D.A.” It’s come to light that “D.A.” were the initials of Judge Moore’s longtime assistant and secretary, Delbra Adams, who says she habitually added them to his official signature, as proved by a divorce document he signed years later with the identical D.A. initials – coincidentally, a divorce decree in the case of none other than the very same Beverly Young Nelson.

That’s a big problem for Allred and Nelson since there’s no way that Moore would have added his assistant’s “D.A.” initials to a personal 1977 yearbook signature (also he was an Assistant D.A., then a judge, never a D.A.) AND especially since Ms. Adams didn’t start working for Judge Moore until 1989, 12 years later. And there are other big doubts about the validity of the Moore signature.

But the most damning evidence of forgery comes from Allred herself. When CNN’s Wolf Blitzer asked her directly: “Can you say flatly to our viewers that the signature is not a forgery?” Allred refused to answer his persistent question. She told Blitzer she would only release the yearbook for examination by hand-writing experts if and when a Senate committee calls a special hearing. Which she knows perfectly well they will not do for a candidate -- and time-wise it’s impossible prior to the December 12 Alabama election.

Allred and her client have exposed themselves as serial liars. The Republicans would rather have a Democrat in the Senate than a man who would help bolster their majority and President Trump’s agenda. And Roy Moore is being mercilessly savaged by political assassins on the basis of nothing more than 40-year-old she-said passing for proof. Oh, and the latest is some woman accusing him of grabbing her butt while her mother was present. Yeah, that happened.

All America awaits the December 12 election to see if Alabama citizens will stand up for their voting rights or bow the knee to the bullies of D.C.


https://townhall.com/columnists/joyoverbeck/2017/11/20/roy-moore-the-moms-and-the-yearbook-signature-n2411630

please note the author is a woman---but a traitor to the cause no doubt right?

yes of course there is more to the story...


Of course, there is more to the story.
The dude has an (R) after his name so you will support him no matter what.

If he had a (D) after his name, you'd be calling for his imprisonment.

Nothing new to see here. SSDD




DaddySatyr -> RE: More allegations of misconduct (11/28/2017 10:49:54 AM)


FR:

I was thinking back to a thread, some time ago where people were pissing and moaning about Vice President Pence not being willing to eat dinner with anyone not his wife, when alone.

I forget the thread name and can't seem to find it, but I am almost positive that I (kind of) made this point, then.

Don't all the new allegations of sexual misconduct flying about, these days make Pence out to be a genius? I think it does. It's now been "established" that he's not alone with females as a rule so, even false accusations become tough to float.

I need to find that thread.







Lucylastic -> RE: More allegations of misconduct (11/28/2017 11:08:18 AM)

No he isnt a genius, using religious ideology to cut his chance of being tempted is simply an attempt to put women back in the kitchen. we wont go back to the fifties, or a religious doctrine designed to make women the fault of mens ignorance.




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