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Submissives and Service - 12/13/2004 3:15:25 AM   
harmony3709


Posts: 292
Joined: 11/15/2004
Status: offline 		I was recently confronted again (in real time, not online) with the statement that submissives are not interested in service; they are into BDSM basically for the play aspect and the satisfaction they get from play and/or scening. Along with this line of thinking comes the statement immediately following it that if you DO have a desire to serve, then you are a slave. I, happen to define myself as a submissive, not a slave (although do not discount that for the future), but service is also very important to me. I should add that normally, I don't let the whole definition thing get to me, but I've heard this so often that I'm feeling quite confused.

I know the discussion of labels is a constant ongoing debate, and one which has been done frequently, so I'm not looking for specific labels and/or definitions. What I am wondering is, what are some other opinions on this issue of submissives being interested or not interested in service? If you are service oriented, should you identify yourself as a slave as an indication that you are interested in service?

Any opinions kindly appreciated,

harmony
Profile   Post #: 1
RE: Submissives and Service - 12/13/2004 5:28:12 AM   
liljoy


Posts: 577
Joined: 3/25/2004
Status: offline 		i take great exception to the whole thing aout sumissies being self serving instead of having a desire to serve and please our One. i Take great strides to anticipate Master's needs and desires. i try very hard to have something ready for Master before He even asks for it. i do not consider myself as a submissive because Master believes that a slave has NO right except the right to beg for release.
While my desire to please and serie Master. i don't not desire to give up all my rights (at least not yet). So i figure i don't neatly fit into either lil box.
i think that those of us that are submissives are submissive because of our desire to please and serve. i wonder if those that speak of submissives being only into it for what we get for ourselves, if they are not confusing us with bottoms or masochists?
jmho
lil_joy

(in reply to harmony3709)
Profile   Post #: 2
RE: Submissives and Service - 12/13/2004 6:46:22 AM   
Destinysskeins


Posts: 267
Joined: 7/1/2004
Status: offline 		Greetings,

i agree with liljoy on this - i believe the correct term for someone interested in only scenes/playing would be masochists or bottoms (depending on the type of scening they prefer). i consider myself to be a submissive (and perhaps even a switch since i do have those tendencies and am currently contemplating exploring them further) but i am quite service oriented in my relationship with my Master. While i do receive great satisfaction during our scenes i also take great pleasure out of anticipating His needs, fulfilling any requirements/preferences that He might have made known to me when performing a task for Him and merely being ready to assist Him in any way that He might require.

Well wishes

(in reply to liljoy)
Profile   Post #: 3
RE: Submissives and Service - 12/13/2004 8:21:17 AM   
srahfox


Posts: 261
Joined: 10/17/2004
Status: offline 		Ditto for me. I do desire to please and serve my Master but neither of us truely wants me to give up complete control of my life. I consider myself a submissive but that doesn't change my desire to please my master. We are all people and therefor can't be fit into perfect little packages.

(in reply to Destinysskeins)
Profile   Post #: 4
RE: Submissives and Service - 12/13/2004 8:59:09 AM   
harmony3709


Posts: 292
Joined: 11/15/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: liljoy

i think that those of us that are submissives are submissive because of our desire to please and serve. i wonder if those that speak of submissives being only into it for what we get for ourselves, if they are not confusing us with bottoms or masochists?


I have felt that way also, that someone who only takes on the role of submissive for play is a bottom, just as I have met several men who call themselves a Dom, and although they may have a dominant personality, their only interest in anything at all in BDSM is play and nothing else; thus, personally I tend to think of them as tops. Although quite frankly, if they heard me refer to them as tops would almost definitely be offended.........why this is, I'm not sure, because I don't see anything derrogatory in the term top or bottom.

harmony

(in reply to liljoy)
Profile   Post #: 5
RE: Submissives and Service - 12/13/2004 3:08:34 PM   
proudsub


Posts: 6142
Joined: 1/31/2004
From: Washington
Status: offline 		I agree with all the posters above me here. I have been "serving" Hubby for 36 years but never felt i was a slave, as i am free to do as i wish a lot of the time.

_____________________________

proudsub

"Without goals you become what you were. With goals you become what you wish." .

"You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts"--Alan Greenspan


(in reply to harmony3709)
Profile   Post #: 6
RE: Submissives and Service - 1/19/2005 8:53:10 AM   
garylee


Posts: 38
Joined: 12/15/2004
From: from? iowa.....
Status: offline 		alright---alright.....
from what little i understand of this.......
i am told to understand...that a subbie........IS different than a slave.
i am,.....a slave.--''i'' have given up ALL rights to ANY power in my own life.
i am told to understand subbies keep some of their own power and are allowed to ask for sex...and play...and whatever their lil hearts desire.
as a slave........i have ZERO options to ask for ANYTHING.

if this wrong.......please tell me?
thanks
garylee

_____________________________

i see the world, i notice it is turning, as my guitar gently weeps.

(in reply to proudsub)
Profile   Post #: 7
RE: Submissives and Service - 1/19/2005 9:00:35 AM   
INSIDEYOURMIND


Posts: 483
Status: offline 		It seems we are going through a thread that has been discussed many times before.

I think it is wrong to get hung up on labels.

You are what you are, and if it works for you, then you have no one else to answer to.

I have a submissive/slave, I call her carolyn!

_____________________________

If I got smart with you.................
How would you know?

(in reply to garylee)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: Submissives and Service - 1/19/2005 10:15:59 AM   
darkinshadows


Posts: 4145
Joined: 6/2/2004
From: UK
Status: offline

Warning... personal view approaching... it isnt set in stone... it isnt right for everyone!
I am me.

People would probably 'label' me as a submissive. Indeeds, its what I am labelled here at collarme (profile).

I belong to my Husband. He is my Master. But it isnt His desire for me to call Him such constantly. He knows what He is, and desire that he does not He need a label. We have our own communication skills and names... that is His choice and I submit to his will. It is how I serve Him.

I know one Dominant who considers me to be 'slavelike'... sometimes He calls me 'girl'. This is acceptable by my Husband. I serve this Dominant because I respect Him, and He respects my limits and that I belong to someone. If my Husband wished me not to serve this particular Dominant who is our friend, then I of course submit to His Will.

In a way... I am serving harmony... by answering her question, yet she herself is a submissive(her own words). I am allowed to write her because it is my Masters wish to express my views, which belong to Him and are His.

I have never considered myself 'slave'... but not because I am not a slave, but because I do not think it covers what a slave within BDSM is. Personal preference. I am blessed that the Owner of me feels the same. I am no less a person because of a label. I serve. I submit. I anticipate my Owners Desires and listen to Him and I obey Him without question. I dont have a choice. I submitted to that and my service depends upon such. His Decision is final.

I am a bottom. I would top if that is what the Dominant desires... but that doesnt make me a switch, because its not my choice, its part of my submission and I serve the will.

Is that as clear as mud?



_____________________________
.dark.



...i surrender to gravity and the unknown...

(in reply to harmony3709)
Profile   Post #: 9
RE: Submissives and Service - 1/19/2005 10:26:30 AM   
darkinshadows


Posts: 4145
Joined: 6/2/2004
From: UK
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: garylee

alright---alright.....
from what little i understand of this.......
i am told to understand...that a subbie........IS different than a slave.


If this is what you have been told by the person who owns you, then it is right - for you.

quote:

i am,.....a slave.--''i'' have given up ALL rights to ANY power in my own life.


amen to that

quote:

i am told to understand subbies keep some of their own power and are allowed to ask for sex...and play...and whatever their lil hearts desire.
as a slave........i have ZERO options to ask for ANYTHING.



that is what your Master/Mistress has decided. and thats between you both. But I am not a slave, i can ask for anything only when Master allows. But in His wisdom, I do not have to ask because He already knows me and fulfils my needs as I serve His desires. My needs are what He desires, therefore i submit to them and to Him without question. Make sense?

quote:

if this wrong.......please tell me?
thanks
garylee


your not wrong... if that is what your Master/Mistress/Dominant/Dominia has decided. But for others, it may be a different thing. Doesnt make them any less... or any more... wrong or right.

_____________________________
.dark.



...i surrender to gravity and the unknown...

(in reply to garylee)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: Submissives and Service - 1/19/2005 10:33:08 AM   
nella


Posts: 1243
Joined: 12/30/2004
From: Norway
Status: offline 		This depends. i am a submissive and i have no paticular wish to clean somone house, basicaly becouse i have no time for it, but other submissives want this type of service. The tern slave and submissive is rather peronal and much controvercy exist as to their meaning.

(in reply to darkinshadows)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: Submissives and Service - 1/19/2005 10:38:42 AM   
ProtagonistLily


Posts: 1222
Joined: 12/27/2004
Status: offline
quote:

i agree with liljoy on this - i believe the correct term for someone interested in only scenes/playing would be masochists or bottoms (depending on the type of scening they prefer).


Hey all,

I always enjoy hearing other people's definitions as they relate to themselves in the scene.

For me, a masochist is a person who's only interested in the play aspects. A bottom, however, as I define it for myself, as in "I bottomed to" Dom(me) X, for me means this is a person, who I know, who I am not collared to or have an ongoing relationship with, who I play with. So when I was 'bottoming" (playing with people who were not my Master/Mistress) I could be collared at the same time.

So, having 'bottomed' to a particular person doesn't detract, for me at least, whether a person is actually a submissive or a slave. It simply, for me, denotes that there isn't a formal BDSM relationship between the person I either played with or play with now as a Top. (Again, I use Top to denote that I am not in a formal relationship with the person who 'bottoms' to me. Otherwise, these relationships would be denoted with Domme and submissive/slave)

Great turn this thread took.

L

_____________________________

"Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind"
~Dr. Seuss~

(in reply to Destinysskeins)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: Submissives and Service - 1/19/2005 10:47:33 AM   
Suleiman


Posts: 1127
Joined: 9/9/2004
Status: offline 		Just remember that an opinion is not a fact, dear, and there is no bondage court handing down categorical definitions of terms used by members of the scene. Labels are nearly meaningless, and for every person who has a clear handle on their personal philosophy, there are a dozen mindless twits who opine on everything while revealing nothing, and there are a gross of misinformed gecks who mindlessly repeat what they have been told, from whatever source, without any clue as to the verity of the statement.

The gecks are easy to tell apart, but the twits and philosophers are a bit difficult. Since you don't really know me, you might consider my statement suspect, and you would be wise to do so.

< Message edited by Suleiman -- 1/19/2005 10:49:20 AM >

_____________________________

Think of my verbosity as a sort of litmus test for our relationship. I write in a manner identical to how I speak and how I think. If you can not cope with what I have written here, it is probably for the best if we go our separate ways.

(in reply to harmony3709)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: Submissives and Service - 1/19/2005 10:51:34 AM   
nella


Posts: 1243
Joined: 12/30/2004
From: Norway
Status: offline 		True Suleiman i can call myself anything from bottom to slave and noen but me and my Dom would realy know what the word meant for us.

(in reply to Suleiman)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: Submissives and Service - 1/19/2005 10:55:44 AM   
ProtagonistLily


Posts: 1222
Joined: 12/27/2004
Status: offline
quote:

True Suleiman i can call myself anything from bottom to slave and noen but me and my Dom would realy know what the word meant for us.


Talking about love is like dancing about architecture.....

I can call myself anything I want...what matters is that you UNDERSTAND why I call myself that thing...regardless of whether you agree with or not.



_____________________________

"Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind"
~Dr. Seuss~

(in reply to nella)
Profile   Post #: 15
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