RE: What happens to old slaves and Masters? (Full Version)

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WhipTheHip -> RE: What happens to old slaves and Masters? (8/4/2006 5:36:41 AM)

Greetings Susan,
 
    I don't know about anyone else, but if I had a sub, I would love her, and consider her my soul-mate
and partner, before I considered her a sub.   If a sub gave me her body to do with as I please, I would
give her my soul, I would view her as a life-partner and a lover, before my view of her as a sub.  In
other words, I practice bdsm in a committed relationship.  I know I may lose a lot of subs by saying
this, because . . .  and I could be wrong about this . . . many subs feel they unworthy of love, they
want to be looked upon as a sub, not a lover, and they fear love.  They fear being loved, and
fear falling live.  They may feel themselves incapable of love.  I would not be in a relatinnship with
a sub who had "no love" as hard limit.  I would try to get my sub to accept love, just as I would
try to get  her to accept the other tortures I desire to inflict on her.  I would get her to think of love
as the ultimate torture, and the ultimate state of submission.  In my view, that is what true selfless
love is all about, If you really love someone, you are willing to do anything and everything for them,
and put their interests above yoors.  Love is about being selfless, and there is really very little of
that in today's world.   I would hate being in a relationship where each partner just used the other,
but had no emotoinal attachment to the other.  I want a sub I "use: and "abuse."  When I write,
"abuse" I mean erotically flog and sexually torture for my sexual pleasure.  I want to be able
to use her body like a sex toy.  But I would love her soul.  I would expect a mutual love to grow
between us.  I would expect us to become emtionally very close.  I could be wrong, but I am 
guessing that a lot of subs have never in their life gotten a certain kind of love, and maybe
some of them have really never loved.  People have to see real love to know what it is, and
many people have never seen or experienced real love in their entire lives.  So, just as I
get pleasure from showing someone new to bdsm the pleasures of bdsm, I get pleasure from
showing a sub love who has never really been loved, and fears it more than anything in
the world.  
 
With love, lashes and endless hugs,
Michael



SusanofO -> RE: What happens to old slaves and Masters? (8/4/2006 6:43:08 AM)

Noah: I loved your post. Especially the part about time together already being forever, like a book already written, and time on Earth being a manifestation of love for loved ones.  

P.S.: I am Irish, as a matter of fact (25%). 
I finally figured out who you remind me of - although you may or may not be familiar w/said person. But - there is a tv show I sometimes watch on the USA network on Friday eve, at 11pm, called "House" - and you are a dead-ringer, dialogue-wise, for the main character, Dr. Gregory House.

It's a great show: Dr. House is the teaching professor at a teaching hospital where the weekly challenge is for Dr. House and his interns to figure out what weird, obscure disease or malady a patient has, by eliminating various possibilities by analyzing them, and through pursuing various courses of treatment and seeing which one works.It's a very interesting and intructive show. Dr. House is a real smartass, in a good-natured, instructive kind of way. A brilliant infectious disease specialist w/an acerbic wit. He walks with a cane due to an old injury, even though he is only middle-aged. He is never wrong in deciphering medical clue data, or in his final medical diagnoses, either. His students all realize he knows what he's doing. It really is a great show - you should watch it sometime, if you've never seen it. I am completely serious when I say - you sound exactly like this guy, most of the time, whyen I read your posts. (watch the show, and you'll see what I mean. It is a good show, and worth a look. It is not boring, even if one is not a medicine aficiando, because the characters are so well drawn). 

- Susan



SusanofO -> RE: What happens to old slaves and Masters? (8/4/2006 6:49:13 AM)

BillsGalSusan: Why does Canada so often seem to have so much more common sense than the U.S. when it comes to how they deal w/these practical life issues?
I've been to Tornoto, and besides looking a lot like to NYC (to me) it appeared to be much cleaner and better-organized. I could go on, but there have been times I have fondly looked rememebered my one trip to Toronto, and thought to myself: Gosh, if I could afford it, I might like to live there (really).

Lilttle Pita: It is good, I think, that your Daddy has already contmeplated such things, because they will eventually need to be dealt with. Good to hear, and continued happiness.

ATLDom: This is very encouraging to hear. I love reading about the mature crowd getting as much out of life as it has to offer. Thanks for the note.  

- Susan



SusanofO -> RE: What happens to old slaves and Masters? (8/4/2006 6:55:05 AM)

Lady Hugs: Your reply is encouraging to read, as you are obviously an example of someone moving toward the senior years with grace and dignity. Thanks for the very on point reminder for people to remember to figure out exactly how they want their toy boxes to be heandled (or found) when they pass. That is an excellent point, and something I think some may well have forgotten, had you not pointed it out.

- Susan   



BillsGalSusan -> RE: What happens to old slaves and Masters? (8/4/2006 6:57:10 AM)

Actually, Susan, Alberta's legislation came about because the province hoped that by creating the opportunity to register non-het/alternative lifestyle partnerships with all the legal rights of marriage they could get away with limiting marriage itself  to heterosexual couples. It didn't work, and at least for now, same sex marriages are legal throughout Canada. Now that the party in power has changed, parliament may attempt to change that this fall.

Another Susan



SusanofO -> RE: What happens to old slaves and Masters? (8/4/2006 7:00:33 AM)

Rayne 58: Sounds like you are already prepared for the eventuality, and not the kind of person who would ever consider abandoning someone. Kudos to you! Your Master is a lucky guy (and am sure you think as much of him).

Evanescence and marie: Neither of you sounds like you could ever toss anyone out the door. Ditto (as above). It is so encouragig to read these replies.

When I first wrote this, I was in a depressed mood (kinda) - no longer. My faith in certain parts of the bdsm community re: Certain questions (and coping w/end of life issues) has been somewhat restored. Thanks.

- Susan 



SusanofO -> RE: What happens to old slaves and Masters? (8/4/2006 7:04:05 AM)

Cowgirl Tough: It is so good to hear about people in the community who are already dealing with these issues, or at least thinking about them.   

Wolfie: Nice to hear from someone who is planning this out. Good to do and encouraging to know.

Whip the Hip: Well, judging from your introductory post the other day, I figuredas much about You, he,he - and you are going to find yourself the woman of your dreams buddy - just hang in there. She is out there (and she is going to be one lucky gal).

**Thanks to everyone who has answered, so far. This has been an extremely encouraging thread to read, and I really I guess wanted to know how people felt about these questions and alos kind of wondered if anybody else thought about them. Of course they do - and now I know that for sure. Thank you!

- Susan



stockingluvr54 -> RE: What happens to old slaves and Masters? (8/4/2006 9:04:54 AM)

if it's a loving relationship then it's just understood.....you go on till the end.



juliaoceania -> RE: What happens to old slaves and Masters? (8/5/2006 4:42:55 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: justheather



Susan, I think more people understand where you are coming from than you think.
If I have my way, I wll be my Daddy's submissive when Im too old to kneel down. I want to be his submissive when all he can do is look over at me and see the look on my face and know that I am still his. If we share a lifetime of such intense connection through our dynamic, how could I imagine it ending any other way?

This is kind of off-topic and, man, I'm going to sound incredibly morbid, but sometimes I think about what it would be like to sit or lay next to my dom while he is dying and kiss his head and face and hold his hand and tell him what a good Daddy he is and how much I love him. I think about doing that with my mother, my father, even my own unmentionable. I think about what that would be like and how very very important it would be for me to be fully present in that moment with that person.

I guess it's because I see people die all the time. Sometimes Im the only one with them. Some die really beautiful deaths surrounded by their loved-ones with music playing and laughter and tears and the room just lit up with love and some die lying alone in a strange bed in a strange room with strangers. I know Im a weirdo, but I dont think Im weird in that a good death is a gift I want for all the people I hold dear.







As a nurse you know that our culture sends our people away to die alone very often. It is not a celebration of that person's life, but a mourning of theor death before they even pass. We said goodbye to my stepfather a couple of months ago in the way you would like to say goodbye to your loved ones. It was beautiful. I wish I had been old enough to say goodbye to me own father in this way.



angelica4 -> RE: What happens to old slaves and Masters? (8/5/2006 5:07:09 AM)

i also  have been at the bedside, as a nurse, juliaoceania, and know exactly what it is like.   it is a wonderful thing to be able to tell someone in those minutes how good they are, how much you have enjoyed them, and in one of those moments, i had a patient look me in the eye and tell me that she loved me.  i told her the same.  it was about knowing who we truly are in our essence, and how connected we all are.  i have experienced the love spoken of above, and it was wonderful, but it still ended.  i could not be perfect 100% of the time, and He could not accept it.. so we ended after three years.  i had thought we would be together at the end, but it was not to be.  i am not looking back, because i have done that with Him too many times.  Too many breakups and back togethers only weaken the chain.  i am afraid now, to give myself so wholely, to enjoy myself too much in the next relationship, because giving all is no guarantee of lasting love, and it hurts very much when it ends.  even though one knows it is for the best, as when a terribly ill person dies, there is a lot of spiritual pain involved and there is no shortcut.  



ExSteelAgain -> RE: What happens to old slaves and Masters? (8/5/2006 6:54:25 AM)

To take this a step further, thoughtful people adapt to physical changes early on. Even with a 40 year old, I’d possibly adapt my play. It is possible that she couldn’t handle the physical exertion a 20 year old could. Then again, I may have to adapt to the 20 year old because she couldn’t handle the emotional element that a 40 year old could. Some of this is knowing your sub well.

I once started fast with a small cane on her back with her kneeling with her hands on the head of the bed. She reacted unusually and said she had a headache. I adjusted; I stopped. There is no difference when dealing with age, I adjust the play.

Susan, to your question, I think we all wonder if we could do the right thing, we have doubts and we feel guilt no matter what we think we would do or actually do, as is happening with me now. My mother is in an assisted living home and I don’t see her enough in my mind.  It is a stressful time when I visit her. Confusion, sorrow and false hope fill the room. I try, I feel guilt, I’m sad.



SusanofO -> RE: What happens to old slaves and Masters? (8/5/2006 7:09:59 AM)

ExSteel: Thnaks for replying; you are alwasy good to read.

Thnaks as well to everyone else who replied. This has been an encouraging thread for me (and I hope for others, too).

Update: My dad is fine, he is just not supposed to exert himself in the heat (turns out he was actaully trying to play golf in 104 degree weather - well hell, I would be fainting too. My sisters and I just shook our heads. He's supposedly a smart guy, but also a die-hard golfer).

I am leaving town today for a week at a lake in Iowa, and will be back next Friday (just saying that so people won't maybe think I've abandoned CM). See ya'll then and take care of yourselves!

- Susan 



SaphireLynn -> RE: What happens to old slaves and Masters? (8/5/2006 7:12:42 AM)

I can answer this one easily. I took care of Mine while he was in poor health. I did not discard him like rubbish. He gave Me his all and I took care of him. And one of these days W/we will be together again.



SusanofO -> RE: What happens to old slaves and Masters? (8/5/2006 7:13:30 AM)

Okay, I'm  Irish then. My grandfather's name was Daniel Patrick McMahon.
(my mother's father). Erin go Bragh!

- Susan 



BillsGalSusan -> RE: What happens to old slaves and Masters? (8/5/2006 7:23:42 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: wetfart

HAS ONE GETS OLDER , THE ANATOMICAL PHYSIOLOGY OF THE PHYSICAL BODY CHANGES. SKIN BECOMES THINNER AND MUSCLES LOOSER, SO THEY CAN NO LONGER TOLERATE PAIN. LIFE ENERGY ALSO DEPLETES,AND WITH IT SEXUAL IBIDO. NEVER BE IN  A HURRY TO GET OLD AND ENJOY BEING YOUNG AND IN GOOD HEALTH FOR SO LONG HAS IT LASTS,USUALLY THE FIRST 4 DECADES OF LIFE ONLY.

Not that I want to entirely discount your experience, wetfart, but this 54 year old submissive is, without a doubt, an exception to your rule. Yes, my skin is thinner, but I take good care of things like muscle tone, and I'm betting I am in better shape than many people your age. The libido stuff might be true for some folks, but certainly not for me. Generalizations like this might just not be all that helpful.

The one big change I have noticed is that my body shape has changed, and there are now some bony areas that are not great in terms of  some kinds of sensation play. It hasn't been a problem, maybe because Bill is not a do it by rote kinda guy.

Another Susan



Mezentius -> RE: What happens to old slaves and Masters? (8/5/2006 7:42:25 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: SusanofO

... Maybe this isn't the place to ask but - think about it:

Question: If you really cared about your Master (Mistress) or slave or submissive, you would take care of them if they were sick, right? Or at least help? You wouldn't toss them out the door because they were "too old"? Well, maybe some would.
Any comments (and accompanying justifications for whatever) welcome.
Sorry to be a wet blanket (if I am) but I do think this is rarely discussed, or maybe even contemplated (why would it be- nobody here is that old, I guess). Doesn't mean people can't think about it.

Question: So - What's your plan, as far as D/s or M/s in your life goes, goes when you really start to age? Gonna have someone there who gives a darn about your welfare, even if you're a wrinkled up thing that can hardly walk anymore, or what? Or not? Gonna toss someone out the door on their butt because they've suddenly become "too old" and-or too much work to care for?...

- Susan


In my experience I have seen many friends in the lifestyle pass on, some early... some later in life. But one thing I have seen is that the responce of the partner(s) has always been the same:

"No one dies alone."

Now... mabey my experience is unique... Slaves have come to Me from Masters whom have passed on... Dominants I have met have had partners and slaves who have passed on... Males and females each have stood tall in the face of the losses they all suffered and life continued for them, after.

Not one person, in the life, abandoned thier chores ... left thier partner... or decided that watching them die was too much. they stayed... they made the other as comfortable as possible and in the end, they remembered their partner with fondness.

I may be unique in that most of those passing on, have been from cancer, and only one person I have met has had someone die from homicide, but even in that case, there was a great deal of togetherness, of comfort.

I have not had anyone in my own circle pass on ... perhaps it is for the best ... but I let those others shine as an example to me, and I see dedication and respect, and I know when my time comes, those that know me, will be there for me.

-Mez



Devilslilsister -> RE: What happens to old slaves and Masters? (8/5/2006 8:35:25 AM)

quote:

Question: So - What's your plan, as far as D/s or M/s in your life goes, goes when you really start to age? Gonna have someone there who gives a darn about your welfare, even if you're a wrinkled up thing that can hardly walk anymore, or what? Or not? Gonna toss someone out the door on their butt because they've suddenly become "too old" and-or too much work to care for?


make sure you have a good retirement plan, full of stocks, real estate, 401k and yer own health care.  Never expect anyone to care fer yer old ass.. and make sure you have yer own plan.

Like, um.. a retirement plan. 

D/s BDSM, M/s Gorean yadda yadda yadda it IS yer OWN future, is it not? 

either that or go off and marry the richest man who has all that and more.. make sure he's in his 90's and THEN become a slave. 

You'll be set = )

and i'm out of fookin pepsi!  Actually noooo... i've a 36 case sitting in the car and since i jus woke up not too long ago, i'm too lazy to go get it.  Whose getting it for me?



KnightofMists -> RE: What happens to old slaves and Masters? (8/5/2006 9:55:59 AM)

quote:


Question: If you really cared about your Master (Mistress) or slave or submissive, you would take care of them if they were sick, right?


The simply answer is Yes.  But, it is as much about caring for them as it is caring for myself.  I like who I am in general... actaully I like myself alot.  But, I can't imagine how much I would despise myself if I tossed out one or both of my girls because they got sick for whatever reason.  I have principles and values I live to... I care about that... Alot.

quote:


Question: So - What's your plan, as far as D/s or M/s in your life goes, goes when you really start to age?


I fully expect to grow old with my girls.  The authority structure will not change.... only the demonstrated behaviors of our interactions.  They will some day not beable to kneel or take an intense flogging.... hell... someday in the future I will not beable to lift that flogger and hit with the skill and care that I do now.  So some actions/activities will disappear.  However, as I have said before... the Dominance and submission of a person is intrinsically motivated from within.  The motivation will be there... we will just find different ways to demonstrate it.  Because our focus it internally and not externally... the changes to interactions/behaviors are not a significant issue.  The plan is to develop skills to appreciate change and to adapt to change.



BrutalAntipathy -> RE: What happens to old slaves and Masters? (8/5/2006 9:58:55 AM)

What? Ya'll don't take 'em out into a back pasture and shoot 'em? Even if they break a leg?



KnightofMists -> RE: What happens to old slaves and Masters? (8/5/2006 10:47:33 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: justheather
This is kind of off-topic and, man, I'm going to sound incredibly morbid, but sometimes I think about what it would be like to sit or lay next to my dom while he is dying and kiss his head and face and hold his hand and tell him what a good Daddy he is and how much I love him. I think about doing that with my mother, my father, even my own unmentionable. I think about what that would be like and how very very important it would be for me to be fully present in that moment with that person.

I guess it's because I see people die all the time. Sometimes Im the only one with them. Some die really beautiful deaths surrounded by their loved-ones with music playing and laughter and tears and the room just lit up with love and some die lying alone in a strange bed in a strange room with strangers. I know Im a weirdo, but I dont think Im weird in that a good death is a gift I want for all the people I hold dear.


This really hits home for me. Several years ago... a dear friend's wife past away... it was one of those beautiful deaths that you describe.  The experience was one the most powerful and empowering experiences of my life.  I don't think anyone can appreciate what it is like to be in that kind of sitution unless you have been in it.  The singing... The laughter.. The storytelling... The tears... A death with grace and love.  I hope that I am the last to go of my girls... so that I can celebrate and honor my girls on their last days of life for all they have empowered and enriched my life with.



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