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RE: One-sided Monogamy - 8/8/2006 12:13:17 PM

raiken

Posts: 868
Joined: 10/18/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Vancouver_cinful

littlesarbonn said something I wanted to address in another thread, but I didn't want to hi-jack it so I thought I'd start a new one.

He said:

quote:

I'm kind of strange about the whole monogamy thing. I demand monogamy of myself when I'm involved with a dominant woman, but she can do whatever makes her happy.

Actually, not so strange. My ex had several playmates, and I was encouraged to have the same. Just didn't ever feel inclined or motivated to do so.

I enjoyed seeing how happy the freedom to play with other women made him. I didn't feel the need to do so out of "what is good for the gander is good for the goose". For me, it was just one of the inequalities of our D/s relationship that made sense.

What are other people's take on this idea?

When it all began many moons ago, i just never had a desire to even think to go there. i didn't mind if my ex did, i enjoyed being able to allow him the freedom to feel fulfilled, afterall, ya only live once. i loved him enough and trusted him enough to do that for him. Now, many years later, i enjoy the same, as my desires began to grow up and out, and i believe and understand poly much differently than when i first began. The only thing i would be concerned with in that area is whether the level of trust and committment were solid. Feelings happen, there may be another who falls in love with the partner who is going outside of the relationship, or the partner falls in love. There is always an affect from outside energy coming in. In poly it is very possible to enjoy loving more than one, and it is rewarding to love freely and openly, but it takes the right mix of personalities and energy for a poly family or situation to thrive for the long haul.

(in reply to Vancouver_cinful)

Post #: 21

RE: One-sided Monogamy - 8/8/2006 1:31:38 PM

mp072004

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Absolutely, a person can have only one partner, but that partner may have other partners. I don't see that one-sided monogamy is especially d/s, despite the prevalence of the image of a "harem" or "stable" of slaves who only have sex with their owner. If the dominant partner wants the person who submits to her to take other partners, and the submissive person obeys, then, yes, that's inequal power or d/s because of the instruction and obedience. However, one-sided monogamy itself is just a negotiated arrangement for happiness in a relationship. As noted above, it is an articulation of the need for partners to realize that parity doesn't mean identity.

Monica

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Post #: 22

RE: One-sided Monogamy - 8/8/2006 9:48:18 PM

MzMinx

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their are risks in everything ....and each person has to make their choices as how best to walk the line through them*smiles* ...in my relationship with my Mentor ...(As I have shared in other posts) ... sexual intercourse was not part of it... so although there was some fluid exchange *smiles* as he had complete physical access to me .... the actual risks where relatively low ...

Not all intimate relationships include high risk activities ... especially within the realm of bdsm where relationships come in many varieties and styles.. and intrercourse is not always high on everyones list

I think this very difference in what the relationship was .. what it brought to her husband... which had nothing to do with her very special role within his life... was the original basis for my mentors wife allowing him to seek another ....

She never felt it took anything away from her .. and indeed give her a more fulfilled husband, lover and best friend

*smiles* .... but I dont think any combination of people is perfect for everyone .. all we can do is strive for the closest to perfection for us

(in reply to impishlilhellcat)

Post #: 23

RE: One-sided Monogamy - 8/8/2006 10:29:18 PM

Vancouver_cinful

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quote:

ORIGINAL: impishlilhellcat

He stated that he had needs that needed to be fullfilled because we were long distance and since I couldn't be there for his every need that he would do what he needed to do to be fullfilled.

While I really respect what you say about this not working for everyone, this is actually an example of why it worked for me...

Although we were not long distance, there are things I'm just not into, sexually, that he was. Since it wasn't going to make me happy knowing there were things he was denying himself, I was happier knowing he was getting those things elsewhere.

Of course, it's likely this would work both ways, if there was something he couldn't give me that I couldn't live without.

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quote:

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Post #: 24

RE: One-sided Monogamy - 8/8/2006 10:33:15 PM

Vancouver_cinful

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quote:

ORIGINAL: raiken

Now, many years later, i enjoy the same, as my desires began to grow up and out, and i believe and understand poly much differently than when i first began. The only thing i would be concerned with in that area is whether the level of trust and committment were solid. Feelings happen, there may be another who falls in love with the partner who is going outside of the relationship, or the partner falls in love. There is always an affect from outside energy coming in. In poly it is very possible to enjoy loving more than one, and it is rewarding to love freely and openly, but it takes the right mix of personalities and energy for a poly family or situation to thrive for the long haul.

Very true, Raiken. I think most people have to grow into it over time and trust doesn't happen overnight.

One thing they say in the book The Ethical Slut is you are only restricted in how many people you can love, by the time and energy you have at your disposal. LOL

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Cin

quote:

My Karma Account is huge, but I just can't seem to make a withdrawal!!

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Post #: 25

RE: One-sided Monogamy - 8/8/2006 10:36:26 PM

Vancouver_cinful

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quote:

ORIGINAL: mp072004

However, one-sided monogamy itself is just a negotiated arrangement for happiness in a relationship.

Well said, Monica!!

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quote:

My Karma Account is huge, but I just can't seem to make a withdrawal!!

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Post #: 26

RE: One-sided Monogamy - 8/9/2006 7:18:22 AM

cloudboy

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IMO, unless someone has been monogamous with another for at least ten (10) years, they really have not been monogamous. Waiting / searching for "the one" and going through multiple partners one-at-a-time is not monogamy.

Frankly, a polyamorous person who sticks with a primary partner for ten years is more monogamous (to me) than the serial dater / monogamist.

As for one sided monogamy, I think it sounds noble in theory --- but I'm afraid it would be too imbalanced to survive the long test of time, and I think such a situation might lead to unhealthy imbalances.

To me polyamory is all about freedom, trust, sensible negotiation, and acute sensitivities to the ones you commit to. These tenets would apply to one sided monogamy as well.

(in reply to Vancouver_cinful)

Post #: 27

RE: One-sided Monogamy - 8/9/2006 7:24:59 AM

KnightofMists

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interesting.... I was with alandra for over 12 years before I ventured outside of the the relationship for any intimate reasons. Now... I have had various intimate relatioships of varying significance in the over the past 7 years. mmmmmmmm I guess that makes me a bit of a hybrid.

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Post #: 28

RE: One-sided Monogamy - 8/9/2006 8:07:28 AM

cloudboy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: KnightofMists

interesting.... I was with alandra for over 12 years before I ventured outside of the the relationship for any intimate reasons. Now... I have had various intimate relatioships of varying significance in the over the past 7 years. mmmmmmmm I guess that makes me a bit of a hybrid.

YES, you know both sides of the fence. My point, though, is that many people profess to be monogamous when in reality their life experience is a series of one-on-one relationships, one after-the-other. (serial relationships) These folks are often quite opinionated about monogamy, marriage, and the rest --- when in fact they have not even achieved monogamy in a LTR. (The real test.)

As for you, it is quite an accomplishment to stay with one person for 19 years (assuming my math is correct), and even though you are now "polyamorous," to me you are more monogamous than the serial monogamists (polyamorists in practice but not in theory) who cannot sustain a LTR.

Also, IMO, all / most polyamorists are "hybrids" with their own histories and backgrounds to tell. In my own case, I now find myself giving my wife some pointers, advice, and insights to make her own extra marital relationship work better. Naturally I did not foresee this role when we got married. Her partner refers to their arrangment as OBS, "our bizarre situation," which I think is quite funny.

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Post #: 29

RE: One-sided Monogamy - 8/9/2006 8:21:16 AM

KnightofMists

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nods you math is right. it was 19 years the beginning of last july.

In a sense... I think your right about serial monogamy being similar to poly. Poly is multiple realitionships at the same time. While the serial monogmist is having mulitple relationships one after the other. I am sure the arguement is that the poly individual deals with issues in all the relationships as the same time while the monogmist doesn't. Even thou the monogmist maybe only have one relaitonship at a time... there tends to be baggage that comes from one relationship to the next. In effect, the current relationship is often dealing with issues of past relationships, making if much more difficult to deal with in my opinion.

I also agree that most that enter poly are hybrids of a sort. Thou, i suspect as times evolve this will be less the case. I see a slow trend that people are coming out into this way of life at younger and younger ages. Not just poly... but BDSM as well. So in some regards, some may grow into adulthood and never really know what it is to live a monogmist lifestyle. In some regards, I wonder how my young ones will evolve. Poly is going to be an accept part of their morality. If they choose to live a poly lifestyle they may very likely never appreciate the Monogmist perspective.

Interesting insight... thanks for sharing

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Knight of Mists

An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

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Post #: 30

RE: One-sided Monogamy - 8/9/2006 8:38:00 AM

impishlilhellcat

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Joined: 3/26/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Vancouver_cinful

quote:

ORIGINAL: impishlilhellcat

He stated that he had needs that needed to be fullfilled because we were long distance and since I couldn't be there for his every need that he would do what he needed to do to be fullfilled.

While I really respect what you say about this not working for everyone, this is actually an example of why it worked for me...

Although we were not long distance, there are things I'm just not into, sexually, that he was. Since it wasn't going to make me happy knowing there were things he was denying himself, I was happier knowing he was getting those things elsewhere.

Of course, it's likely this would work both ways, if there was something he couldn't give me that I couldn't live without.

You know I absolutely can see that working for some, but why it didn't work for me was because it was causing this huge insecurity and he didn't bring this to me until we were well over a year into the relationship and it was just hard for me to deal with the fact that he was seeing other women on the side and in my opinion doing it in a sneeky fashion BY not being honest with them about me. I think I had a whole lot of issues with the situation in general that I am really just realizing now that I am away from that. But like I said I can see how that works for others.

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Post #: 31

RE: One-sided Monogamy - 8/9/2006 9:27:39 AM

hizgeorgiapeach

Posts: 1672
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When push comes to shove, my real "issues" with the type of situation mentioned in the OP (one monogamous partner while they are committed to someone who is decidedly poly) is whether it is by their own choice - or because they weren't given a choice. Its not that I object to Poly relationships. I simply object to Double Standards under the Guise of Poly.

If my partner expects to have more than just me in his life, he's got to be willing to be simply one of many in MY life. Because I'm not going to be happy waiting around for him to get to my name on the list, if I am not "allowed" other outlets to fulfill MY needs just like he is expecting. If he gets pissy with me about being with other men, then he needs to expect to be on call to me exclusively, just like I am to him. Because of his demand for me to not play with others, it becomes his responcibility to meet all my needs BEFORE offering any time to another partner. If we're in an open relationship and then *I decide that I don't want someone else, that's my choice in the matter and I'm not being neglected. At that point it becomes MY responcibility not to bitch if he happens to not be available when I want/need something.

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Post #: 32

RE: One-sided Monogamy - 8/9/2006 1:49:25 PM

Vancouver_cinful

Posts: 1911
Joined: 2/3/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

Frankly, a polyamorous person who sticks with a primary partner for ten years is more monogamous (to me) than the serial dater / monogamist.

A very good point, cloudboy.

quote:

As for one sided monogamy, I think it sounds noble in theory --- but I'm afraid it would be too imbalanced to survive the long test of time, and I think such a situation might lead to unhealthy imbalances.

I agree this is very possible. It would have to depend on whether the monogamous partner was feeling completely fulfilled by the relationship. It's possible that D/s dynamics would play a strong role in this. Doms and subs have different needs, after all.

A non-bottoming dom/top could probably happily live forever without feeling a flogger across his back, whereas a sub/masochist may find themselves frustrated, emotionally and physically, if it doesn't happen for a few months...Isn't this a similar situation?

_____________________________

Cin

quote:

My Karma Account is huge, but I just can't seem to make a withdrawal!!

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Post #: 33

RE: One-sided Monogamy - 8/9/2006 1:59:07 PM

Vancouver_cinful

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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

even though you are now "polyamorous," to me you are more monogamous than the serial monogamists (polyamorists in practice but not in theory) who cannot sustain a LTR.

This is where society confuses monogamy with fidelity.

When a couple agrees to certian activities that involve other partners they aren't being unfaithful to their vows, or their relationship, even if those activities involve sex.

You can be having sex with multiple partners and still be faithful to your spouse.

That's why there's no single answer to such questions as: Is cybersex cheating? That's why you can be unfaithful if you are lying to your spouse in order to go grab a beer with friends you promised not to see anymore.

It's all in the negotiations, and in honouring your partner's trust.

_____________________________

Cin

quote:

My Karma Account is huge, but I just can't seem to make a withdrawal!!

http://cinful.wordpress.com

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Post #: 34

RE: One-sided Monogamy - 8/9/2006 2:01:54 PM

Vancouver_cinful

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Joined: 2/3/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

In my own case, I now find myself giving my wife some pointers, advice, and insights to make her own extra marital relationship work better. Naturally I did not foresee this role when we got married. Her partner refers to their arrangment as OBS, "our bizarre situation," which I think is quite funny.

I think this becomes inevitable in almost all open relationships. In a way it's a sign of love and trust, and it truly can seal the bond so much tighter. I've found that in every open relationship I've had, I've done the same.

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Cin

quote:

My Karma Account is huge, but I just can't seem to make a withdrawal!!

http://cinful.wordpress.com

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Post #: 35

RE: One-sided Monogamy - 8/9/2006 2:04:13 PM

missturbation

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As long as my Sir was honest he was playing with others i would accept it. I would not like it and know i would have difficulty handling the situation but due to my wanting Him to be happy and the distance between us at present i would try my best.

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Post #: 36

RE: One-sided Monogamy - 8/9/2006 2:04:14 PM

raiken

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Joined: 10/18/2005
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[quote]ORIGINAL: KnightofMists

nods you math is right. it was 19 years the beginning of last july.

In a sense... I think your right about serial monogamy being similar to poly. Poly is multiple realitionships at the same time. While the serial monogmist is having mulitple relationships one after the other. I am sure the arguement is that the poly individual deals with issues in all the relationships as the same time while the monogmist doesn't. Even thou the monogmist maybe only have one relaitonship at a time... there tends to be baggage that comes from one relationship to the next. In effect, the current relationship is often dealing with issues of past relationships, making if much more difficult to deal with in my opinion.

I also agree that most that enter poly are hybrids of a sort. Thou, i suspect as times evolve this will be less the case. I see a slow trend that people are coming out into this way of life at younger and younger ages. Not just poly... but BDSM as well. So in some regards, some may grow into adulthood and never really know what it is to live a monogmist lifestyle. In some regards, I wonder how my young ones will evolve. Poly is going to be an accept part of their morality. If they choose to live a poly lifestyle they may very likely never appreciate the Monogmist perspective.

Interesting insight... thanks for sharing
[/quote]

Both cloudboy and KnightofMists echo my thoughts. i know i am a hybrid, lol! As my babes grow they too have already been introduced to both lifestyles mentioned. i have spent many hours in ponderance over these new waves rolling in upon the younger gen and the world that awaits my young ones.

Good thoughts from both of you.

~raiken

(in reply to KnightofMists)

Post #: 37

RE: One-sided Monogamy - 8/9/2006 2:07:24 PM

raiken

Posts: 868
Joined: 10/18/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Vancouver_cinful

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

even though you are now "polyamorous," to me you are more monogamous than the serial monogamists (polyamorists in practice but not in theory) who cannot sustain a LTR.

This is where society confuses monogamy with fidelity.

When a couple agrees to certian activities that involve other partners they aren't being unfaithful to their vows, or their relationship, even if those activities involve sex.

You can be having sex with multiple partners and still be faithful to your spouse.

That's why there's no single answer to such questions as: Is cybersex cheating? That's why you can be unfaithful if you are lying to your spouse in order to go grab a beer with friends you promised not to see anymore.

It's all in the negotiations, and in honouring your partner's trust.

Yes, and there is also poly-fidelity and that trust may be even more fragile since there are more involved that would be affected by a breach in that trust. Good thought Cin.

~raiken

(in reply to Vancouver_cinful)

Post #: 38

RE: One-sided Monogamy - 8/9/2006 2:08:53 PM

Vancouver_cinful

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Joined: 2/3/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: impishlilhellcat

You know I absolutely can see that working for some, but why it didn't work for me was because it was causing this huge insecurity and he didn't bring this to me until we were well over a year into the relationship and it was just hard for me to deal with the fact that he was seeing other women on the side and in my opinion doing it in a sneeky fashion BY not being honest with them about me. I think I had a whole lot of issues with the situation in general that I am really just realizing now that I am away from that. But like I said I can see how that works for others.

Insecurity comes from mistrust, and in this case your mistrust was not unfounded if he was indeed being sneaky about it. Mistrust is not always bred of low-self-esteem or past issues. Sometimes it's a healthy intuition that something is not quite right.

That's why it's a question of fidelity. He was unfaithful to you, and that never works in a relationship.

In the end we simply need to determine what works for us, and hold out for that. And that's what I see all my past relationships as, a way of working out what I truly want and need.

(Practice makes perfect!)

_____________________________

Cin

quote:

My Karma Account is huge, but I just can't seem to make a withdrawal!!

http://cinful.wordpress.com

(in reply to impishlilhellcat)

Post #: 39

RE: One-sided Monogamy - 8/9/2006 2:20:13 PM

Vancouver_cinful

Posts: 1911
Joined: 2/3/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: hizgeorgiapeach

Because of his demand for me to not play with others, it becomes his responcibility to meet all my needs BEFORE offering any time to another partner. If we're in an open relationship and then *I decide that I don't want someone else, that's my choice in the matter and I'm not being neglected. At that point it becomes MY responcibility not to bitch if he happens to not be available when I want/need something.

Absolutely. One must know how to communicate their needs, and take responsibility of getting those needs met. We aren't helpless children; we know how to ask for what we want and need.

It's crucial in an open relationship that these things are communicated about and negotiated. The scenario you mention is a big determinant on whether an open relationship succeeds, or fails. Resentments and neglect can not be allowed to pile up and build. Small things grow and fester if not dealt with.

One of the major rules in all my relationships (professional, friendships, etc) is the No Hoarding rule. You don't get to hoard the little resentments, hurts, uncertianties...you are responsible to bringing them to the light of day where they can be treated, before the time comes that only an amputation will save the patient.

_____________________________

Cin

quote:

My Karma Account is huge, but I just can't seem to make a withdrawal!!

http://cinful.wordpress.com

(in reply to hizgeorgiapeach)

Post #: 40

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