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utterlybutterfli -> I'm sure you've heard this one before... (8/15/2006 7:36:12 PM)

Hi. I'm hoping for a bit of advice really, or maybe a few different perspectives on a problem I have. Its not a problem that is specific to BDSM, but really, I have noone that I can talk to about this and I guess.. I just need an ear.

I met a Dom, on this site, who I really like. We have a real time D/s thing. I hesitate to call it a relationship - but I suppose thats what it is. To put in in context, We've had a few dates,  and we've spent the night together once. This has played out over maybe 4 or 5 weeks. He's quite a busy man and we live about 200 miles apart - so I guess I knew I wasn't going to see him that often. We also both live with people, which makes it even harder - I live with the father of my son - but not in a romantic relationship of any kind, just parenting together until we can afford to live apart and he - well he lives with his ex girlfriend and sub apparently, same reasons - financial. According to him - shes aware that he's seeking, and she's looking to meet someone else also.When we talk and we're together, he treats me very respectfully and makes me feel special. We click very well physically.

My problem...Is that its still early days for us - but I have a nasty feeling that hes pursuing ontact with other subs. We've never discussed exclusivity (is that a word? - its 3,30 am here) but - hes mentioned his displeasure that my profile was still up as seeking (its down now) but his remains up. I can see he's on collarme quite regularly. I also have had a couple of other 'red flags' that have happened - the first time we played he just stopped contact for a good 3-4 days , which I found a bit difficult to take - having spoken to him about this , he says he couldn;'t talk to me because his dad took ill that weekend, but he did use collarme that weekend, and I don't know if him texting me to say hello would have hurt. 
I know that I have to ask him whats going on. I'll do that in the next couple of days but I guess what I'm trying to get my head around is..
Is it a sin of omission not to mention that you maybe pursuing contact with other partners.
Is it realistic to seek exclusivity after  such a short time?
Given that I'm probably looking for someone who only wants to be with me, should I carry on looking

Feel free to be (brutally [;)]) honest with me on this... I know that I can't know anything until I've spoken to him, but would like other's thoughts on this before I do so

Thanks all very much

And I'm sorry if this has been a little long winded - I just wanted to mak sure I had made the situation clear !








SusanofO -> RE: I'm sure you've heard this one before... (8/15/2006 7:43:45 PM)

I think maybe just come out and say, in as nice a way as you can muster (and, btw, I'd say it with some sense of "finality" as well):

"I really am looking for a relationship that is exclusive - meaning, I am seeking someone who will be committed to only me, and I to them. I can see this isn't what you are seeking. Please don't feel you need to explain your actions to me, that isn't what I am needing here. I do need someone who wants to be with one person. It's been fun,  but I think you definitely need something else, and I don't think because of that, we are probably a great fit. That doesn't mean we can't be friends, though". 

Do consider that thinking about being exclusive with you after a short time might not have even crossed his mind. **Especially considering you are both currently living with other people (Hello!)
 
However, evenso - if that is one of the things you seek in a relationship, I think he needs to know that. So, I'd say all of the above anyway. If he wants to become exclusive, he will let you know that is a distinct possibility somewhere down the road. If he mentions that it is, I'd try to make sure he means it (if that is even possible). 

But - before you say anything at all to him,  this might sound cynical of me, but - I'd make sure you know that:

1) He is unlikely to change, simply because you want an exclusive relationship. Yeah, I've seen this happen, but most of the time I've been an observer of these kinds of "promises", if one person just doesn't want to be exclusive, it doesn't. He might say it will, but it probably won't.  Your other option is to be "checking up on him" (sounds like a drag).That doesn't make him a rat ass bastard, it just means you want different things.

2) Make sure before you "confront" him (or talk about it) you are prepared for any outcome - including not seeing him anymore. Because if he doesn't care about exclusivity, and you do - that's what is sometimes known as a "deal-breaker". You've made it clear it is one for you. If it's not for him - then it looks like "things" are at an end - unless you just want to be "friends with benefits" or something.

Also, there really isn't much need for him to "explain things". If he cared a lot, and was interested in seeing just you, he'd be more attentive and exclusive, unless he is a comitted Polyamorist. If you don't know if he is or not - find out. And decide if you can deal. Otherwise, I think unless he's got some really plausible-sounding explanation, "talking about it" is just an exercise in futility (in my estimation anyway). But, he might think doing this will "clear things up."

But - I think, it probably won't.
Like I said, that doesn't make him a meanie. I know some great Poly people. That's just not what you seem to want. 
I know this can hurt (been there), but - believe me, getting this kind of thing out in the open now is probably the best favor you can do for yourself. Good luck.

- Susan     



Lashra -> RE: I'm sure you've heard this one before... (8/15/2006 7:47:56 PM)

I would say spend more time getting to know each other. It sounds as if trust hasn't been built up and you are quite right to keep your eyes open to any red flags. I think time will tell if this Dom is a keeper or not. I think its rather odd he wanted you to change your profile and yet he hasn't changed his, I think you may want to call him on that one and see what the deal is.

Don't be afraid to question, I know a few on here will say a sub shouldn't question a Dom, I don't agree with that at all. Your human and you want to form a relationship you have a right to be informed.

I wish you the best,

~Lashra



LotusSong -> RE: I'm sure you've heard this one before... (8/15/2006 7:55:36 PM)

First.. he's a Dom and can do as he wishes.  If you didn't have a conversation in the introduction phase of your  meeting where you  could tell him you are looking for exclusivity.. then.. you missed your chance.  You neglected that little detail of your negotiations.

I'd just go about my business until he contacts you again. Then I'd "be busy" for a bit. Don't act despirate!  If he wants to contact you, he will. I'd put my profile back up until he wakes up. If he wants you - he'll let you know.  If you find another in the interim..you can let HIM know!

Oh.. and if he's given you "orders" to take it down .. friggy diggy.  Did he put a collar around your neck?  You are treated only with the value that you put on yourself.



SirDarkside357 -> RE: I'm sure you've heard this one before... (8/15/2006 8:06:23 PM)

It's never too late to state your wants and needs, until the collar snaps. If you are looking for  one thing tell him, if he is too, then great....if not, save both of you some waisted time.

Be Well,
Darkside



LuckyAlbatross -> RE: I'm sure you've heard this one before... (8/15/2006 8:17:30 PM)

I think it's just time to bring up the talk.  Next time you're together, just ask "So do you think we should become exclusive?"

Frankly the fact that he got miffed at your profile when no agreement had been discussed prior and as he had given no sign of becoming exclusive to you is a negative sign- it means he can't just bring up an issue maturely.

But it's not an end of the world sign and it seems as if the time is ripe to talk abuot "the next step."



HarryVanWinkle -> RE: I'm sure you've heard this one before... (8/15/2006 8:20:43 PM)

I agree with Lashra.  While I usually agree with Susan's posts, I think it's a little soon to take such drastic action yet.

I have a few questions.  Have you met/ talked with his "ex-sub, roommate" and confirmed that she is, in fact, an ex, and what she thinks of him?  If not, you should do so.  And if he objects, then take Susan's advice.  Do not, however, put TOO much weight into her opinion of him, especially if it's negative, as she may have an axe to grind.

Have you asked him about the "red flags?"  All of them, and anymore that might pop up in the future.  Again, if he refuses to answer, or takes offence at the questions, take Susan's advice.

I don't think it's a sin of omission not to mention that he may be still searching for partners yet, but only because you haven't asked him.  I do think it's unrealistic to SEEK exclusivity at this point, but not to DISCUSS it.

Any and ALL questions you have about him, or your potential relationship with him, you should ask him.  If he won't answer, forthrightly, again take Susan's advice.

quote:


Don't be afraid to question, I know a few on here will say a sub shouldn't question a Dom, I don't agree with that at all. You're human and you want to form a relationship you have a right to be informed.


I couldn't agree more strongly with Lashra's last paragraph.  I would emphasize that not only SHOULD a sub question a Dom, but also that if the Dom takes offence to such questioning, the sub should run for the hills.



juliaoceania -> RE: I'm sure you've heard this one before... (8/15/2006 8:25:06 PM)

This is why I set terms to what I am looking for and expecting before I enter into any sort of "thing" with anyone, I would want us both on the same page. I consider any sort of Ds ongoing "thing" to be a dynamic, it may be a new one, but it is still one. As subs we set ourselves up in a bad position (I know this from experience) when we do not define our wants and needs before we scene with someone. He does not like your profile remaining open to other doms, and yet does not tell you what you can expect from him.

I know some will think I am wrong about this, but I am going to be blunt, in the beginning before we completely submit we have all the power. We exchange some of it as we go along before the collar comes or exclusivity comes, but we retain our power. If we haven't agreed to exchange something then we have to decide if we are going to.

I would put my profile back online and I would email him or call him and explain why I am doing so. It doesn't mean that you cannot be friends with this person, or you have to quit seeing him, but if you are giving more than you are comfortable with there is a big problem. It is an uneasy feeling to be in this situation, and it keeps you off balance, the best policy is to be upfront and honest about where you are and where you want to go. Defining where you want to be isn't being unsubmissive or demanding or giving ultimatums.. it is just stating where you want to be and making your boundaries strong. Strong boundaries protect us, and if he hasn't known you long enough to know if he wants just you, then he doesn't know you well enough to demand that you lower your boundaries for him.

We teach people how to treat us....



SusanofO -> RE: I'm sure you've heard this one before... (8/15/2006 8:25:58 PM)

I think LA and Harry are right, on second thought.

If this is a new relationship, this is maybe just something that hasn't been brought up yet because it's a new relationship.

I think my response was just how I'd react if someone expected me to do things like take down a profile when they had given me no indication they had any intention of forming anything more long-term with me at all. I'd just mostly I guess, consider it time for me to "move on".

I've always had a hard time dealing w/types who can't see the ridiculousness of requesting behavior from others they rarely engage in themselves. To me, an approach like that really lacks finesse, and (yes), maturity. Sorry to sound perhaps judgmental (which I truly rarely am) but - I seem to see this kind of thing a lot on the CM boards (ah well, that's life, and it's a big world out there, w/lots of types of people in it I guess).

Not that this request of his to the OP is inherently "wrong". In a D/s relationship, I might well consent to living with an arrangement like the one the OP is dealing with, But - it would indeed be something that would be negotiated, not just assumed. 


Dismissing this guy out of hand is not necessarily a good idea, though - because there really seem to be (sad as it is) plenty of folks out there who are:

1) Not great (or even mediocre) communicators, and who also -

2) Rarely seem to consider that what they expect of other folks is somehow something they should also perhaps apply to their own behavior.

They either seem to either not think about this at all, or seem to think that believing or acting this way is perfectly "fair".

Granted - what is "fair" in terms of a D/s relationship may not be much of an issue at all - but that is (I think) when two people have already somewhat established there is indeed a D/s relationship between them in existence. If you two haven't done this, then I agree - it may well be time for a "talk" about all of that kind of thing.

- Susan



DelRey -> RE: I'm sure you've heard this one before... (8/15/2006 8:29:55 PM)

quote:


is it a sin of omission not to mention that you maybe pursuing contact with other partners.

Naaaaa men do it all the time

quote:


Is it realistic to seek exclusivity after  such a short time?

Naaaaa women do it all the time

quote:


Given that I'm probably looking for someone who only wants to be with me, should I carry on looking

Feel free to be (brutally ) honest with me on this... I know that I can't know anything until I've spoken to him, but would like other's thoughts on this before I do so


You already know the answer to this....
or
invest, invest and invest some more without the commitment, have it blow up on you, get bitter for wasting the time, then come on back, write a post about what you did, tell us to let  you have it........... and we will !

comon baby, how old are you? you ain't in high school any more.....



crouchingtigress -> RE: I'm sure you've heard this one before... (8/15/2006 11:19:37 PM)

i would not read very much into being on CM and not connecting to you in a time of stress. i cant tell you how many times i have done just that. my submissives take WORK the energy is 100 percent. My mind my heart my emotions all have to be engaged, and sometimes esp in times of stress i dont have the energy for that.
 
but i do have the energy to idly chitter chatter, to pontificate profusely on a random post and to surf the naked flesh....
 
in fact i make it a point not to engage with my submissives when i am stressed or tired or not up to par which, as is has with you, has caused bruised feelings and jumped to conclusions...
 
and many many times i am seemingly here for days because i leave my computer on.[;)]
 
just something to consider.
 

 
 



porcelaine -> RE: I'm sure you've heard this one before... (8/16/2006 12:03:47 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: utterlybutterfli

My problem...Is that its still early days for us - but I have a nasty feeling that hes pursuing ontact with other subs. We've never discussed exclusivity (is that a word? - its 3,30 am here) but - hes mentioned his displeasure that my profile was still up as seeking (its down now) but his remains up. I can see he's on collarme quite regularly. I also have had a couple of other 'red flags' that have happened - the first time we played he just stopped contact for a good 3-4 days , which I found a bit difficult to take - having spoken to him about this , he says he couldn;'t talk to me because his dad took ill that weekend, but he did use collarme that weekend, and I don't know if him texting me to say hello would have hurt. 

I know that I have to ask him whats going on. I'll do that in the next couple of days but I guess what I'm trying to get my head around is..
Is it a sin of omission not to mention that you maybe pursuing contact with other partners.
Is it realistic to seek exclusivity after  such a short time?
Given that I'm probably looking for someone who only wants to be with me, should I carry on looking



I'm a stickler for laying my cards on the table. It eliminates situations like the above and prevents me from investing time with someone that isn't seeking the same. From what you've stated it appears you've come to this conclusion based on several factors. When suspicion sets in it can be difficult to get rid of especially if the peculiar behavior continues.

Is it possible that he's seeking or speaking to other women? Yes
Will you be able to find out? Probably not unless they tell you.
Can speaking to his submissive hurt? I don't honestly feel you'll get the complete picture. They live together after all.

What can you do?

Stop fretting and allowing the doubt to gnaw away at you. You are facing a situation that you can resolve easily by simply expressing yourself. I don't think it is too soon to ask if he wants something casual or more exclusive. It allows you to discover if you are on the same page and pursuing similar ideals. I wouldn't remove your profile until you felt comfortable doing so and had solidified the direction of your relationship.

One last thing, I'm going to take an opposite stance on the lack of contact. While real life emergencies do happen from time to time, he was perfectly capable of making a quick call, sending an email, or text message to alert you about what had occurred. It is called common courtesy. I'm willing to bet if you posed this question to dominants most would concur that if the submissive had time to be online they had time to get in touch. Double standards are nifty aren't they?

Remember submission is a beautiful thing. But it doesn't imply that our voices are silenced, spines withered, or individual wants and desires go drifting out to sea when we settle at someone's feet. You'll respect yourself far more once you've spoken to him and will probably have less to worry about as well. Best of luck.

porcelaine



Wolfie648 -> RE: I'm sure you've heard this one before... (8/16/2006 12:09:44 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: utterlybutterfli

Hi. I'm hoping for a bit of advice really, or maybe a few different perspectives on a problem I have. Its not a problem that is specific to BDSM, but really, I have noone that I can talk to about this and I guess.. I just need an ear.

I met a Dom, on this site, who I really like. We have a real time D/s thing. I hesitate to call it a relationship - but I suppose thats what it is. To put in in context, We've had a few dates,  and we've spent the night together once. This has played out over maybe 4 or 5 weeks. He's quite a busy man and we live about 200 miles apart - so I guess I knew I wasn't going to see him that often. We also both live with people, which makes it even harder - I live with the father of my son - but not in a romantic relationship of any kind, just parenting together until we can afford to live apart and he - well he lives with his ex girlfriend and sub apparently, same reasons - financial. According to him - shes aware that he's seeking, and she's looking to meet someone else also.When we talk and we're together, he treats me very respectfully and makes me feel special. We click very well physically.

My problem...Is that its still early days for us - but I have a nasty feeling that hes pursuing ontact with other subs. We've never discussed exclusivity (is that a word? - its 3,30 am here) but - hes mentioned his displeasure that my profile was still up as seeking (its down now) but his remains up. I can see he's on collarme quite regularly. I also have had a couple of other 'red flags' that have happened - the first time we played he just stopped contact for a good 3-4 days , which I found a bit difficult to take - having spoken to him about this , he says he couldn;'t talk to me because his dad took ill that weekend, but he did use collarme that weekend, and I don't know if him texting me to say hello would have hurt. 
I know that I have to ask him whats going on. I'll do that in the next couple of days but I guess what I'm trying to get my head around is..
Is it a sin of omission not to mention that you maybe pursuing contact with other partners.
Is it realistic to seek exclusivity after  such a short time?
Given that I'm probably looking for someone who only wants to be with me, should I carry on looking

Feel free to be (brutally [;)]) honest with me on this... I know that I can't know anything until I've spoken to him, but would like other's thoughts on this before I do so

Thanks all very much

And I'm sorry if this has been a little long winded - I just wanted to mak sure I had made the situation clear !



Trust your heart.

At the same time look at his/her perspective. Until you have proven yourself, why commit? Committment is a 2 way street. I'm not saying you haven't, I'm saying look at 2 sides.

D (owner of j)



Pimpernell -> RE: I'm sure you've heard this one before... (8/16/2006 2:50:04 AM)

4 to 5 weeks with only a few meetings is not enough to constitute an exclusive relationship.  Sorry.  Unless you have said you want exclusivity and he has put that in his profile as well, it is not implicit.  Even then, it would be unfair for him to not talk at all to other subs.  I know if I found someone I would still keep in contact with my sub friends.  As to visiting this site...  Other people have said it has listed them as being on when they weren't.  I also have clicked on the wrong bookmark and came here accidently.  Also I have checked in quickly to see what someone wrote me before I left for work and not responded until I got home or until the next day.

Him not contacting you for 3 or 4 days, hm, could be a bad sign.  I would have dropped you a line at least.  But let's say my dad took seriously ill and I found out at work.  I would have to take a plane to see him.  I wouldn't be using my work computer to visit collarme and I wouldn't be using his computer when I got there, so unless I had a phone number I would be in the same situation.  This is only a problem if it happens a few times.  Actually, even if I did have a phone number I might not want to worry you if I knew you tended to get upset, or I might need to deal with the situation in my own way and there is no way I would be stepping away from someone's hospital bed just to say hello to someone.  There are a million reasons.  3 to 4 days seems like a long time, but in those situations you are focusing on who needs you most.

But going back, the main point is if you want exclusivity you need to say so.



bandit25 -> RE: I'm sure you've heard this one before... (8/16/2006 3:17:48 AM)

Well, even in times of stress, he could say just that...that it's a stressful time and he can't deal with a sub right now.  I agree with julia (no surprise there).  If you don't state what you are looking for, you put yourself in a bad position.  How does he know unless you tell him? 



MsSonnetMarwood -> RE: I'm sure you've heard this one before... (8/16/2006 4:42:33 AM)

If a sub approached me about potentially serving but was still living with an ex for whatever reason, I'd tell him to go straighten his living situation out before approaching me again - he may swear up and down it's only platonic, but frankly, I'd be very hard pressed to take him at his word.

Given that you are both in living situations with exes, I would say that neither one of you is in a position to request exclusivity, not until you are living independently from them.   The Today show quoted the other day that about 60% of folks do "sex with the ex" even when the relationship has downgraded into friendship (and mentioned that a big chunk of the 40% who said no way were lying) - perhaps not the most scientific source of information, but probably not far off.

Yes, I would definately discuss with him his expectations on exclusivity, and think very hard what you want - and can offer - for yourself.  Sometimes you need to get past relationships sorted out before you can take that step with someone else.




RavenMuse -> RE: I'm sure you've heard this one before... (8/16/2006 4:48:12 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: SirDarkside357
It's never too late to state your wants and needs, until the collar snaps. If you are looking for  one thing tell him, if he is too, then great....if not, save both of you some waisted time.


Short, sweet and right on the button.
Communicate, clearly, honestly and openly. Find out where you stand then make any further decision from there.



LotusSong -> RE: I'm sure you've heard this one before... (8/16/2006 5:13:34 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong

First.. he's a Dom and can do as he wishes.  If you didn't have a conversation in the introduction phase of your  meeting where you  could tell him you are looking for exclusivity.. then.. you missed your chance.  You neglected that little detail of your negotiations.



I've been questioned in my email about my comment here and I feel I should clarify my stand on it.

Yes, you can ALWAYS negotiate.  In this case, I felt she ASSUMED  the relationship was going to be exclusive and come across to me that she is shocked that he has distanced himself.  All I'm saying is that - SAY what you EXPECT up front and that way you won't waste your time.. 



TNstepsout -> RE: I'm sure you've heard this one before... (8/16/2006 5:32:41 AM)

Yes, I recently had a situation very much like this. It was too new to even start talking about exclusivity (and I didn't want that anyway) but what I did want was some kind of discussion of exactly what we did have so we'd be on the same page. I didn't want to seem pushy, since we'd really just met, but I was getting mixed signals and wanted to know. So I finally called to make time to discuss it, but apparently he'd already moved on. He said he'd call later that night to get together for the weekend and never called back, and then showed up the next night at a munch with another woman.

Sooooo I guess the moral of the story is to go ahead and talk about these things as soon as you start having confusing signals. On the one hand he's not calling or contacting you very often, he appears to be seeking others, yet he is laying claim to you by asking you to take down your profile. Definately mixed messages. It won't seem desparate or clingy (something I also worried about) to just call and say you need to talk because you are confused and need some clarification.

One way or another you will get an answer out of him. You may not like what you get. But at least you will know and you can make a decision to move on sooner rather than later and feel like you had some control in the decision.

TN



eroticangel -> RE: I'm sure you've heard this one before... (8/16/2006 5:40:26 AM)

i think that no matter what happens in life, there is always a minute to let someone know. i see it as only right. Also, if you do have the talk, be sure not to "tell" him what he wants...not to assume you know, nit to put words in his mouth. Let him explain and talk ....i hope this makes sense to you and i wish you the best.



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