The difference

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vessel111 -> The difference (8/21/2006 7:56:30 PM)
I was having a discuss with someone about can a Master have a sub. Thier thinking was slaves are Masters and subs are for Dominants. The reason behind their answer(opinion) was the level of submission that a slave show. They tend think that slaves tend submit deeper than a sub therefore they should only submit to Masters (yeah right). Me I beg to differ. In my opinion a sub can submit just a deep if not deeper as slave.

justheather -> RE: The difference (8/21/2006 8:02:50 PM)
It is impossible to determine what a person's "level of submission" is based on whether they accept the label "slave" vs "submissive". I know "slaves" who covertly negotiate every last frickin detail of their dynamic and subs with virtually no limits. In the hands of the wrong dominant, a slave could find herself resenting his authority and rebelling. In the hands of the right dom, a submissive could find herself out-submitting anything anybody ever did on the planet Gor. People are going to love whomever they choose to love, regardless of what the heading on their collarme profile says.

mstrjx -> RE: The difference (8/21/2006 8:11:05 PM)
Well, I'll wade into this, and possibly get bashed behind me. Let's have fun! IMHO, a dom and a Master is really the same thing. One is more a title than another. Now, where it gets trickier, I do see a difference between a sub and a slave. In a single word, the difference is surrender. The slave determines that their trust level is so deep such that they allow all choices and direction to come from the dominant. If you feel that a sub can exist on this level, then again the terms are more of what make that particular couple comfortable. In the typical lexicon, yes, doms are associated with subs, while masters are associated with slaves (D/s, M/s). If what I said before (that a dom and a Master are the same thing), another word that crops up that might be more typified of a slave is owner. Doms, Masters, owners all have to take responsibility for the sub/slave 'at least' during a scene but again, in my opinion, really need to do so nearly all the time (definitely all the time in a 24/7 situation). But it makes sense that an 'owner' would be aware that that responsibility never ends. In my way of thinking, doms and subs tend to relieve themselves of their persona (perhaps a bad phrase) at some points in time, i.e. they take breaks for some semblance of normalcy (definitely a bad word - I'm typing on the fly). Slaves and owners (Masters, if you will) never step out of their character (I can feel the flames any time now). That's not to say they can't seem ordinary (to the casual observer), but within themselves their power exchange is constant. (And yes, I'm well aware of the debate about the phrase 'power exchange'.) So, as you can see, it's all clear (as mud) in my mind. Where you will find the greatest debate, I feel, is in terminology. Pardon me while I go duck now. Jeff

justheather -> RE: The difference (8/21/2006 8:14:13 PM)
I think my relationship's power exchange dynamic uses the typical lexicon to hold open that first story bedroom window where the sash is not functioning properly.

Slipstreme -> RE: The difference (8/21/2006 8:17:46 PM)
Depends on your preference for labels. I personally do go by the, if I own someone, I'm a Master, she is my slave label. If they submit to me, I am their Dominant and they are my submissive. If they are an occassional scene partner, they are my Top/bottom. My label preference. However, a friend of mine who would hardly fit the bill of a slave, calls himself a slave. He is unowned and mostly submits when it is convienient to him to do so and he has no loyalty. But slave is the label he chooses. I do rag on him about it though in jest. The only problem I have with him is that he does try to compare himself to slaves like the ones on this board. I have seen several people call themselves Masters, although they have no slaves or pets. Many times though it seems such Dominants, if they prove to be the arrogant insistent that everyone bows down to them type, tend to get laughed off the board, or out of the lifestyle group.

gooddogbenji -> RE: The difference (8/21/2006 8:25:21 PM)
Giant fucking flame!!!!! Glad I got that out. Now, OP dude, didja have to open this can o' worms? I thought so. Fair enough. You will now hear about 50 people screaming their own opinions over one another, telling each other they are wrong, and generally making asses of themselves. One person will post all the other threads on this topic (Not all, I hope. CM has limited space) and by reading those you can predict, word for word, what will happen on this thread. In short, we are fucked. Yours, benji PS: No offense intended, LA. But this time the list will really be too long.

justheather -> RE: The difference (8/21/2006 8:26:53 PM)
Hey, man, I tried to kill it early. Next time I will bring more morphine and a bigger syringe.

mnottertail -> RE: The difference (8/21/2006 8:37:53 PM)
I remember one time, I had this girl gobbling my cock like a christmas turkey......as I was ready to come I asked her; do you identify as a submissive or a slave?......a very interesting philosophical discussion ensued.....I found myself rather taken aback by her retort....... Ron

gooddogbenji -> RE: The difference (8/21/2006 8:56:04 PM)
By the looks of it, the lurkers are leaving. I may have been wrong. Thank God! Yours, benji

marieToo -> RE: The difference (8/21/2006 9:09:54 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: gooddogbenji By the looks of it, the lurkers are leaving. I may have been wrong. Thank God! Yours, benji Actually I see alot of people 'lurking'. I think its gonna get full-blown. NO!! Not THAT kind of blown!

gooddogbenji -> RE: The difference (8/21/2006 9:11:54 PM)
Only Jeff and violetraven at this point.... and me.. LOL Yours, benji

DiurnalVampire -> RE: The difference (8/21/2006 9:23:15 PM)
I should just come and hang out to lurk and annoy you Benji... :P

gooddogbenji -> RE: The difference (8/21/2006 9:28:04 PM)
But then you gotta stay. You're not lurking now.... Yours, benji

DiurnalVampire -> RE: The difference (8/21/2006 9:36:02 PM)
lurk lurk lurk just for you benji

gooddogbenji -> RE: The difference (8/21/2006 9:41:36 PM)
No, post post post, but no lurk lurk lurk. Yours, benji

LuckyAlbatross -> RE: The difference (8/21/2006 9:50:23 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: vessel111 I was having a discuss with someone about can a Master have a sub. If they want to and are happy with it. quote: Thier thinking was slaves are Masters and subs are for Dominants. Generally that is how people are paired up, but hey, any combo you can think of exists out there. YOu got switches and slaves, subs and subs, doms and doms, masters and switches, bottoms and masters....it's out there, just not as common. quote: The reason behind their answer(opinion) was the level of submission that a slave show. They tend think that slaves tend submit deeper than a sub therefore they should only submit to Masters (yeah right). Me I beg to differ. In my opinion a sub can submit just a deep if not deeper as slave. Depth of submission is basically like saying "He loves me more/deeper/better because he does X." It's a completely useless statement that serves no purpose but to make some people feel better and put others down. Be who you are and be with someone who fulfills you.

NastyDaddy -> RE: The difference (8/21/2006 9:57:54 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: vessel111 ...They tend think that slaves tend submit deeper than a sub therefore they should only submit to Masters (yeah right). Me I beg to differ. In my opinion a sub can submit just a deep if not deeper as slave. Are you sure they didn't tend to think "longer"as opposed to "deeper"? Deeper sounds awfully cock length'ish, and I was always told that was bragging. With regard to "longer", there are many who will argue to cut through the chase and place the difference on two criterion; 1) submissives are regarded as part-time 2) slaves are regarded as full-time. Let's examine that closer.... oh, good idea, let's do... Do submissives get overtime?

amayos -> RE: The difference (8/21/2006 10:49:15 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: vessel111 Me I beg to differ. You can beg all you want, dear.

juliaoceania -> RE: The difference (8/21/2006 10:49:52 PM)
This is one of those things that is very hard for an outsider to judge. We can not gauge someone's heart condition to determine if they are more submissive than someone else. Someone that has a lot of power, self discipline, and control - and is accustomed to using it is giving up a lot more than someone who doesn't have oodles of personal power, self discipline, and control. The one that easily surrenders what little personal power she has to anyone that wants it may appear to be "more submissive", but the one that puts aside a powerful persona to serve is, in my opinion, more submissive. To the outsider this may not be apparent, but to the dom receiving the power it is. Many doms I have read on this board (and both I have been involved with) wanted a submissive with a lot of personal power and self discipline. (whether they find that in me is not for me to judge..smiles) My point is not that someone that is a "slave " or a "sub" is better, or that anyone is more submissive than another... just wanted to point that the above is saying that we cannot tell from an outsider view. (did I escape the flame?)

juliaoceania -> RE: The difference (8/21/2006 11:21:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NastyDaddy Do submissives get overtime? Yes, but there is no rule stating we have to be rewarded for it, that is up to the generous mood of the master/dom. I looked it up in the the manual published by the US government that regulates submissive breaks, sick time, vacation time, and maternity leave,.... it turns out we do not get those either unless our dom says we do... Im hoping the retirement package is better, but I am dubious about that.

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