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U.S. Envoy Caught Bringing Weapons Into Venezuela - 8/28/2006 4:26:56 AM

glovedneck

Posts: 5
Joined: 6/21/2006
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A U.S. envoy was stopped at the Venezuelan airport with 15 plus bags and caught trying to bring in ejector seats to replace worn ones for the Venezuelan military. He also had in the bags explosive charges. He's being charged with violating diplomatic immunity for baggage brought into the country. Well, the U.S. has an embargo on military supplies to Venezuela. The envoy's explanation was that the explosive charges were for his personal use. What the hell does he do, hang them on his walls? This really has a bad smell to it. Something's going on. As much as I don't care for the Venezuelan government, this is something we need to stay out of. Bush has caused enough trouble in this world.

Post #: 1

RE: U.S. Envoy Caught Bringing Weapons Into Venezuela - 8/28/2006 6:17:02 AM

pahunkboy

Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline

we the public may never know about covert ops.

there are tons of covert ops going on all the time. it is like a giant chess game. we play each side, sometime even ourself. as teh left hand doesn know the righthand.

dont forget, under bush- we have some laws we cant know about. they arent disclosed. yikes.

(in reply to glovedneck)

Post #: 2

RE: U.S. Envoy Caught Bringing Weapons Into Venezuela - 8/28/2006 7:33:28 AM

CrappyDom

Posts: 1883
Joined: 4/11/2006
From: Sacramento
Status: offline

While I believe we were behind the first coup, this one isn't what it looks like. Ejection seats use both rockets and explosive charges to do things like sever bolts, blow off the canapies and such.

If they had found real explosives, they would be trumpeting it. Keep in mind a human is sitting in a chair right next to those "explosives" so they are not exactly big explosives.

In this case, this is Chavez fucking with us although I sure don't blame him. Saddam only made threats against Bush and we occupied his whole country, Bush staged and actual coup so all is fair in love and war.

(in reply to glovedneck)

Post #: 3

RE: U.S. Envoy Caught Bringing Weapons Into Venezuela - 8/29/2006 12:23:30 PM

Termyn8or

Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
Status: offline

We see a picture of President Hugo Chave Frias that is painted by a media monopoly known to lie and distort the truth.

The fact of the matter is he is the leader of that country, the CIA did overthrow him some years ago and he was back in the saddle within 48 hours. Some dictator. Obviously he is what the people down there want.

T

(in reply to CrappyDom)

Post #: 4

RE: U.S. Envoy Caught Bringing Weapons Into Venezuela - 8/29/2006 12:25:41 PM

LotusSong

Posts: 6334
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Domme Emeritus
Status: offline

I have come the realization that we are no longer the "good guys"

_____________________________

Life Lesson #1

I'm not your type.
I'm not inflatable.

(in reply to glovedneck)

Post #: 5

RE: U.S. Envoy Caught Bringing Weapons Into Venezuela - 8/29/2006 7:04:16 PM

LTRsubNW

Posts: 1604
Joined: 5/6/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: glovedneck

A U.S. envoy was stopped at the Venezuelan airport with 15 plus bags and caught trying to bring in ejector seats to replace worn ones for the Venezuelan military. He also had in the bags explosive charges. He's being charged with violating diplomatic immunity for baggage brought into the country. Well, the U.S. has an embargo on military supplies to Venezuela. The envoy's explanation was that the explosive charges were for his personal use. What the hell does he do, hang them on his walls? This really has a bad smell to it. Something's going on. As much as I don't care for the Venezuelan government, this is something we need to stay out of. Bush has caused enough trouble in this world.

Let me see if I understand your consternation;

You're concerned because an international traveler was caught with explosive charges.

Is that right?

Ejector seats.

Enough charges that could easily explode a standard economy class passenger door.

And you're curious why the general public would find that offensive (and as to why the TSA would feel encumbered by someone, carrying enough charges to blow a standard passenger door of a PUBLIC airline to feel unduly burdened...that doesn't strike a chord?).

I have one question for you:

Are you so incredibly stoned out of your mind that you have no cognizent ability to grasp what's been going on in the papers in the last few (days/months/years)?

I have one more question for you;

"HELLOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO????"

(in reply to glovedneck)

Post #: 6

RE: U.S. Envoy Caught Bringing Weapons Into Venezuela - 8/29/2006 7:17:45 PM

MrDiscipline44

Posts: 1776
Joined: 1/5/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong

I have come the realization that we are no longer the "good guys"

You're just now figuring that out?

_____________________________

If you love somebody, you have to be willing to break them.

Those who can, do. Those who can't, teach.

Have you slapped your slave today?

(in reply to LotusSong)

Post #: 7

RE: U.S. Envoy Caught Bringing Weapons Into Venezuela - 8/29/2006 7:23:04 PM

LotusSong

Posts: 6334
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Domme Emeritus
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrDiscipline44

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong

I have come the realization that we are no longer the "good guys"

You're just now figuring that out?

yeeeeeeeeeeee-up :/ It's kind of like finding out Santa Claus doesn't exist.

_____________________________

Life Lesson #1

I'm not your type.
I'm not inflatable.

(in reply to MrDiscipline44)

Post #: 8

RE: U.S. Envoy Caught Bringing Weapons Into Venezuela - 8/29/2006 8:33:53 PM

juliaoceania

Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline

The USA has been behind almost every coup in the Southern Hemisphere... and I knew Chavez was not going to remain in power when the US kidnapped him. I do not understand why we as Americans put up with this shit,... it is so immoral

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to glovedneck)

Post #: 9

RE: U.S. Envoy Caught Bringing Weapons Into Venezuela - 8/29/2006 8:42:18 PM

LotusSong

Posts: 6334
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Domme Emeritus
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

The USA has been behind almost every coup in the Southern Hemisphere... and I knew Chavez was not going to remain in power when the US kidnapped him. I do not understand why we as Americans put up with this shit,... it is so immoral

This reminds me of a story about the reluctant sparrow.
Once upon a time, there was a reluctant sparrow that did not want to fly south for the winter. As the days drew on, he bacame cold. So cold he could not fly. He sat in the barnyard fearing the end was near.

Then a horse came by and crapped on the little bird. The little bird feared he was going to suffocate and die but the manure warmed him and he began to sing.

A cat, upon hearing the singing, came by to investigate, saw the bird and promply ate him.

The moral to this story is:

1. Not everyone who shits on you is your enemy.
2. Not everyone who gets you out of that shit is your friend.
3. And if you are warm and happy and in a pile a shit, keep your mouth shut.

I think we are at #3.

_____________________________

Life Lesson #1

I'm not your type.
I'm not inflatable.

(in reply to juliaoceania)

Post #: 10

RE: U.S. Envoy Caught Bringing Weapons Into Venezuela - 8/29/2006 8:48:38 PM

MrDiscipline44

Posts: 1776
Joined: 1/5/2005
Status: offline

The moral to this story is:

Cats will eat something covered in shit.

_____________________________

If you love somebody, you have to be willing to break them.

Those who can, do. Those who can't, teach.

Have you slapped your slave today?

(in reply to LotusSong)

Post #: 11

RE: U.S. Envoy Caught Bringing Weapons Into Venezuela - 8/29/2006 9:44:01 PM

CrappyDom

Posts: 1883
Joined: 4/11/2006
From: Sacramento
Status: offline

LTR,

The TSA is an AMERICAN agency, it uh doesn't have authority in VENEZUALA! The explosives had already left the plane, the issue was bringing them into the country, not in flying with them.

I would explain more but that is enough I hope to get you back on the right track.

(in reply to LTRsubNW)

Post #: 12

RE: U.S. Envoy Caught Bringing Weapons Into Venezuela - 8/30/2006 1:20:22 AM

Kedicat

Posts: 251
Joined: 3/13/2005
Status: offline

Hmmmm Smuggling in the explosive parts for the fighter jet ejector systems?
If I was contemplating invading a country, and was worried about the fighter aircraft. I might smuggle in defective parts to a desperate airforce.
An unfortunate malfunction of the ejector system could easily destroy the cockpit of the aircraft, and a destroyed cockpit renders the plane useless. Where a non functioning ejector might only inspire the pilot to do even better.
If I was a higher up in the Venezuela military, I'd have those parts inspected and see what the intent really was.

If I was a spooky sort, I would have a diplomat smuggle in the parts, hand them off to a fake " smuggler/procurer " and let the airforce install your bombs in their own planes.

(in reply to glovedneck)

Post #: 13

RE: U.S. Envoy Caught Bringing Weapons Into Venezuela - 8/30/2006 6:29:15 AM

pantera

Posts: 210
Joined: 1/7/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong

I have come the realization that we are no longer the "good guys"

You're right!!!! we're the bad guys!!!! chavez and castro are the good guys!!!!

Many americans will never understand what this country means for immigrants and the rest of the world- All I can do is forever be thankful for what it has done for me and my family.

(in reply to LotusSong)

Post #: 14

RE: U.S. Envoy Caught Bringing Weapons Into Venezuela - 8/30/2006 6:44:44 AM

Emperor1956

Posts: 2370
Joined: 11/7/2005
Status: offline

You know, sometimes you people are so gullible. Did any one bother to check the underlying news story before they spouted off about how much they hate/love the USA?

I don't ususally read these political posts, but this one seemed so "out there" that I did about 5 minutes of checking on the Web to see the news story where a "A U.S. envoy was stopped at the Venezuelan airport with 15 plus bags and caught trying to bring in ejector seats to replace worn ones for the Venezuelan military" to quote the OP. Guess what. That isn't exactly what happened -- indeed, that may not be what happened AT ALL.

http://www.iht.com/articles/2006/08/28/news/venezuela.php

That is ONE of about 30 articles any of you could have read before you spouted. I won't take a point of view in this thread, but maybe some of you -- including a few people I value -- could think before you post on politics?

Happy Wednesday.

E.

_____________________________

"When you wake up, Pooh," said Piglet, "what's the first thing you say?"
"What's for breakfast? What do you say, Piglet?"
"I say, I wonder what's going to happen exciting today?"
Pooh nodded thoughtfully.
"It's the same thing," he said.

(in reply to glovedneck)

Post #: 15

RE: U.S. Envoy Caught Bringing Weapons Into Venezuela - 8/30/2006 7:21:29 AM

LotusSong

Posts: 6334
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Domme Emeritus
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: pantera

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong

I have come the realization that we are no longer the "good guys"

You're right!!!! we're the bad guys!!!! chavez and castro are the good guys!!!!

Many americans will never understand what this country means for immigrants and the rest of the world- All I can do is forever be thankful for what it has done for me and my family.

You'll get over it.

_____________________________

Life Lesson #1

I'm not your type.
I'm not inflatable.

(in reply to pantera)

Post #: 16

RE: U.S. Envoy Caught Bringing Weapons Into Venezuela - 8/30/2006 7:35:35 AM

pahunkboy

Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline

i hesitate to give him the attention.

holy cow- give the US 08 to clean up the mess.

hopefully we can clean it [up]

(in reply to LotusSong)

Post #: 17

RE: U.S. Envoy Caught Bringing Weapons Into Venezuela - 8/30/2006 8:14:21 AM

CrappyDom

Posts: 1883
Joined: 4/11/2006
From: Sacramento
Status: offline

Emporer,

You are going to have to explain your point, because I read the link and it doesn't present anything in any different light than the original article.

(in reply to Emperor1956)

Post #: 18

RE: U.S. Envoy Caught Bringing Weapons Into Venezuela - 8/30/2006 9:25:43 AM

juliaoceania

Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: pantera

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong

I have come the realization that we are no longer the "good guys"

You're right!!!! we're the bad guys!!!! chavez and castro are the good guys!!!!

Many americans will never understand what this country means for immigrants and the rest of the world- All I can do is forever be thankful for what it has done for me and my family.

Perhaps part of the reason it sucks to live in other places in the Western Hemisphere is because Americans just can't let people run their own show and have to undermine freedom because of standards like the Monroe Doctrine... we think we own all of this hemisphere and should call the shots, no matter how many death squads we have to train, like the the School of the Americas....

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to pantera)

Post #: 19

RE: U.S. Envoy Caught Bringing Weapons Into Venezuela - 8/30/2006 11:19:43 PM

Emperor1956

Posts: 2370
Joined: 11/7/2005
Status: offline

quote:

CrappyDom: Emporer,

You are going to have to explain your point, because I read the link and it doesn't present anything in any different light than the original article.

CD: my point is that the OP distorted this news story, and apparently those posting subsequently did not verify the actual story. In brief, here is what the OP said (for ease of reading I'll put the OP in blue) and here's the actual story:

A U.S. envoy was stopped at the Venezuelan airport with 15 plus bags and caught trying to bring in ejector seats to replace worn ones for the Venezuelan military. Well, no. The bags of a newly arrived diplomatic employee were on the same plane as some military grade parts which the US was supplying to Venezuela at its request. The parts included propulsion motors for ejector seats in Venezuelan owned fighter jets. There is a dispute as to whether other military items were included. The "envoy" apparently had NOTHING to do with the questioned shipment other than his family's bags were on the plane and then on the delivery truck.

He also had in the bags explosive charges. He's being charged with violating diplomatic immunity for baggage brought into the country. Well, uh.... No. As said in about 30 news stories from all over the globe and the political spectrum, the envoy had NOTHING questionable in his bags. The supposed "contraband" was ON THE SAME PLANE AND THEN ON THE SAME TRUCK.

And by the way, the OP's grasp of international law is pretty weak. One can't be charged with violating diplomatic immunity, except by one's own country. What has happened is Venez. has lodged a formal protest with the US State Dept. that the diplomatic privilege of not having your shipments to your embassy inspected was abused. This notwithstanding that the shipment WAS inspected by Venezuelan customs and cleared for delivery to the Embassy.

Do I need to go on? The rest of the post is drivel. Go back and read it. Here's what happened as best as I can tell:

A US diplomatic employee moved to Venezuela and shipped his family's personal effects. On the same (US) plane were military parts ordered by Venezuela, paid for by the country and inspected by the Venezuelan customs. The parts, the diplomat's bags, and some other allegedy contraband items were all loaded on a truck bound for the US Embassy, and then the Venezulan government decided to "expose" the shipment.

For reasons known only to Mr. Chavez (hmmm...like he was making a violently anti-US and anti-Israel speech in Syria the same day as this little incident and maybe needed some distraction?) the Venezuelan Dept. of State "discovered" these heinous military devices (which are defensive, not offensive). And decided to raise a minor ruckus.

Now...may I ask you to shoulder the burden of the thread and explain why everyone is ranting?

E.

OH I FORGOT: the other issue the Venezuelan government has vigorously protested in that SOMEONE -- the new employee or someone in the Embassy -- is accused of violating the rules of Diplomacy again...there was a serious, hideous smuggling attempt besides these "weapons". Yes...sadly...SOME EVIL, ROTTEN AMERICAN APPARENTLY ATTEMPTED TO SMUGGLE AMERICAN RAISED CHICKEN IN THE DIPLOMATIC SHIPMENT! 167 lbs, to be exact. NOW, there's a war crime for you! DAMN THAT EVIL GEORGE BUSH!

(I'm not making this up...the "chicken offense" was reported by the Venezuelans along with the alleged importation of military weapons. And I'm not fan of Bush, but I really, really dislike stupidity, and this thread reeks of it...like week old chicken in the Venezuelan sun.)

_____________________________

"When you wake up, Pooh," said Piglet, "what's the first thing you say?"
"What's for breakfast? What do you say, Piglet?"
"I say, I wonder what's going to happen exciting today?"
Pooh nodded thoughtfully.
"It's the same thing," he said.

(in reply to CrappyDom)

Post #: 20

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