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RE: Abortion Industry Decimating Black Community - 9/6/2006 3:18:06 PM   
Level


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quote:

ORIGINAL: TreSwank

quote:

ORIGINAL: Estring

70% of black children in the US are born out of wedlock. That statistic is very disturbing.



I believe that one of those quiet facts that most people are afraid to acknowledge is that people carry over the vestiges of traits from previous generations through a sort of implicit, observed learning process.  Although black people have assimilated into the culture created by white Europeans for many years, the learned traits of many poverty stricken African Americans can be partially understood in the context of their ancestral roots in Africa.

     In the same way that many Italian Americans are known for cultural traits that have been perpetuated for hundreds and years, and make up a good deal of the "cliche" loud, gesticulating, fiery tempered Sicilian image, fine-tuned by learned behavior, poverty stricken blacks show certain negative behavioral patterns because they are still crafted in the mold of indigenous Africans (because of subtle, traits, picked up through generations).

Africa has always been a bellicose country, and the hunter-gatherer way of life is still the norm in some parts of the "motherland".  In a country where poverty, disease, tribal disputes, and illiteracy rule supreme, it's no wonder that poor blacks display such a disproportionate level of promiscuity and violent tendencies in relation to the white population.

I read an article recently, in which an AFRICAN AMERICAN governor had suggested a plan to Norplant young, black pre-teen girls, in an effort to curb the pregnancy rate, and to allow these kids to live NORMAL lives, and eventually reach towards a college education without being fettered down by the stain of teen pregnancy.  This plan was shot down IMMEDIATELY by POOR BLACKS, who argued, tooth and nail in favor of "Lashanda's" right to get knocked up at age 15, and lose a lifetime of opportunity only to become another welfare tragedy.
Sounds like a community that "really" knows where it's priorities are.

Am I fully qualified to criticize a community to which I do not belong?  ABSOLUTELY NOT...................but sometimes the spectre of common sense gets neglected in an attempt to rationalize a truth.


Africa is a continent, not a country. 
 
I would offer as suggested reading, for anyone curious about some of the issues plaguing the black community, "Losing The Race", by John McWhorter. He's come out with a follow up, but I haven't read it yet.
 
I wouldn't put much credence in today's problems with how things went in Africa, Tre.

< Message edited by Level -- 9/6/2006 3:19:43 PM >

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Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

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(in reply to TreSwank)
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RE: Abortion Industry Decimating Black Community - 9/6/2006 3:55:02 PM   
abytchgoddess4u


Posts: 268
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Level
I don't think anyone is "targeting" black women for abortions, but the ratio is much higher for abortions:
"The abortion ratio for black women (503 per 1,000 live births) was 3.0 times the ratio for white women (167 per 1,000 live births). " 
http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/ss5212a1.htm


Level,
 You quote the ratios only...not the full stats. Could be construed as manipulative and pushing your own views on choice...considering that the percentages were in the first sentance of the "same" paragraph that stat came from. The percentages are more appropriate...

"In the 41 areas for which race was adequately reported, approximately 55% of women who obtained legal induced abortions were known to be white, 35% were black, and 7% were of other races; for 3% of the women, race was unknown."

Fact is, it's a higher ratio b/c black women are having fewer pregnancies than whites. Actual numbers...whites are having more theraputic abortions.

To the OP:
I think that article is bullshit, as it only mentioned the ratios as well. Besides, Margaret Sanger targeted all poor people, not just blacks...and it was based on her own life experience. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margaret_Sanger
 
Just another example of the Religious Right trying to manipulate the masses and instil more hatred.

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Ask all from yourself." Rumi

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RE: Abortion Industry Decimating Black Community - 9/6/2006 4:38:39 PM   
Level


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quote:

ORIGINAL: abytchgoddess4u

quote:

ORIGINAL: Level
I don't think anyone is "targeting" black women for abortions, but the ratio is much higher for abortions:
"The abortion ratio for black women (503 per 1,000 live births) was 3.0 times the ratio for white women (167 per 1,000 live births). " 
http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/ss5212a1.htm


Level,
 You quote the ratios only...not the full stats. Could be construed as manipulative and pushing your own views on choice...considering that the percentages were in the first sentance of the "same" paragraph that stat came from. The percentages are more appropriate...

"In the 41 areas for which race was adequately reported, approximately 55% of women who obtained legal induced abortions were known to be white, 35% were black, and 7% were of other races; for 3% of the women, race was unknown."

Fact is, it's a higher ratio b/c black women are having fewer pregnancies than whites. Actual numbers...whites are having more theraputic abortions.

To the OP:
I think that article is bullshit, as it only mentioned the ratios as well. Besides, Margaret Sanger targeted all poor people, not just blacks...and it was based on her own life experience. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margaret_Sanger
 
Just another example of the Religious Right trying to manipulate the masses and instil more hatred.


I'd hardly say I was being manipulative, as I included the link to the whole shebang. We can also look at it as there are far fewer black women in America.... black Americans make up roughly 12% of the population, but have 35% of the abortions.
 
I'm not trying to take a dump on black women, or anyone else; the only reason I posted anything about black women and abortion is because that's what the topic of the thread is. In other threads dealing with abortion in general, I only posted general info.
 
And I surely hope no one is saying I'm a member of the religous right.....

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

(in reply to abytchgoddess4u)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Abortion Industry Decimating Black Community - 9/6/2006 6:50:45 PM   
MistressWolfen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Vendaval

The article does not mention related social and economic issues
that plague the inner cities such as:  poor nutrition, poor education,
drug and alcohol addiction, lack of health care and lack of housing.
 
Vendaval
 


Well spoken Vendaval, it is seldom that such clap trap and shoddy reporting does address the underlying issues of marginalization, or indeed, the facts.

I have to agree with the majority of posters that question the veracity of this article.

To Levels recommended reading I would like to add (if you are interested);

Subjects Between Nature and Culture, Oliver, K., 1997
The Power of Culture: Critical Essays in American History, Fox.R, Lears, T., 1993
Family Matters: Feminist Concepts in African Philosophy of Culture, Nzegwu, N., 2006
some ole classics
The Changing Family, Hutter, M., 1997
The Family, Eschelmann, J.R., 2003

...submitted with respect and absolutely no personal input on this subject matter. I have come to admire many of the posters in the forum and realise that sometimes people perhaps type things in a way that makes them come across as bigotted, racial, fascists and unlearned twats, when really it is just a matter of interpreting the specific written word to a common language.

and thank you Lashra for bringing this knee jerk reporting to our attention.



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RE: Abortion Industry Decimating Black Community - 9/6/2006 6:59:39 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		I will tell you what is decimating black folk.  AIDS.  It has been an ongoing scourge in Africa (the continent, not the country (continents are some larger usually...........LOL)) for some time.


And I believe that it is the black plague.(in a non sickass pun way) and  it will so vastly change the makeup of the world in the immediate and forseeable future...........I don't know what the implications are.

Ron    

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RE: Abortion Industry Decimating Black Community - 9/6/2006 7:02:28 PM   
MistressWolfen


Posts: 578
Joined: 6/20/2005
Status: offline 		Yes you are dead correct Ron, as AIDS is dessimating the First Nations and Aboriginal populations, again we must acknowledge SES and marginalisation. Excellent point btw!

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RE: Abortion Industry Decimating Black Community - 9/6/2006 7:08:06 PM   
LTRsubNW


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Joined: 5/6/2006
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quote:

http://www.cbn.com/CBNnews/CWN/042106Abortion.aspx
quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong

I've cut and pasted but can't pull it up.


(That's okay, I've fallen down and I can't get up)

(in reply to LotusSong)
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RE: Abortion Industry Decimating Black Community - 9/6/2006 7:11:15 PM   
LTRsubNW


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Joined: 5/6/2006
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quote:

http://www.cbn.com/CBNnews/CWN/042106Abortion.aspx
quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

"The article does not mention related social and economic issues
that plague the inner cities such as: "
 
They fuck too much. They don't use contraceptives.
 
It is really that simple.
 
T


I'd just like to add one small point of contention:

I don't think it's possible to fuck too much (and if it is, I'm willing to sacrifice myself for the eventual study).

(in reply to Termyn8or)
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RE: Abortion Industry Decimating Black Community - 9/6/2006 7:22:30 PM   
Level


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quote:

ORIGINAL: MistressWolfen

Yes you are dead correct Ron, as AIDS is dessimating the First Nations and Aboriginal populations, again we must acknowledge SES and marginalisation. Excellent point btw!


"AIDS is now the leading cause of death for African-American women between the ages of 25 and 34."
 
That from a Boston Globe article:
 
http://www.boston.com/news/globe/editorial_opinion/editorials/articles/2006/09/04/aids_and_black_america



_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

(in reply to MistressWolfen)
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RE: Abortion Industry Decimating Black Community - 9/6/2006 7:35:13 PM   
MistressWolfen


Posts: 578
Joined: 6/20/2005
Status: offline 		mmhmmm...check the stats for the female Canadian Aboriginal population, I think two years ago it was almost endemic *shakes head* very sad, and the cause is the same (not drug use), heterosexual women being conatminated by their life partners. *sighs* educate educate educate is my mantra on this one.

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RE: Abortion Industry Decimating Black Community - 9/6/2006 9:08:22 PM   
Lordandmaster


Posts: 10943
Joined: 6/22/2004
Status: offline 		The right wing needs black voters.  Some of them seem to think that this is the way to get them.  They know that sanctimonious and patronizing moral rhetoric works on millions of white voters, so you can understand why they're trying it out on blacks too.

(in reply to Lashra)
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RE: Abortion Industry Decimating Black Community - 9/6/2006 9:55:02 PM   
Termyn8or


Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
Status: offline 		Are they going around in black neighborhoods with 'bortionmobiles or something ?

Are they asking them in homeroom if they need an abortion today ?

Are they giving away abortions with blunts or cigarillos ?

If they are I haven't seen it.

T

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RE: Abortion Industry Decimating Black Community - 9/6/2006 10:28:06 PM   
CuriouslyKat


Posts: 118
Joined: 8/21/2006
From: Kansas
Status: offline 		*quick reply*
I am highly amused by where this thread is going.  Can we talk about white people and meth next?  Going to get random here:

On the abortion issues: Most of the black women I knew who have had abortions were college educated and had them because they were not ready for children and not married. That's four women right there.

I had an abortion last year because I already have two from my first marriage that I raise on my own. I am not going to bring another child in the world without the proper resources.  I made a stupid mistake with on a ONS, a really sucky ONS at that.  Having the abortion  was the worst thing I ever had to do, but the best for my situation. I count it as a very painful lesson learned.

On the black women and AIDS issues.  Every once in a while an article or show will feature it but it fades into the background. It should not. It should be shouted from the roof tops. There are a lot of women who just don't know.   That also ties into the "down low" stuff going on with black men. 

Welfare: Welfare is a trap and most black people know it. It's having the resources to get out of the trap while still being able to live is the problem.

I think I got everything mentioned. I can not speak for all black people because we are all individuals who make individual choices, who live in a variety of ways. Yes, a lot of it adds up to disturbing patterns that need to be addressed.  We have some piss poor leaders in the black community. I won't go into my hate for Jesse Jackson or Al Sharpton. I would be here all night.

Kat......That's all I can think of now....Just wanted to share a chocolate view.



_____________________________

Ouch I have lost myself again
Lost myself and I am nowhere to be found,
Yeah I think that I might break
Lost myself again and I feel unsafe

Sia "Breathe Me"

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RE: Abortion Industry Decimating Black Community - 9/8/2006 6:07:26 AM   
TreSwank


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Level


I wouldn't put much credence in today's problems with how things went in Africa, Tre.


  When Africans were first brought to the United States, their own homeland wasn't exactly an epicenter of advanced civilization.  In fact, I'd venture to say that Africans had forged a "hunter gatherer / primitive agrarian" culture, whereas white Europeans and Americans had formed a complex civilization.  Now, when you take something out of it's natural habitat, and thrust it into an entirely different environment...........things are gonna go a little bit haywire.  If fucking and predatory behavior are natural tendencies amongst, lets say, 75% of a given group of people, and you place this group into another population where the cultural and value systems are vastly different, there will be a certain amount of destructive non-assimilation.

   These days, the "equality at all costs" propaganda disseminated by God Knows Who, has got America in an ideological stranglehold. Take one moment to suggest that, statistically, Northern Asians have better math skills than whites (even American born Northern Asians, according to statistics), and you'll get general concurrence from most folks.....................but try to point out an obvious deficiency in a certain portion of the population, and prepared to be crucified.  I'm not a right-wing religous zealot, nor am I a Republican, but common sense has got to take the steering wheel away from rationalization at some point.  People need to stop taking their ideas straight from the media, from the president, from public schools, from their parents, from 20-something college-hipsters ; what America needs is little bit of reflection time that's free of psychic pollution.

< Message edited by TreSwank -- 9/8/2006 6:43:40 AM >

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RE: Abortion Industry Decimating Black Community - 9/8/2006 6:39:21 AM   
CrappyDom


Posts: 1883
Joined: 4/11/2006
From: Sacramento
Status: offline 		Repbulicans believe the right to life ends at birth.

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RE: Abortion Industry Decimating Black Community - 9/8/2006 8:45:16 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
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Status: offline 		It's a timing thing.

Ron


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RE: Abortion Industry Decimating Black Community - 9/8/2006 9:04:35 AM   
Kedicat


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Status: offline 		Oh yes, decimating.
It would be much better for the black community to have more babies than can be properly supported. Keep them poor, desperate, and keep taking away social programs, underfunding education. So troublesome to import desperate folks to work like slaves. When we can grow our own right at home. Some slavery was abolished.
Economic slavery is still legal. And growing.

(in reply to Lashra)
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RE: Abortion Industry Decimating Black Community - 9/8/2006 9:16:37 AM   
TreSwank


Posts: 1165
Joined: 3/5/2005
Status: offline 		THIS might be what's really decimating the "Black Community."  Jesus Christ, I'm starting to sound like an old geezer already!!!!

                (Sorry.........I had to insert a lighthearted joke into this discussion)

< Message edited by TreSwank -- 9/8/2006 9:19:42 AM >

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RE: Abortion Industry Decimating Black Community - 9/8/2006 9:20:35 AM   
Kedicat


Posts: 251
Joined: 3/13/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: TreSwank

THIS might be what's really decimating the "Black Community."  Jesus Christ, I'm starting to sound like an old geezer already!!!!

               (Sorry.........I had to insert a lighthearted joke into this discussion)


Worth a 1000 words at least.

(in reply to TreSwank)
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RE: Abortion Industry Decimating Black Community - 9/8/2006 9:21:45 AM   
TreSwank


Posts: 1165
Joined: 3/5/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kedicat

Oh yes, decimating.
It would be much better for the black community to have more babies than can be properly supported. Keep them poor, desperate, and keep taking away social programs, underfunding education. So troublesome to import desperate folks to work like slaves. When we can grow our own right at home. Some slavery was abolished.
Economic slavery is still legal. And growing.



This one hit the nail on the head.

(in reply to Kedicat)
Profile   Post #: 40
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