Collarspace Discussion Forums


Home  Login  Search 

RE: What about trans women submissives?


View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
 
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Ask a Mistress >> RE: What about trans women submissives? Page: <<   < prev  1 [2] 3 4   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/20/2006 12:32:20 PM   
MstrssPassion


Posts: 2444
Joined: 1/1/2004
From: West Palm Beach, FL
Status: offline 		oh I never disagreed with Steffie... I took the "get it" comment to be more about the matters of the big head...  not the matters of what is or what may have been about the little head.

< Message edited by MstrssPassion -- 9/20/2006 12:33:35 PM >

_____________________________

MstrssPassion


(in reply to LadyEllen)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/20/2006 11:51:43 PM   
Sylph


Posts: 38
Joined: 8/26/2004
Status: offline 		My partner is a M2F transsexual. We met through this site. My partner did disclose fully where she was in the transition process and why she chose to transition. I believe in full disclose, everyone has issues in their life.

It has been my experience that disclose tends to decrease the stress and drama in the whole transition process. There are some significant stresses that come to play.  It is unfortunate that some pple react and do unkind things out of fear. Some pple are more prone to dealing with stress in a dramatic fashion than others. Each person is an individual and how they react to stress is individual. I have noted that the pple who can transition without drama are more prone to going to "stealth ".

I would like to address that there is medical research showing that there  are biological differences associated with transsexualism. Coupled to this there are several birth anomalies that can be grouped as being inter sexed. Some of these are more obvious than others. If the OP wishes to differentiate herself as having a "condition", who am I to question this?

I do hope that the OP find someone who fulfills what she is looking for. She presents herself as a thoughtful and well articulated person. I think she would be a good catch.

Sylph

(in reply to MstrssPassion)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/21/2006 12:52:35 AM   
Kahri


Posts: 70
Joined: 8/30/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MstrssPassion

quote:

All of which makes a TS the perfect partner, because we get it.


Well that is open to debate. I totally get what you are saying but if you really get to the core of it all... did the M2F TS every really get what it was to be a man? Science has surely shown that there is a difference in the brain of the transsexual. Where it truly mattered, was she ever a man in the first place?



Not to be difficult here, but I also wonder if the M2F is really getting what it is like to be an XX female?  Naturally your sex drive went into a few gears that mine never has because I never went from the higher levels of testosterone to the lower.  But I don't know if that experience means that you truly know what it's like to be a 19 year old girl (my own age of maximum sexual stupidity) for example.

This is not to denegrate the reality of your femaleness (is that a word?) in any way, but simple to say that your experiences are unique to you and don't necessarily reflect those of us who were born members of the female gender.

(in reply to MstrssPassion)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/21/2006 1:56:20 AM   
LadyEllen


Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline 		Kahri - I think you make a good point; however strong one's female identity, in many cases this is not allowed free rein until such a point in life that one has had to conform for a long time to the birth sex gender, and this has certain inevitable consequences on the psyche. In that way, no its not possible to be 100% or to experience 100% what its like to be a real woman - but then how many real women could describe what its like and agree 100% about it? The best any of us can be is ourselves, and we are all different after all.

I remember a television programme on BBC back in the 70s when I was about ten (I think). It was the first of its kind, and followed a guy called George as he became Julia, (its was called "George to Julia"). The doctor had a bunch of medical students in the room and asked Julia about her identity, to which she replied "I feel like a woman". The doctor then asked the single female medical student in the room, "how does it feel to be a woman?" to which she replied "I dont know", which the doctor then used in order to humiliate Julia in front of all of them. That was the way he did things, (he was BTW an absolute shithead to her throughout!), and I cant help but think that a lot of the changes in the way people are handled since then have been a result of the terrible manner this doctor had. I also remember I got into a lot of trouble for reading my dad's newspaper about it all and coming out with the quite innocent comment, that I'd like to do that one day too! (I didnt understand at age ten that this was such an awful sin).

One of the things I learnt as things changed for me, was that "women are people too" - not as a slogan, but as a reality. Regardless of how I felt, I was brought up with the same male conditioning that said that women were all the same, and in effect at least, less than men - who of course were real people. The basics of this conditioning are, that women dont have personalities, interests, abilities, intellect, friends or activities - except inasmuch as these relate to their role in raising children, looking after the housework and cooking for their family. That even as a child I just did these things (I am the eldest) without question and without other ambition even, probably says a lot about me! It was really only once I had crossed over that I discovered all these "empty people" (women) were people very alike in character to me and with whom I was comfortable. The only problem now being that things are tilting the other way, and men seem all alike instead! I suspect though that despite all the ranting that goes on in society and on here about this sort of thing, is just a function of men and women mainly keeping themselves to themselves and only mixing in the event of long term relationships and in the context of families. It does also add to a certain mystique about one another that I think is probably important to the whole mating game.

I guess if we were able to identify TS people at birth and raise them in the appropriate gender then things might be better for all concerned - but then we have to remember that right now intersex people who were surgically altered at birth to make them fit one sex or the other, are up in arms over the way the medical community decided what was best for them. We also have to bear in mind the Dr Money experiment in raising one of two male twins as a girl following a surgical accident, and which ended so tragically. (and that wanker is still, apparently, claiming his work a success!). Overall, the way things are now with self presenting cases, even with the negative gender conditioning they have received, is probably the best, safest way.
E

(in reply to Kahri)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/21/2006 3:22:12 AM   
Emperor1956


Posts: 2370
Joined: 11/7/2005
Status: offline 		FastReply (you should be able to figure out why).  I read this thread with growing irritation and disgust.  I had wanted to post from a biologically and still intact male point of view, but by the second page of the thread it was clear that the purposes of this thread were hijacked into a "lets hate testosterone and men" fest.  It would be nice if a civil discussion could be had about this topic without male bashing.  Apparently some of you (not all, fortunately) who have made a gender choice from M to F also believe that you must denigrate anything male thereafter in order to support your decision.  Any compassion I might have had for your difficulties is pretty much outweighed by my disgust for your intolerance. 

E.

_____________________________

"When you wake up, Pooh," said Piglet, "what's the first thing you say?"
"What's for breakfast? What do you say, Piglet?"
"I say, I wonder what's going to happen exciting today?"
Pooh nodded thoughtfully.
"It's the same thing," he said.

(in reply to MstrssPassion)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/21/2006 3:29:21 AM   
LadyEllen


Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline 		Huh?

(in reply to Emperor1956)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/21/2006 4:27:07 AM   
Emperor1956


Posts: 2370
Joined: 11/7/2005
Status: offline
quote:

LadyEllen:  Huh?


I thought my post was lucid.  Which part did you not understand?  Or did you choose to not understand any of it?

E.

_____________________________

"When you wake up, Pooh," said Piglet, "what's the first thing you say?"
"What's for breakfast? What do you say, Piglet?"
"I say, I wonder what's going to happen exciting today?"
Pooh nodded thoughtfully.
"It's the same thing," he said.

(in reply to LadyEllen)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/21/2006 4:38:09 AM   
LadyEllen


Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline 		Emperor - my "huh" was because as far as I could see, no one had said anything that could have been construed as male bashing, and no one was holding a "lets hate testosterone and men" fest either. There have been comparisons and contrasts but hardly the revelation of some femi-nazi conspiracy to do down the male.

Perhaps if you could elucidate which posts and the points thereof have caused you so much concern?

But I do hope that you're not one of those for whom, unless everyone says how great men are, its construed as male bashing.

E 

(in reply to Emperor1956)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/21/2006 6:48:22 AM   
MstrssPassion


Posts: 2444
Joined: 1/1/2004
From: West Palm Beach, FL
Status: offline 		I'd have to say huh as well... I don't recall anyone saying anything derogatory about men or the high sex associated with testosterone.

I'm especially curious because Emperor says he posted a fast reply but his post is linked to one of my post when I was being very tongue in cheek about big head little head & that reply was not a poke-shot at men.. it was clarifying that my reply was about the mental & emotional presence of the TS not being male like due to the fact they are TS... a TS may never know fully what it is to be neither a "male" or a "female".

If you really followed this thread with interest I might go into further detail but it is fairly obvious that you were just looking for bones.




< Message edited by MstrssPassion -- 9/21/2006 6:57:01 AM >

_____________________________

MstrssPassion


(in reply to LadyEllen)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/21/2006 6:53:13 AM   
LadyEllen


Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline 		I think men are clearly superior, and their high levels of testosterone make them so.

Is that better I wonder?

E

- dammid, got my dungue sduck in my tcheek now

(in reply to MstrssPassion)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/21/2006 7:00:05 AM   
MstrssPassion


Posts: 2444
Joined: 1/1/2004
From: West Palm Beach, FL
Status: offline 		LOL... this whole concept of superiority based on gender, genetics or hormones is a bunch of hogwash.

it is of my opinion that those who preach superioty are those who are most suffering from inferiority.

_____________________________

MstrssPassion


(in reply to LadyEllen)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/21/2006 7:17:05 AM   
LadyEllen


Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline 		MstrssP - I know, but knowing my place is to make men happy, I thought I'd best write something like that!

E

(in reply to MstrssPassion)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/22/2006 8:34:24 AM   
Emperor1956


Posts: 2370
Joined: 11/7/2005
Status: offline 		Well, lets see, Lady Ellen.  From the moment you entered this post, you've been all about bashing men (tho in all fairness you take a swipe at women periodically, and sometimes TGs, too.  Maybe I misjudged you as a man-basher, and you just don't like anyone very much).

quote:

 LE:  In my experience, men will run a mile at the first hint that one has chromosomes other than XX ...


quote:

...and any boys listening in here will never understand female sex drive until they have had a few months on HRT... [this snip from a thread that seems to bash anyone who isn't TG'd]


quote:

I was brought up with the same male conditioning that said that women were all the same, and in effect at least, less than men - who of course were real people.
And you go on to generalize this attitude to ALL men.  Guess what, Lady E.?  I and my brother were brought up without this destructive "male conditioning".  So were 100s of men I know.  How come every man you know is otherwise?  Could it perhaps be your issue?

Then there is that quote equating testosterone to heroin...

What I object to (and commented on in my original post) is your hijacking this otherwise interesting thread and equating your very narrow personal experiences with universal "truths".  Had you acknowledged even once that your repeated issues were your very individualized experiences and not a collection of universal truth, I would support that discussion.  But you don't.  You make sweeping assertions about all men, and sometimes all women, with no thought of tempering your statements to reflect your individual experience.  

And when I first called you on it, your response was another hijack to "wonder" if I am just looking for posts to glorify men, which is silly.  No, those are words that you and Mstrss Passion put in my mouth to evade discussion of the issue I raised re: the hostility in your posts.  I am not at all looking for issues of one gender being better than another; I'm interested in honest, thoughtful, respectful discussions that don't begin and end with "all ___ are ____"  (Insert your favorite castigating universal statement here).
E.


_____________________________

"When you wake up, Pooh," said Piglet, "what's the first thing you say?"
"What's for breakfast? What do you say, Piglet?"
"I say, I wonder what's going to happen exciting today?"
Pooh nodded thoughtfully.
"It's the same thing," he said.

(in reply to LadyEllen)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/22/2006 8:58:06 AM   
MisPandora


Posts: 2911
Joined: 4/7/2004
From: Philadelphia, PA
Status: offline 		*backing slowly away from the thread*

And here I was afraid what I said was offensive!  Dang.

_____________________________

Pandora
Ms World Leather 2004
Ms Philadelphia Leather 2004

"Simply put, if you want a real femdom to love you, give her reasons to love you." Gloria Brame

(in reply to Emperor1956)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/22/2006 9:09:07 AM   
LadyEllen


Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline 		Emperor

If you re-read all the bits you've quoted, you will notice one thing; they are my personal experiences. 1) yes, I have had men run a mile, 2) yes, I dont think you will understand female sex drive unless youve been there (or male for that matter), 3) yes, that was the attitude and conditioning when I was brought up, where I was brought up. I fail to see how, in the absence of the mindframe to reach such a verdict whatever was written, anything I have said could be construed as male bashing or inferred to be meant to be applicable to all men.

These are my experiences, from an unusual angle I'll admit, as someone who has lived on both sides of the fence, and as such may or may not be of interest or value to those reading. That no one else has reached the conclusion you have on my posts, seems to indicate that they are of interest and value to this thread and those reading it.

I am sure that if anyone else had a problem, then they would have raised it by now and pointed it out, but no one has, and in fact if you check back you will find that my posts often receive rapturous applause from all sexes, genders, orientations and interest groups, and not the sort of prejudicial review and negative criticism with which you seem to regard them. Still, if that is the way you wish to see it, then that is your right, but be prepared to be in a minority as things stand. OK?

E

(in reply to Emperor1956)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/22/2006 9:14:12 AM   
MstrssPassion


Posts: 2444
Joined: 1/1/2004
From: West Palm Beach, FL
Status: offline 		You are still taking the replies out of context... you speak from the view of a man who is completely ok with being a man & you have no issues with what the presence of testosterone in your body or how this hormone motivates you as a man.

This is completely normal for you. This is fine & there is absolutely nothing wrong with this.

Now for the transsexual... this is a horrible thing. During puberty when testosterone is first introduced into the male body changes happen that make the male body more male... hair growth, physical changes in the body, muscle growth & yes... erections.

All of this is horrifying for the transsexual who identifies as being female.

Have yo ever spoken to a transsexual M2F?

I have... & the one thing I hear over & over is how many use to go to bed at night & pray to God that when they wake that they would be a girl & that these horrible changes wouldn't take place. (or something similar)

This has nothing to do with bashing men... it has everything to do with a girl just trying to be a woman & that woman trying to overcome the physical defect of being male all of which is aggravated because of the presence of testosterone in HER body.

I'm a genetic woman. Until I met my partner I was also a heterosexual woman. I still have NO DESIRE to involve myself with a genetic female but it would be very wrong of me to say that I am in a heterosexual relationship because my partner is definitely a woman. So I guess this makes me a lesbian.

I don't hate men. I have never bashed men.. Men have a much higher sex drive than women & for completely different reasons & it is this that was being discussed.

One of the things that happens with a trans woman is that once she reduces the presence of or blocks the male hormone & her body adjusts to the female hormones... the sex drive completely changes. In fact they often have to learn what it is to enjoy orgasm as a woman because even that is completely different for a woman... the big diff, women are multiple so they aren't focused on the big bang that is designed for the act of procreation. 2 or 3 for a guy is remarkable... that is but a warm up for a woman. The female orgasm has been linked to procreation as well because the muscle tension actually draws in the fluid that is ejaculated... so it is understandable why multiple reflexes would ensure the fluid is drawn in to impregnate.

You merely misunderstood the dynamics being discussed as bad thing/an attack on men when it wasn't... it was just a transsexuals view on the thing that prevented them from being the woman they so need to be & were meant to be. I"m hopeful that you actually have a real interest in this topic & that this is why you keep coming back to it. Don't attempt to take this information & apply it to your own secure male identity because it won't fit. Human nature of trying to figure out things is to have us try to figure out how this applies directly to us & how would we react/respond. Genetic men & women have no idea what it is to be transsexual.

I've become very well versed & informed due to my involvement with the trans community. I have also become experienced with the fetish community & what cross dressing means to the men who do so because of my interactions with them. I'm also understanding of the heterosexual men who would never dress because I've been in relationships & even a marriage with this type.

So I have to disagree with your take on this & at least my posts within it... I am not a man basher nor a man hater. You completely misinterpreted my posts.

< Message edited by MstrssPassion -- 9/22/2006 9:18:43 AM >

_____________________________

MstrssPassion


(in reply to Emperor1956)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/22/2006 9:17:00 AM   
MstrssPassion


Posts: 2444
Joined: 1/1/2004
From: West Palm Beach, FL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MisPandora

*backing slowly away from the thread*

And here I was afraid what I said was offensive!  Dang.


You, back away??


_____________________________

MstrssPassion


(in reply to MisPandora)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/22/2006 9:17:37 AM   
lunamor


Posts: 52
Joined: 6/9/2005
Status: offline 		I'm following this thread with great interest! Steffie's description of the effects of testosterone certainly helps me to 'get it' better, thanks!

Lunamor

(in reply to LadyEllen)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/22/2006 9:27:55 AM   
MstrssPassion


Posts: 2444
Joined: 1/1/2004
From: West Palm Beach, FL
Status: offline 		There really aren't too many questions that can be asked, that my partner & I haven't been asked already about our sex life. We have been speaking in colleges for a few years now. These college kids really have no shame & never hold back.

We also speak with family members or friends of the TS in thier life when they are struggling with it... questions typically mean a good thing. It is when someone is silent that you are faced with denial or the inability to cope with or accept the TS in their life.

Maybe this is a little off topic but 2/3 is still on topic as far as I'm concerned... it's in ask a Mistress & I am talking about trans women.... it doesn't matter if the trans woman submissive or not... the info still applies so there is plenty for the tans woman sub to read about here.

< Message edited by MstrssPassion -- 9/22/2006 9:28:29 AM >

_____________________________

MstrssPassion


(in reply to lunamor)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/22/2006 9:34:04 AM   
LadyEllen


Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MisPandora

*backing slowly away from the thread*

And here I was afraid what I said was offensive!  Dang.


Yes - how come you got away with it!? LOL!
E

(in reply to MisPandora)
Profile   Post #: 40
Page:   <<   < prev  1 [2] 3 4   next >   >>
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Ask a Mistress >> RE: What about trans women submissives? Page: <<   < prev  1 [2] 3 4   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy

0.094