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RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/23/2006 11:08:05 AM

sissifytoserve

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I think males do have a feminine side...(mabye not as strong as the one I have)...and the ones who destroy it or deny its existence ten to be troubled the most. Just as a female has has an animus (male) part of her personality. An extreme case of that would be say...a female bodybuilder taking male hormones.

There has to be a balance.

Sophia....I think you are doing fine under the circumstances you had to endure.

(in reply to sophia37)

Post #: 61

RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/23/2006 11:10:12 AM

MstrssPassion

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It's good that you already recognize this sissifytoserve... often this desire/need to dress, for the male to express himself as femme is confused as a wish to be female or worse yet... an indication that he may be bi or gay. This isn't true.

This is also the key thing that separates the Cd from the TS... most CD's are completely OK! with their male anatomy.

There are many men that dress even to extremes & are quite macho & very heterosexual as well. These men simply recognize that dressing triggers something in them & they explore it. Some may experience pleasure... some humiliation or even humility... in the case of this "lifestyle" they may feel more submissive--an ultimate expression of surrender.

The list goes on & why I said... somewhere... recognize the energy that you respond to & what it means to the one you are interacting with & have fun with it. If a feminized male isn't your thing... well, don't explore it... it's simply a matter of their kink not matching your kink... no different than other differences we encounter everyday & that do not evoke heated debates. I don't care for scat & there have been scat threads but we surely don't see 20 pages of conversation. I enjoy edge play & even extreme edge play as well as many of the other activities that have now been lumped into this category. Even those conversation only create a page or three.

I don't recall who said it but I think it sums it up... I think people feel threatened about male crossdressers & transwomen. Maybe it is-- dammit he looks better in a dress than I do-- that causes envy or down right jealousy... maybe these women have a diva mentality & don't wish to be outshined... I dunno. The men who jump on this with negativity... maybe they are repressing their own desires or in some way feel threatened that any man would be less than what they measure a man to be. Again... I dunno.

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Post #: 62

RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/23/2006 11:51:23 AM

sissifytoserve

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Well....admittedly..I have always been androgynous...and try to stay that way. To each their own.

Why does everyone want Black and White so much and no room for grey areas?

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Post #: 63

RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/23/2006 12:02:29 PM

sophia37

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R U kidding? I would LOVE a black and white world. Wheres the manual? How do I get one! lolol

I just think that whats so amazing is that when all is said and done with these threads, the people I feel the most affntiy for are the people that could have so easily become my enemies, had my life been in charge of me instead of me being in charge of my life.

If I had the power to magically have my way, I'd transport sissytoserve ladyellen mstrssPassion Cloudboy and me all to the coolest handout place on earth and sit around and shoot the breeze. Drinks on me! and my magic jeanie. Actually drinks are on my magic Jeanie. Im kinda broke right now. I'll just dance on top of the tables. That wouldnt cost anything. lol

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Post #: 64

RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/23/2006 1:34:28 PM

LadyEllen

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quote:

ORIGINAL: sissifytoserve

I would say that in my case its fleeeting and temporary...as I do not have a problem whatsoever with being a male.

However....it seems to me that I cannot also be whole without having a strong feminine side. This is expressed through dressing as a female.

I very much enjoy both sides of my psyche.

Most definately differen't than Becca. If I were a TS..I certainly would want to be known as a woman...even if my physical body because of
DNA and chromosonal factors dictated that I had to have a male body.

I have tremendous respect for others who want to go all the way.

After all....WE ARE...so much more than just our bodies.

Way more.

Hi sissify

I picked up on the two parts from your post that I have put in bold, as (I may be wrong), they seemed to express confusion about the difference between occasional crossdressers and those with gender identity issues.

Earlier in this thread (page 2 I think), I wrote a long post on the differences, which seemed to go down well with readers. In short, it is not a question of "wanting to go all the way" for TS people, by comparison with CD people who have urges of a "fleeting and temporary" nature. Whilst each type do exhibit similar behaviour by way of crossdressing away from their birth sex, there is no spectrum connecting the two - they are different phenomena, which means they cannot really be compared.

I hope this will help, and if I misread your comments and you do appreciate there is a difference, then I apologise.

E

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Post #: 65

RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/23/2006 1:46:29 PM

sissifytoserve

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No confusion on my part.

I certainly know the difference.

I disagree with the notion that many posted here that my crossdressing is "just a fetish" however.

It IS an integrated part of my persona.

< Message edited by sissifytoserve -- 9/23/2006 1:48:28 PM >

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Post #: 66

RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/23/2006 2:18:01 PM

angelwingrazor

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i'm a pre-op myself, so i'm veyr relieved at some of the responses gotten on here :] gives me a lot of hope

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Post #: 67

RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/23/2006 2:30:12 PM

LadyEllen

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quote:

ORIGINAL: sissifytoserve

No confusion on my part.

I certainly know the difference.

I disagree with the notion that many posted here that my crossdressing is "just a fetish" however.

It IS an integrated part of my persona.

Hi

Please dont get me wrong OK? I wasnt having a go or anything.

I think what you said about each of us having a male/female side was interesting too, and whilst I have no idea if that is something of nature or of environment, it is something said so often that it has some weight behind it.

I also want you to know that I realise there are a lot of different motivations for crossdressing, something I learned a couple of years back when I wrote the first draft of a custody training document for the police and got shot down in flames by the two CDs in the group! Really, I thought the same sort of things as most people until then, even as a TS!

E

(in reply to sissifytoserve)

Post #: 68

RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/24/2006 7:59:33 PM

mellian

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I just remembered that I started this thread and forgot to check it this past weeks, been busy, but now I am going through the thread.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sylph
If the OP wishes to differentiate herself as having a "condition", who am I to question this?

When I say conditon, I meant it more physically than mentally. Having some form of disability and abnormal biological formation and such is considered by many as a condition, so having a body with the wrong biological settings and growth is condition. Gender is a mental thing and there is nothing wrong about having any particular gender identity, nor is it a disorder.

quote:

I do hope that the OP find someone who fulfills what she is looking for. She presents herself as a thoughtful and well articulated person. I think she would be a good catch.

Yes, eventually I will find someone.

-mellian

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Post #: 69

RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/24/2006 8:15:47 PM

mellian

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Emperor1956
I do appreciate that my comments have led to some change in focus -- some people are admitting that their "universal pronouncements" are in fact derived from their unique experiences and that what they say may only be their experiences. That was my key point.

Emperor, the main impression I got from all your posts, and this base on my experiences with people reacting such a way online and in person, is insecurity. Anyone who feels offended by some people have a civil positive discussion about gender and biological differences is pure and simple insecurity, and doesn't matter how supportive you are of trans folks and their issues. So seriously, grow up.

-mellian

< Message edited by mellian -- 9/24/2006 8:18:14 PM >

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RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/24/2006 8:33:28 PM

mellian

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quote:

ORIGINAL: sophia37

my sister was not realistic about the outcome at all. Im just not sure why. It could be she surrounded herself with all Pro transgendered people for two years. In a therapy environment you can become clouded to the real world. But eventually therapy stops and reality starts. Once you get out of that hosptial setting things just arent the same.

She did tell me about the high suicide rate. Shes was an is still an alcoholic. The good news is, she got a number one radio show in a very large metro area! The bed news is since no one can see her, she uses a mans name! lolololol Sometimes,..you gotta laugh. lol

Like the rest of society, there will always be the nutty ones. I too getting annoyed with trans folks make it like the only thing in life is being trans. I feel they are just setting themselves for a big fall, especially for those who focus way to much on getting the SRS done and not on anything else in life. Also get piss off with those who lie their way to SRS instead of being themselves and to be true. There is one case of a donkey in Australia that did that and then turn around suing the shrinks and doctors, and then is used as maskot by the conservations to bash transsexuals and prevent SRS in general.

Only way I found is the best way is to be yourself. Sure there is your gender identity, but that is only one aspect of the whole. How I found the most acceptance for who I am and in turn getting apathy by even more people as I proven to be really no different from rest of society....until it involves a relationship and BDSM which who I am and what I am stuck with for body can be problematic. C'est la vie.

-mellian

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Post #: 71

RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/24/2006 9:08:10 PM

mellian

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In regards to gender and how things have being going can be simplified like this....

Pre-Puberty - I was gender blind, didn't know the different of boy and girl apart from just clothes and names. In kindagarden, there was a dress up section and wore whatever, male, female or mix type costumes and outfits. Same later on in first grade at the babysitters playing dressup with her daughter, just seem natural and fun, and no real different. Sure there was one time I turn down the opportunity to dressup like a fairy, but alot of students in class and the other girls didn't want to either.

Post-Puberty - In combination of puberty and later grades of school really start to enforce the gender stereotypes, I was really genderly confused. So in turn, I went through stages in dealing with that, still not understanding how I feel and why have the urge to appear female and be like the girls whom I seem to relate more and easier to make friends with...until they shoo you away from some circles and talks because I thought I was a "boy". This lead to trying to suppress how I feel and totally being someone I am not by trying to relate with boys and to be like them. Apart from some things I enjoy like hockey, soccer, computers, and so on, only thing I could think of is how stupid they are for some of the things they do and way of thinking, and how stupid it was for me trying to follow along when i feels totally wrong. Also, I wasn't truely accepted as the rest of fellow students thought I was weird and to much of a fake. So gave up trying to be someone I am not, yet I stil wasn't being myself I still have the feelings, still feel something was wrong yet didn't understand why, and in turn I was unfortunatly was really temper mental, angry at the world for some reason, to negative, and again unforunatly my younger brother took the full brunt of it at home and got into fights with him.

Gender Questioning - By age 15-16, I discovered the world of the internet and finally got information on how I feel and why, so slowly started to figure myself out, yet I was still scared of anyone finding out. Some time later, started hanging at the local youth services drop-in and counsellor read my diary called book of nonsense at the time which as some writings about how I felt and my questioning. Soon later, started seeing a counsellor due to my negativity and depression which I agreed to, mainly because it is confidential even to my parents. At one session, when we started stalling, counsellor brought it up thanks to other counsellor opening a file on me and mentioning in it what she read for my journal diary thing. So huge weight off my shoulders, but wasn't until the next counsellor I started seeing as the first was just a temporary student one really started figuring out who I am with her help, without judging or diagnosing...just asking questionings and point out some of the things I said. Year later, I came out and started being myself at age 16, and following months dealt with the headaches of my parents and family finding out.

Gender Certaint - Apart from the first couple of years of further self-discovery, development my own style, and finally truely being myself all the time after highschool, that part-time job I got terminated from, and that youth leadership program I did which I had to bump heads with the administration for being who I am, smooth sailing and way happier. With the mental aspect taken of, just the other aspect of hormones which really helped mentally despite taking some getting use to the emotional attacks, ID change, and then eventual final surgery, I just focus on rest of life as I wait. While doing so, I establish myself in life and in this society has Me which I never did before. Made many friends, eventual full time job, first relationship and its end, and so on... Whole transsexual thing now is on the backburner and not a focus in life, just a condition I have to deal with occasionally.

So yes, now I am 23 and this past year has been great for me and alot better in comparison to the previous few years. Finally actually feel I moving ahead in life and have the basic needs covered. Now, would like to play hockey again after I deal with one legal issue, get into some of my interests which requires money, and in turn a D/s relationship......and then eventually when the money is there the finaly surgery.

There, summery of my life, so learn from it and cherish it as may prove useful.

-mellian

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RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/25/2006 1:35:25 AM

Kahri

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MstrssScarlet

After reading this thread from beginning to end, I have to say that I was shocked by Emperor's statement as well. A shame because all I saw was an interesting and informative discussion on the life of a TS.
I do have just one comment though. It was mentioned that women just naturally have a lower sex drive because we have a different approach to a sexual encounter. Perhaps I misunderstood this, but I would have to disagree. I personally have a very high sex drive - at times exceeding my husband's.
Mistress Scarlet

Ever since LadyEllen responded to my post I've been trying to decide whether I should revive this particular discussion because I obviously didn't make myself clear at all, and this post made up my mind for me. I wasn't talking about the over-arching psychological experience of being a 19 year old girl and experiencing life that way. I was talking strictly about sex drive and hormones.

More specifically:

A m2f tg's body was at one time designed to have much higher levels of testosterone and react to those levels. When they go on the hormones as part of the transformation, naturally their sex drive plummets as a reaction to the reduction of the amount of testosterone in their system.

My body, as an XX woman, was designed to have and respond to much lower levels of testosterone. I respond sexually to those much lower levels. To say that you understand the level of desire in an XX females because you now have the same hormonal balance is unlikely to be true because your genetic makeup is still the same as that of a male, even if your hormones are that of a female.

So I don't think that you really do know what a woman's level of sexual desire is, nor how it corresponds to a man's. You only know your own sexual desire. As I only know my own, and every other man and woman only knows their own.

I know that right now, most people think that men have a higher sex drive than women. But this hasn't always been the case; in previous eras women were considered the more libidinous. I also think that our current perceptions are based on two things: men's bodies reach climax more quickly; and women are taught to say no while men are (generally) taught to seek sex. And with that quicker response comes a lack of stamina - women can simply have sex longer than men can, and I think that should count in the calculation some place.

On a personal note, most of the men I dated back in my early 20s were convinced their sex drive was higher than mine, but my experience told me otherwise. Sure, they could reach climax more quickly, but they didn't want sex any more often I did, and they didn't have more orgasms than I did. They usually had fewer.

I think that men's sex drive vs. women's sex drive is likely to be much like men's math ability vs. women's - there is more variation within each gender than between the genders. I wouldn't care to guess who's is higher.

< Message edited by Kahri -- 9/25/2006 1:37:32 AM >

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Post #: 73

RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/25/2006 2:19:59 AM

LadyEllen

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Hi Kahri

Point taken absolutely - there is no way I could know my drive is the same as any woman's, and there is a great variation amongst any significant population. But going off comparisons with what genetic women have told me, and what I have read, it seems pretty clear to me that there is a strong correlation there on so many counts with such a large proportion of the sample population (those with whom I discussed and those whose accounts I've read), that it must be close to it. The more interesting factors though, which show the greater correlation, are in such things as cues and responses.

E

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Post #: 74

RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/25/2006 2:24:27 AM

LadyEllen

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Hi Mellian

Thanks for sharing your story - its amazing isnt it, how all of these stories match so well!?

E

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Post #: 75

RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/25/2006 4:03:00 AM

mellian

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Joined: 9/6/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kahri

More specifically:

A m2f tg's body was at one time designed to have much higher levels of testosterone and react to those levels. When they go on the hormones as part of the transformation, naturally their sex drive plummets as a reaction to the reduction of the amount of testosterone in their system.

My body, as an XX woman, was designed to have and respond to much lower levels of testosterone. I respond sexually to those much lower levels. To say that you understand the level of desire in an XX females because you now have the same hormonal balance is unlikely to be true because your genetic makeup is still the same as that of a male, even if your hormones are that of a female.

Umm Kahri, each human being as the genetic coding to be either male or female, the only difference is an 1 or 0 switch, XX or XY or mix during the initial formation of an human being, and then the body develops base the genetic blueprints it has. It is because of this hormones can be used to change one's body, it is why female and male bodies have lots of simililarities, just different growths and hormone levels and development of the human brain. The brain is develop more in the later stages of pregnantcy and where the genetic blueprint gets veered off thanks to hormones in the womb wiring one's brain differently from the body in case of trans folks. Human body is geneticly design for either estrogen or testerone females and males have both in their bodies, it is the brain that can get problems processing certaint hormones, hence before taking hormones trans people get depressed and so on.

Now, as for sex drives, for trans women, one of the hormones is testerone suppressors and those do good job of it. One such brand called Androcur, and its only other common use apart from trans women is to chemically castrate pedophiles and perverts in prison. Once a trans women gets SRS or lesser surgery that removes the main source of testerone in the body, they stop taking testerone supressors, which allows natural estrogen to take over at the upper balance as it should be and at that point, sex drive will make a comeback. This from many of the trans women I know that got SRS, and after recovering and healing up, not distracted by pain, many of them end up being horny bunnies.

So yes, point is, female and male is geneticly designed for both set of hormones. Just the brain is the main factor on how it deals with it.

-mellian

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RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/25/2006 5:15:17 PM

Kahri

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quote:

ORIGINAL: mellian

So yes, point is, female and male is geneticly designed for both set of hormones. Just the brain is the main factor on how it deals with it.

-mellian

yes, I know this. I believe you misunderstood my point. I am quite well aware that both genders have both hormones. That was very much a part of my point. As a tg undergoes transformation from male to female, and the testosterone is suppressed to "female" levels, naturally their sex drive plummets with it. This is not a "natural" level of sexual desire for either gender.

I know several individuals who have undergone the transformation and my experience is that they have different levels of sexual desire, some higher some less, just like everyone else.

My point was that I don't know that their experiences can or should be generalized to address those of us who were born XX women. Again, this is in no way taking away or denying the genuineness of their current femininity, merely observing that they took a different path to get there than most of us, and their experiences may be very different than those of us who did not take that path.

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Post #: 77

RE: What about trans women submissives? - 9/26/2006 2:39:34 AM

MistressSassy66

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHugs

Dear mellian, Ladies and Gentlemen;

I would consider all individuals, regardless if I wasn't Lesbian or Bi-sexual. I look for the 'servant' slave, not a sex toy/slut.

Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs

Wonderfully put as usual,Lady Hugs.

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In the Immortal Words of Bob....Fuck the dumb shit.

"I love you not only for what you are,But for what I am when I'm with you."- Opening line from a poem by Roy Croft

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Post #: 78

RE: What about trans women submissives? - 10/17/2006 6:29:30 PM

Mistressnfantasy

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I love tgirls as they have the best of both sexes and the worst of both sexes... I prefer the best of both sexes as their bad is very bad... but i love being intimate with them and just hanging out with them on a positive day............

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Post #: 79

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