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RE: Left wing media. - 9/21/2006 8:58:17 AM   
Archer


Posts: 3207
Joined: 3/11/2005
Status: offline 		Funny how we all tend to view ourselves as rather close to center, LOL

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RE: Left wing media. - 9/21/2006 9:04:07 AM   
KenDckey


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Status: offline 		I saw all those movies   didn't really like any of them.   and I am a movie adict.  What suprised me was how much of the Passion whre I understood the words.   Especially not having taken Latin.   the similarities between Italian and Amharic (Ethiopia) were astounding.

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RE: Left wing media. - 9/21/2006 9:14:50 AM   
Amaros


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Joined: 7/25/2005
Status: offline 		I did like "Soldier", I thought Russel did a heroic job portraying a character with no emotions or personality and still managing to make him sympathetic - the movie itself was subtly lacking somehow though, as a film - not tragic enough maybe, a little too Randist perhaps, I guess you were supposed not to care for all the settlers that were killed cause they were lilly livered liberals - politics tends to ruin movies IMO.

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RE: Left wing media. - 9/21/2006 12:17:56 PM   
Lordandmaster


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Status: offline 		When your primary purpose is to make a profit, you can't be left-wing, right-wing, or any wing at all.  You have to be whatever makes the most money.  (Otherwise your investors remove you.)

The same goes for Hollywood, since you brought it up.  You think a production company asks themselves, before deciding whether to produce a movie, "Hey, what are the politics on this puppy?   Is it left-wing enough for us?"  No, they say, "Hey, how much money are we going to pull in?"  They don't give a rat's ass about politics.  And when they appear to, it's always a calculated gesture designed to increase revenue.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Estring

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster

The media CAN'T be left-wing because the media in this country are run by corporations whose purpose is to make a profit.


Since when are left wingers opposed to making a profit? I think Hollywood is doing very well as far as profits go, and they are definitely left wing.


< Message edited by Lordandmaster -- 9/21/2006 12:18:40 PM >

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RE: Left wing media. - 9/21/2006 12:26:34 PM   
NorthernGent


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Status: offline 		Kedicat,

If you mean the BBC as in the British BBC then they are not left-wing. Centrist possibly, left-wing definitely not. The BBC are a part of the establishment - a left-wing Government with designs on social justice is really not in tune with their core interests. Equality = reduction of privelege (which the BBC enjoys).

Regards

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RE: Left wing media. - 9/21/2006 12:28:58 PM   
NorthernGent


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Joined: 7/10/2006
Status: offline 		The dailies The Guardian and Independent I consider centrist.
 
The Guardian absolutely centrist. Look closely and you'll see fond remembrances of the two world wars - strange for a supposedly left-wing newspaper.

The Independent - absolutely left-wing - why do you think otherwise?

Regards




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Sooner or later, the man who wins is the man who thinks he can.

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RE: Left wing media. - 9/21/2006 12:33:47 PM   
NorthernGent


Posts: 8730
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Status: offline 		Many left-wingers aren't opposed to making a profit. They just believe in equul opportunity to make that profit and a reduction of privelege and elitism that swings heavily in the favour of a particular group. We all need incentive as a means of motivation regardless of which political ideology/party you identify with. The real difference is about whether or not you believe there should be a level playing field or a select group who take the piss.

Regards

_____________________________

I have the courage to be a coward - but not beyond my limits.

Sooner or later, the man who wins is the man who thinks he can.

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RE: Left wing media. - 9/21/2006 1:10:50 PM   
meatcleaver


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quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent

a left-wing Government with designs on social justice is really not in tune with their core interests. Equality = reduction of privelege (which the BBC enjoys).



The assumption that left wing governments are the only governments that are concerned with social justice is a nonsense. There are many ways to kill a pig and just because someone doesn't believe in your way doesn't make theirs invalid.

As for the BBC, what would you have it do, be a leftwing mouth piece? The fact that the BBC gets complaints from governments who set up enquiries to debunk the BBC says it is doing a reasonable job. The idea of a left wing government or a right wing government for that matter, singing the praises of the BBC makes me shudder. The times I get pissed with the BBC, I try to remember all the complaints it gets.

As for it being establishment, who do you suggest should run and fund it? Sky? The Worker's Revolutionary Party? Who?

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RE: Left wing media. - 9/21/2006 1:19:28 PM   
Amaros


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Status: offline 		I, for one, get better news from the BBC (radio mostly) than I do from American networks, who area all talking about the same thing, half the time, about some hollywood love affair - I have no idea what is going on in Iraq from one day to the next, because no networks ever show it.

The BBC by contrast, tends to have a lot of man on the street interviews, so I get an idea what's going on from somebody who lives there, and is there, every day.

I remember one notable interview, during the recent Liberian uprising, a phone interview with one of the leaders of the rebels forces, who was dodging bullets and pausing to exchange gunfire with Taylors forces in the middle of the interview, lol.

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RE: Left wing media. - 9/21/2006 1:33:20 PM   
NorthernGent


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Status: offline 		The assumption that left wing governments are the only governments that are concerned with social justice is a nonsense.
 
Well, ok then, as we're British let's take the British Conservative Governments as they have been at the fore of British political history. Examples of the past Conservative Governments' social justice will be useful here. Feel free to post them.

There are many ways to kill a pig and just because someone doesn't believe in your way doesn't make theirs invalid.

Why exactly are you making a big issue of my views and opinions when there is a board full of people with views and opinions? And, some people's ways are invalid - were Hitler's or Stalin's ways valid and, locally, are the Conservative policies of moving tax from business to goods valid when pensioners end up taking a share of this? It is bollocks to say everyone has a valid point of view because people are educated to different standards and, as a result, understanding varies. Are you saying that everyone, regardless of their opinions, has a valid viewpoint? BNP?

As for the BBC, what would you have it do, be a leftwing mouth piece? The fact that the BBC gets complaints from governments who set up enquiries to debunk the BBC says it is doing a reasonable job. The idea of a left wing government or a right wing government for that matter, singing the praises of the BBC makes me shudder. The times I get pissed with the BBC, I try to remember all the complaints it gets.
 
What exactly are you talking about? I never mentioned anyone singing the praises of the BBC - I was making the valid point that the people running BBC are from a certain background with certain values and these values are in tune with the establishment.

As for it being establishment, who do you suggest should run and fund it? Sky? The Worker's Revolutionary Party? Who?
 
Rather than attempt to push me down a road of defending a statement that the BBC is part of the establishment you need to post exactly what point you are trying to make instead of the emotive language hinting at something. Post your point clearly and concisely and then I'll answer.

Regards




_____________________________

I have the courage to be a coward - but not beyond my limits.

Sooner or later, the man who wins is the man who thinks he can.

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RE: Left wing media. - 9/21/2006 2:25:12 PM   
Kedicat


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Estring

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster

The media CAN'T be left-wing because the media in this country are run by corporations whose purpose is to make a profit.



Since when are left wingers opposed to making a profit? I think Hollywood is doing very well as far as profits go, and they are definitely left wing.



Good one. Yeah there are some very capitalist lefties. Hefty book prices to read impassioned left wing ideals seems a bit of an oxymoron. I notice few people selling ideals take a lower profit to do it.
A few businesses run by lefties do make extra efforts for their employees and such. But so do some rightwing ones.
Everybody has to eat. But your actions can match your ideals a bit more.
I like some of the high quality info and articles available almost free on the net. And the almost free to post them.

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RE: Left wing media. - 9/21/2006 2:26:20 PM   
SkatDomina


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Status: offline 		The BBC gets attacked by all political sides and long may that continue.

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RE: Left wing media. - 9/21/2006 2:30:19 PM   
Kedicat


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quote:

ORIGINAL: KenDckey

quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

US liberals aren't leftists, they are centrists. That is the perspective from here anyway. I have never heard anyone in Hollywood advocate leftwing policies. Not in the last 35 years or so and maybe more.


I tend to disagree fervently.   Wasn't it Richard Gere that advocated taking action against the soldiers sent to do the fighint?


I think Hollywood has a majority of liberal folks. But I wouldn't call the product they produce majority liberal or left. I separate the product from the people to enjoy it more.

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RE: Left wing media. - 9/21/2006 3:03:50 PM   
KenDckey


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kedicat

quote:

ORIGINAL: KenDckey

quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

US liberals aren't leftists, they are centrists. That is the perspective from here anyway. I have never heard anyone in Hollywood advocate leftwing policies. Not in the last 35 years or so and maybe more.


I tend to disagree fervently.   Wasn't it Richard Gere that advocated taking action against the soldiers sent to do the fighint?


I think Hollywood has a majority of liberal folks. But I wouldn't call the product they produce majority liberal or left. I separate the product from the people to enjoy it more.



I would still disagree but only because that I think it is human nature to produce something that closer agrees with one's beliefs.  that is like    I don't think John Wayne would ever play a nazi, nor would Richard Gere would make a good Patton.   I have never figured out Kurt Jergens.   He played lots of Nazi parts even though he was put in a Concentration camp for his beliefs.

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RE: Left wing media. - 9/21/2006 4:10:21 PM   
WyrdRich


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Status: offline 		       Bernard Goldberg wrote an excellent book on the subject called "Bias."  He makes the point that people in mass market media tend to become isolated in their points of view.  They all generally agree with each other and soon come to believe that what they all agree on is mainstream thought.

      It shows up on the screen.  They believe the audience shares the prejudices of their friends.  They get a little breathless or sneery in their tone sometimes, depending on what they believe  popular opinion dictates.  Depending on the viewers values, they could seem right, left, or dead in the middle on any subject.

  I find them leaning to leftist on social issues, blatantly biased in political coverage, and off in some scary ultra-right when it comes to the global economy and accumulation of corporate power. 

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RE: Left wing media. - 9/21/2006 4:11:44 PM   
Estring


Posts: 3314
Joined: 1/1/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kedicat

quote:

ORIGINAL: KenDckey

quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

US liberals aren't leftists, they are centrists. That is the perspective from here anyway. I have never heard anyone in Hollywood advocate leftwing policies. Not in the last 35 years or so and maybe more.


I tend to disagree fervently.   Wasn't it Richard Gere that advocated taking action against the soldiers sent to do the fighint?


I think Hollywood has a majority of liberal folks. But I wouldn't call the product they produce majority liberal or left. I separate the product from the people to enjoy it more.



Lol. What movies are you watching?

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RE: Left wing media. - 9/22/2006 1:10:53 AM   
Kedicat


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Joined: 3/13/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Estring

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kedicat

quote:

ORIGINAL: KenDckey

quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

US liberals aren't leftists, they are centrists. That is the perspective from here anyway. I have never heard anyone in Hollywood advocate leftwing policies. Not in the last 35 years or so and maybe more.


I tend to disagree fervently.   Wasn't it Richard Gere that advocated taking action against the soldiers sent to do the fighint?


I think Hollywood has a majority of liberal folks. But I wouldn't call the product they produce majority liberal or left. I separate the product from the people to enjoy it more.



Lol. What movies are you watching?


Hmmm Dirty Harry was such a pinko fairy. Rocky, Rambo, countless war movies, gangster flics, scifi. Hollywood is out to make a buck by providing entertainment. There is a huge range of types and some do have an idealism involved. But tons of em are just entertainment. I guess you could start disecting them to point out the undertones. But why spoil a good movie. Or waste the effort on a bad one.
I separate documentaries and docudramas from the lot. They often have slants.

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RE: Left wing media. - 9/22/2006 3:37:05 AM   
philosophy


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Status: offline 		"I have never figured out Kurt Jergens.   He played lots of Nazi parts even though he was put in a Concentration camp for his beliefs."

...being one of those theatrical type people, i can see how KJ might approach it. He may well feel that the stories needed to be told and that they wouldnt make sense without the nazis in them. Also it's always more fun to play the bad guy :)

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RE: Left wing media. - 9/22/2006 10:40:35 AM   
Lordandmaster


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Joined: 6/22/2004
Status: offline 		Laughing...yeah, Rambo, that bleeding-heart liberal latte-drinking Volvo-driving Northeastern American elitist left-wing pussy.

Of course you'd be fried alive if you ever suggested that Hollywood played up to RIGHT-WING stereotypes...

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kedicat

Rambo

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RE: Left wing media. - 9/22/2006 12:54:50 PM   
SirKenin


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From: Barrie, ON Canada
Status: offline 		Ok.  I will bite.  I AM a centrist.  I do not take a side in US politics and I am very cautious in Canadian politics.  Most of the people that argue politics in this forum like to THINK they are centrists, but they are leftwing.  In many cases I have seen, leftwing extremists.  Sorry, but there is nothing centrist about you.  If I was good with the stupid search engine I would give you examples, but unfortunately it gives Me every result but the ones I want.

The Dems in the US are not centrist.  Not even close.  If they did not lift their legs to pee on trees I would call them tree huggers.

The BBC is as close to centrist reporting as you are going to get.  The left will not see it that way because they do not side with them, but that is one phenomenal reporting agency.   I have a lot of respect for them.

Fox is very right wing, but you did not ask for that.

For left wing, you do in fact have Hollywood.  That is completely undeniable.  You also have CNN, NBC, CTV to name a few.  CNN is the worst offender of the bunch.  They continuously pitch the left.  They are sold out corporate trash, yet they wield an incredible amount of power.  HOWEVER.  They campaigned SO hard against Bush in both elections.  They did everything in their power to keep him from getting elected and they failed.  That must have been the ultimate kick in the balls for them.

That is probably part of the reason you campaign so hard against Bush in these forums.  You are completely misinformed.  You have no idea what is really going on because you have your eyes glued to the idiot box and sold out garbage that is only giving you one side of the story.  That is the biggest reason I do not get involved in your petty crap.  You think you are coming off as informed, but the reality is that I do not formulate an opinion based on your media, I base it on research.  The research never aligns with your point of view, and when it is presented to you you completely ignore it.

I am not at all surprised that you do not view your media as left wing.  It spoon feeds you what you want to hear.

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