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Humiliation - 1/18/2005 8:55:54 AM

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Hello: Just curious about the lifestyle..have heard a bit but not a great deal. Humiliation apparently can be a large part of the lifestyle? What are common forms of female humiliation???
Curious

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RE: Humiliation - 1/18/2005 9:25:18 AM

siamsa24

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Not to be horribly rude, but why?
According to what there is of your profile you are a submissive male, what does it matter what the forms of humiliation for females are?

(in reply to RL)

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RE: Humiliation - 1/18/2005 9:35:52 AM

MadameBette

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I feel when folks talk about humiliation play, they are sometimes talking about two different things.
One would be the obvious use of words and/or actions that embarrass the bottom or sub, which for them, is erotic, and that is the purpose, or goal of such activity.
The other type of humiliation play would be where the goal is submission.

Taken from my article – Humiliation Play, Part 2, on my website, http://www.madamebette-bdsm-info.com
“In a D/s relationship, one person is dominant, while one is submissive. The Dom is in a higher position because he has power, or control over the sub. Humiliation play, that is, putting someone in their place, being humbled, in an SSC manner, is a tool used to make her do things that she would not do for anyone else, to show her submission. It is the most important tool that a dominant has since submission is the most important …” Please go to the site and read about it and the accompaning articles.

Suggestions for play can be found on the Dom/sub Friends website.
http://www.domsubfriends.com/library/humiliation1.shtml#top

Hope this helps, and answers your question.

~ Bette

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RE: Humiliation - 1/18/2005 9:44:21 AM

BeachMystress

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quote:

ORIGINAL: siamsa24

Not to be horribly rude, but why?
According to what there is of your profile you are a submissive male, what does it matter what the forms of humiliation for females are?

I think this was a translation to English problem.. if you check his profile, he is Asian. I often find this odd way of phrasing things when speaking with people from an Asian culture. I think what he meant is what are the ways a woman can humiliate a male.

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RE: Humiliation - 1/18/2005 10:42:15 AM

INSIDEYOURMIND

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quote:

I think this was a translation to English problem..

I tend to agree with siamsa here, this is the same person that in very good English, told of a friend of his that was being abused, and questioned if they were submissive.

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RE: Humiliation - 1/18/2005 12:44:13 PM

sub4hire

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Form's of humiliation differ from individual to individual. So whatever embarrasses you, that is humiliation to you. It may not be for me, it very well could be something totally different for me.
So there is no one answer here.

(in reply to RL)

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RE: Humiliation - 1/18/2005 1:09:51 PM

harmony3709

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quote:

ORIGINAL: siamsa24

Not to be horribly rude, but why?
According to what there is of your profile you are a submissive male, what does it matter what the forms of humiliation for females are?

*shrugs*

I didn't realize we were limited to asking only questions specfically pertaining to what was listed on our profile. In fact, he even stated he was just curious.

As far as the topic.......I agree that humiliation is in the eye of the beholder.

harmony

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RE: Humiliation - 1/18/2005 1:17:57 PM

siamsa24

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It was more the fact that there is nothing at all in his profile. I get quite suspicious when people have nothing in their profile and then start asking questions like this with no context or reason. Maybe I've just run into too many people that ask questions like this for thier own pleasure, not knowledge.
Although it may be a translation problem or he could be seriously asking, I don't know. That's why I asked why.

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RE: Humiliation - 1/18/2005 1:22:19 PM

willing2serve

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I'm kind of jumping tracks here, but what makes some people harder to humiliate than others?

After looking at the list MadameBette provided there were only possibly 3 things listed that would humiliate me.

Respectfully,
Willing2serve

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RE: Humiliation - 1/18/2005 3:34:41 PM

domtimothy46176

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I think it's important to look at not only the meaning of humility but also what is implied by lack of humility. In a perfect world, I think we would all be humble to the degree that we recognize our human fallibility. I think each event that reinforces awareness of that fallibility is, by definition, humiliating.
Humiliation as it pertains to D/s is, IMO, no more than an exercise that serves to reinforce a submissive's awareness of the implications of her decision to surrender control. I think it neccessarily varies according to the areas of control she has surrendered, as well as her individual personality. What is humiliating for one submissive may have a completely different effect on another.
I think it is important to understand that there is a distinct difference between humiliation and degradation. Some may enjoy or even seek out degradation, many do not. Humiliation, on the other hand, is a natural part of D/s, IMO.
Timothy

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RE: Humiliation - 1/18/2005 5:38:07 PM

proudsub

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These threads might help:

humiliation and control

verbal humiliation

public humiliation

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RE: Humiliation - 1/18/2005 5:41:02 PM

ProtagonistLily

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quote:

I'm kind of jumping tracks here, but what makes some people harder to humiliate than others?

After looking at the list MadameBette provided there were only possibly 3 things listed that would humiliate me.

Respectfully,
Willing2serve

I think that a one size fits all approach to himiliation doesn't work. This lifestyle is about communication, and if you are listening to what a submissive is talking about in conversations, and probably ones not even based on humiliation, you can come up with some delicious humiliation play for that particular sub.

What humiliates one doesn't humiliate another.

Lily

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RE: Humiliation - 1/19/2005 4:58:51 AM

LadyAngelika

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quote:

I think that a one size fits all approach to himiliation doesn't work.

I agree. Humiliation is less an act for me and more a dynamic. You can't get to someone unless you get inside their head first.

- LA

< Message edited by LadyAngelika -- 1/19/2005 4:59:50 AM >

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RE: Humiliation - 1/19/2005 8:32:02 AM

willing2serve

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quote:

I think it is important to understand that there is a distinct difference between humiliation and degradation.

Very interesting, this made me look at things in a different perspective (AIN'T FORUMS GRAND..) So do you think too often degradation and humiliation are confused?

hmmm, could it be degradation is a belittling, lowering self esteem and humiliation is a lifting, knowing your place of which you belong and therefore can be endearing?

I do agree that you have to know someone very indepth to understand what would humiliate them.

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RE: Humiliation - 1/19/2005 7:44:31 PM

LadyAngelika

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quote:

ORIGINAL: willing2serve
hmmm, could it be degradation is a belittling, lowering self esteem and humiliation is a lifting, knowing your place of which you belong and therefore can be endearing?

Actually...

To humiliate (according to the definition people at www.m-w.com) is to reduce to a lower position in one's own eyes or others' eyes.

To degrade (same source) on the other hand is a) to lower in grade, rank, or status (see demote); b) to strip of rank or honors; c) to lower to an inferior or less effective level; d) to scale down in desirability or salability.

Humiliation can be an effective form of power exchange. It can also be just plain mean. It all depends on the intent and how it is done. It can have the effect of belittling such as what happens when one just bellows out a series of curse names at someone (of course making the Dom/me look like a potty mouthed moron). It can also have the effect of making someone feel safe in their place, what willing2serve describes as "knowing your place of which you belong and therefore can be endearing".

- LA

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RE: Humiliation - 1/19/2005 8:00:52 PM

ShadeDiva

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika
Humiliation can be an effective form of power exchange. It can also be just plain mean. It all depends on the intent and how it is done. It can have the effect of belittling such as what happens when one just bellows out a series of curse names at someone (of course making the Dom/me look like a potty mouthed moron). It can also have the effect of making someone feel safe in their place, what willing2serve describes as "knowing your place of which you belong and therefore can be endearing".

Well said, I'd concur completely.

~ShadeDiva

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RE: Humiliation - 1/20/2005 2:52:53 AM

Paulnz

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I had a girlfriend once who liked a scene where she would be sitting with her friends in a bar and I would just walk by, snap my fingers, and she would follow. Her friends would ask her " why did you go with him ? " For her it was so hot. For me, it was really easy to do.

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RE: Humiliation - 1/20/2005 5:57:59 AM

domtimothy46176

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

quote:

ORIGINAL: willing2serve
hmmm, could it be degradation is a belittling, lowering self esteem and humiliation is a lifting, knowing your place of which you belong and therefore can be endearing?

Actually...

To humiliate (according to the definition people at www.m-w.com) is to reduce to a lower position in one's own eyes or others' eyes.

To degrade (same source) on the other hand is a) to lower in grade, rank, or status (see demote); b) to strip of rank or honors; c) to lower to an inferior or less effective level; d) to scale down in desirability or salability.

Humiliation can be an effective form of power exchange. It can also be just plain mean. It all depends on the intent and how it is done. It can have the effect of belittling such as what happens when one just bellows out a series of curse names at someone (of course making the Dom/me look like a potty mouthed moron). It can also have the effect of making someone feel safe in their place, what willing2serve describes as "knowing your place of which you belong and therefore can be endearing".

- LA

I use dictionary.com when i'm working at the puter, mostly for spelling, although I keep a copy of Webster's Unabridged Dictionary of the English Language for more serious questions relating to meanings. dictionary.com has a couple of entries although the first is the better, IMO. It also corresponds almost closely to Webster.

hu·mil·i·ate ( P ) Pronunciation Key (hy-ml-t)
tr.v. hu·mil·i·at·ed, hu·mil·i·at·ing, hu·mil·i·ates
To lower the pride, dignity, or self-respect of. See Synonyms at degrade.

Webster stated:
to cause (a person) a painful loss of pride, self-respect or dignity; mortify

I employ this definition, specifically the mortification. For those who don't have ready access to Mr Webster, I'll share his definition.

mortification
3. the practice of asceticism by penitential discipline to overcome desire for sin and to strengthen the will

I don't believe that the process needs to physically painful to be effective. In truth, I believe that it is much more a process of helping my girl work through problems that arise from the conflict between how she wants to behave and how she has been conditioned to behave. I provide an environment that is designed to allow her to break that conditioning and develop new behaviors that are more in line with who she wants to be. In common parlance, we speak of self-respect and one's place when speaking of humiliation. I've observed more self-respect and pride in my girl when she is able to behave in accordance with her vision of submission.

I think the key to humiliation is to recognize it covers a lot of ground. It can be designed to hurt, to tear down or it can be a journey of learning to surrender in order to gain a deeper, more spiritual perspective. Viewed in one light, humiliation and degradation are, indeed, synonymous. Knowing how a partner interprets the words is a neccessary first step before agreeing to engage in it.

Timothy

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RE: Humiliation - 1/20/2005 6:30:25 AM

merrymasochist

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i have to say i'm wary of humiliation... i consider it a form of edge-play and think it needs to be treated as such... i know the general idea of edge-play usually involves something physically risky, i.e. fire, scalpels, asphyxia, but to me, humiliation holds a very real emotional risks and should only be done with proper knowledge, trust and caution... a slip of the knife can be treated with first-aid and will eventually heal and mayhaps leave a scar for the experience... what happens with the slip of an emotional knife? what's the first-aid for that sort of wound? and what of the scar afterwards, that can mar a lifetime rather than just skin?

just some things that came to my mind when i read your question...

thank you RL...

sincerely,
merry

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RE: Humiliation - 1/21/2005 4:18:37 AM

LadyAngelika

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quote:

ORIGINAL: merrymasochist

i have to say i'm wary of humiliation... i consider it a form of edge-play and think it needs to be treated as such... i know the general idea of edge-play usually involves something physically risky [...]

I'm in agreement with you. You never know what a can of worms you are opening when you start humiliation play with someone. That is why I stressed how important it was to know and understand someone before starting this kind of play. If we look at the example above, Timothy obviously has a good grasp on how this works with his girl.

So far, we've only talked about the submissives' perspective. But it affects the dominant partner too. Of course I'm always concerned about my submissive's emotional safety but I also have to be concerned about mine. There is probably a place or two way deep in my twisted sub-conscious that I have not tapped into and who knows what will happen if/when I do.

- LA

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