quote:

ORIGINAL: WhipTheHip

Professor Gary Kildall had a Ph.D. in computer science.  He was
a genius who wrote the first truly successful operating system for
micro-computers.  Bill Gates stole his OS, and called it MS-DOS.  
Gates then leased it to IBM, then leased it to the public. 
 
First of all, get your history correct:  Gary Kildall invented/created "CPM" which was a superior operating system to "MS-DOS" (which {MS-DOS} was purchased from Tim Patterson of Tukwila Washington (NOT Gary Kildall as you've stated) by Microsoft for approx. 50 grand)...by the way...it was called (by Tim Patterson) "QDOS" (which stood for "Quick and Dirty Operating System"). 
 
Tim sold it for a reasonable price which included in his signed contract a statement that clarified with no hesitation whatsoever that "Microsoft would sell this software to various companies, including but not limited to International Business Machines" (IBM), and he later sued for several million dollars for breach...and won (oddly).
 
When Gary Kildall came out with his own Intel 8088 compatible
OS, DR-DOS, Bill Gates instructed his employees to spread a
false rumor that it was not compatible with software written
MS-DOS.  Bill Gates put all his effort into addiing all kinds of
quirks and ineffeciencies into MS-DOS so programs written
for it would not work with DR-DOS.   
 
(I would have done no less). 

Bill Gates in clear violation of the Sherman Antitrust act told
all computer manufacturers that he would not sell them any
product including MS-DOS, if they offered any computer
with DR-DOS or any rival operating system.
 
Bill Gates then bought up second-rate computer applications
and ordered computer manufactures to give them away
free with their new computers.  He used his clout as sole
manufacturer of MS-DOS and latter Windows, to position
his second-rate computer applications as the de facto
business standard.    Word Perfect was better than Word,
Oracle and other spread sheet programs were better than
the one Bill Gates made the de facto standard.  And
Apple has always been a better computer than PCs. 
 
Emphasis..."was better".  Considering that Word perfect is still available (as is Lotus "Smart Suite")...both of which cost approx. 1/2 of what Microsoft offerings sell for...which should suggest to any right thinking person, knowing that they offer all Microsoft compatibility (in every aspect) that Microsoft isn't cornering the market....DOH!!!!
 
People think Bill Gates is a smart guy, when it was
mostly his lack of ethics that made him what he is.
 
Gary Kildall did not initially sue Bill Gates and IBM
because he feared the suit would be costly, and
every attorney told him he would pay more in
attorney fees, than he would collect from Bill Gates
and IBM even if he won.  No one at the time knew
how much MS-DOS would be worth, and that
includes Bill Gates.  It was not sweat off Bill Gate's
brow because whatever he made was sheer
profit, since he was licensing a program he didn't
own.
 
(GAWD you need to learn to write).
 
And of course he owned it...the record shows he purchased it, with a legal contract, and even major competitors now agree that computers today are easier to use thanks to Microsoft's efforts.

 
Even though the US court system found that Bill
Gates blantantly violated the Sherman Anti-trust
act for ten years, all they did was give him a slap
on the wrist.  The judge who actually heard the
case wanted to do a lot more, but higher judges
wouldn't let him do anything but slap Microsoft
on the wrist.

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhipTheHip
I posted this to twenty websites, and not a single person agreed with me.  They all
blasted me for trying to tarnish Bill Gate's reputation.   I say, "Look at the Wikipedia
entree for Bill Gates and Gary Kildall."  

quote:

ORIGINAL: pinkee

TY for that, WhiptheHip.  i used an Apple PC in my Masters in Tax Law program, and was totally computer-illerate at the time.  i remember well how user-friendly that computer and its software were.  i very much doubt i could have written my thesis on a Microsoft PC with its software, as it existed then.
 
When it was time for a new pc, i bit the bullet and bought a Dell, with Internet Explorer and Word, etc.  At the time, i was working for a law professor, whose PC was of course networked, and also Windows based.  It was not possible to "translate" from Apple to Microsoft, as far as i knew then, so i felt i had no choice.
 
Now i have Windows XP and am routinely dragged to the Microsoft site for downloads meant to "fix" little "bugs" in XP.  This has been going for five years.  For the life of me, i cannot understand why Microsoft released XP at all if it was so damned defective. 
 
BTW, i also agree with You about the results of the Anti-Trust case against Microsoft.  i am somewhat familiar with that area of law, and IMO, the proper remedy was, among other things, the disassemblage of the Microsoft Corp into baby corps, unrelated to one another. 
 
The Microsoft case only tended to show what i had come to believe from the insurance company fraud cases i had handled: if the violation of the law is egregious enough -- and i mean really flagrant -- and the defendant is wealthy, the penalty is inversely proportionate to the harm done.
 
pinkee

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhipTheHip

LTRsubNW wrote:
> First of all, get your history correct
 
First of all, I do have my history correct.  It is always the
ignoramuses that presume they must be right, and I must
be wrong.  (You are indeed incorrect...it is in fact the ignoramuses that most need historical correction).

> Gary Kildall invented/created "CPM" which was a superior
> operating system to "MS-DOS" (which {MS-DOS)
 
MS-DOS was Bill Gate's name for CP/M!!!! 

(I doubt that (and in fact history shows entirely to the contrary}, considering CP/M was a product manufactured by Gary Kildall (which, by the way, was not at all what Microsoft later purchased as MS-DOS), which was a product that IBM actually decided against, after several attempts to purchase it (even after Bill Gates twice told IBM {on two separate visits} "we don't do operating systems").
 
> was purchased from Tim Patterson of Tukwila Washington
> (NOT Gary Kildall as you've stated) by Microsoft for approx.
> 50 grand)...by the way...it was called (by Tim Patterson) "QDOS"
> (which stood for "Quick and Dirty Operating System").  
 
DUH!   Seattle Computer products built a computer around
the Intel 8088 chip, and needed an operating system for it.
 
(Actually, Seattle Computer never built a computer around anything, rather, they developed the operating system called "QDOS" around a computer called the "Altair", which they modified through code to "approximate" the 8088 chip {which by the way, Gary Kildall's web site, Tim Pattersons web site, Seattle Computer Products [old web site] and of course Microsofts web site all will attest}).
 
(You'd be advised to do your research in real time, as opposed to simply copying and pasting your "research" from Yahoo, which, by the way, anyone can verify by simply moving their cursor over your "research" and discovering the "Yahoo" logo when doing so).
 
Gary Kildall had the best one. (I agree, as does anyone else who not only does their own research...but...has cerebral accuity).   They asked Gary Kildall to
modify CP/M so it would run on the 8088 chip.  They didn't
offer Kildall enough, so Gary refused.  Seattle Computer
Products then asked one of their programmers to
illegally write a patch for Kildall's CP/M, so it would run
on Intel's 8088 chip.   This programmer's name was
Tim Paterson.  He called his modification of CP/M: "Q-DOS"
because it was a quick and dirty modification of CP/M. 

Anyone who thinks Tim Paterson could have writen Q-DOS
on his own has to be a nincompoop.  Tim Paterson was a
third-rate programmer whose programming abilities were
far from being able to write such a successful micro-computer
OS.    CP/M, Q-DOS, MS-DOS were due to the genius of
Gary Kildall and no one else.  And Gary got shafted.
 
It's really immaterial whether or not Mr. Patterson was a "nincompoop", what matters, from a historical standpoint is....he was the man who indeed generated the code that in fact became Q-DOS, which, by purchase, became MS-DOS.
 
Now, whether or not we can agree (which frankly I'm not competent to argue, and it would appear...neither are you) that Mr. Patterson was in fact capable of creating "Q-DOS", it would appear that history has carved his stone quite adequately...and he was indeed the man who the contract between the then nascent Microsoft and Mr. Patterson, was in fact written.
 
(I'll assume for the sake of this discussion that several attorneys and multiple judges were adequately served to determine who in fact not only Mr. Patterson was, but more importantly....that he was in fact the architect of the now debated and your argued MS-DOS). 

Tim Paterson did not have the right to modify CP/M. 
 
(Of course not...he had nothing to do with it whatsoever, CP/M was manufactured and engineered by Gary Kildall as you have so many times accurately suggested and it was neither "Q-DOS" or the later {argued, innacurately by you} "MS-DOS).

Whatever Tim Paterson did for Seattle Computer Products
belonged to Seattle Computer Products, not Tim Paterson,
because that is the way American law works.  What you
do for a company as a salaried employee of that company
belongs to the company not you.
 
Of course.  Naturally (see below).
 
So Tim Paterson selling Q-DOS to Bill Gates would be like
me selling you the Brooklyn Bridge.  Tim Paterson did
not own Q-DOS and neither did Seattle Computer Products (see above and below).
Dozens of top programers testified for Gary Kildall that
Q-DOS was simply an illegal clone of CP/M (no argument).  That Tim
Paterson copied CP/M code line for line (also no argument).  
 
Please explain to everyone here (accurately please) how Tim Pattersons decision to abscond with code from Gary Kildall and then sell it to Microsoft makes Microsoft the big bad corporate bully? 
 
(I'm missing something here).
 
When asked
to explain the purpose of various lines of code in Q-DOS
Tim Paterson could not do it, and Gary Kildall could.  In
the end, Tim Paterson admitted he had simply copied
CP/M line for line.   
 
(See above).

> Tim sold it for a reasonable price which included in his 
> signed contract a statement that clarified with no hesitation
> whatsoever that "Microsoft would sell this software to various
> companies, including but not limited to International Business
> Machines" (IBM), and he later sued for several million dollars
> for breach...and won (oddly).
 
You don't know what you are talking about.  Tim Paterson did
not own Q-DOS (You're correct, Seattle Computer Products did, which Tim Patterson was the legal liason for).  Bill Gates knew that (of course he did, which is why the legal documents named "Seattle Computer Products" as the legal entity, with Tim Patterson as the legal authority to sign for as the appropriate entity), that is why he also paid Seattle Computer Products for Q-DOS (I believe I already said that).  Gates also knew Seattle Products didn't own Q-DOS (in fact, they did, which is why the legal documents state as such), but he figured that by this point he
had so complicated the picture, that stupid Americans would
not be able to figure out what happened, and by the time they
did, it would be too late.
 
Well, "Stupid ..." is aptly put.  I'm afraid I can only suggest where that moniker would be best suited.

1973 "Gary Kildall developed CP/M, the first standard operating system for microcomputers. Appears Gary Kidall of Digital Research (appears to be a one man company) is the real originator of DOS. Died in 1994 See Gary Kildall Legacy
1973 Gary Kildall of Digital Research writes an Operating System in PL/M language. CP/M (Control Program/Monitor)
Note - See Digital Research for more on Gary Kidall .

1980 Quote: "MS-DOS was an imperfect copy of another operating system. CP/M by Digital Research. MS-DOS was essentially a clone of Digital Research CP/M version 1.4 ported to the Intel 8086/8 . SOC DOS (aka QDOS = "quick and dirty operating system") as it was initially called was written by Tim Paterson of Seattle Computer Products, a maker of an 8086 processor board for S-100 machines.
Quote: "The new operating system was purchased by Microsoft and licensed to IBM when Digital Research refused to sell all rights to CP/M-86 for a song. Microsoft and IBM subsequently managed to get Digital Research to drop its threat of a lawsuit about MS-DOS by agreeing to offer CP/M-86 as an alternative to IBM PC DOS and leave the choice to the customers. What they didn't tell Digital Research was that they were going to charge $240 for Digital Research product but only $40 for Microsoft's.

1980 The Seattle Computer DOS (Tim Patterson) SC-DOS was a clone of Kildall's CP/M 86??? (Tim Patterson went to work for Microsoft shortly after)

1980 Microsoft (over QDOS) sued by Seattle Computer Products (out of court settlement).
1981 Kildall of Digital Research called MS-DOS a rip off and that it contained some CP/M code.

1982 Gary Kildall sued Microsoft in 1982 over DOS and won, and right to clone MS-DOS.

1982 DOS -"Digital Research sued Microsoft & IBM (over copyright infringement) Quote: "Gary Kildall sat down at a fresh IBM PC, typed a few keystrokes & poped up a Digital Research copyright notice. This impressed the Judge. Digital Research won the case, monetary damages, and the right to clone MS-DOS. Microsoft won a gag order to make sure the public never heard about this case."

1982 Another story - Kidall (DR) considered suing Microsoft for copying all the CP/M system calls, program structure, and user interface. However Kidall (DR) knew it would also have to sue IBM. DR did not have the resources.
Note: Dvorak 1996 "a very early copy of MS-DOS that contained an easter egg that printed Gary Kildall's name. CP/M had the same easter egg."
See this link how Microsoft beat Gary Kidall to IBM.

1987 - Digital Research exercised its right to clone MS-DOS won by lawsuit (see 1982) and released DR-DOS
The success of DR DOS led to Novell acquiring Digital Research

[Mod Note:  multiple images removed]

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhipTheHip

The reason Apple fell on hard times was Bill Gates stole their Interface. 
Apple sued and won.  Apple recovered after Gates paid them off. 
 

quote:


I know both Word and Word Perfect, and Word Perfect is a
100 times better program. 
 

quote:



I don't hate Bill Gates.  I just think he is a crook who has seriously
hurt the development of computers...
 

quote:



Bill Gates sabatoge of DR-DOS is preserved in his personal e-mails
to top employees.   If you were to read those emails as I have done,
you would get a picture of a man who is mean-spirited, very petty,
and sees business like Hitler saw war.  
 

quote:



... Steve Jobs... made made the old fashioned way... earned it. 

quote:

ORIGINAL: pinkee

BTW, i also agree with You about the results of the Anti-Trust case against Microsoft.  i am somewhat familiar with that area of law, and IMO, the proper remedy was, among other things, the disassemblage of the Microsoft Corp into baby corps, unrelated to one another.