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Did it make who i am a lie? - 1/26/2005 8:24:20 AM   
Hislavegurl


Posts: 30
Joined: 11/15/2004
Status: offline 		Good Morning A/all:

After reading the message about owning two slaves/subs and all the replies, i decided i needed to ask a question and get a feel for what others think, perferably the Masters.

Suppose You had a friend who was a slave and she came to You with this scenerio what words would You then feed to her heart?

She was collared to a Master who was married to an alleged submissive. The slave accepted His collar based on the knowledge her Master presented to her. That the wife 'knew' about the slave, the relationship,etc. As time went on the slave moved in with the Master and His subby wife. The slave began to realize that the wife did not know the 'real' details of the relationship that the Master and slaved shared. The slave was extremely hurt when she found this out. She stayed for a time in the relationship, why? The slave felt that she had no recourse because she accepted His collar knowing that the only way out was to be released by the Master. The slave tried to over come the 'lie' she was living. For a time she pushed it way deep down inside of her heart trying to live like the lie didn't exist. As time progressed, the slave began to see that the wife was not submissive at all. At first the slave thought perhaps it was insecurity or jealousy leading her emotions, until the day when the Master said no the wife is not submissive but i am working on it. For the wife did declare she was submissive, but after they married, she decided she wasn't really submissive at all. The slaves' question to the Master friend is this....when if at all is it allright for the slave to seek release and if that release was not granted does the slave have a right to walk away? If she did walk away, would other Masters view her as not a slave at all? This is a real life story that happened and it is now about picking up the pieces and finding peace in ones heart, it's about helping the slave become whole again. i am not the slave this happened too, but the friend of the slave who is watching her struggle and i am trying to help her find her way.
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RE: Did it make who i am a lie? - 1/26/2005 8:39:13 AM   
Bigbossman4u


Posts: 116
Joined: 11/24/2004
Status: offline 		If the slave is facing a choice between her own mental well being and being worried about what other Masters will think of her... then it's a no brainer. Walk away! Far, far away! If other potential Masters are incapable of understanding the situation (if it is indeed so bleak as to make the slave want to relinquish the collar) then they aren't suitable to be her Master either.

The collar was given and recieved under the premise of a lie, IMO making it null and void to begin with.

Just my opinion of course... Others' mileage may and probably will vary.

best,
Joshua

_____________________________

"Egotism is the anesthetic which nature gives us to deaden the pain of being a fool." - Dr Herbert Schofield

(in reply to Hislavegurl)
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RE: Did it make who i am a lie? - 1/26/2005 8:51:45 AM   
Iamcynthia


Posts: 1
Joined: 11/2/2004
Status: offline 		IF she is a true "slave" in all it's meaning under these circumstances.. what others think of her is of no consequence.. the ONLY person who matters is her Master. If he is a good man.. a decent Master.. he will never let harm come to her in any way.

(in reply to Bigbossman4u)
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RE: Did it make who i am a lie? - 1/26/2005 9:06:06 AM   
Bigbossman4u


Posts: 116
Joined: 11/24/2004
Status: offline
quote:

If he is a good man.. a decent Master.. he will never let harm come to her in any way.


Hey cyn!!! {{hugs}}

.. but what if he's NOT? If he has been untruthful as described in the OP's description?? ...and he won't release her?

WWCD? <g>

xoxo,
Joshua

_____________________________

"Egotism is the anesthetic which nature gives us to deaden the pain of being a fool." - Dr Herbert Schofield

(in reply to Iamcynthia)
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RE: Did it make who i am a lie? - 1/26/2005 9:12:19 AM   
stef


Posts: 10215
Joined: 1/26/2004
Status: offline 		He's clearly not a decent "master" since he's been lying from the start. He doesn't deserve to own goldfish, much less a slave.

~stef

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Welcome to PoliticSpace! If you came here expecting meaningful BDSM discussions, boy are you in the wrong place.

"Hypocrisy has consequences"

(in reply to Iamcynthia)
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RE: Did it make who i am a lie? - 1/26/2005 9:25:56 AM   
ruffnecksbabygir


Posts: 412
Joined: 1/4/2005
Status: offline 		here's my $0.02

It just all depends...how does she really feel about Him? Is she able to go on with this situation and just stick it out no matter what? Is the wife harrassing her? i think she is the only one that can answer this and she would need to look deep inside her in order to decide for herself if she will be able and willing to continue living this way.

It sounds like she knew what she was getting into from the start, sure the wife may not be submissive as her Master told her originally, but so what, how does that affect her? i'd think that's her Master's problem to deal with, or not deal with.... i think the question here is whether she loves and trusts her Master enough to over come her feelings of betrayal by His initial lie... However if the only reason she is in this relatinship is because she is afraid of what other Master's might think of her later on because she asked to be released then personally i'd advise her to just ask release and go.... Life is way too short to be in a relationship you don't want to be in, no matter if it's Master/slave or vanilla...it's just not worth it.

good luck!


_____________________________

~hugs~
Babygirl

:Disclaimer: The above is only this slave's opinion:

"And Those Who Danced Were Thought To Be Quite Insane By Those Who Could Not Hear The Music" -- Angela Monet

(in reply to Bigbossman4u)
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RE: Did it make who i am a lie? - 1/26/2005 9:47:03 AM   
panthergoddess


Posts: 93
Joined: 1/11/2005
From: Bessemer City, NC USA
Status: offline 		Here's my take

If there were lies on the part of the Master, then he has shattered the trust of the slave. In this lifestyle trust and open honest communication are two of the MOST key components. How can you have a relationship (lifestyle or nilla) without trust.

The slave needs to assess for themselves whether the offenses of the Master are redeemable and if she may be able to regain the trust she once had in him and the relationship, or if it's gone beyond the point of no return. If it's redeemable, then open honest communication as well as working on the relationship on both parties will be in order. If not, then she should state the irrevocable emotional damage he's caused her by those actions and request her release. Emotional damage is just as palpable as physical damage and a Master's responsibility is to ensure over all safety of his slave. Which in this case was not done.

If the Master in question does not honor her requests for improving the relationship or outright release (depending on which way it goes), then she has every right to walk away, feeling no shame in doing so as the Master in question was unable to live up to keeping his slave safe.

_____________________________

"No good deed goes unpunished."

(in reply to Bigbossman4u)
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RE: Did it make who i am a lie? - 1/26/2005 9:50:20 AM   
TallDarkAndWitty


Posts: 1893
Joined: 6/12/2004
From: Rochester, NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Hislavegurl
The slaves' question to the Master friend is this....when if at all is it allright for the slave to seek release and if that release was not granted does the slave have a right to walk away? If she did walk away, would other Masters view her as not a slave at all?


Is this really a serious question? Seek release???

Slavery, at least in the United States is a figment of the imagination. This does not mean it isn't real to those who indulge in such figments, but there is no legal recourse for a slave who just decides to walk away.

As for what other Masters would think, a Master with any experience in the lifestyle would understand that the slave jumped into a situation without really understanding the details. Most would figure that she probably learned from the experience, and would most likely be a better, if more cautious, slave for the journey.

I love the lifestyle, but sometimes I wonder what planet these questions come from...

Taggard

_____________________________

A most rewarding compliment is an insult from the ill-informed.


My slave: Kat (RainaVerene on the other side) and her website: RainaVerene.com

(in reply to Hislavegurl)
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RE: Did it make who i am a lie? - 1/26/2005 10:04:52 AM   
darkinshadows


Posts: 4145
Joined: 6/2/2004
From: UK
Status: offline
This is a modern age. No 'slave' has to be released to leave. No law is made to make her stay. Any person may leave when they wish. She will not be wrong to leave if thats her decision - collar or no collar.

Form her perspective. She has to be true to herself and do what is best for her. If the relationship is not what she believed it would be... if the Dominant made her believe that she was entering a sub/slave/Dominant household and she has not. Then He has lied. Whether He was protecting her or not in His eyes... He still lied. How many more times will He lie? How many more times has He lied? The trust will be lost. Indeed, it has been lost and she feels failed and herself feels a failiure (which she isnt).

No Dominant worth her service will worry about why she left. They will be understandable shocked He has said such a blatent lie and accept her for what she is.

_____________________________
.dark.



...i surrender to gravity and the unknown...

(in reply to Hislavegurl)
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RE: Did it make who i am a lie? - 1/26/2005 10:55:07 AM   
ruffnecksbabygir


Posts: 412
Joined: 1/4/2005
Status: offline 		well, we all know that the Master would not have any real/legal rights to his slave, the slave is there by her own free will, when it comes down to it...however, if the person takes this lifestyle seriously and takes honor in her collar and in her relationship, the right thing to do would be to ask for release, as a vanilla marriage would seek divorced, of course, i don't think anyone would argue that the slave is able to just pick up and leave, whether it's honorable or not, no one is holding a gun to her head, or atleast i hope not, and making her stay in a relationship she wishes not to be in.

_____________________________

~hugs~
Babygirl

:Disclaimer: The above is only this slave's opinion:

"And Those Who Danced Were Thought To Be Quite Insane By Those Who Could Not Hear The Music" -- Angela Monet

(in reply to darkinshadows)
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RE: Did it make who i am a lie? - 1/26/2005 12:02:03 PM   
Cyis75


Posts: 164
Joined: 8/31/2004
From: Georgia
Status: offline 		Addressing the OP after reading the replies I couldn't seem to see anyone mention the fact that what we do is based on *CONSENT*. That consent is given and can be taken back at any time. In this situation I would think that the slave in question would have every right to want to be released afterall if he lied about that what else has he lied about. The master in question has already broken the trust between them and IMNSHO without trust you dont have anything.

As for whether other masters or anyone for that matter would look upon the slave asking to be released. Understandably opinions of others is important to us, but ultimately the only real opinion that matters to me is my own and the one(s) I'm involved with. I've had to deal with my fair share of slings from those without the full facts and made rash decisions based on those inaccuracies. I knew the truth myself as did those I was involved with and that's all that mattered to me.

(in reply to Hislavegurl)
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RE: Did it make who i am a lie? - 1/26/2005 1:37:27 PM   
darkinshadows


Posts: 4145
Joined: 6/2/2004
From: UK
Status: offline
quote:

the right thing to do would be to ask for release,


An interesting point. But the question is, if the agreement has already been broken, then so has the contract... therefore she does not need to 'ask' for anything? Its already occured. Its now the slaves decision on whether she can accept and move on in the relationship and work on her trust to build, or depart.

_____________________________
.dark.



...i surrender to gravity and the unknown...

(in reply to ruffnecksbabygir)
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RE: Did it make who i am a lie? - 1/26/2005 1:42:43 PM   
LdyAuburn


Posts: 179
Joined: 5/9/2004
Status: offline 		It appears that the slave wants to be 'true' to her beliefs even if the master hasnt been straightforwarded with his. Hers appears to be ' I will be slave regardless and will do the 'right' thing'
Probable she wants to feel good about herself if she leaves and that she has done all she can.
Yes there is no civil law that can keep her there, but a personal one makes it difficult
I agree with dark angel though if he has lied (which he appears to have done so)therefore his basis of the slave contract is void.
Good luck with the friend. Sounds like a tough choice

(in reply to darkinshadows)
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RE: Did it make who i am a lie? - 1/26/2005 1:57:49 PM   
match2u


Posts: 131
Joined: 11/15/2004
Status: offline 		Dear hislavegurl,

i posted a thread a few days ago also in this forum release of slavery....

and, yes like mentioned here before there is no law, no force who will be able to keep you in that situation, relationship - except your heart - your own feelings.

myself - honestly i am also asking myself - what happen if you are slave to a Master - and honesty is a main importance, you would like to be released and this will be denied of the Master and He also hold the access to Your money - would be for myself as a mother a big concern when i am not able to make sure my kid get the chance to move on with me.
therfor some things will be negotiated before a collar is taken or given - but at least if it starts out with a lie - is there any proove that all was negotiated before will be truthful?

kinda hard question......

be well and all my love to you

petra

(in reply to LdyAuburn)
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RE: Did it make who i am a lie? - 1/26/2005 4:19:10 PM   
Hislavegurl


Posts: 30
Joined: 11/15/2004
Status: offline 		Thanks to E/everyone for listening and offering up some great thoughts for me to pass along. Someone said it perfectly when they said:

"It appears that the slave wants to be 'true' to her beliefs even if the master hasnt been straightforwarded with his. Hers appears to be ' I will be slave regardless and will do the 'right' thing' Probable she wants to feel good about herself if she leaves and that she has done all she can."

The question isn't about legalities..and people saying they can't believe the questions some people ask!

The questionaire was seeking to find an internal answer. A collar may only a piece of paper or a material possesion, but what about enternal enslavement? What about being bound emotionally?

Again thanks to E/everyone for some great thoughts,

soft smiles,

Hislavegurl

(in reply to LdyAuburn)
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RE: Did it make who i am a lie? - 1/26/2005 4:29:16 PM   
MizSuz


Posts: 1881
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

The collar was given and recieved under the premise of a lie, IMO making it null and void to begin with.



If that is indeed the case then my answer is:

Hear Here!

_____________________________

“The more you love, the more you can love—and the more intensely you love. Nor is there any limit on how many you can love. If a person had time enough, he could love all of that majority who are decent and just.”
- Robert Heinlein

(in reply to Bigbossman4u)
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RE: Did it make who i am a lie? - 1/26/2005 5:57:10 PM   
proudsub


Posts: 6142
Joined: 1/31/2004
From: Washington
Status: offline
quote:

i posted a thread a few days ago also in this forum release of slavery....


Here it is:

release of slavery

_____________________________

proudsub

"Without goals you become what you were. With goals you become what you wish." .

"You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts"--Alan Greenspan


(in reply to match2u)
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RE: Did it make who i am a lie? - 1/26/2005 9:01:39 PM   
ShadowKnight


Posts: 40
Joined: 12/7/2004
From: Missoula, Montana
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Hislavegurl

Suppose You had a friend who was a slave and she came to You with this scenerio what words would You then feed to her heart?
...
The slaves' question to the Master friend is this....when if at all is it allright for the slave to seek release and if that release was not granted does the slave have a right to walk away? If she did walk away, would other Masters view her as not a slave at all? This is a real life story that happened and it is now about picking up the pieces and finding peace in ones heart, it's about helping the slave become whole again. i am not the slave this happened too, but the friend of the slave who is watching her struggle and i am trying to help her find her way.


Greetings,
Here is My take on this.

1. This Master lied on two counts to the slave. This shows dishonesty and a lack of honor. Honor and Honesty are needed for trust. If he has lied about those two things there are probably other numerous lies that she has just not found out about yet.

2. The slave is attempting to do the best she can in a bad situation. That being the case I applaud her for attempting to do the right thing.

3. Based on the dishonesty and the dishonor shown by the Master I do not think that the slave will be able to regain her initial trust of him which is what led her to beg the collar. This being the case I would counsel the girl to beg release and then if it wasn't granted then to remove the collar and leave.

Is that a book Gor answer? No. Is it a real world Gor answer? Yes. I am quite sure the girl understands that her slavery is consensual but given the fact that she is a slave who has gotten herself into a pickle she is trying to retain the most of her self respect possible.

Just My two tarn bits,

ShadowKnight



_____________________________

What is weightier than gold yet depresses no scale?

The collar is put on from without, but what it encircles comes from within. Slavery, true slavery, comes from within.

(in reply to Hislavegurl)
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RE: Did it make who i am a lie? - 1/26/2005 9:10:30 PM   
ProtagonistLily


Posts: 1222
Joined: 12/27/2004
Status: offline
quote:

The slave began to realize that the wife did not know the 'real' details of the relationship that the Master and slaved shared.


This is the sticking point for me in this story:

Are you saying this slave accepts a collar, proceeds to move into what has been described as a Poly home, and then realizes that the wife's vanilla and she's not this guys slave, just his wife?

So, my question is, how does this "Master" bring his "slave" into his home, under his wife's nose, and get away with it? I mean that's an extreamly unusual situation for someone who's trying to 'pull the wool over someone's eyes' to get away with.

Lily

_____________________________

"Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind"
~Dr. Seuss~

(in reply to Hislavegurl)
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RE: Did it make who i am a lie? - 1/27/2005 5:41:39 AM   
Hislavegurl


Posts: 30
Joined: 11/15/2004
Status: offline 		Hi Lily:

The wife knows that the girl is the husbands slave, but.....she thinks that there is no sex between the Master and slave. The wife thinks that they are just platonic and that the slave is just there to sit at the Masters feet. She does not know the truth about when they met and how. She does not know a lot of things. Quite honestly the wife is pretty 'gullible'. The wife is not submissive though she says that she is. All her actions or lackthereof show she is not submissive. The husband is just now admitting that the wife is not submissive. Regardless of what the wife is, my friend moved in under one pretense only to find out that there 'true' relationship must be kept secret. Thus of course my friend feels betrayed and not only that is she really being allowed to live as a slave? But ShadowKnight hit it right on in his response. Thanks again to E/everyone with all there insights and advice. Have a great day,

Hislavegurl

(in reply to ProtagonistLily)
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