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Najakcharmer -> RE: Dommes wanting too much respect (10/30/2006 10:07:23 AM)
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quote:
ORIGINAL: submit2one
Najak-not-very-charming-at-all,
You are letting your lack of experience show, young one.
*chuckle* The problem with the Internet is that you have no idea who you're talking to. You could be talking to a trained monkey for all that you know. In fact, sometimes I think that must surely be the case. [:D]
quote:
20 years ago, to be treated with respect by a submissive in a BDSM environment did not mean a sub would have to grovel at My feet, begging for My attention...it merely meant that treating Me with insults and or sarcasm would earn him swift discipline, whether at the hands of his own Domme or at the hands of the event Moderator or MC. Treating Me with respect could be an act as simple as a sub maintaining silence and lowering his eyes as I passed by. If you define protocol as "DS interaction" on that level, then yes, I expect it.
20 years ago I owned a dungeon, taught classes and workshops and organized events ranging from Munches to play parties to charity fundraisers. These days I go stealth, but there's a few folks on board who know who I am and what my history has been. I'm here to tell you that it simply wasn't like that, except within the confines of some very specific and much smaller subcultures. I visited those subcultures too, but even the folks who primarily lived there dropped the protocol when they went to the bigger mixed-energy events.
The reason that "protocol" didn't work at large community events was basically that there was no fucking way that a lesbian boi bottom would call a heterosexual male Master. Nor would the average het male subbie want to be addressing a gay top by his preferred title of Daddy. It wouldn't have sent the right signals. Plus all the lesbian Daddies, the drag queens (some of whom were dominant), transvestite subbies and other flavors of gender benders made it pretty well impossible to just slap a generic title on anybody if you didn't know them. The signals of top or bottom and also of gender and sexual orientation were not always perfectly clear on sight, and despite a flagging system in existence most people simply didn't use it. It was a big time social faux pas if you addressed a lesbian Daddy as Mistress or Ma'am, but on the other hand some women in the scene who looked butch were neither lesbian nor did they identify as Daddy or Sir. So by definition, being polite meant just offering normal adult courtesy until you actually knew someone on a more personal basis. Which just wasn't possible with everyone, given the size of our community events.
That is an accurate historical picture of BDSM community events from that era on the West Coast, and I stuck my nose often enough into East Coast events during the same era to say that it was pretty much the same story. I can think of several other folks on these boards right off the bat who were there too. Where were you?
quote:
It might have been a gathering at High Tea, it might have been a flogging demonstration, it might have been a CBT tutorial, or it might have been at a mixer or dinner that is commonly known today as a 'munch'. *rolls eyes and shivers at the very word 'munch'...egads*
The term "Munch" originated in the early 1990's in Palo Alto at Kirk's. Kirk's makes an awesome burger; I used to drop in on it. The founder of the original Palo Alto Munch attended my play parties. Munches didn't change anything about the social dynamics of our community; that casual "respect for everyone whether dom or sub" attitude already existed in all of the larger mixed-energy events where the gay, straight and genderbent groups came together to form a greater community. I did regular demos and tutorials during that era, both at my dungeon and at community functions, and I can guarantee that there was no "protocol" expected at those events beyond normal courtesy for everyone.
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Even Dommes treated Each Other with complete respect, something you would know nothing about.
It's nice to have fantasies about the Goode Olde Days, but they're not reality. Look back on some of the actual history of that era sometime; there have always been notorious catfights. For that matter those have been going on since the days of Oscar Wilde and the original Hellfire Club. I don't know where you were spending your time 20 years ago, but I don't think it was in the real life leather community that everyone else remembers.
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I am saddened for those who do not know, and who will never know, what it is to be treated with reverence by any and all submissives encountered at such functions. That was a grand feeling, and if it were not tied directly to My Dominant persona I probably would not have found it so intensely gratifying, but I did, and it was.
Been there done that didn't like it much. In-role events that were strictly for people of one set of sexual and D/s orientation did occur, though obviously they were smaller than the greater community events that brought us all together for purposes other than playing (eg, charity fundraisers that actually accomplished something). The submission of strangers is meaningless to me. They are not submitting to me personally, they are acting out a role for their own sexual and fetish gratification and I'm being used as a prop for their fantasies. No thank you. But to each their own. If you get your ego shored up or your personal fetishes tickled that way, more power to you, go find some consenting adult partners and do it. But it's no fair to expect everybody to play with you right off the bat. You do have to ask first, and some people may say no.
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Many years past, in times and in circles you cannot hope to ever understand or appreciate, one would never have replied with such blatant disdain for the opinion of One far more experienced than themselves, as you just have.
*chuckle* And how exactly did you imagine you knew what my experience level was? I think that "imagine" is definitely the key word here. [:D]
I'd be curious as to where you spent your time in leather 20 years ago. I doubt it was at any of the larger community events. Possibly some folks managed to survive that era with their fantasies intact by never sticking their noses outside their femdom-only or maledom-only or lesbian-only groups, but anyone who wanted to participate in the greater community projects and cooperative ventures learned pretty quickly that they had to respect lifestyles and subcultures that weren't the same as theirs. Eg, just because they were Madam Empress Goddess Domina Whoever in their own femdom group, they were not going to be kowtowed to by the leather Daddies and their boys. So they either settled for camaraderie and the companionship of brothers and sisters in leather, or they kept their heads in the sand in their local groups and didn't get to play with the bigger community.
I prefer comradeship and the brotherhood and sisterhood of leather, respecting people in our community for their achievements and their service to the community as a whole. Respect based on who spanks who is artificial at best. Real respect in our community is earned by deeds that benefit and honor us all. Take a look at what some of our titleholders are doing sometime to carry the torch, and ask yourself if maybe that's something more important to think about than their sexual or D/s orientation.
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