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is this common ???? - 11/8/2006 8:25:09 PM

mystique2003

Posts: 30
Joined: 8/27/2006
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How many other subs and/or slaves have seen or felt this. That many, not all mind you, Doms and Masters when they read about a female sub or slave who has " had a hard life" " been abused by someone" or has some other sob story, well they just seem to melt. I mean they just have to help that poor defenseless maiden. Even when others can see that this poor defenseless maiden is handing over a load of bs. I have seen this not only online but in real time too.

Why does it seem that the Dommes or Mistresses more often can see through this kind of smoke screen ? This has just been a observation i have made and wish to see if others have experienced it or seen it too.

Post #: 1

RE: is this common ???? - 11/8/2006 8:31:23 PM

RedSavageSlave

Posts: 733
Joined: 9/12/2006
Status: offline

I have not seen it myself..and I certainly dont see that Dommes or Mistresses are any more above that kind of behavior merely by the fact of being female.

People are people. We are all individual and deal with situations based on how we deem fit. Maybe some have a rescuer mentality..but others dont.

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RE: is this common ???? - 11/8/2006 8:44:29 PM

MasterFireMaam

Posts: 5587
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Charleston, WV
Status: offline

MANY people, not just kink people, have a Rescuer and Knight archetype functioning in their lives. Some simply have a huge need to be needed and their sense of self esteem comes from being the Rescuer or the Knight. Since het men are taught provide for their women, they get a charge out of being able to do so. A woman in need of rescue can be quite irresistable to a lot of men. Here's what Myss has to say about the Rescuer:

"Rescuer In its empowered profile, the Rescuer assists when needed and, once the rescue mission is accomplished, withdraws. A Rescuer provides an infusion of strength and support to help others to survive a difficult situation, crisis, or process that they lack the stamina or the inner knowledge to maneuver through themselves. Unlike the Knight, to which it is related, the Rescuer is more common among women, especially in its shadow aspect. The shadow Rescuer often surfaces through a romantic connection in which one party seeks to establish an intimate bond by lending emotional support, with a hidden agenda that assumes the rescued party will return the Rescuer's romantic feelings. Such romances are destined to fail, because the shadow agenda has to keep the "rescuee" in need of being rescued, lest the Rescuer lose her significance. Healing and empowering the Rescuer within is a common emotional challenge, because being needed is essential to our nature. Most people can relate in part to the characteristics of this archetype which somewhat parallel the Knight, Healer, Hero, and even Servant. If you feel drawn to this archetype, then, be careful to compare the characteristics of those others before deciding to add the Rescuer to your family."
And what she says about the Knight:

"Knight (see also Warrior, Rescuer) The Knight archetype is primarily associated with chivalry, courtly romance, protection of the Princess, and going to battle only for honorable causes. The Knight serves his King or Lord and so this archetype has spiritual overtones as well of service and devotion. Loyalty and self-sacrifice are the Knight's great virtues, along with a natural ability to get things done. The Black Knight donning dark armor and riding a black horse represents the shadow characteristics of this archetype, especially the absence of honor and chivalry. Somewhat like the Warrior, the shadow Knight manifests as loyalty to a questionable ruler or principle. In its negative aspect, the Knight can also, like the Rescuer, fall into a pattern of saving others but ignoring his own needs. A true Knight, like the Mystic, walks the fine line between self-sacrifice and self-neglect."
You can find the descriptions of a bunch more on her website.
Master Fire

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(in reply to mystique2003)

Post #: 3

RE: is this common ???? - 11/8/2006 8:47:35 PM

DiurnalVampire

Posts: 8125
Joined: 1/19/2006
From: Nashville, TN
Status: offline

The one thing I have noticed is that females in general do not fall a quickly for the maiden in distress act simply becasue we know often times its only looking for attention. Then again, I know I personally tend to be wary when anyone overexplains personal issues from their past to complete strangers. Male or female, putting a sob story out there for everyone is saying "look at me, feel bad for me, make me feel better" becasue typically, one in a situation like that would want it to be shared privately. Or at least I would have.

DV

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Snarko Ergo Sum
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VampiresLair

(in reply to RedSavageSlave)

Post #: 4

RE: is this common ???? - 11/8/2006 9:12:19 PM

LuckyAlbatross

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http://www.collarchat.com/m_118804/mpage_1/key_knight/tm.htm#118804
"White Knight Syndrome"

http://www.collarchat.com/m_537169/mpage_1/key_knight/tm.htm#537169
Knight in shining armor

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Post #: 5

RE: is this common ???? - 11/8/2006 9:51:34 PM

babysburnin

Posts: 421
Joined: 2/16/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mystique2003

Why does it seem that the Dommes or Mistresses more often can see through this kind of smoke screen ? This has just been a observation i have made and wish to see if others have experienced it or seen it too.

I think it's two things - First, many men have that "I will fix it" mentality, and what better to feed their provider/protector side than a women who they can help or heal? Many women have the "rescue me" mentality, and seek out men that want to rescue them (so to speak).

Second, most women are just more aware/sensitive of other people's feelings. Not to mention that women are typically more "clever" in manupulating others' emotions - so also more clever in recognizing when it is being done by another.

(Don't give me a hard time ... It's true.)

_____________________________

-Babysburnin

"Love is, above all else, the gift of oneself."
- Jean Anouilh

"The highest proof of virtue is to possess boundless power without abusing it."
- Lord Macaulay

(in reply to mystique2003)

Post #: 6

RE: is this common ???? - 11/9/2006 5:35:09 AM

jimbo747

Posts: 109
Joined: 10/6/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: babysburnin

quote:

ORIGINAL: mystique2003

Why does it seem that the Dommes or Mistresses more often can see through this kind of smoke screen ? This has just been a observation i have made and wish to see if others have experienced it or seen it too.

I think it's two things - First, many men have that "I will fix it" mentality, and what better to feed their provider/protector side than a women who they can help or heal? Many women have the "rescue me" mentality, and seek out men that want to rescue them (so to speak).

Second, most women are just more aware/sensitive of other people's feelings. Not to mention that women are typically more "clever" in manupulating others' emotions - so also more clever in recognizing when it is being done by another.

(Don't give me a hard time ... It's true.)

You hit the nail on the head

(in reply to babysburnin)

Post #: 7

RE: is this common ???? - 11/9/2006 6:10:10 AM

mnottertail

Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline

Stop by the house, I'll beat the shit outta ya, I don't give a fiddlers fuck what you been thru, you ain't seen nothin' yet.

We are not all the same.

LOL,
Ron

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30

(in reply to mystique2003)

Post #: 8

RE: is this common ???? - 11/9/2006 7:06:39 AM

CrazyC

Posts: 949
Joined: 9/28/2006
Status: offline

It really depends on the situation. Hearing it over the boards makes me wonder, since many are people you don't know well.

in day to day life, i know i never really want help and i never ask for help, but the minute i mention something going wrong in my life there is always some guy wanting to help. Trust me...they aren't always helpful. i was always tought though to let them make their own mistakes without nagging. Am i looking for my white knight because they just come? And i have to admit, at times it actually works to thier benefit.

< Message edited by CrazyC -- 11/9/2006 7:10:34 AM >

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Post #: 9

RE: is this common ???? - 11/9/2006 7:12:21 AM

mistoferin

Posts: 8284
Joined: 10/27/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: babysburnin
I think it's two things - First, many men have that "I will fix it" mentality, and what better to feed their provider/protector side than a women who they can help or heal? Many women have the "rescue me" mentality, and seek out men that want to rescue them (so to speak).

Second, most women are just more aware/sensitive of other people's feelings. Not to mention that women are typically more "clever" in manupulating others' emotions - so also more clever in recognizing when it is being done by another.

(Don't give me a hard time ... It's true.)

I think you're pretty close to the mark. I would also add that women tend to judge others by their own experiences. Most of us as women have been in bad situations at some point, possibly victims of some type of abuse at some point or just down on our luck. If we have managed to make it through and rise above it without having to rely upon some White Knight, then it is hard to look at someone else going "Poor me, save me!" without thinking "Girl, pick yourself up, go wash those tears off your face, roll up your sleeves, get to work on it and get over it".

< Message edited by mistoferin -- 11/9/2006 7:16:41 AM >

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(in reply to babysburnin)

Post #: 10

RE: is this common ???? - 11/9/2006 7:23:59 AM

Legman1

Posts: 25
Joined: 8/3/2006
Status: offline

I've felt this before. That urge to "rescue" to "fix it" can be pretty strong at times. I hope I've learned though thats it's a futile excersize if the "damsel in distress" ultimately wont allow the rescue. Often they are down the road shortly after any skeptisism is shown to them. Not interested in being rescued or actually fixing they're shit but rather being the martyr and getting attention.

(in reply to mnottertail)

Post #: 11

RE: is this common ???? - 11/9/2006 8:18:41 AM

Slaveboiz

Posts: 38
Joined: 4/19/2005
Status: offline

Why does it seem that the Dommes or Mistresses more often can see through this kind of smoke screen ? This has just been a observation i have made and wish to see if others have experienced it or seen it too.

I see this as a two part issue;

One there are those Doms and Dommes both that have what I call a savior complex. Thinking, that if I take him or her on I can make their life better or I can fix them. I don’t see this as an issue, I think we all hope that our presence in someone’s life could make it better. Where it seems to take on faulty reasoning is when there is no expectation that the sub/slave will take personal responsibility for working on those issues that arise from a painful past. The Dom or Domme feels they have the power to change them into what they want them or see they could be. In addition those Dommes and Doms that take on such a project tend to later on find themselves in a quagmire (sp?) they have taken this sub on and now can’t get rid of them. I recommend choosing wisely the pet projects you take on as it may bite you in the ass.

I do realize that a lot of people I have come in contact with in the scene have painful pasts and they find the lifestyle a place where they are accepted and yes can have the ability to work through such issues as trust and self esteem. But again the responsibility has to be on the individual to make those changes.

If we were to make the distinction between male and female Doms I would say that women tend to have heightened intuition about when other women are running down some BS sad story… “no one knows a woman like a woman”

Warmest regards
Slave ziggy

(in reply to mystique2003)

Post #: 12

RE: is this common ???? - 11/9/2006 8:56:49 AM

juliaoceania

Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mystique2003

How many other subs and/or slaves have seen or felt this. That many, not all mind you, Doms and Masters when they read about a female sub or slave who has " had a hard life" " been abused by someone" or has some other sob story, well they just seem to melt. I mean they just have to help that poor defenseless maiden. Even when others can see that this poor defenseless maiden is handing over a load of bs. I have seen this not only online but in real time too.

Why does it seem that the Dommes or Mistresses more often can see through this kind of smoke screen ? This has just been a observation i have made and wish to see if others have experienced it or seen it too.

I would say that people that do this damsel in distress thing are often codependent. It is not from a healthy place they do the rescuing. I have known many men like this, doms excluded, that pick up strays to "fix" them. What usually happens is the rescuee uses them and was never a victim at all. It is a grifter game, a con job, and men often fall for it because it makes them feel powerful and needed... that is quite an enticement.

These sorts I am not attracted to because I am looking for someone that wants a whole woman, not half a woman. I want someone that feels complete within themselves. Life is hard enough without being a victim all the time to entice my mate.

< Message edited by juliaoceania -- 11/9/2006 8:57:36 AM >

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Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

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(in reply to mystique2003)

Post #: 13

RE: is this common ???? - 11/9/2006 9:51:03 AM

CrazyC

Posts: 949
Joined: 9/28/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

I would say that people that do this damsel in distress thing are often codependent. It is not from a healthy place they do the rescuing. I have known many men like this, doms excluded, that pick up strays to "fix" them. What usually happens is the rescuee uses them and was never a victim at all. It is a grifter game, a con job, and men often fall for it because it makes them feel powerful and needed... that is quite an enticement.

These sorts I am not attracted to because I am looking for someone that wants a whole woman, not half a woman. I want someone that feels complete within themselves. Life is hard enough without being a victim all the time to entice my mate.

Completely agree! That is why you should always run if they think they can "save" you. lol

_____________________________

"You never lose by loving. You always lose by holding back." Barbara De Angelis

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Post #: 14

RE: is this common ???? - 11/9/2006 12:43:17 PM

Celeste43

Posts: 3066
Joined: 2/4/2006
From: NYS
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin

I think you're pretty close to the mark. I would also add that women tend to judge others by their own experiences. Most of us as women have been in bad situations at some point, possibly victims of some type of abuse at some point or just down on our luck. If we have managed to make it through and rise above it without having to rely upon some White Knight, then it is hard to look at someone else going "Poor me, save me!" without thinking "Girl, pick yourself up, go wash those tears off your face, roll up your sleeves, get to work on it and get over it".

I think this is it. But it isn't just women who do it, we simply apply it more often to emotional situations. I know a woman who is very kind and caring but doesn't believe that depression or other mood disorders exist. She is very hard on those who have them because she herself has always made it through hard times and therefore cannot believe that someone else can't. Instead she blames the parents for poor parenting if the minor is so ill. It's a blind spot.

Now, he will always stop and help a woman of any age change a flat but he won't stop for a man unless he's elderly or using a cane. He believes that men should be able to change their own tires despite knowing that there are men with heart conditions or arthritis who simply cannot. Also a blind spot.

But I wonder if jealousy and/or envy don't sometimes enter into it. If we aren't harsher on someone who is with a good partner when we can't find anyone, wouldn't we then be more likely to seek flaws in them and claim they are playing helpless instead of admitting that this woman does have a real problem in one area and has sought a partner to help her with it?

(in reply to mistoferin)

Post #: 15

RE: is this common ???? - 11/9/2006 6:56:54 PM

babysburnin

Posts: 421
Joined: 2/16/2006
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This is off-topic, but Juliaoceania - your new pic is great!

Have you been working out?

You go girl!

_____________________________

-Babysburnin

"Love is, above all else, the gift of oneself."
- Jean Anouilh

"The highest proof of virtue is to possess boundless power without abusing it."
- Lord Macaulay

(in reply to juliaoceania)

Post #: 16

RE: is this common ???? - 11/9/2006 7:30:29 PM

juliaoceania

Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: babysburnin

This is off-topic, but Juliaoceania - your new pic is great!

Have you been working out? You go girl!

Thanks, and that pic is a year old, and i need to lose a little weight to get back to that.. thanks for the compliments

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to babysburnin)

Post #: 17

RE: is this common ???? - 11/9/2006 7:53:15 PM

Kalira

Posts: 954
Joined: 10/9/2006
From: Fort Wayne Indiana
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Stop by the house, I'll beat the shit outta ya, I don't give a fiddlers fuck what you been thru, you ain't seen nothin' yet.

We are not all the same.

LOL,
Ron

Thats the line that Master uses also lol.

_____________________________

Facilius Per Partes In Cognitionem Totius Adducimur
We are more easily led part by part to an understanding of the whole.
Seneca

Damnant Quod Non Intellegunt

(in reply to mnottertail)

Post #: 18

RE: is this common ???? - 11/10/2006 3:09:21 PM

Squeakers

Posts: 489
Joined: 10/3/2006
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     Although, I tend to agree that sometimes there is an over abundance of sob stories on the internet but it's not limited to women but also men.   Because the internet is so impersonal one can come on express their feelings, tell their stories but keep their identity private to an extent.   Often times it is difficult to express ourselves face to face and for some people the internet serves as a sounding board.
    In some cases I really feel that abuse can cause a persons submissive traits.   Is this a bad thing? No, not always. But I do feel that any sort of abuse can affect a relationship and in order for two people to have and maintain a healthy relationship abuse must be disclosed.
     Sometimes, I do feel that people will tend to use the 'sob stories' as an attention getter and any relationship based completely on need (need for attention or need to be the 'white knight') is probably going to fail.   But again at some point disclosure has to happen if there is a problem and if the male Dom feels that this submissive is worth his time and effort, who am I to question him.

(in reply to Kalira)

Post #: 19

RE: is this common ???? - 11/10/2006 3:27:34 PM

onlythewindknows

Posts: 259
Joined: 10/22/2006
Status: offline

my 2 cents of advice to those w/the urge to "rescue"

look to how much a person can speak in the positive despite traumatic events.
as in: ""hey, my husband ran off with all my money and his personal assistant BUT
my gosh i am really learning to enjoy my free time and the simplicity of life." (and NOT said sarcasticlly)

or at least look to see if sobbster asks how YOU are doing at any point.

only then they might actually be worth the effort

_____________________________

As Darth once said: "you are beaten. It is useless to resist."

(in reply to Squeakers)

Post #: 20

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