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Sending Your Kids Off To College - 12/3/2006 8:14:30 PM

juliaoceania

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From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
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Since this is about adult children and not the unmentionable kind I thought it would not be against the TOS to bring up this topic...

Another thread got me to thinking about this, if you have kids, do you encourage them to go on to college? Do you think college is a waste of time? On another thread there seemed to be a lot of dismissiveness about those who go to college and whether or not their education has intrinsic value in their life, so I wondered whether people feel it is important to have a college education for their children. I know that when push comes to shove we want our children to have the best chance in life, so I wonder if those that think that a degree is "just a piece of paper" feel that way when it comes to their own children? Just curious.

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Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

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RE: Sending Your Kids Off To College - 12/3/2006 8:27:28 PM

ownedgirlie

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I didn't see a lot of dismissiveness about college; I saw testimonies from those who did not feel it made a difference to them.

I wanted to go to college. It was neither encouraged nor discouraged. I was told if I wanted it badly enough I would do it on my own. My late father, an Annapolis graduate and Naval officer, retired as a senior reconnaissance analyst for a large organization which contracted with the white house. He would have found some of the statements in that other thread about military experience to be rather amusing.

I wasn't particularly supported in my desire to go to school. And after I was married, it was not possible for reasons I won't get into here. I am going now for my own sense of accomplishment, and to finish a goal of mine, and because my Master ordered me to, lol.

Of my siblings who have youngsters, some have supported their kids financially through college and the others started college funds for them right away. All my siblings, however, have said it is up to their kids as to whether or not they want to go to school - they will encourage it but not push it. If I had been fortunate enough to have children, I would encourage a higher education as well.

(in reply to juliaoceania)

Post #: 2

RE: Sending Your Kids Off To College - 12/3/2006 8:35:52 PM

juliaoceania

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From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
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Well we could quibble about being dismissive, but saying that research skills are not valuable, a degree is just a piece of paper, that the only place a professor can work is in a college, that military people are more capable than young people that went to college, all seem rather dismissive to me, but that is just my opinion.

As for the rest of your post, thanks for sharing your experiences. My parents had some education in finance and real estate, but they did not have degrees. I am the first in my family to go to school, although my siblings are all at least as intelligent if not more so than me

. I went back because I could not physically continue in the only job I knew how to do that would support my son and myself, which was serving. I have found an entire world that has opened up for me with my education.

I do a little more than encourage my son, I have told him I will give him a place to live all through school if he goes to college, if not he can do his own thing and I will not support him. He will need to pay me rent or move out. Knowing my own experiences in life, education these days is crucial to even getting a foot in the door, as compared to when we were younger, it just was not as important.

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to ownedgirlie)

Post #: 3

RE: Sending Your Kids Off To College - 12/3/2006 8:51:16 PM

ownedgirlie

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Thanks for your reply, Julia. And I agree there was dismissiveness, I just did not see it as an overwhelming opinion. But no matter :)

I guess I have seen both sides of the coin. My father was quite educated, as were the members of his family. My mother grew up in post civil war Spain and her family was poverty stricken. One of my uncles moved here and with no education whatsoever, started his own business and supported his family on it, picking up lots of real estate in the process. This is why I see the imnportance of one's drive and attitude as quite important as well. Of his two daughters, one got a degree with a 4.0 gpa and owns her own business, the other is one of the most passionate, artisitic, beautiful and non scholastic people I know, and works from home raising two brilliant little ones.

I applaud you for what you are going to provide your son, just as I applaud my siblings for doing what they are doing. I wished I had that opportunity, but I didn't. I agree with you that more and more an education is needed to get one's foot in the door. My Master has 2 bachelors and a PhD, and his adult kids are also highly educated. Sometimes I feel intellectually clumsy around him when we discuss certain topics. I find myself researching subjects on my own just to keep up with him! But I digress, and do not mean to hijack your thread... :)

(in reply to juliaoceania)

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RE: Sending Your Kids Off To College - 12/3/2006 11:25:52 PM

proudsub

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Joined: 1/31/2004
From: Washington
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quote:

so I wonder if those that think that a degree is "just a piece of paper" feel that way when it comes to their own children? Just curious.

I think college is extremely important if you want a successful career. My older daughter has her phd and is a professor, and my younger daughter has her masters and occupational therapy license. It's such a relief to know they both have excellent careers.

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proudsub

"Without goals you become what you were. With goals you become what you wish." .

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(in reply to juliaoceania)

Post #: 5

RE: Sending Your Kids Off To College - 12/3/2006 11:50:45 PM

hisannabelle

Posts: 1992
Joined: 12/3/2006
From: Tallahassee, FL, USA
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since i don't have kids, and i was recently "sent off to college" (well, actually it went more like YOU MUST GO TO COLLEGE BUT STAY HOME!!!! - so we compromised - i'm at college in my hometown, but living on my own) i'll speak from my experience as the bird freefalling from the nest.

college was always required. my sister did not go to college originally, and didn't go back until after she had two kids, and still hasn't completed her degree after about 5 or 6 years. i was the kid who Had To Do Well in School. my mom's philosophy on education was, "you're going to college, and i'm not paying for it, so you better make good grades so you can get a full ride." my dad always talked about how my sister wasted her life by not going to college and by having children out of wedlock, so although he never expressly said that college was required, i imagine i would've gotten an earful about what a life-wasting disappointment i was if i didn't go to college.

i did NOT want to stay in florida, especially not in tallahassee, so fsu was the only school i applied to that wasn't out of state, and it was my backup school. i got into my first choice (naropa university in boulder) but they didn't want to pay for anything, and fsu pays my tuition and almost all of my rent, so guess which university won out? once i started going here i really did fall in love with it (though i don't plan to stay in florida or do grad work here).

i LOVE school, especially university. i busted my ass getting out of high school a year early because i was so eager to get here. the world sort of crashing down around my ears has definitely affected my performance and made my expectations of myself much more realistic than they were when i started, but i cannot imagine not being in school. actually, i can, and it's a pretty dim picture. after my fibromyalgia diagnosis (which was just the cherry on the top of the sundae of health problems and craziness), my aunt offered to let me move in with her and told me i should quit school, because i'm working full time to be able to stay in school full time. but honestly? i couldn't stand NOT being in school. i would hate it. i'm lucky now in that i'm studying what i want to study, so even when work sucks, i still get up and get to do something i like to do almost every day. it's not easy, but it's where i want to be, and i'm happy with it. and i plan on going to grad school, so i'll be doing it for a very long time, and then i want to teach, so i'll pretty much be here forever.

the degree doesn't matter to me so much - it's the fact that i need it to reach my goal (becoming a professor), and the fun i'm having getting it, that matters. so i guess you could say it IS just a piece of paper. but the actual experience of a college education is definitely not a token experience for me, or something i take lightly - and i think it's really important and valuable. i don't plan on procreating, but if i do, i'll encourage (not require) my kids to go to college.

(in reply to proudsub)

Post #: 6

RE: Sending Your Kids Off To College - 12/4/2006 12:58:22 AM

adaddysgirl

Posts: 1093
Joined: 3/2/2004
From: Syracuse, NY
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quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

I do a little more than encourage my son, I have told him I will give him a place to live all through school if he goes to college, if not he can do his own thing and I will not support him. He will need to pay me rent or move out. Knowing my own experiences in life, education these days is crucial to even getting a foot in the door, as compared to when we were younger, it just was not as important.

julia,

i live in a small town and have four brothers but only one who went to college, and he never got a degree. Funny thing is, as my father's only daughter, he pushed me into college....and in 1979, with a child myself, i ended up getting a 2 yr degree (which was good then) in criminal justice (actually, my father was a local cop and kinda pushed me that way). Back then, that little stinkin' 2 yr degree got me a lot.....and i now have 20 yrs in with NY state as an investigator. Who would've thought?

Now fast forward......my oldest daughter knew that she wanted to be a doctor (of some sort) before she even got into high school. In any event, with little influence from me, she went on to college, 2 yrs here, a Masters from Syracuse Univ, then onto chiropractic school. She is now a chiropractor in Buffalo, NY. How much luckier could i get?

my oldest son.....never, ever seemed like 'college material'. He was lucky he went to school. At 16, and while in school, he got a part time job at a local grocery store as a cart pusher (or cart associate, as he called it...lol). But he had no idea what he wanted to do upon graduation. i said ' You are either going to college or into the service'.....because otherwise, in 30 years, around here, you might be 'head cart pusher' at Tops. Whoop-de-doo! He ended up going into the service in 1999, chose the Marines himself, and is now a Sgt there. He is now taking college courses because as he says, he sees the benefit to it.

Now we come to this last one at home. He is 18 and in college here. i told him the same as i told my other two.....and basically what you told your son.

Do i think a 'degree' matters? Abso-fucking-lutely! Where i live, without a degree, you can get a job at McDonalds, at Walmart, at a grocery store, or in a factory. Period.

i have 2 cousins my age. Neither have any college. One has worked in a factory for 20 years.....she lives paycheck to paycheck. The other has worked for the county for 20 years.....not good pay, but good retirement. They both borrow money from me, on a regular basis, but do pay it back. Neither will have any more than they have now.

i did go on more than i thought here but my point, in reference to your post, is this. Do i think a college degree is important in this day and age? Absolutely! Have others been successful without it? Sure! But i would neither encourage my kids (nor my grandkids that are now on their way) to not get an education. That's all.

DG

(in reply to juliaoceania)

Post #: 7

RE: Sending Your Kids Off To College - 12/4/2006 1:51:34 AM

meatcleaver

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Joined: 3/13/2006
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I'll encourage my daughter to do what she wants to do. I'm just making sure she gets a good education up to 18, after which I'll only have influence over her but no legal hold. I've got two degrees and a Masters and I've got a brother and sister who have absolutely no qualifications but either can buy and sell me ten times over so I don't really have personal experience in the family of college providing a materially better life style.

My daughter can already speak four languages and wants to be a designer (but doesn't know what she wants to design duh! but I guess that will come) and live and work in Japan awhile where she has a half sister. I have a friend who has design business who never studied design who is impressed with her creativity said she can have work experience in his company if she wants. If she doesn't I have an investment for her to use to see her through university or to start her own small business.

However, I am not pushing, she has to be hungry and want to do what she chooses but I'm happy to give her a start I never had and if college is what she wants and can get accepted on a course then fine.

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(in reply to juliaoceania)

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RE: Sending Your Kids Off To College - 12/4/2006 3:10:20 AM

agirl

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I am in two minds about this......I'd have LIKED all of my children to have been academic, studious and to have also had *application*, simply because it would give them a decent springboard but they are all VERY different.

As far as I'm concerned, it's pointless to push a child that isn't academically bent and lacks drive, into further education of an academic kind. There are lots of vocational courses and paths.

Two of my children would never have made it through A Levels, let alone a degree course. The other two are both academically bent, study hard, enjoy the whole process, do exceptionally well in school and are aiming for a university education. I don't expend energy pushing things that *I* might want for them, unless they are receptive to that and want it too.

I think that encouraging your children to discover the skills and talents they have, whatever they are, is the most important thing. Further education isn't the *best* path for all children.

When it comes down to what matters, to me.......it's that they have a sense of accomplishment in whatever they do and that they are nice people.

So, no.........I wouldn't encourage them to go on to further education unless they were capable of making the most of it and want it too, at the time. I'd encourage them to find SOMETHING that suits them, whatever that may be.

agirl

(in reply to juliaoceania)

Post #: 9

RE: Sending Your Kids Off To College - 12/4/2006 3:40:59 AM

LadyEllen

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From: Stourport-England
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On the other thread, I already mentioned that my son isnt cut out for academia - but if he wants to do university, then I will back him. Equally, my daughter looks set to excel academically, but if she doesnt want university, then I wont push her.

Whats important is that they each know what they want to do, and get support in doing it. As some will know, I never got that sort of support, and I'll be damned if my kids dont get it.

E

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RE: Sending Your Kids Off To College - 12/4/2006 3:42:02 AM

Kalira

Posts: 954
Joined: 10/9/2006
From: Fort Wayne Indiana
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

Since this is about adult children and not the unmentionable kind I thought it would not be against the TOS to bring up this topic...

Another thread got me to thinking about this, if you have kids, do you encourage them to go on to college? Do you think college is a waste of time? On another thread there seemed to be a lot of dismissiveness about those who go to college and whether or not their education has intrinsic value in their life, so I wondered whether people feel it is important to have a college education for their children. I know that when push comes to shove we want our children to have the best chance in life, so I wonder if those that think that a degree is "just a piece of paper" feel that way when it comes to their own children? Just curious.

Well, since my teenager has expressed the interest since the age of 7 about being a veterinarian, I think sending her off to college would be a wonderful idea

Even if she did not have a specific goal in mind, I would still encourage college simply because most places...notice I said most...most places will not hire anymore without some kind of college or technical training.

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Damnant Quod Non Intellegunt

(in reply to juliaoceania)

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RE: Sending Your Kids Off To College - 12/4/2006 4:03:27 AM

seeksfemslave

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The original question on "other" thread was whether having a degree should confer a sense of entitlement or special privileges.

Should you send/support your "nipper" to/at college is a totally different question and requires a subjective decision.
I repeat that in the UK most "degree owners" are financed by the taxpayer, so there IS an unaknowledged downside.

Of those who do have a degree a vanishingly small number do anything really creative.

< Message edited by seeksfemslave -- 12/4/2006 4:05:51 AM >

(in reply to Kalira)

Post #: 12

RE: Sending Your Kids Off To College - 12/4/2006 4:08:55 AM

meatcleaver

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quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave

I repeat that in the UK most "degree owners" are financed by the taxpayer, so there IS an unaknowledged downside.

Every country that aspires to being developed and staying that way subsidize higher education somehow. But I've got nothing against a graduation tax. Econimies need an educated workforce. The problem nowadays is that many people go for an education that the economy doesn't need, which is fine but they shouldn't squeal about having a degree and not being able to secure a job and still have to pay a graduation tax for the privilege.

< Message edited by meatcleaver -- 12/4/2006 4:10:00 AM >

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RE: Sending Your Kids Off To College - 12/4/2006 5:15:04 AM

AquaticSub

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~Fast Reply~

College is a good thing most of the time. It annoys me because I'm frustrated with papers and all the shit that I'm not even doing because I want to. But being here with all of my classmates has given me a lot of life experience. Without the people I've met here I don't know if I would have discovered myself as a submissive. I think most people benfit from going to college, but really it's not for everyone and I hate that just everyone is going because you need a bloody degree to work anywhere now.

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(in reply to meatcleaver)

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RE: Sending Your Kids Off To College - 12/4/2006 6:07:00 AM

sophia37

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I have a masters degree yet my income is very low. So one should never say that college equals income. College equals knowledge. And knowledge is extremely important for all of us.

I use my education every day. Mainly becuase I need every bit of brain power I can muster, to try and make it through this crazy world. At least I understand how to do research. At least I know how the system works. Without that knowledge Id be in bad shape. Its how I am my own boss.

I want for every one of my children to go thru college. So far so good. But my youngest, I couldnt say yet. I feel its a neesecity not a luxury, but maybe my youngest will teach me something new.

(in reply to juliaoceania)

Post #: 15

RE: Sending Your Kids Off To College - 12/4/2006 6:19:48 AM

spankmepink11

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Joined: 9/28/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

Well we could quibble about being dismissive, but saying that research skills are not valuable, a degree is just a piece of paper, that the only place a professor can work is in a college, that military people are more capable than young people that went to college, all seem rather dismissive to me, but that is just my opinion.

Julia, the gist of the other post was about whether those of us who have gone to college deserve certain entitlements as opposed to those of us who have not.
The issue that you take on this subject seems to be rooted in the fact that you feel someone with a degree should automatically garner the respect of the masses, and you've made it abundantly clear that you hold the ability to write a research paper in very high regard....good...great...But, not only did you contradict yourself in the other thread, but you started a whole new thread to defend a stance that was not even challenged. I didn't recollect anyone advising against sending ones offspring to college.
Below is a quote from you in the other thread, you point out that you deserve respect for no other reason than the fact that you are a crack researcher and hope to be a professor....yet you immediately state afterwards that you would not respect a veteran solely on the fact that they are a veteran....you can't have it both ways.

[Quote}
I want to be a professor when I am finished, and to be honest it saddens me that there is so little respect for those who are talented with their minds and use them, as if this is something to be ashamed of or something.

And BTW, veterans get no more respect from me than the person who went to college, both are human beings, both did something with their lives.... one path is not superior to another. Even the military prizes people with educations and promotes them to become officers, and there is a reason why.

[end quote]

Does the statement in bold imply that you feel you deserve more respect than one who's path is different from your own? Or is said respect your "entitlement" for persuing a degree...

< Message edited by spankmepink11 -- 12/4/2006 6:34:15 AM >

(in reply to juliaoceania)

Post #: 16

RE: Sending Your Kids Off To College - 12/4/2006 6:36:24 AM

seeksfemslave

Posts: 4011
Joined: 6/16/2006
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Spankme has recognised as have I, that MsJ has had, in an intellectual way of course, her cage rattled.
Hence approach the problem from a different angle, ie this thread.

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Post #: 17

RE: Sending Your Kids Off To College - 12/4/2006 6:41:49 AM

servantforuse

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On average those with college degrees make about $20,000.00 per year than those with only a high school diploma.

(in reply to seeksfemslave)

Post #: 18

RE: Sending Your Kids Off To College - 12/4/2006 6:55:47 AM

mnottertail

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Interesting non-use of the word, 'more'.

College grad?

LOL,
Ron

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Post #: 19

RE: Sending Your Kids Off To College - 12/4/2006 7:11:17 AM

popeye1250

Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

On average those with college degrees make about $20,000.00 per year than those with only a high school diploma.

Gee, I'll inform my Plumber of that "statistic."

(in reply to servantforuse)

Post #: 20

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