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RE: myths about suicide - 12/6/2006 9:07:06 PM   
ownedgirlie


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I had a long conversation with my sister-in-law the other day about this subject, as her son - my nephew - has made two serious attempts on his life.  He is in his early 20s, and a brilliant, beautiful spirit.  Both attempts rendered him hospitalized.  My sister-in-law has become involved in NAMI meetings (National Association for the Mentally Ill) and has found their information to be quite helpful.

I called her because my ex husband is threatening to kill himself, and has called me in the middle of the night, scaring me with it.  She said one of the things she learned from these meetings is that some people will make it in this life, and some people won't.  For some, life is just too hard and too painful to bear.  And all we can do is love them and pray for him (for those of us who pray).

I have tried to take my own life in the past.  Nothing anyone could have told me at the time would have made life seem worth living for me.  Something in me kept fighting, though, and in my darkest days even still, the fight continues.

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RE: myths about suicide - 12/6/2006 9:17:55 PM   
dcnovice


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Melanie: Thanks so much for starting this great thread on an important topic. I really appreciate it.

Katy: Thanks for mentioning Night Falls Fast. I have it but haven't read it yet.

I'm very fond of Darkness Visible, by William Styron. It's a firsthand account of living through depression, and I reread it every time the dark clouds gather. It's the book I always want to give people and say, "Here. This is what I'm going through."

< Message edited by dcnovice -- 12/6/2006 9:18:54 PM >

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RE: myths about suicide - 12/6/2006 9:23:45 PM   
KatyLied


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dcnovice, you would probably like this book as well:


An Unquiet Mind: A Memoir of Moods and Madness by Kay Redfield Jamison.  It is about her battle with manic-depression.  She is an expert in the field as someone who has the disorder, as well as a professor of psychiatry.




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RE: myths about suicide - 12/6/2006 9:27:35 PM   
HollyS


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SlaveAkasha

I don't think anyone contends that some people reach out for help and don't get it.  I think my problem with it are the ones that constantly say they are going to, or cry wolf all the time.  I do want to feel that this time could be serious, but when it happens time after time, after time, it does make one sort of role their eyes at "here we go again". 


I can understand this if you really feel like someone is using threats of suicide to manipulate you. 

Still, what's the greater harm?  Paying attention to someone who threatens to kill themselves but doesn't...
  ...or not paying attention to someone who threatens to kill themselves and does.

Be careful whom you suspect of "crying wolf."

~Holly


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RE: myths about suicide - 12/6/2006 9:43:21 PM   
lighthearted


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie

My sister-in-law has become involved in NAMI meetings (National Association for the Mentally Ill) and has found their information to be quite helpful.

I called her because my ex husband is threatening to kill himself, and has called me in the middle of the night, scaring me with it.  She said one of the things she learned from these meetings is that some people will make it in this life, and some people won't.  For some, life is just too hard and too painful to bear.  And all we can do is love them and pray for him (for those of us who pray).



thank you for mentioning NAMI, ownedgirlie...there's a huge stigma in this country of being labelled as "mentally ill", and it keeps people from getting the help they need, IMO. 

as much as part of me doesn't want to accept that "some people will make it in the life, and some won't", sadly, it's the truth, isn't it?  I have lost a brother and a also a close friend to suicide, and as much as I wanted to help, as much as I wanted to be whatever it was that they needed to hang on, I couldn't...there comes a point where one has to realize that suicide is a decison, not a happenstance.  sometimes the decision is made by someone whom we may judge as too young/too sick/too depressed to know any better.  and sometimes, as difficult as it may be to accept, it is the only means of their achieving peace within themselves.  like you said, all we can do is love them, and pray...I believe prayer is a powerful tool...but that's another thread entirely.  

as far as myths about suicide, I can guarantee anyone, there is nothing "romantic" about seeing someone you love on a hospital stretcher, pupils fixed and dilated, with a respirator shoved down their throat.  harsh, I know, but the truth.

lighthearted (who currently sees the irony in her profile name)

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RE: myths about suicide - 12/7/2006 2:43:49 AM   
SusanofO


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ownedgirlie: Geez. I had no idea this was happening to you right now (or rather, within your realm of relatives). I'll say some prayers. Sorry to hear of it, but glad you were able to get it off your chest. I tried it once, too (actually twice - but it was over 25 years ago, (and a few years ago) and I'd never ever do it again (she said, crossing her fingers). I do believe that life is a gift. But - people who are in the grip of that deep, gaping emotional black-hole aren't thinking about things ever getting better, they just want Out, mostly. Of course I realize I cannot speak for everyone. Glad it's over - so very very glad. I truly haver been under the impression that almost everyone had at least had it cross their mind at one time or another at some point, although I could be way off-base there). 

I will say, though, that I am very glad I found anti-depressants that work with my bodu chemistry. I hope your husband can find his way to seeing a good doctor and-or psychiatrist. Why shoud people suffer this needlessly when medical and pharmacuetical help is available? For me, "talk therapy" just did nothing, because my depression is entirely bio-chemical (and hereditary). Anti-depressants were like waking up to a whole new life - I never had any idea I could walk around and not feel like general _hit all the time. It was like the sun suddenly came up or something. My entire life changed. All of a sudden I felt happy, for "no good reason" (imagine that)! I'd never known one could feel good all the time. I'd just assumed everyone else felt cruddy most of the time, too, anf that it woild just go on like that - forever. I never talked about it much (it was a kind of "taboo" topic around my mother, for various reasons).

I'd gone through college making copious notes re: Every text-book chapter I read, because my memory was so bad, due to depression, I could never seem to remember anything for longer than about 10 minutes, even though I am supposedly fairly bright. My brain just wasn't working very well (but, my dad wouldn't let me quit college and insisted I was going to graduate. Which I did, with honors). This hellish see-saw of  symptoms went on for six years. I thought it would never end. Couldn't eat, couldn't sleep (or slept all the time). It wasn't my fault. It's an illness, and a physical one, with physical symptoms. I am thanking God that people are starting to let it "out of the closet". I don't dwell on it, and hardly even think about it at all, anymore, except when topics like this come up sometimes, and of course I do take my pills every day. But, I do think that - for heaven's sake, people die due to ignorance and stupid myths about this illness needlessly all the time.

At the time I first got hit by this, meds were still in the "dark ages" and the side effects were terrible. I must have tried about 15 different ones. Then one year, I found one that really, really worked well for me. And it made all the difference in the world.   

Of course everyone is different, and getting someone to actually see a doctor can be very hard at times. But if he hasn't done it, he really should (and of course you already know that). Also, it might not be wise to intervene yourself, especially if you are trying to "disengage" (and I am sure you've decided already what you need to do here, too. I am not trying to butt in, but know how painful these situations cna sometimes be, and so if you needf an ear, e-mail me). In any case, he probably needs to get himself a good support system (and maybe not you. And it's not up to you to "save him" either, but these scenarios can be very tough sometimes, I think, to deal with).  Maybe someone else who knows both of you could do that (intervene, if necessary, to get him help ) instead? Anyway, good luck. I know you have a wonderful master who is probably helping you through this. But please do feel free to e-mail me if you need to talk.  

- Susan

< Message edited by SusanofO -- 12/7/2006 3:42:08 AM >


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RE: myths about suicide - 12/7/2006 2:50:24 AM   
wandersalone


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I want to thank everyone who has replied to this thread so far.  I admit to being overwhelmed with the sharing of personal stories by others. 

LAM and daddysprop247 - I believe that for a number of people that commit suicide, nothing that anyone else does or says will change the outcome. Yes there are people who really see death as the only answer.  I was one of those people for about 4 years in my early 20's and can still remember how angry I felt with my family, friends, counsellors and the hospitals for not letting me die.  Even though I truly did not believe that this feeling of utter hopelessness and never-ending sadness would ever end, it did. 

Sometimes just letting someone know that you are there if they ever want to talk can help them feel a tiny bit less alone. And yes, ultimately it is the individual who makes the final choice. 

Thankyou again to everyone for posting

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RE: myths about suicide - 12/7/2006 3:02:09 AM   
SlaveAkasha


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quote:

ORIGINAL: HollyS

quote:

ORIGINAL: SlaveAkasha

I don't think anyone contends that some people reach out for help and don't get it.  I think my problem with it are the ones that constantly say they are going to, or cry wolf all the time.  I do want to feel that this time could be serious, but when it happens time after time, after time, it does make one sort of role their eyes at "here we go again". 


I can understand this if you really feel like someone is using threats of suicide to manipulate you. 

Still, what's the greater harm?  Paying attention to someone who threatens to kill themselves but doesn't...
...or not paying attention to someone who threatens to kill themselves and does.

Be careful whom you suspect of "crying wolf."

~Holly



I am very, very careful..but I will not give my attention to someone that manipulates in this way.  I suppose it's because I know what it's like to try it and I know friends that have also.  I think it's mentally cruel to put others through something just because you want attention.
 
I am in no way cold hearted, I just know that some people don't want help, they would rather whine about it.  I think a lot of people expect others to solve their problems for them and as most of us know, that cannot happen.  You have to want to get better, you have to put effort in and work.  It's not easy, goodness knows, but it can be done.  I have suffered from severe depression my whole life and am bi-polar.  I don't take anything lightly, but I want to help those that will actually want it, and not those that use it as a tool to manipulate.
 
I am sorry if this seems cold to others, that is not my intention... I agree that anyone that talks about suicide needs help, but those that need more help are usually the ones that are silent about it.
 
Kasha

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RE: myths about suicide - 12/7/2006 8:31:59 AM   
ownedgirlie


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Susan:  Thanks for the warm thoughts.  It wasn't so much I needed to get anything off my chest, but to put something out there that others may relate to.  As for my ex husband, the best thing I can do for myself is to exit his life. He is sick and has spent years taking me with him and I can't go there anymore. Intervening only pulls me back in.  Cold as it sounds, I can not be his crutch anymore.  He calls me, and I call his family to deal with it.  A few times of that, he doesn't call me anymore.  Painful yes, but I won't go down with his ship. 

Yes, my Master has been quite amazing through this.

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RE: myths about suicide - 12/7/2006 11:11:36 AM   
pahunkboy


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If anyone needs to talk, email me. we can talk by phone-i can pay for call if in the US.


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RE: myths about suicide - 12/7/2006 1:34:45 PM   
Arpig


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Maybe these will open somebody's eyes a little.

http://geocities.com/maddyvand/

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