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RE: A Minor Revelation - 12/21/2006 8:50:48 AM

angharad

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quote:

I think I'm a realistic optimist. I see what's there. I delight in examining things to their details, the big small and sideways pictures. I love consistency.

In order to appreciate what there is, we must understand and accept what IS- only then can we truly appreciate and delight in the bliss that we have.

There is a certain strength in the harsh reality, in the truth and I for one much prefer to operate understanding what is rather than keeping the rosy tinted glasses and forming judgements and attitudes based on other peoples beliefs which I took unquestionally as my own. Besides it much much more interesting when people are honest about what makes them tick, and the more taboo the subject the more interesting it gets

quote:

How does it serve me personally to correct those that portray opinions and beliefs as facts and statistics? I believe that it's nonconsensual to lie to people.

I have started to notice alot of opinions stated as fact and it has started to irritate me somewhat. I don't have anything against opinions being stated and discussed, I enjoy it, its the broad sweeping statements that somehow are fact because they seem to hold truth for the person making the statement. It suggests an unwillingness to look outside their comfort zone and well I would find that tedious to say the least. I had a quote on another website that ran :

In a perfect world I would probably be bored.

To the OP, I too have a certain acceptance of other peoples activities, and the curtain twitching, interfering, moralistic condemnation is another example of being stuck in a rut/mindset. Add an a to the word interfering and you get the word fear. Interesting? The main reason I spent weeks getting up courage to enter an online bdsm room was fear of what I would find.

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RE: A Minor Revelation - 12/21/2006 8:54:03 AM

SusanofO

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I appreciate your reply angharad.

- Susan

_____________________________

"Hope is the thing with feathers,
That perches in the soul,
And sings the tune without the words,
And never stops at all". - Emily Dickinson

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RE: A Minor Revelation - 12/21/2006 9:46:34 AM

popeye1250

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterFireMaam

One simple reason is that a lot of people think that pleasure, in general, is mostly related to sins. Since it's "bad" to willfully sin, it's "bad" to not only enjoy, but (gasp) pursue sexual pleasure. The states were settled by religious fanatics that had, for the most part, been kicked out of wherever they came from. These are the repercussions.

Master Fire

I think Master Fire nailed it.
All religions seem to think that sex is for procreation "only" and that people shouldn't take "pleasure" in it for whatever reason.
Why they think this I don't understand.
That's why it's tremendously funny when one of those holy roller preachers gets caught shagging his secretary or especially another male! They're fuckin hypocrites! lol!
Like Susan I couldn't care less what someone else does sexually if it's not illegal (unmentionables) and if it makes them happy.
What two consenting adults do, or three or four is their own business.

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RE: A Minor Revelation - 12/21/2006 11:40:06 AM

xonemasterx

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This topic reminds me of the "different kinds of kinky" joke.

A man is sitting in a bar looking depressed when a woman approaches and asks him what's wrong. He tells her sadly that his girlfriend just left him and, after some pressuring, admits that it was because he was just too kinky for her. "What a coincidence!" exclamimed the woman. "My boyfriend just left me for the same reason." The two hit it off and, after a few drinks, decided to go back to her place as it was nearest. The woman left the man alone in the living room and disappeared into the bedroom. After ten minutes she reappeared dressed in full leather and chains, with whip and ballgag in hand only to see the man about to leave. "Where are you going?" she asked. "I thought you were kinky." "I am," he replied. "I fucked your cat and just took a shit in your purse. I'm off home now."

Disclaimer: I, personally, am not into cats or purses.

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RE: A Minor Revelation - 12/21/2006 2:03:59 PM

justheather

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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250
All religions seem to think that sex is for procreation "only" and that people shouldn't take "pleasure" in it for whatever reason.

You sure about that?

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And paste me in that book you always carry.
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Post #: 65

RE: A Minor Revelation - 12/21/2006 2:25:56 PM

popeye1250

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quote:

ORIGINAL: justheather

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250
All religions seem to think that sex is for procreation "only" and that people shouldn't take "pleasure" in it for whatever reason.

You sure about that?

Heather, I meant the religions in this country.
I don't know what Hindus think for example.

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RE: A Minor Revelation - 12/21/2006 2:28:56 PM

justheather

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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

quote:

ORIGINAL: justheather

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250
All religions seem to think that sex is for procreation "only" and that people shouldn't take "pleasure" in it for whatever reason.

You sure about that?

Heather, I meant the religions in this country.
I don't know what Hindus think for example.

Well, Popeye, let me be the first to tell you....there are Hindus in this country. :-)

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I want the scissors to be sharp
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And paste me in that book you always carry.
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RE: A Minor Revelation - 12/21/2006 2:53:12 PM

popeye1250

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quote:

ORIGINAL: justheather

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

quote:

ORIGINAL: justheather

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250
All religions seem to think that sex is for procreation "only" and that people shouldn't take "pleasure" in it for whatever reason.

You sure about that?

Heather, I meant the religions in this country.
I don't know what Hindus think for example.

Well, Popeye, let me be the first to tell you....there are Hindus in this country. :-)

Heather, NOOOOOOOOO?
I meant the Catholic and most Protestant religions.
And Merry Christmas to the Hindus.

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RE: A Minor Revelation - 12/21/2006 2:54:46 PM

justheather

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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

And Merry Christmas to the Hindus.

Next time I hang out with them I will send your regards.

_____________________________

I want the scissors to be sharp
And the table perfectly level
When you cut me out of my life
And paste me in that book you always carry.
-Billy Collins

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RE: A Minor Revelation - 12/21/2006 5:56:52 PM

adaddysgirl

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SusanofO

quote:

But - it just is what it is - it's what some people want to do.

quote:

Of course there are things that are not to my taste. But - I don't give two hoots who else want to do them.

quote:

Why would that be considered odd, or bad - if it isn't hurting any non-consensual people?

Susan,

i feel this same way (and what i write here only pertains to consensual people...not children, animals, rape victims, etc).

i honestly think that people just have a hard time accepting that which they feel they would never do. But the problem is...instead of just saying 'that particular act does not appeal to me, or disgusts me, or sickens me, etc'....it becomes a personal attack on those who do enjoy it.

Here's a non-bdsm example. my son came in one night and turned the TV on and told me to watch. It was that show Fear Factor which i never, ever watch because i really have a weak stomach when it comes to bugs, maggots, spiders, etc.

Anyhoo, on this one epsiode, this girl had to eat 4 or 5 LIVE slugs. OMG....was that ever gross! It really made me sick just to watch it. God....the one girl was wiping them on her arm first to get off some of the slime....and some of them were big too! OK...i can't talk about it anymore.....it is just too disgusting and gross. Granted....she was doing it for the possibility of winning some money but for me, they couldn't offer me enough

Now...do i think that particular person is disgusting and gross? Absolutely not! First of all, i don't even know her. Secondly, that being the case, how could i judge what type of person she is?

When i first came to the boards, one of the first threads i read was something on being a human toilet. Now to me, there is not much more disgusting than eating shit. i mean, i would never, in my wildest dreams, imagine myself doing that. So yes, i can say that eating shit is disgusting, gross, totally repulsive to me.....but would i use those same words to describe someone who enjoys doing it....either because it is their kink or they do it for their Master/Mistress? Absolutely not!

i really don't care what 2 consenting adults do between themselves. i don't care if it's their kink. i don't care if they do it solely because it pleases Master or because they feel that is what expected of them in their 'role'. None of this matters as long as somewhere along the line, it was acceptable for those involved.

i think it is kind of funny how others are judged as 'sick'....or their partners abusive (or whatever)....because others just cannot fathom a behavior, or another's motivation for engaging in such behavior. But as you, i say....who cares? i mean, we are adults here, aren't we?

Yes, we are human. Everyday we see things that are acceptable to us or not...and that is fine.....in our lives. To be honest, i think that part of the journey of this whole 'wiitwd' thing is opening our minds to what others do that may not necessarily agree with our views, outlooks, opinions, morals, etc....and accept that although others do it differently, they are not 'strange' or 'sick'.

i'm really not sure how much this pertained to your OP but in some ways, i think it did. i just really find it ironic that a masochist can come on and say she (he) was beaten bloody....and that was okay...then wonder what is wrong with someone who likes to eat shit....lol.

DG

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RE: A Minor Revelation - 12/21/2006 11:17:04 PM

popeye1250

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Daddy'sgirl, funny post.
Reminds me of that saying ; "Whatever floats your boat."

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RE: A Minor Revelation - 12/22/2006 10:25:06 AM

Amaros

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quote:

It's more like mystified curiosity that there is some social phenomenon at work that for some reason I am not privvy learning more about. It seems to have eluded me almost completely. It is fascinating and scary at the same time. Maybe I am thinking too much about it. I don't know. I was just rolling it around in my brain and it wasn't getting anywhere, so thought I'd pour it out here and see where it went.
Thanks for listening.

See the "Vanilla's are scared", etc., thread - much of it has to do with a patrimonal socio-political structure, the virgin/whore dichotomy and a general fear of female seuality. Other things may have a practical basis: proscriptions against anal sex probobly made sense when there was no running water, and hygine wasn't what is is now - and not knowing what germs even were, it wouldn't take much to get a mini e-coli epidemic started that could easily wipe out most of a household and cause considerable panic in the community - the death toll from dysentary makes the Black Plague look like a mild case of the sniffles. What water there was was probobly already havily contaminated with e-coli, which is why washing itself was probobly not a good idea in the absence of sewage treatment, and they drank wine instead.

Unfortunately, most of these things were promulgated culturally via superstition, rather than reason based on science, and as these superstition have lost their practical value, they've taken political value: when religion serves as tribal identity pattern as it often does, it's one way they can differentiate and hold themselves apart and above from "the other". Only time and experience can dislodge them if they can be dislodged.

Others may just have delicate sensibilities -the first time I saw fisting, I was pretty freaked out - after seeing a lot of smiling faces, babies being born, etc., it doesn't even strike me as odd.

I also do happen to think that some people have a greater genetic propensity towards conformity, and are less prone to engage in any behavior that might concievably result in unwanted attention - finger pointing is a way of distancing yourself from behavior that you fear "others" might find reprehensible, and otherwise suspect you of.

It's one of the great sources of institutional evil historically when it synergizes with mob violence - self definition through negation, and it applies to all sorts of superficial differences: culture, color, religion, etc.

< Message edited by Amaros -- 12/22/2006 10:47:47 AM >

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RE: A Minor Revelation - 12/22/2006 10:29:13 AM

adaddysgirl

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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Daddy'sgirl, funny post.
Reminds me of that saying ; "Whatever floats your boat."

Sounds so easy, doesn't it?

DG

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RE: A Minor Revelation - 12/22/2006 10:58:11 AM

Amaros

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Things is, people freak out about what they see, and usualy don't question what they don't see - the demand for cell phones is fueling bloody wars in the Congo over control of Tantalite, conflict Diamonds probobly financed 9-11, hell, somebody pretty much dies every time you fill up the SUV.

Owning any of these, a cell phone, a wedding ring or an SUV, isn't considered immoral, in fact they're status symbols - you're a loser if you don't have them - but people are dying every day for these things, and you could go on - agribusiness destroying the Gulf of Mexico, global warming. etc., and so on.

The predjudice against un-monitored, un-regulated sexuality is a mindless sort of thing - it is kind of boggling when one weighs all of these other travesty's against a couple of people make each other feel good.

So it goes.

I sure as hell don't lose any sleep over it, or at least not sleep I don't choose to lose...

< Message edited by Amaros -- 12/22/2006 11:00:55 AM >

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