RE: Age

RE: Age (Full Version)

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TypeAsub1 -> RE: Age (12/29/2006 1:27:24 AM)
I personally know 2 women who are 55 and 57.. both widows.. both subs. Both are horribly frustrated trying to find a Dom, because men who are in their 50's and 60's are finding MUCH younger women and won't even speak to them. And these are attractive, fit, financially stable women. And btw - you just sang my tune. Your with a much older man. My very point is that older men.. want younger chicks. Your relationship is yet another example of that. You can claim that he wasn't looking for a younger woman.. but that's exactly what he went and got. Short term gain for long term pain has never been my style - but YMMV. I understand that in the here and now you are enjoying life. However, I prefer to view things logically. It is logical that you will spend a good deal of your life, changing his diapers and caring for him as he ages. Elder care is a growing issue. The healthcare system is not prepared to care for all of the aging people in our societies. And while I've no doubt that you love him and will want to provide care for him ... even children of parents become worn down over time when having to deal with these issues. It's even more difficult for young spouses to watch their aging partner waste away... while they are still young, spry, sexual and capable of living a very active life. Is what I'm saying selfish? Yes and no. It's certainly selfish if you make that committment and then abandon it. However, I do not think it selfish to look at the odds, weigh out the options and make the best decision for you. I'd rather spend 3 - 5 years looking now... than 5-10 years in my 50's and 60's nursing my ill spouse while I'm still young and healthy. And then - have to spend many years again, attempting to find someone else when that ends. In the end, for me.. the time is better spent finding someone now. It's basic math - and the numbers don't add up. quote: ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie quote: ORIGINAL: TypeAsub1 wait until you're 40+ [:D] You'll be singing a different tune. As a 41 year old with an "old guy" for a Master (he is 58), I can only say I would have missed out on a hell of a lot had I turned away because of his age. I'd still be singing my unfulfilled and depressed tune had I not jumped at the opportunity he provided. And while it's true he will likely "kick the bucket" well before me, I would not trade one moment of my life with him for anything. As for liking young chicks, that's not his make up. He was concerned I was too young for him when we first began speaking, as he is accustomed to owning women much closer to his own age. I don't begrudge you your choices, just as you do not begrudge others. But not everyone at 40+ sings the tune you're speaking of. But I do think it's cool you think we're still "young chicks" [:D]

eyesopened -> RE: Age (12/29/2006 2:15:57 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TypeAsub1 I personally know 2 women who are 55 and 57.. both widows.. both subs. Both are horribly frustrated trying to find a Dom, because men who are in their 50's and 60's are finding MUCH younger women and won't even speak to them. And these are attractive, fit, financially stable women. i used to fib my age on my profile to put me under the 50 mark and i would get plenty of emails. If i received one i felt was interesting i would immediately let them know my real age and normally it didn't make a difference. Once i decided that i should be honest up front the emails stopped. it would appear that a line is drawn at particular age delineations and that it's extremely rare that a Dom of any age seeks a sub over 50. i don't believe age is "just a number" because people's life's goals change over time. Now if a man in his 50s + wants a much younger woman because being with a youthful person makes him feel young, there's nothing that can be done about it. i am youthful. my unmentionable's friends enjoy my attending their band concerts. my unmentionable's girlfriend said to me (her mother is 13 years younger than me) that she wishes i would take her mother shopping with me so her mother wouldn't dress like an old lady. my youthful exhuberance will never be known because of the silly calendar, but it is what it is. Regarding groups, my munch group welcomes people of all legal age but a couple of years ago a group of 20-30-somethings started their own group. Maybe it was to avoid being hit on by the 'dinosaurs' ? i don't know.

Quivver -> RE: Age (12/29/2006 3:14:19 AM)
Honestly, in a way I'm thankful i'm no longer under 40. my inbox is rarely visited but it makes weeding thru the wankers alot easier. life experiance has me much less Frenzy prone, not that all younger women are, but the tendency is there. I agree fully with TypeASub1, her findings are what i've seen also.

dawntreader -> RE: Age (12/29/2006 4:06:30 AM)
i definitely follow this philosophy... quote: ORIGINAL: maybeican Well you are only as old as you feel and as young as you dare. I feel that people that set age limits, are limited in their own choices.

Lordandmaster -> RE: Age (12/29/2006 4:27:58 AM)
Have you had an experience like this yourself? Or seen one up close? To me, what you're saying sounds a little distorted--as though you had some kind of traumatic event involving long-term care for an aging loved one, and now you're gunshy. Anyone can kick the bucket and die (or require long-term care) at any time; we're mere mortals. I'd prefer to meet people, take them for who they are, and enjoy whatever time I have with them, then to worry whether, twenty years down the line, I might have to change their Depends. How many relationships last twenty years anyway? Life is short. quote: ORIGINAL: TypeAsub1 Short term gain for long term pain has never been my style - but YMMV. I understand that in the here and now you are enjoying life. However, I prefer to view things logically. It is logical that you will spend a good deal of your life, changing his diapers and caring for him as he ages. Elder care is a growing issue. The healthcare system is not prepared to care for all of the aging people in our societies. And while I've no doubt that you love him and will want to provide care for him ... even children of parents become worn down over time when having to deal with these issues. It's even more difficult for young spouses to watch their aging partner waste away... while they are still young, spry, sexual and capable of living a very active life.

badpaliden -> RE: Age (12/29/2006 6:16:16 AM)
As there is a local age group around here , I asked about what it was all about , and what it did. I was told it was formed so that the young girls who were subbies wouldnt feel all squenched out from the "old guys staring at them". I laughed my ass off from that one. Its nothing to me if the younger ones want a club house. Its a normal part of human development. We form groups. So be it. Its just less posing and primping when at a public dungon and waiting on the use of the play funiture. LOL As to what seems to be a side bar issue here,about older men and younger women. Well as I'm one of those.. I'll put in my two cents worth. Ladies, you do it to your selfs... You seem to think that its all down hill for us men after say 49 or so. I cant tell you how many woman seem to think a man has to act a certin way because he's at a perticular age. But of course I think if you examine these womens lives you'd find a packed bag or two they are carring around about this issue for another reason. As for being an old fart.... I some times wake up and wonder what happned ... I still feel like the guy who was just twenty just a little while back, I still have a lot of the same thoughts and stuff.. just a lot more wisdome about when and where to act on them!! I guess to me I'd rather have some good times with some one who is intrested in ME and not what I have to leave them when I'm gone.. Hell, let them go get their own stuff!

hisannabelle -> RE: Age (12/29/2006 6:19:18 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TypeAsub1 I personally know 2 women who are 55 and 57.. both widows.. both subs. Both are horribly frustrated trying to find a Dom, because men who are in their 50's and 60's are finding MUCH younger women and won't even speak to them. And these are attractive, fit, financially stable women. Short term gain for long term pain has never been my style - but YMMV. I understand that in the here and now you are enjoying life. However, I prefer to view things logically. It is logical that you will spend a good deal of your life, changing his diapers and caring for him as he ages. Elder care is a growing issue. The healthcare system is not prepared to care for all of the aging people in our societies. And while I've no doubt that you love him and will want to provide care for him ... even children of parents become worn down over time when having to deal with these issues. It's even more difficult for young spouses to watch their aging partner waste away... while they are still young, spry, sexual and capable of living a very active life. the thing is - you don't know her mileage, or mine. it is very possible i may be changing his depends in twenty years, or even less. it's also very likely he may be dealing with me in a wheelchair in ten. that is, if the next 10-20 years is granted to either of us...hell, i may walk out and get hit by a bus on my way to work today, too. but for some of us, life is just too short/long. "ymmv" isn't just personal preference - it's actual experience. it's not like we're all young and spry at 20 (or 40) and have the exact relationship and health state currently that you must be picturing. additionally, i know women (not necessarily submissives) who are older and have lost older partners and have a difficult time finding men their age. i also know women younger than 50 who have that problem. i know men in their 40s and 50s who have that problem as well. there are men on cm whose profiles say that they are specifically seeking younger women. there are also men whose profiles say they are specifically seeking women in their age range. for every man in his 50s and older who wants a younger women, there is a man who wants someone with experience commensurate with his. it seems to me as though you're choosing to ignore things that don't go along with what you think.

JohnWarren -> RE: Age (12/29/2006 6:26:17 AM)
Another amusing take on this is the people who claim in their profile that they aren't looking for a partner and are just seeking friends/information/whatever, but then add they don't want to hear from anyone more than X years older than they are. I regularly write notes to people who live in areas where I know a bit about the offline scene letting them know their alternative option. I also write to people with certain interests, again with information for them. An amazing number of these emails are never opened. Their loss

SusanofO -> RE: Age (12/29/2006 6:30:41 AM)
Considering I didn't really even start exploring bdsm at all intil I was about 43 years old, at 46 I'd like to think I am just on the verge of hitting my exploratory prime. There's absolutley nothing I can do about my age at all. So I just try to keep myself fit and as attractive as I can. I believe there is also something to be said for the widom some people can gain as a result of aging. I don't worry about some things I worried about at 25 or 30 - there's just plain too much that has happened in my life for me to really sweat over what I consider much "small stuff" anymore. Ocasionally I do - but by far, not as often as I did back then. To me, that's a bonus of being my age. - Susan

Mercnbeth -> RE: Age (12/29/2006 6:45:50 AM)
quote: They will have age restricted groups, they will have the klans and gangs and all sorts of stuff. I'm still going to think its stupid. Illogical. NOW if some one like Latigress, or LaM, or KOM, or Mnotter, Mercnbeth or a few of the others on here that show a lot of wisdom in their posts - saying different then i could stand corrected. Riot, I don't believe that our "wisdom" is any more valid than anyone else's but I understand the concept behind the idea. As this lifestyle has become more visible with the advent of the internet, more people have discovered there is a name for their desires. They are finding out that they are not alone or "freaks". Brave enough, they want to meet these other people who are "like them". Many, if not most, of the groups TES in NY Threshold here in LA are long establish groups run by long established people. The are a gateway to good information, good people, and can answer or point to answers. The information is great, but when it comes time to put it in practice, or to interact with others its common to want to do that with people who have common life experiences and common interests outside the groups common interest in the D/s BDSM lifestyle. I don't see it as a "bad" thing. There is a club here in LA that has parties that attract a younger crowd. We've gone a few times. beth and I are pretty delusional when it comes to our age. We both enjoy going to, and doing things, that we should be "too old" to do or go. At this club, the music is "Tech-no" and to us, VERY loud; but we manage to hit the dance floor. They serve alcoholic beverages, often strictly prohibited at other BDSM clubs. We are AMAZED at the fetish fashions worn by the group; appreciating that "Hot Topic" wasn't around when we were their age. We think it's great, and the energy of the room fantastic. They don't point and laugh at us "old folk" when we leave the dance floor and go into a room to play. Many times they follow and observe and ask questions. I'll tell you what though, just as often I'll approach them and compliment them on their skills. Some groups alienate younger people by their rules. The rules, such as no alcoholic beverages, drugs, sex; are practical and have good reason, but tell that to a 20 something. In fact tell that to some of us 40-50 year olds. Assuming that having a glass of wine, or two people to actually want/need to have sex as part of a BDSM scene isn't really that outrageous no matter how much someone older and more experienced says its not a good idea. There are very good and practical reasons for those rules. We can all tell horor stories about what happened to clubs and people who broke those rules. However, some 'life lessions' need to be learned first hand. Also, it's "normal" to seek out people who have the same ideas and definitions of a "good time". Are they putting themselves in a position to get in trouble? Are they engaging in dangerous activities? Sure, just as most of us have driven a car when we KNOW we've drunk enough to get arrested for a DUI. There are common issues and problems age specific. Can someone my age remember what it was like or relate to someone who wants to know how to "play" at home while living with their parents? We don't see a problem with age specific groups. Common interests along with common age is good fertile ground for forming relationships that last. Eventually they'll make enough trips around the sun to either be excluded from their own group, or change the criteria. It's not a "problem" its a fact of life. I remember feeling depressed when I got my notice that I qualified for joining AARP, but the first time I had the chance to use it for a discount, I did! On the other side of the spectrum beth is still 'carded' sometimes when ordering a drink. Every year at the Folsom Street Fair we make sure we take a picture of a great older gentleman who wears a sandwich sign announcing "83 Years of Being Gay! - (But maybe it's just a phase I'm going through.)" We've seen him since the sign had 79 years. We hope someday to have our own similar banner announcing our 25th year attending Folsom. Some will look at us as strange, some will laugh, some will just shake there heads and turn away from the disgusting old folks. Our goal is not to care and to feel as young and proud as the 83 year old man.

MaamJay -> RE: Age (12/29/2006 7:33:21 AM)
First to the OP - age related groups have a place, but I don't think they should be the totality of a person's bdsm experience. In the local scene, all ages over 21 are welcome, those 18-21 are vetted more carefully in terms of attending play parties simply from the aspect of potential problem parents etc. The scene also welcomes people of various ethnicity, style of bdsm, genders, sexuality etc etc, and all share their ideas and expertise. An under 35s group started up as a subgroup, but its members still attend the regular open-age parties. They just seem to have a bit more stamina (and/or less life responsibilities) and want to get together more often to party! Similarly a Goth subgroup has started, but that's an all-age thing, just a special interest. And there's a spankers/CPers subgroup etc etc. Subgroups are great when they are still part of a larger, more inclusive whole. Now to the side issue - well it ain't necessarily so that men like younger women! My Master is 35 ... and i am 50 ... W/we have been together 3 years and W/we are going strong. This year i was diagnosed with diabetes and with an atrial fibrillation. He has helped me extensively with my stubborn elderly Mother who insists on living alone at age 83 even though she needs more care. Has He shown signs of fear and foreboding? Is He polishing up His running shoes? NO! He and i realise W/we are in this as a true commitment ... that it really is "for better and for worse, in sickness and in health" even though W/we aren't married and didn't exactly include those words in O/our collaring contract! By all biological reckoning He is likely to be pushing me around in a wheelchair one of these days, or at very least i won't be able to drop that sweet little curtsey when serving His meals as i do now! As for changing Depends ... well fortunately He has established more control over my bladder than i've EVER been able to muster ... He just has to be very specific about telling me when i can pee (no good saying "you can pee when you get to the public toilet" ... better to say "you can pee once you've SAT down on the public toilet" LOL!). At least if the age odds work out for U/us, W/we should both enjoy growing old disgracefully together as i might even drop off my perch before He drops off His. By the way, i am not His Mrs Robinson (not that everyone here would recognise that reference!), He just happens to appreciate a mature woman who has got past the concern with their own self-image or what everyone else will think and instead is more into living every day in service of Him. Just my 2c worth, and happy New Year everyone! violet[A] aka Maam Jay (still also searching for a male subby to whom I will be Mrs R LOL!)

ownedgirlie -> RE: Age (12/29/2006 8:33:24 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TypeAsub1 And btw - you just sang my tune. Your with a much older man. My very point is that older men.. want younger chicks. Your relationship is yet another example of that. You can claim that he wasn't looking for a younger woman.. but that's exactly what he went and got. Well I am claiming it because that is the truth. He owned a 51 year old slave at the time as well, and his sub prior to that was 58. We clicked. Something between us clicked. I will take the rest of my life in frustration when he is gone for the absolute joy he is bringing me now, any day. quote: Short term gain for long term pain has never been my style - but YMMV. I understand that in the here and now you are enjoying life. However, I prefer to view things logically. It is logical that you will spend a good deal of your life, changing his diapers and caring for him as he ages. Elder care is a growing issue. The healthcare system is not prepared to care for all of the aging people in our societies. And while I've no doubt that you love him and will want to provide care for him ... even children of parents become worn down over time when having to deal with these issues. It's even more difficult for young spouses to watch their aging partner waste away... while they are still young, spry, sexual and capable of living a very active life. Short term gain? Enjoying my life now? You have failed to see my point but perhaps I didn't make it well on this thread. He saved my life. I was a lost cause when he found me. He saw through me though, and took a chance on me. As a result, my life is a complete 180 and he is reaping the benefit. I will change his diaper any day. I changed my Dads while he was ill, so why wouldn't I want to change my Masters? Why would I not devote the rest of my life giving to a man who has introduced me to my own life? And by the way, I never felt worn down by my Dad. He was a beautiful man and caring for him was the most rewarding and beautiful thing I have ever done. quote: Is what I'm saying selfish? Yes and no. It's certainly selfish if you make that committment and then abandon it. However, I do not think it selfish to look at the odds, weigh out the options and make the best decision for you. I'd rather spend 3 - 5 years looking now... than 5-10 years in my 50's and 60's nursing my ill spouse while I'm still young and healthy. And then - have to spend many years again, attempting to find someone else when that ends. In the end, for me.. the time is better spent finding someone now. It's basic math - and the numbers don't add up. You are doing what you feel is best for you. I am doing what is perfect for me. I do not begrudge you that - I only ask that you not make assumptions about my situation and my future. I say again - I would not give up one moment of this, ever. Nor do I even think about another owning me later in life. My connection with him is too deep, and no one ever could.

TPEOwner -> RE: Age (12/29/2006 9:17:52 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: JohnWarren Of course since my first set of nipple clamps were triobites... live triobites, I can't qualify for membership in ANY age limited group. Of course, some people feel more comfortable locking doors and not being around "different" people. They form country clubs, religions and klans. It's fine with me as long as they are upfront about their limitations, but I do feel they are missing something. What's really funny (and this has happened to me) is when one of these organizations want a presenter who isn't from their restrictive class and magnanimously offer to cut a hole in the barbed wire and lower the drawbridge for the person they wouldn't mix with unless he or she had something they wanted. The term "hypocrite" sorta comes to mind. Of course, what's worse is for the "honoured exception" to come through the door that is locked for all his kindred. So you're the one who stole my triobites.... I don't see these type groups as missing something at all. Every sub (no pun intended) group is restrictive, that's why they are sub groups. When you go to a fetish club that requires fetish clothing or leather, they are restrictive. I can't join VFW, because they don't recognize cold war veterans as having served in war time. I'm considering suing the Red Sox because they refuse to let me play right field just because I can't hit major league pitching. These type groups don't limit choices, they add to them. Though I can't join TNG groups, there are still just as many groups that I can join as there were before they came to be. There are Jewish BDSM groups, and Christian, spankers only, women only, men only, and who knows how many this or that only bdsm groups. They all are choices for people who desire to make those choices. Now I think I'm going to take off my shoes and shirt and see if I can get into the supermarket.....

agirl -> RE: Age (12/29/2006 11:46:59 AM)
I'd have no problem with being the younger person if there was a big age disparity........I have far less of of a problem thinking that I might have to care for someone else than I would if I was the older person and having to be cared for. I think I'm probably more comfortable falling apart with someone who's falling apart at pretty much the same rate.....lol Having had (and still have, to a degree) a relationship with someone 20 yrs younger than myself, I know the insecurities that affected me. Like ownedgirlie, I can't imagine anyone else owning me.....what I have is a bit of a one off. Also, I don't really care that much about having someone....I've never searched for partners. The ones I've had just happened along. agirl

TypeAsub1 -> RE: Age (12/29/2006 1:19:28 PM)
LOL.. certainly individual factors CAN change the outcome. However - if anyone here has ever studied 'probability' or worked in the insurance industry.. or known someone who works as an 'underwriter'.. you will find that statistically, the facts I am using are quite sound. So if you choose to gamble that your unique situation will turn out differently than the probable outcome of most others in that situation.. by all means, take that risk. I, however, prefer not to take that risk. The insurance industries are very wealthy companies... they've made billions by using these kinds of statistics to predict who will live, die, get sick, have car accidents etc. Sometimes they are wrong - however, WAY more frequently.. they are right. I'm gonna put my money, behind a horse that I know can win. That's my approach. It's not for everyone.. but it is for me.

Devilslilsister -> RE: Age (12/29/2006 1:45:05 PM)
Thank you for those that have responded. Merc, i see what you are saying and i do agree with it. I obviously didnt think of that at first. I know that some of the crowd younger then me enjoys loud rap music and i would prefer to bang my head against a wall. So i doooooo understand the difference in interests and problems and all that. I can see that having age restricted groups might be more interesting for the younger crows as certian rules might be off setting to them. I do understand there is a major difference in generations. Which i suppose is why age related groups seperate off. I can understand that. The younger crowd (generally) doesnt want to sit around and drink wine and listen to classical music while the older crowd doesnt want to have rap music blasted in their ears while they watch everyone screw everyone else and possibly catch and STD. What you say does make sense. It just seems to be wise to learn from the older generations and to exclude them is to also exclude their knowledge. Granted not all those that are older are wiser, but if you get 30 people of the older generation you are going to get some extra bit of wisdom. I suppose, it is that we must all learn from our own mistakes and its why we never listened to those older then us when we were young. No matter how many people told me to "enjoy my youth" i didnt actually listen until i lost my youth. Live and learn. Some things you have to learn the hard way. This i get and i understand the desire for the age restrictive groups. Its not as dumb as i orginally thought. Although, i still think its cutting off your nose despite your face! <smiles> As my father says "as kids get older thier parents get smarter" To me, that says a lot. i also didnt expect you or anyone else to toot your own horn. The wise man knows he has alot to learn. LAM - i completely agree. I also think the whole depends thing can be a bit kinky. Imagine the humiliation factor involved... oooo So i stand mostly corrected. (i think if you include everyone, you tend to learn alot more and not get restricted information)

agirl -> RE: Age (12/29/2006 1:53:57 PM)
I don't see what gamble there is. Having a relationship of any type is rather nice but it's not my drive in life.......lol. agirl

dawntreader -> RE: Age (12/29/2006 2:27:57 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: JohnWarren Another amusing take on this is the people who claim in their profile that they aren't looking for a partner and are just seeking friends/information/whatever, but then add they don't want to hear from anyone more than X years older than they are. I regularly write notes to people who live in areas where I know a bit about the offline scene letting them know their alternative option. I also write to people with certain interests, again with information for them. An amazing number of these emails are never opened. Their loss i would agree especially since the e-mail came from you!

dawntreader -> RE: Age (12/29/2006 2:38:11 PM)
i agree! i am totally delusional about my age LOL! and i have found wisdom in all age groups...

dawntreader -> RE: Age (12/29/2006 2:42:17 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SusanofO Considering I didn't really even start exploring bdsm at all intil I was about 43 years old, at 46 I'd like to think I am just on the verge of hitting my exploratory prime. There's absolutley nothing I can do about my age at all. So I just try to keep myself fit and as attractive as I can. I believe there is also something to be said for the widom some people can gain as a result of aging. I don't worry about some things I worried about at 25 or 30 - there's just plain too much that has happened in my life for me to really sweat over what I consider much "small stuff" anymore. Ocasionally I do - but by far, not as often as I did back then. To me, that's a bonus of being my age. - Susan i am right with you on this one! Infact, life is a hell of alot more fun now...there are no plans in my future of "going out to pasture" :-)

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