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RE: Are we really that different? - 1/2/2007 7:39:45 AM   
NorthernGent


Posts: 8730
Joined: 7/10/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SirKenin

What strikes Me is the attitudes and politics.  They are currently VERY different.  The British on here appear to be very socialist, on the verge of communist, and the American politics seem to be very paranoid, to the point of schizophrenia.  The other interesting thing is that American politics appears to be very segregated and polar.  Not a happy medium, but extremists.  You have the liberal extremists on one side, the conservative extremists on the other.

There is a distinct lack of centrism, which I am, so that is why I do not even waste My time.  Nobody is interested in what the other person has to say.  Nobody is interested in finding a middle ground, either British or American.  They only try to bash their opponents over the head with their ideals and run them into the ground into a state of compliance.

It really is quite pathetic.



It's funny how different people take different things from messages.

I would say the politics are nowhere near as different I was expecting. I would say what...a 65/35 split right and left on this board? In Britain it's probably 55/45 so not that much difference.

Kenin, how you've arrived at the conclusion that the British on this board are "socialist, on the verge of communist" is mind-boggling. Of the Brits who post on here only two could be described as left-leaning (unless I'm forgetting a couple). Now, I'm nowhere near a socialist and I doubt MC is. The rest appear to be centre ground or right of centre.

I tell you what though Kenin, I remember a conversation I had with you when I first joined this board and one of your messages was along the lines of "well, all the lazy fuckers on the left should get off their arses and get a job". Now, that's about as centrist as Pol Pot.

My intention is not to turn this thread into a petty tit-for-tat name calling exercise but to politiely point out that maybe you're misunderstanding posters' intentions and beliefs.

Ditto, with your summary of American poltics on this board. Some people couldn't care less about politics, others could but can't be arsed with arguing the same points until the cows come home, some are very, very suspicious of government intentions, some lean to the right and talk like British Conservatives, others are centre, some are to the left. Just like Britian really with the slight difference being there is probably a slightly higher percentage of people on this board who lean to the right than there is in British society. A point worth bearing in mind if you have an interest in British politics - from 1979-1997 we had a very conservative government who won convincingly at each election. Since 1997, we have had a Labour Government acting like conservatives because we are a conservative nation at heart (to the extent that it was believed in the 80s that a left leaning government would never happen again in Britain). You know what, the French and Germans are shit scared of our politics, they think we're a pack of greedy profiteers who have no regard for social welfare. It is a serious misconception to think that British politics is dominated by those from the left. You couldn't be further from the truth.

You say nobody is interested in what the other person has to say, are you sure? As far as I can see there is some healthy debate going on.


_____________________________

I have the courage to be a coward - but not beyond my limits.

Sooner or later, the man who wins is the man who thinks he can.

(in reply to SirKenin)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Are we really that different? - 1/2/2007 7:52:42 AM   
meatcleaver


Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline 		Got to agree. I'm no where near communist even though some left wing ideas inform my politics but then again, some rightwing ideas inform my politics too, though I used to be far more leftwing in my youth but most people are or so I'm led to believe.

NG is right about the perception of Britain on the European continent. If I didn't know Britain by being British, I would think Britain is right out on the right in Bush country from what I see on the TV news and read in the European papers.

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There are fascists who consider themselves humanitarians, like cannibals on a health kick, eating only vegetarians.

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RE: Are we really that different? - 1/2/2007 8:02:06 AM   
SirKenin


Posts: 2994
Joined: 10/31/2004
From: Barrie, ON Canada
Status: offline 		I am going to have to challenge you to find that quote and cite it in context while you are at it I am afraid.

As for politics, you probably do not see it because you are in the thick of it, right in with the rest of them.  You are very socialist, as far to that communist extreme as I have seen so far.  It is always hardest to analyze yourself.

See, I take a middle ground.  I will bash conservatives every bit as much as I will bash the liberals.  I can not stand polarization or extremism.   The line of thinking demonstrated on this board is the same line of thinking that has nearly torn the United States as a whole in two.  In fact before long it will.  The US will fall from grace, fall from power and will eventuallly fall off the map altogether, just like Rome and all those before her (Egypt is another).

It is literally a case of the blind leading the blind.  None of you will compromise.  You call it healthy debate.  There is nothing healthy about it.  You do not give an inch.  Ever.  You are forever convinced that you are right and everyone else is wrong.  And, of course, so is everyone else that enters into discourse with you.  That is not healthy.  You are trying to ram your ideals down someone else's throat.  To be honest, the political debates on this board have driven some really good people away from CM altogether because they are nothing short of boring, repetitive, nonsensical and just plain atrocious.

Have you ever listened to yourself on a tape recorder?  Well, try doing that with your discussions some time.

Then, the rampant, ridiculous, unfounded paranoia and conspiracies that bounce around here are nothing short of childish National Enquirer material.  Complete and utter garbage, and representative of the thinking of a large number of Americans.  They thrive on that bullshit.  There is no evidence for it.  All of it has been soundly refuted.  Yet continuously you get the same trolls bringing the same shit up, over and over again.  Have you ever met a schizophrenic?  I have met a few of them.  They think exactly the same way.  The only difference is that they are hospitalized.  This trash is just allowed to run rampant.  America thrives on this shit.  Look at all the supermarket tabloids.  They all consist of the same shit, and they are a multimillion dollar industry.

As far as I know, the British are substantially smarter than to fall for that crap.  I am not aware of a thriving superstition/conspiracy theory/paranoia industry over there.

I realize that Britain had a distinctly conservative government for years, but the tides have changed.  You are very much left leaning now.

Unfortunately Canada has taken a moderate lean to the right.  A minority government, but still to the right nonetheless.  Typically we sit very much to the center, which I really like.  It affords equal opportunity and rights for everyone.

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Hi. I don't care. Thanks.

Wicca: Pretending to be an ancient religion since 1956

Catholic Church: Serving up guilt since 107 AD.

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Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Are we really that different? - 1/2/2007 8:19:44 AM   
NorthernGent


Posts: 8730
Joined: 7/10/2006
Status: offline 		Kenin, are you on drugs?

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I have the courage to be a coward - but not beyond my limits.

Sooner or later, the man who wins is the man who thinks he can.

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Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Are we really that different? - 1/2/2007 8:36:30 AM   
meatcleaver


Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline 		One of the problems I suppose on these boards is that we don't see a each other's politics in the context of where we live. To me my brother is a rabid capitalist and he fits in nicely where he lives in California and his friends I have met consider me a Karl Marx clone while I have two American friends, one Californian and one from Maine that have lived in Europe for ten years and think my politics are moderate and think America is generally very rightwing.

Funny old world.

_____________________________

There are fascists who consider themselves humanitarians, like cannibals on a health kick, eating only vegetarians.

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Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Are we really that different? - 1/2/2007 8:39:39 AM   
missturbation


Posts: 8290
Joined: 2/12/2006
From: another planet
Status: offline 		 I was hoping to keep this away from a heavy political debate. I know politics is something we Brits and Americans may differ in opinions of but if at all possible can we not turn this into a political argument i will not understand?

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What you don't witness with your eyes, don't witness with your mouth. Proverb.

If it fit's in a toaster, i can cook it.

Buying 10 item's or less is not shopping !!

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RE: Are we really that different? - 1/2/2007 8:46:47 AM   
KeirasSecret


Posts: 415
Joined: 8/17/2006
From: central NH
Status: offline 		LoL...little old ladies in cadillacs. Is a roundabout the same as a walkabout?

Be well,

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Bitching; whining in a louder voice.

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RE: Are we really that different? - 1/2/2007 8:56:17 AM   
NorthernGent


Posts: 8730
Joined: 7/10/2006
Status: offline 		American products sell well in Britain. From films, music, television, clothes, fast food etc. There has to be a certain amount of similarities otherwise they wouldn't sell here.

_____________________________

I have the courage to be a coward - but not beyond my limits.

Sooner or later, the man who wins is the man who thinks he can.

(in reply to KeirasSecret)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Are we really that different? - 1/2/2007 8:58:03 AM   
SirKenin


Posts: 2994
Joined: 10/31/2004
From: Barrie, ON Canada
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent

American products sell well in Britain. From films, music, television, clothes, fast food etc. There has to be a certain amount of similarities otherwise they wouldn't sell here.


Uh.  Not really.  It's called consumerism.  Or literally translated "Gimme. Gimme" and it's a constant in every wealthy nation the world over.

The films and stuff, music, television, everything can be said for every major country in the world.

< Message edited by SirKenin -- 1/2/2007 9:03:18 AM >

_____________________________

Hi. I don't care. Thanks.

Wicca: Pretending to be an ancient religion since 1956

Catholic Church: Serving up guilt since 107 AD.

(in reply to NorthernGent)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Are we really that different? - 1/2/2007 9:00:32 AM   
missturbation


Posts: 8290
Joined: 2/12/2006
From: another planet
Status: offline 		Now you are just spoiling for a fight

_____________________________

What you don't witness with your eyes, don't witness with your mouth. Proverb.

If it fit's in a toaster, i can cook it.

Buying 10 item's or less is not shopping !!

(in reply to SirKenin)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Are we really that different? - 1/2/2007 9:03:28 AM   
SirKenin


Posts: 2994
Joined: 10/31/2004
From: Barrie, ON Canada
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation

Now you are just spoiling for a fight


Got Me boxing gloves right here...  Put your dukes up. 

I just do not like it when people misrepresent the facts to try and make themselves sound knowledgeable or to reinforce their own points.  Sucks.

_____________________________

Hi. I don't care. Thanks.

Wicca: Pretending to be an ancient religion since 1956

Catholic Church: Serving up guilt since 107 AD.

(in reply to missturbation)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Are we really that different? - 1/2/2007 9:07:47 AM   
Nosathro


Posts: 3319
Joined: 9/25/2005
From: Orange County, California
Status: offline 		greetings missturbation
 
Yes we are different, but that is what make us both unique. 
 
I wish you well
 
Nosathro
 
P.S. I am not paranoid....I know everyone is out to get me

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(in reply to missturbation)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: Are we really that different? - 1/2/2007 9:09:47 AM   
missturbation


Posts: 8290
Joined: 2/12/2006
From: another planet
Status: offline 		I suck but thats not a bad thing surely?
 
Put ur dukes up lol - reminds me of a song !!
 
*Sings*
 
Well you're the real tough cookie with the long history
Of breaking little hearts, like the one in me
That's O.K., lets see how you do it
Put up your dukes, lets get down to it!
Hit Me With Your Best Shot!
Why Don't You Hit Me With Your Best Shot!
Hit Me With Your Best Shot!
Fire Away!

Pat Benatar

_____________________________

What you don't witness with your eyes, don't witness with your mouth. Proverb.

If it fit's in a toaster, i can cook it.

Buying 10 item's or less is not shopping !!

(in reply to SirKenin)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Are we really that different? - 1/2/2007 9:12:53 AM   
cjenny


Posts: 1736
Joined: 11/27/2006
Status: offline 		missturbation,
I am glad you opened this thread. I think it clarifies some of the difficulty that you and I had on the 'other' thread when I tried *poorly* to explain that cultural differences do exist, and that they do have influence in ones view of things.
whisperedsighs said:
~
He was suprised that I enjoyed british humor.  Said that most american's don't get it because they don't have the sense of history that the british have.  There is a depth of history, and richness to the british history that americans just will never get because america is so much newer and has never had such things happen to it as a country that the british have had to get through.  I think he has a point there.  Of course coming from a different country or area of the world you will have a different cultural outlook to things, a different way of communicating. 
~
That is really the point that I tried to make. I am sorry if you thought I was slamming you for being British, I wasn't. I was trying to show that history & culture are things that form the way we see the world & react to things. A common language IS shared which makes it seem that we shouldn't have differences but we do.

(in reply to missturbation)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Are we really that different? - 1/2/2007 9:16:16 AM   
missturbation


Posts: 8290
Joined: 2/12/2006
From: another planet
Status: offline 		No i didn't think you were slamming me at all
No apology needed.
I just wanted to understand a little better why we do seem to have a lot of misunderstandings here. I know some can be put down to misreading and presumprion but not all. I think this thread has made things a little clearer. There are those who genuinely just dont get the sense of humour, context etc of a post and those who just want to misread and fight.

_____________________________

What you don't witness with your eyes, don't witness with your mouth. Proverb.

If it fit's in a toaster, i can cook it.

Buying 10 item's or less is not shopping !!

(in reply to cjenny)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Are we really that different? - 1/2/2007 9:22:52 AM   
Marc2b


Posts: 6660
Joined: 8/7/2006
Status: offline 		Misturbation said:
quote:

Curiosity has the better of me now lol. I'm asking that this please doesn't turn into a slanging match or pissing contest. . . etc.


You’re are absolutely right about how tone does not come across in the written word. A Good natured poke in the ribs is not recognized for what it is. I do not think we are all that different, most of America’s cultural and political underpinnings come from Britain after all. Still, our divergent history (starting with the North American colonization), our interactions with other cultures (via immigration, etc.), and our embrace of dentistry, has produced some significant differences. People from different countries are just going to naturally have different world views.

This all brings to mind something someone once said (but I forget who so all due credit to whoever credit is due): the British think six hundred years is a short time and six hundred miles is a long distance while the Americans think six hundred years is a long time and six hundred miles is a short difference.

Many people do dismiss other’s opinions because of nationality (not to mention religion, political orientation, ethnicity, and just about anything else that makes people different, but it is a cheap and lazy cop-out from critical thinking with the added bonus of allowing one to feel superior.

RealOne said:
quote:

in the states, we thrive on sensationalism, drama, anything dead brain so we dont have to think.


Speak for yourself please.

MarieToo said:
quote:

But I think when people speak the same 'language'. . . "


Wasn’t it Winston Churchill who quipped that America and Britain were two countries separated by a common language?

SirKennin said:
quote:

I can not stand polarization or extremism.

Me too. The ideologue is the greatest enemy of the human freedom.

and:
quote:

The line of thinking demonstrated on this board is the same line of thinking that has nearly torn the United States as a whole in two. In fact before long it will.


Again, me too. I see the vitriol, the paranoia, and the outright hatred growing day by day. No one listens to each other anymore, they just dig their heels in and refuse to even consider other options or even that their "enemies," aren’t really enemies at all – just people with a differing point of view. I truly fear that the United States is heading toward a second civil war. Probably within the next twenty years. It’s a damn shame because it doesn’t have to be that way.

Now, somebody cue the Benny Hill music so we can all have a good laugh.

_____________________________

Do you know what the most awesome thing about being an Atheist is? You're not required to hate anybody!

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Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Are we really that different? - 1/2/2007 9:34:31 AM   
kisshou


Posts: 2425
Joined: 2/11/2005
Status: offline 		I just kept thinking of Monty Python who tons of people love but I never found funny.

In what way do the people from the US seem paranoid?

(in reply to missturbation)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Are we really that different? - 1/2/2007 9:37:53 AM   
missturbation


Posts: 8290
Joined: 2/12/2006
From: another planet
Status: offline 		I don't find Monty python funny either so you are definately not alone there.
 
In what way do the people from the US seem paranoid?
It was in response to another thread where conspiracy theories were mentioned. America just seems to have so many, 9/11, elvis, aliens, marilyn monroe, j f kennedy etc etc.
Im not proud that i made that comment it was judgemental and i try not to judge if possible.

_____________________________

What you don't witness with your eyes, don't witness with your mouth. Proverb.

If it fit's in a toaster, i can cook it.

Buying 10 item's or less is not shopping !!

(in reply to kisshou)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Are we really that different? - 1/2/2007 9:38:16 AM   
SirKenin


Posts: 2994
Joined: 10/31/2004
From: Barrie, ON Canada
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation

I suck but thats not a bad thing surely?
 
Put ur dukes up lol - reminds me of a song !!
 
*Sings*
 
Well you're the real tough cookie with the long history
Of breaking little hearts, like the one in me
That's O.K., lets see how you do it
Put up your dukes, lets get down to it!
Hit Me With Your Best Shot!
Why Don't You Hit Me With Your Best Shot!
Hit Me With Your Best Shot!
Fire Away!

Pat Benatar


We will have none of that Americanization today, thanks.  But if sucks is American then fuck it, I can live with that.

lol

_____________________________

Hi. I don't care. Thanks.

Wicca: Pretending to be an ancient religion since 1956

Catholic Church: Serving up guilt since 107 AD.

(in reply to missturbation)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Are we really that different? - 1/2/2007 9:48:21 AM   
missturbation


Posts: 8290
Joined: 2/12/2006
From: another planet
Status: offline 		Lol we Brits do say it sucks but personally im more likely to say it 'blows'.
I'm twinkie means im horny but for Americans its some kind of cake!?!
Minger - thats one ive found most Americans ive spoken to dont get - it means fubared, very ugly.
We also usea lot of cockney rhyming in my house - things like 'i havent got a scooby ' = (scooby doo) clue, 'ruby murry' - curry.
We call a  man we'd do a burger.
A man we'd die to do a big mac.
I think my house is just full of raving nutters.
 
 

_____________________________

What you don't witness with your eyes, don't witness with your mouth. Proverb.

If it fit's in a toaster, i can cook it.

Buying 10 item's or less is not shopping !!

(in reply to SirKenin)
Profile   Post #: 40
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