D/s and deep love...can it exist? (Full Version)

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slavebrandyj -> D/s and deep love...can it exist? (1/2/2007 7:47:39 AM)

First, I want to state that I am not new to Collarme. I had another profile that I wish to bury. It is the one that helped me find the love of my life. The Dominant Lady that had me under consideration for a little less then a year. She is a member here and has several friends here also. So one reason I chose to make a new ID is to protect Her identity. She is a very private person and does not wish to share Her personal life. Maybe I do to much. I tend to wear my feelings on my sleeve for all the world to see.  
I have been told that love and D/s cannot co-exist, or at best is rare. I find that hard to believe since the trust and honesty that is required to make a D/s power exchange work seems to be the root or even a starting point for love to grow and exist. However, I am having some doubts since I see so many Dominant Women that state they only want a service sub or in other ways state that they are not looking for love. So many state that the subs needs and wants are not important and it is only their needs and wants to be satisfied. Good luck with that attitude in finding a sub or slave that is sincere. He will get his fill of being walked on and used real fast. Some guys will do anything to have their kinks met. That is not to say that my Domme's needs don't come first, they do! But let's be real, I would not be a slave or sub if I did not have my needs and wants fore-filled too.
Other evidents to me is the amount of Dommes that want more then one slave, a stable of them or whatever you want to call it. Personally, I don't believe love can exist in that type of arrangement. At least not the kind of love I need and want. To each their own respectfully.
Please, I do not mean to step on any toes with my own personal beliefs about poly or multiple subs and slaves. It's just not something I would have anything to do with personally . I am not here to debate that issue and respect those that desire or live and believe in it. I am not throwing stones so be kind if you are a Domme that has more then one sub or slave or are poly. I am just pointing it out as to perhaps why I feel so many Dominant women seem to shy away from love and only want the D/s power exchange one on one.  One on one monogamous D/s relationships is my focus and all I want out of our chosen lifestyle. I will however state that does not mean "play" or scening with others if that is what that loving, caring couple agree upon. I know my Heart-breaker and I had talked about it with certain limitations that we both agreed upon.  
Here is the part I do not understand and am dealing with: She said that She does not see us going any further to our mutual desire to find a life partner and our need and want for a loving D/s relationship where Her slave/sub would be offered and accept Her collar of ownership. Which I would in a heartbeat! Yet, She says She loves me, just not on the same level that I love Her. I just don't understand that.
She further made it clear that She wants me to remain in Her life. She said I can e-mail Her, IM Her if I want to; And I think She wants me to. But She said that talking on the phone would be to hard for Her right now.   Now I wonder at what level and why She wants me in Her life. Just a friend or what? I don't get it.
No, She is not just being kind by saying those things. I know one thing about Her for sure. She is the most honest, most honorable woman I have ever known. She will never say anything She does not mean. so what level of love is this love She has for me?  I mean we love our friends, we love our family, our dog etc. So where does someone that was once very close and heading for a life partner relationship fit in to Her life now? How am I to conduct myself and remain in Her life while jealousy and pain can continue when and if She finds another sub/slave to consider?
Don't tell me to just forget Her and move on. I can't. I love Her that much. I can't turn love on and off like a faucet. And I know for a fact, neither can She. I did nothing wrong to cause this. No harsh words, no disobedience on my part, no cheating or lying...nothing! She made this decision in what seemed like over night. Could it be hasty on Her part? Is She afraid of love? Or am I to believe that after months the chemistry is just not there?
I might add that this is a long distance relationship. We have both traveled to be with each other several times. Plans were for one or the other to move to the other. Hell, I'd move to the end of the world for Her. 
So I wonder...are many of the Dominant women I have met or at least read their profiles so jaded because of men in their lives that used and hurt them so much that they can't trust and love at the level needed to have and to hold a one on one loving D/s relationship? I have heard of many that have trust issues with men and have had their hearts broiken so much that they can't love deeply again. Of course after this, maybe I will feel that way myself. This is my second love relatinship with a Domme. The difference is, the first one cheated, lied and was nothing more then a player. But stupid me was blind for over 3 years. This is not the case with this highly respected Lady that has been in the lifestyle 3 times longer then me.
OK, I am reaching out for answers and help. My heart is broken and this is my way of tryng to get by with the healing process. So I sincerely apprecaite Yur time in reading and commenting on the issue at hand, NOT the part about other types of relationships that I used merely as examples of perhaps why (IMHO), some Dominant woman may have trouble with one on one loving D/s relationships.
 
I know many of You here in this forum and respect your opinions. After all, we are all here to listen, learn, share and even help if possible. I have the highest respect for some of You even though You live a lifestyle within the bountries of D/s or BDSM,  that is not right for me. So please, do not flame me for my beliefs. I do not need that right now. Be kind OK?         



Stephann -> RE: D/s and deep love...can it exist? (1/2/2007 7:59:13 AM)

Explaining love is a nightmare. 

I look at modern art, and I love it.  The guy next to me sees the same art, and hates it.  Neither of us is wrong, but we both have different tastes, ideals, beliefs, expectations, and a whole host of emotional, mental, and psychological drives and experiences that go into that one piece of art.

This might not sound overly supportive, but I hope you can see the value.  Your Domme did you great service in putting a halt to things now.  Rather than try to 'settle' in a situation she's not happy in, she is giving you the opportunity to find someone who will love you 100%, the way you deserve.  Understandably, your heart is broken - but you will find love, again.

Real love does exist, just like real art.  Art doesn't have to love you back, though.  When you have it, you'll know - and so will that person.  Until then, try to consider that sometimes we aren't in love with the person, but rather the idea of that person.  It can take about a year for that 'being in love with love' feeling to wear off, and see what has grown in the meantime.

Don't lose heart, or hope - you've been given a chance to find the perfect partner for you.  Spend a couple days with a bottle of bourbon (or twenty packets of green tea, or whatever your favority comfort food is) and enjoy the carthisis.  Then get back to living, loving, meeting, and being with people who make you happy.  Sooner or later, they'll come along.

Stephan



blmtrsne -> RE: D/s and deep love...can it exist? (1/2/2007 8:07:45 AM)

My husband/slave loves me, and he loves me even more because I understand his position. It just fits. I'm happy and so is he.



LaTigresse -> RE: D/s and deep love...can it exist? (1/2/2007 8:20:02 AM)

I would hope that the two facets of a relationship can co-exist. If not then I am doomed to be alone. I don't want a casual play/service relationship.
I mean, hey, if a guy wants to come and clean my gutters then go home and call that service, its all good. But that is not MY focus, I want a life partner and she had better be as commited to all aspects of the relationship as I am. The gutter cleaner, welllllllll if thats his kink we will be happy to watch and direct.



LotusSong -> RE: D/s and deep love...can it exist? (1/2/2007 8:35:03 AM)

In my D/s life, I am a one-sub-woman.  Want to know why?  My sub has been with me, 10 years this April.  Early on, when I would play with another he would be my assistant and tend to me afterward, but I could see the hurt in his eyes.  His loyalty and patience meant more to me than any casual play partner.



slavebrandyj -> RE: D/s and deep love...can it exist? (1/2/2007 8:37:35 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

I would hope that the two facets of a relationship can co-exist. If not then I am doomed to be alone. I don't want a casual play/service relationship.


I can't agree with you more LaTigresse. I want and need a loving bond that is one and the same as a loving D/s relationship. For me, I don't wnat one wihtout the other. Thank you for your showing me that soem do want and need the same thing and I am not alone with this desire.



thetammyjo -> RE: D/s and deep love...can it exist? (1/2/2007 8:38:53 AM)

The way people love each other is never the same because each of us is a different person. No matter how alike we may seem there are many differences. Of course I don't love my slave the same way he loves me; I don't love my husband the same way he loves me -- I can't, I'm not either of them.

I have never understood the idea that one can only love one person when it comes to adult romantic relationships. Does a parent only love one of their children? Does a pet owner love only one of their pets? Do you fall in love with one person and lose the ability to love again should something happen to that one person? These must be really small hearted people to have only room for one in their lives.

However none of this is really important, slavebrandyj, if you have an expectation that isn't being met in a relationship. As long a that's not being met, you will suffer on some level.

So you have choices.

1) move on and try to find someone who is closer to your expectations; I think this is unlikely to work unless you also take the next choice

2) work on your expectations and making them more realistic

Many folks have high expectations and that is fine unless you constantly find yourself unhappy. Then I think you have to ask yourself how realistic those expectations are. Too many people think there are only two choices -- their high expectations or no expectations. Think of your expectations, see them as a line of different concepts or points, now more those points up and down the line from the two extremes until you are looking for something that fulfills what you want but offers you a realistic chance to successful find a partnership.

Of course, you could always chose to just give up on any relationship but that doesn't sound too good to me. Temping when we are upset and disappointed, sure, but again it denies you the possblity to succeed.



slavebrandyj -> RE: D/s and deep love...can it exist? (1/2/2007 8:42:07 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong

In my D/s life, I am a one-sub-woman.  Want to know why?  My sub has been with me, 10 years this April.  Early on, when I would play with another he would be my assistant and tend to me afterward, but I could see the hurt in his eyes.  His loyalty and patience meant more to me than any casual play partner.


There is hope! I just hope my looyalty and patience will mean something to my...(what do I call Her now?) Well, the Lady I love with every fiber of my being. And if She sees it, will it make a difference? Only time will tell.
Thank You Ms. Lotus



Jill805 -> RE: D/s and deep love...can it exist? (1/2/2007 8:53:45 AM)

I have read many of the forums here and not responded before, but felt the need to share this with you.  D/s and deep love CAN exist.  How do I know this?  Because my sub and I were together for 25 years, married for 20 of those years and only separated by his death 10 years ago.  I was totally devastated by this unexpected event after living the lifestyle that neither of us even knew WAS a lifestyle, to us it was just the way we lived our lives.

However, time goes on and so must I, so here I am now knowing that there is a lifestyle and looking again for that most difficult thing to find.  I am a Domme looking for a companion, lover, friend who also needs to serve as much as I need to dominate.  I know it is possible, I have done it once...................



slavebrandyj -> RE: D/s and deep love...can it exist? (1/2/2007 9:33:30 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: thetammyjo

quote:

I have never understood the idea that one can only love one person when it comes to adult romantic relationships.[quote/] 
 
 And I have never understood how anyone can compare love of their children or pet with romantic love. Seems to me to be a more watered down version of romantic love to me. Romantic love and love of your children or pet are not the same thing at all. Like comparing oranges to apples. 
 
quote:

Do you fall in love with one person and lose the ability to love again should something happen to that one person?


No, not at all. But how about one at a time? Or is it lust and having a big sexual appetite the draw to having more then one? Somebody is getting less then your full attention. Romantic love to me means giving of one's self to only one. But maybe I'm an idealist hanging on to the way I was raised and lead to believe it is supposed to be.

quote:

These must be really small hearted people to have only room for one in their lives.


I definitely disagree with this. In fact it is perhaps the other way around. A small hearted person that does not have the capacity to devote all of their love romantically to just one.

quote:

However none of this is really important, slavebrandyj, if you have an expectation that isn't being met in a relationship. As long a that's not being met, you will suffer on some level.


Now that I can agree with. But that is a no brainer.

So you have choices.

1) move on and try to find someone who is closer to your expectations; I think this is unlikely to work unless you also take the next choice

quote:

  2) work on your expectations and making them more realistic


Now this sounds like I should lower my values and settle for less then what I need and want.

quote:

Many folks have high expectations and that is fine unless you constantly find yourself unhappy. Then I think you have to ask yourself how realistic those expectations are. Too many people think there are only two choices -- their high expectations or no expectations. Think of your expectations, see them as a line of different concepts or points, now more those points up and down the line from the two extremes until you are looking for something that fulfills what you want but offers you a realistic chance to successful find a partnership.


And what's so high about having expectations of a one on one loving D/s relationship? I won't lower it by sharing my heart with more then one romantically. And to me anything less is lower then the way it should be. But that's me and I think the majority of both men and women feel. Maybe not in D/s relationships;The voter is still out on that. But not in a one on one love relationship.  

quote:

Of course, you could always chose to just give up on any relationship but that doesn't sound too good to me. Temping when we are upset and disappointed, sure, but again it denies you the possblity to succeed.


Nope, not a good choice at all. But I am not giving up on this one either. Not yet.
 
Tammyjo, you and I have different expectations and values when it comes to romantic love. That does not make me right and you wrong. It just makes us different and surely would be very incompatible as D/s partners is all. I however respect your opinion and your lifestyle choices.
Thank you.



hammernhoney -> RE: D/s and deep love...can it exist? (1/2/2007 9:49:04 AM)

AN interesting subject and I don't know if anyone has the correct answer for you..MY yahoo away mesage is this"WHAT DOES LOVE HAVE TO DO WITH THIS SLAVE GIRL"I can love another slave or sub in my own way but not the deep romantic way for my heart and world belongs to my wife...WILLAIAM AKA BOUNTYHUNTER



TigressOfDs -> RE: D/s and deep love...can it exist? (1/2/2007 9:55:27 AM)

I typically don't' respond on the boards because so many others that are far wiser than I say it for me (-:   But this time I just couldn't help myself  brandyj It's possible for two people to meet, and after having spent quality time with each other come to the conclusion that loving someone doesn't equate or guarantee falling "in love".  for some loving is a natural feeling for those we care about as human beings ... ok, like a close friend, sister, brother etc ... being "in love" requires a lot more ... like total trust, honor, commitment and above all being the same person in 90 days that you were on the first date.    Just because two people can't love on the same level doesn't mean either of them lacks the ability, has to many past issues to cope ,or allow love ... nor does it indicate the person doesn't want to fall in love.  It simply means the two people in question didn't work... rather due to chemistry, moral ethics, financial status, sexual performance or any other entity in shared mutual interest.     AND  this issue reminds me so much of a poem my grandmother gave me as a teenager (a poem that until somewhere in the 90's was author unknown ...now claimed by many) 
 
“After a while you learn the subtle difference
between holding a hand and chaining a soul.
And you learn that love doesn’t mean leaning
and company isn’t security.
Kisses aren’t contracts and presents aren’t promises.
 
After awhile you begin to accept your defeats
with your head up and your eyes open,
with the grace of a woman, not the grief of a child.
And you learn to build your roads on today
because tomorrow’s ground is too uncertain
and the inevitable has a way of crumbling in mid-flight.
 
After a while you learn that even sunshine burns
if you stand too long in one place.
 
So, plant your own garden and decorate your own soul
instead of waiting for someone else to bring you flowers.
Then you learn you really can endure,
 

 



TigressOfDs -> RE: D/s and deep love...can it exist? (1/2/2007 10:00:40 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Stephann

Explaining love is a nightmare. 

I look at modern art, and I love it.  The guy next to me sees the same art, and hates it.  Neither of us is wrong, but we both have different tastes, ideals, beliefs, expectations, and a whole host of emotional, mental, and psychological drives and experiences that go into that one piece of art.

This might not sound overly supportive, but I hope you can see the value.  Your Domme did you great service in putting a halt to things now.  Rather than try to 'settle' in a situation she's not happy in, she is giving you the opportunity to find someone who will love you 100%, the way you deserve.  Understandably, your heart is broken - but you will find love, again.

Real love does exist, just like real art.  Art doesn't have to love you back, though.  When you have it, you'll know - and so will that person.  Until then, try to consider that sometimes we aren't in love with the person, but rather the idea of that person.  It can take about a year for that 'being in love with love' feeling to wear off, and see what has grown in the meantime.

Don't lose heart, or hope - you've been given a chance to find the perfect partner for you.  Spend a couple days with a bottle of bourbon (or twenty packets of green tea, or whatever your favority comfort food is) and enjoy the carthisis.  Then get back to living, loving, meeting, and being with people who make you happy.  Sooner or later, they'll come along.

Stephan


 
 
 
WOW ... see. this is why I don't post often ... so many say it better  !! 



LotusSong -> RE: D/s and deep love...can it exist? (1/2/2007 10:02:00 AM)

I think as we get older, we look for security.  That one person to grow old with. 
 
The fun and games of our 20/30/40's no longer offer that.  Friendships come and go.  It's harsh, but true.. the older we get the less desireable we become.  Even the communes of the 60's failed...  




onestandingstill -> RE: D/s and deep love...can it exist? (1/2/2007 11:17:51 AM)

I've often heard from subs their Master/Mistresses can't love them in an in love type of dynamic as it affects their ability to be a Master/Mistress.
They claim the love will make them soft.
I have also heard multitudes of sub/slaves that feel like you and I do.
In my opinion unless there's real in love, love between my Dom and I there's no way I'd be willing to literally lay my life in their hands to do with as they choose.

I don't understand why love would make a sadist soft if you both enjoy them being the way they are, and I probably never will.

It's quite a situation that causes pain and confusion in many relationships.

I'd say accept your position the Mistress offers knowing she will not fulfill this need you have, or even though it will be painful move on to finding a Mistress who does think love has some place in your relationship other than general love.

One you get your Mistress on her terms that does not meet your needs, and the more painful way will get you the Mistress of your hearts desire if you're up front about your intentions with the future people you date.
Good Luck,
suzanne



slavebrandyj -> RE: D/s and deep love...can it exist? (1/2/2007 11:28:35 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: onestandingstill

I've often heard from subs their Master/Mistresses can't love them in an in love type of dynamic as it affects their ability to be a Master/Mistress.
They claim the love will make them soft.
I have also heard multitudes of sub/slaves that feel like you and I do.
In my opinion unless there's real in love, love between my Dom and I there's no way I'd be willing to literally lay my life in their hands to do with as they choose.

I don't understand why love would make a sadist soft if you both enjoy them being the way they are, and I probably never will.

It's quite a situation that causes pain and confusion in many relationships.

I'd say accept your position the Mistress offers knowing she will not fulfill this need you have, or even though it will be painful move on to finding a Mistress who does think love has some place in your relationship other than general love.

One you get your Mistress on her terms that does not meet your needs, and the more painful way will get you the Mistress of your hearts desire if you're up front about your intentions with the future people you date.
Good Luck,
suzanne


Thank you for sharing onestandingstill. I have heard the same thing. And I am sure I have seen signs of that from her as well.
 
Right now I'd take Her on any terms! Well almost any terms. We all have our limits even if it hurts to be put out of Her life.
I have always been upfront and honest with anyone I have ever considered as a love interest, be it D/s or vanilla. Maybe that's it. Some Doms, male or female do not know how to mix vanilla and Dominance and become vanilla swirls.   



pixelslave -> RE: D/s and deep love...can it exist? (1/2/2007 11:46:53 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong

the older we get the less desireable we become. 



LotusSong,
I have to take exception to the line you written which I've quoted above.  While we may physically change as we age, mentally and emotionally I think we become more desirable as we age!  There's something about maturity that can be really sexy when you pause long enough to look at what's inside another person.  The knowledge and experience of someone who is 50, is something that one rarely sees at 30 or 40!  While it may be true that many people are obsessed with what is visual, there are those who are more emotional & spiritual, allowing them to be able to see beyond the external; opening themselves to the inner beauty that only ripens and improves with time.  That's the part of a woman with which I desire to share my life as I continue to pass through the events of time.

- pixel
 


Edited to correct spelling errors



TigressOfDs -> RE: D/s and deep love...can it exist? (1/2/2007 12:17:01 PM)

 [/quote] 

There's something about maturity that can be really sexy when you pause long enough to look at what's inside another person.  The knowledge and experience of someone who is 50, is something that one rarely sees at 30 or 40!  While it may be true that many people are obsessed with what is visual, there are those who are more emotional & spiritual, allowing them to be able to see beyond the external; opening themselves to the inner beauty that only ripens and improves with time.  That's the part of a woman with which I desire to share my life as I continue to pass through the events of time.

- pixel
 


Gosh Pixel ... Very nice post
you just changed my image of all those Red Neck Texas men {weg}
  
 

 Ms.Kat  (a former Texan)
Listen carefully to what is said,take what you need,then blow the rest away with a breath of kindness. But always watch what they do, for in action there is always a clue. kd2003



BlkTallFullfig -> RE: D/s and deep love...can it exist? (1/2/2007 12:59:44 PM)

You've already received wonderful advice/words of wisdom from the people before me.   I only wanted to agree with the folks who said that if love cannot be a part of D/s, than I will be a single woman, because I'm not interested in casual play as a way of life.    M



LotusSong -> RE: D/s and deep love...can it exist? (1/2/2007 1:05:25 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: pixelslave

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong

the older we get the less desirable we become. 



LotusSong,
I have to take exception to the line you written which I've quoted above.  While we may physically change as we age, mentally and emotionally I think we become more desirable as we age!  There's something about maturity that can be really sexy when you pause long enough to look at what's inside another person.  The knowledge and experience of someone who is 50, is something that one rarely sees at 30 or 40!  While it may be true that many people are obsessed with what is visual, there are those who are more emotional & spiritual, allowing them to be able to see beyond the external; opening themselves to the inner beauty that only ripens and improves with time.  That's the part of a woman with which I desire to share my life as I continue to pass through the events of time.

- pixel 
 Edited to correct spelling errors
Dearest Pixel :)
 
When I wrote that it was in the context of poly relationships.  I don't know about you, but I don't think I've seen a bunch of blue hairs living in lust in their advancing years. (unless it's a forced nursing home situation. However, Sun City gets pretty frisky, I hear.) Now my concept of poly is a group of people living, working, sharing and loving together 24/7. (think the sitcom ' Friends') I'm starting to get the impression that it is now a group of people who know about each other but live separate lives in separate domiciles.  Imagine my shock when someone mentioned my situation was 'poly'.
 
Oh I know we get better as we age :)  But I don't think the <50 age range is going to invite us in unless we have money to offer.. I mean.. all that saggy stuff! There has to be SOME sort of payoff.  LOL!



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