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Why's it so Hard? - 1/7/2007 10:50:43 PM   
Devilslilsister


Posts: 1262
Joined: 8/3/2006
Status: offline 		Why is it so hard to fall asleep?  Why does incense always smell so funny?

Ok, now on to why i'm posting.  My Master and i have traveled a long hard road in our relationship, to the point where it was non existant for awhile.  Yet he refused to give up and has been working things out.  We've been doing really well in a vanilla sense.  During the whole time, he didnt stop wanting an M/s relationship often reminding me of various rules, of my place, who was who - but still giving me my space.   Unfortunetly, i wasnt ever in much of a head space to agree.  So while i obeyed sometimes, i often didnt and generally only the things that were agreeable to me.  We've had a few set backs because of my head space and he's allowed them.  We are now reaching the point where he is starting to enforce his rules.  More so along the lines of M/s then we have been in the past 6 months or so.  I am starting to want to obey again............. but............  (now this is the part i dont understand)

Half of me wants to and the other half of me is throwing a 5 year old tantrum.  Bedtime is 1030 at night.  This being the second night he's enforcing it.  (aye and i was in bed.. but its 1.21 am and i cant sleep)  So we can see i'm having abit of an issue.  Last night it was harder.  I think i begged, pleaded, conjoled, tried to convince him it was a good idea if i stayed up and i asked him about a million times to reconsider.  Yet i was in bed at 1030 throwing a 5 year old tantrum in my head.  Grumbling and muttering to myself that "i dont want to be in bed"  Luckily for me he is at his place and not here to see it.  Unfortunetly for me, i sent him about 4 text messages last night every hour or so saying something simliar.  heh.  Not that it did me any good, he was intelligent enough to ignore them. 

Tonight my tantrum was abit better.  I debated the bed time for only a short period of time, eventually catching myself and switching topics.  Unfortunetly i havent fallen asleep and well here i am.  Rationally i understand i am being ridiculous.  I rationally understand that my response to obeying is not rational.  Which is what i am confused on.  Why is it so hard?  Rationally, it shouldnt be this hard.  I am being irrational and i dont understand it!!!!!!

i also know that i had this problem when i was first with him 2 years ago.  Back then i also had these irrational responses, which i could also not figure out.  Granted since then i had gotten alot better - but i seem to be back to square one.  Which is also irrational.  What is even more irrational is that some of the things i used to enjoy doing (ie service orientated) i get the same irrational response. 

Its like i'm at war with myself.  (Which let me remind you is irrational)  I have always seemed to be at war with myself when it comes to submission.  Half of me says "YES!" and the other half of me fights it.  Why is it so hard??  Any chance its like falling off a horse and i just have to remember how to ride one again? 

This is all so irrational i just dont understand.   Can anyone make rational sense of this - so tomorrow night when i am in bed at 1030 - i can have some new things to tell myself.  Telling myself  "you are being completely ridiculous, irrational and you really want this" is not working against the 5 year old who seems to be planted inside of my head.  No matter what i've said to myself i still feel and hear "but i dont want tooooooooo".  Whats even more irrational, is i shouldnt have a tantrum ruling over a 27 year old woman.  Now thats as irrational as it gets. 


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RE: Why's it so Hard? - 1/7/2007 11:01:31 PM   
tangldupinblue


Posts: 230
Joined: 3/20/2006
Status: offline 		ok so i understand almost all of that but first let me say as someone who has a bed time to it gets easier, but you have to set yourself up to be able to relax and go to sleep, take a hot bath, drink some tea, make your self cum til you pass out...what ever you need to relax and i have to always keep in mind that theres always a reason hes asking me  to do it, i may not always agree but hes usaly right.

blue

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RE: Why's it so Hard? - 1/8/2007 2:20:29 AM   
Padriag


Posts: 2633
Joined: 3/30/2005
Status: offline 		Not knowing you personally, it would be hard to say specifically why you are having such a problem.  So all I can do is give some generalities.

Many people have a problem with giving up control because this goes against what we have always been taught.  Western society emphasizes independence and individuality to such a degree that submission is viewed in poor terms.  For women in particular this can be hard because added to that are the conflicts of the feminist movement (which generally very strongly disapproves of women being submissive).

Western culture also places a great deal of emphasis on the notion of equality, that everyone is equal and therefor no one has any right to any authority over anyone else (in practice this is not how we live, but the ideology is there).  Yet a master / slave relationship is one of very deliberate inequality and that can be a hard pill for some to swallow.

It could also stem from your childhood.  Some children are not disciplined at all, or very little, as children.  They grow up not having to respect rules or boundaries, and yet many go on to spend much of their life both seeking those very boundaries and rebelling against them.  For these people what is at issue is the need to deal with some unresolved feelings going all the way back to their childhood.

I can't really say what the source or sources of your problem are.  It could be all of the above, or none.  What I do know is that the answers are there inside of you.  You need to spend some time thinking about it.  Next time you feel one of these tantrums coming on, stop yourself and take some time to think about it.  Trying to identify what you are really feeling (more than just "I don't want too", why don't you want to, are you afraid of something, or angry, etc?.), where is it coming from?   When you know what the source of these tantrums are, you can start dealing with the root cause.  But in no case should you use it as an excuse to disobey.  If you let the tantrums win, then you are right... these emotions will be ruling over a 27 year old woman... and that's not a good thing. 

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A stern discipline pervades all nature, which is a little cruel so that it may be very kind - Edmund Spencer

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RE: Why's it so Hard? - 1/8/2007 4:00:39 AM   
twicehappy


Posts: 2706
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline 		 

Off the subject but WOW some of you photos are simply beautiful.

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RE: Why's it so Hard? - 1/8/2007 6:02:08 AM   
Devilslilsister


Posts: 1262
Joined: 8/3/2006
Status: offline 		Aye he's got a good one in the woods.  Looking all mysterious and domly. 

Thanks Padriag, I do stop and think about it.  I usually come up with something irrational like "i'm not tired"  or "i'm not done doing X yet, i'm not ready for bed"  and i generally feel completely stubborn.  No anger, no fear.  What i really feel is stupid. 

I've come up with the it being just plain rebellious.  Em or the fact that i completely reprogrammed myself when i was 14/15 to not do a damn thing anybody said.  You know and i spoke with a good friend of his, who is a Mistress.  It seems he discuss me with her.  One of the things she said via an email to me once was "one of the problems with you is you never had any authority in your life that cared about you"  Which bothers me to no end cos how dare some one know something about me that i didnt know!  I'd reckon she's mostly right and i wonder if that has anything to do with things. 

i dunno but tangl said things'll get easier - so i'll use that to try and calm myself. 




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My ability to cope with BS is at an all time low - me

i may look like i'm doing nothing, but i'm very busy at a cellular level

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RE: Why's it so Hard? - 1/8/2007 6:40:56 AM   
velvetears


Posts: 2933
Joined: 6/19/2006
Status: offline 		Submission is something someone wants, it doesn't go against ones nature, it is ones nature.  i'm not saying theres never any struggles but it's not like he's asking you something that's terribly difficult to comply with.  Perhaps deep inside you need or enjoy the conflict, for whatever reason?  You stated "So while i obeyed sometimes, i often didnt and generally only the things that were agreeable to me."   That's not submission in my opinion, you can't pick and chooose once you agree to be someones submissive. This statement you made clues me in to the fact that you may be testing him "Unfortunetly for me, i sent him about 4 text messages last night every hour or so saying something simliar.  heh. Not that it did me any good, he was intelligent enough to ignore them."  Perhaps deep down you have doubts about his ability to successfully dom you, but really it isn't a contest.  If you care about him and love him just let go, don't think so much about it and obey. If you doubt him so much you can't - be his girlfriend and let go of the D/s.  Think about how difficult it ust be for a dominant to be challenged at every turn or feel his submissive is unhappy with his decisions - it will chip away and erode the relationship after a while.  Hope i was helpful - good luck.


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RE: Why's it so Hard? - 1/8/2007 7:07:21 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

This is all so irrational i just dont understand.   Can anyone make rational sense of this - so tomorrow night when i am in bed at 1030 - i can have some new things to tell myself.  Telling myself  "you are being completely ridiculous, irrational and you really want this" is not working against the 5 year old who seems to be planted inside of my head.  No matter what i've said to myself i still feel and hear "but i dont want tooooooooo".  Whats even more irrational, is i shouldnt have a tantrum ruling over a 27 year old woman.  Now thats as irrational as it gets. 


The reactions you're experiencing tend to be typical actually for a novice- their minds haven't caught up with their hearts yet, so even though they KNOW the right thing to do, they don't yet feel secure to follow through and thus act out in frustration because they can't directly and maturely address the problem yet.  Within a few months of a stable and secure relationship, this usually smooths itself out as everyone settles into their own balance and learns to communicate directly.

As for someone who has been in the situation for a few years now, I can only think that there is an even deeper thread of insecurity within you which hasn't been able to be addressed yet.  The ups and downs of the relationship, the new unexpected pregnancy and the fact that perhaps his "rules" have often not really been held to on a very consistent basis in the past can all contribute.

Something that might help THROUGH that point is to move beyond your own head and look a little farther than yourself- you need sleep to take care of your children, you need sleep to be productive during the day.  In some ways you very much might be like a 5 year old saying "No I'm NOT tired!" because they really are SO tired and cranky they can't just let themselves rest.  Maybe you've trained yourself into an automatic pattern of rejecting rules and need to be trained out of it?

So think beyond yourself and why this is a good rule not just for YOU, but for the people and commitments you are responsible for.

Or, as I always say, you don't have to WANT to obey, you just have to obey.

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Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

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RE: Why's it so Hard? - 1/8/2007 7:18:03 AM   
CreativeDominant


Posts: 11032
Joined: 3/11/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: velvetears

Submission is something someone wants, it doesn't go against ones nature, it is ones nature.  i'm not saying theres never any struggles but it's not like he's asking you something that's terribly difficult to comply with.  Perhaps deep inside you need or enjoy the conflict, for whatever reason?  You stated "So while i obeyed sometimes, i often didnt and generally only the things that were agreeable to me."   That's not submission in my opinion, you can't pick and chooose once you agree to be someones submissive.


~cynical laugh~  Really?  Some submissives seem to think this is perfectly O.K.  Not only O.K. but "natural" and just a part of the journey that they are on.

This statement you made clues me in to the fact that you may be testing him "Unfortunetly for me, i sent him about 4 text messages last night every hour or so saying something simliar.  heh. Not that it did me any good, he was intelligent enough to ignore them."  Perhaps deep down you have doubts about his ability to successfully dom you, but really it isn't a contest. 

It isn't?  What about those who state that you "must prove your dominance"?  Perhaps the poster isn't this way...but to me, as it does to you, it certainly sounds similar.

quote:

 If you care about him and love him just let go, don't think so much about it and obey. If you doubt him so much you can't - be his girlfriend and let go of the D/s.  Think about how difficult it ust be for a dominant to be challenged at every turn or feel his submissive is unhappy with his decisions - it will chip away and erode the relationship after a while.  Hope i was helpful - good luck.


Exactly.  Often then, the statement cited ... and seen on these boards and in some profiles...is the infamous "he wasn't dominant enough for me" followed closely by the "he didn't know how to bring out my submission".  If you have agreed to submit, then submit.  If you cannot do it, then there comes a time when you admit that it has nothing to do with his dominance or lack of it...and in this case, from what you yourself say, it certainly doesn't...and rather with you yourself.

Please forgive me but after having read Lotus's thread questioning why on this very matter and dealing with an ex who, when it came down to the critical areas, had a lot of these same issues yet insists that there has to be a dominant with the magic answer rather than finding it within herself. 

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RE: Why's it so Hard? - 1/8/2007 7:24:29 AM   
sweetnurseBBW


Posts: 2464
Joined: 1/26/2006
From: North Carolina
Status: offline 		I think you are just not used to having rules eventhough you said he reminded you of them. Reminding you and doing them are much different. Being a submissive at first means testing things to know boundaries, this is something novices sometimes do. Being a submissive is something you have to want to do,  noone can make you submissive. You need to think about the reasons for your tantrums. Why is it that you are fighting so much. Only you know the answer.

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RE: Why's it so Hard? - 1/8/2007 8:03:57 AM   
domiguy


Posts: 12952
Joined: 5/2/2006
Status: offline 		Wells since I don't know you or your partner ...the first  question I would ask is why a 27 year old woman needs to be in bed at 10:30 pm?  I realize that this "lifestyle" atttracts all types as to what you are willing to accept or what is reasonable to be demanded.

I would want my sub in bed at 10:30 or maybe earlier if I didn't like her company.  Or 'cuz she gets so sweepy that she won't be any fun tomorrow or without enough rest maybe she'll get sick and throw up.  Otherwise just seems rather like a bunch of bullshit but to each their own....I guess you can Tivo any late night shows...and I think it was some old poop that said nothing god happens after "midnite" in your case it must be 10:30...lol

out.

D.G.

p.s. Jesus please protect me from your followers..

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RE: Why's it so Hard? - 1/8/2007 8:17:18 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: domiguy
Wells since I don't know you or your partner ...the first  question I would ask is why a 27 year old woman needs to be in bed at 10:30 pm?  I realize that this "lifestyle" atttracts all types as to what you are willing to accept or what is reasonable to be demanded.

*shrug*

I'm almost 27, lucky enough to have a job at an office that opens at 9 and a 15 minute commute.  Given that I do all my showering and only have basic stuff to do in the morning, I get up about 8:15 and go to bed at midnight.

However, when I had a job that had an hour and a half commute, I did have to get to bed at 10:30 to be up in time to make my buses.

Given that Devils has a young unmentionable to take care of and like most people probably does her showering and such in the mornings and happens to be pregnant currently as well, I think 10:30 could be a completely reasonable time to get to sleep.

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RE: Why's it so Hard? - 1/8/2007 10:46:35 AM   
velvetears


Posts: 2933
Joined: 6/19/2006
Status: offline 		i agree CD a lot of dominants get the blame for not being dominant enough, or too easy, or not able to bring out the sub's submission sufficiently and i think that's all just BS.  It's not the doms responsibility to create in the sub something that should already be there.  Beforehand a sub should understand who she is getting involved with and feel it is a good match and her needs will be met. If she finds it's not working to her liking - well she can leave and find a "stronger more dominant" dom or maybe consider switching sides - this way it can always go her way

Personally if i were a dom and a sub told me, or implied, i had to prove my dominance i would do so by kicking her or him to the curb.

The only way to learn, grow, and move on in life is to take personal responsibility.  Otherwise you will live life running around in circles fulfilling your own false prophesies and continue to fail.

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RE: Why's it so Hard? - 1/8/2007 12:49:34 PM   
dawntreader


Posts: 3045
Joined: 11/23/2006
Status: offline 		my perception is there is something important missing in this dynamic...

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RE: Why's it so Hard? - 1/8/2007 1:08:54 PM   
Sirandlittle1


Posts: 538
Joined: 12/22/2005
Status: offline 		because it is bloody hard!
 
simple answer, feal the rebellion, and do it anyway.
 
Shelle's definition of anyway. Get a cd story tape, a walkman, get into the sodding bed, and put it on, bore yourself to sleep. Or a nice warm shower. YOU have to find the way, that helps you obey.
 
I wouldnt say that there is anything wrong in your dynamic, and frankly, doesnt it piss you off when other jump in and judge? it does me.
I have days when powerexchange is a doddle, it flows through me, around me, and other days when i could hit him with a baseball bat for a 'stupid' sodding request/demand he's made. And im years into our relationship.
 
A bit of self searching as to why you are not submitting. That could be the ticket.
But id rather suggest a little in depth respectful conversation with HIM, telling him how your feeling. Work it out together. That helps ease you into obeyence perhaps?

I remember dropping our dynamic at my request coz it was too hard, 'just for a little break'. God was i lost without it.
Personally, id find it harder to remain submissive without his presence at night.
 
Im having a rebellious phase myself right now. It makes me smile to see others also have these moments lol.
We are working through this one, just as we have the others. We talk, we resolve, and things work out. Until some 'imp' inside me rises again, to cause a little havoc.
Some would of dumped me long ago, for the stunts ive pulled. Some would of dumped him ages ago, for the stunts he's pulled. But we are human, we fuck up. We work through our problems, like any other long term couple would, be it vanilla or bdsm.
 
Good luck honey, dig deep, you'll get there if you need to.
 
littleone

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RE: Why's it so Hard? - 1/8/2007 1:59:00 PM   
onestandingstill


Posts: 1335
Joined: 8/3/2006
Status: offline 		Hey DLS,
First I feel I need to say I love and respect you.
Second I must say Duh.... You're pregnant and NEED to get your rest.
Here here three cheers for your Master for concerning himself with your health and emotional well being.
I'd also say most pregnant women have a hard time sleeping after the first trimester so it's very common to be restless in bed at night.
I think maybe (if he'd let you) try reading in bed.
It may help you settle down and stop all those thoughts racing around in your head enough for you to realize you're tired.
Being you're a student I'm sure you have tons of boring reading you need to do.
Maybe you can get yourself to sleep reading.
It's worked for me in the past.

As far as 50/50 split in submission without not liking it sometimes.
Look at it like cleaning the bathroom, laundry, or working out.
Even when you don't feel like it you know in the end you'll feel better for doing it.
I think it's common to question your submission and fuss or cuss in your mind (not out loud) when you want something different than the constraints your Master's given you. As long as you recognize your submission fits you in your heart eventually the stubborn mind follows along.
No one said it's easy, it's just what you and I seem to need in our lives to be completely happy in a relationship.
suzanne

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RE: Why's it so Hard? - 1/8/2007 2:31:44 PM   
ardelle


Posts: 63
Status: offline 		Greetings
 
Often, it is nothing more than pride that stops us from becoming that which we truly yearn to be. Pride can be very hard to overcome; but if this is something that your truly desire; it can be achieved as long as you are honest about what is holding you back and why.
 
i wish you well

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RE: Why's it so Hard? - 1/8/2007 5:40:49 PM   
Devilslilsister


Posts: 1262
Joined: 8/3/2006
Status: offline 		Thank you LA, i much apprecaite it and i'll add that into my arsenal of self talk.  You're completely right, as is he.  Its why i've always had a bed time.  I honestly need it and for some reason i think i am superwoman and i can function with out sleep. 

To answer Domiguy - i need to be in bed at 1030, because i am one of those odd people who needs alot of sleep.  Me being over tired is a sure fire way to throw my emotions into up heavel.  I've also been told by an outsider that they know when i havent had enough sleep as i get "out there". 

I know its not him.  I know its me.  Its not about doubts its, its not about a contest, its not about conflict.  Quite frankly, he isnt here with me and i could stay up if i chose.  I wasnt obeying before IE "So while i obeyed sometimes, i often didnt and generally only the things that were agreeable to me."  Not because of my submission, but because we had alot of other issues to work out.  I was infact ending the relationship.  Personally, it seems silly to obey some one you arent planning on being with.  Aye? 

Thank you little one.  i am lucky that he generally allows me a TV at night as its how i've learned to fall asleep my whole life.  <grins>  BOY you should hear what goes on inside of my head when he says "TV off".  The funny thing, like you, when our dynamic dropped.. i was worried.  Worried that because of me we would end up being vanilla for ever and ever.  So here he is, putting the dynamic back in and what am i doing??  Completely irrational!  For the most part i look forward to it.. i just have these odd moments.  Nah, doesnt piss me off when others judge, i expect it.  They're only giving me their opionon based on their life's experiences.  I just try and correct so they can judge abit more accurate. 


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My ability to cope with BS is at an all time low - me

i may look like i'm doing nothing, but i'm very busy at a cellular level

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RE: Why's it so Hard? - 1/8/2007 5:51:09 PM   
Devilslilsister


Posts: 1262
Joined: 8/3/2006
Status: offline
quote:

Often, it is nothing more than pride that stops us from becoming that which we truly yearn to be. Pride can be very hard to overcome; but if this is something that your truly desire; it can be achieved as long as you are honest about what is holding you back and why.


This is the second time i've heard about me having issues with pride.  LOL i'm going to really have to dicuss that with him.  Maybe he can help me lose it to make things go smoother or atleast give me some ideas on what to do. 

Hiya One!  Awwwwwwww  tons of hugs, kisses and love for you too - ) ::smiles::  I agree, 3 cheers for him in making sure i'm doing what i need to do.  <grins>  Classes JUST started so i havent any crazy reading to do yet and there all online classes this semester.... <wicked giggle>  So i doubt i'll do any reading other then to pass a test.  Did i ever mention i got an A in Spanish class and i only cracked open the book twice?  Once before the mid term and once for the final.  Online classes.......... eassssssssy street.  I also enjoy cleaning and working out = ( And if i get into do doing the laundry i enjoy it as well and i'm usually disappointed when its all done.  I enjoy the whole organizational thing.. I also enjoy weeding and mowing the grass and cleaning out cars. 

But you are right, i ALWAYS feel better in the end when i obeyed.  Its what really got me when i was newer.  I fought obeying and when i didnt i always felt worse, yet when i did i always felt better.. yet i was sill fighting it.  Strange....  i think he understands this issue, which is why he's understanding about it.  He probably has alot better idea of why i feel like this then i do.  Though i doubt he'll tell me.  hahahhahaha

it must be rebellion, stubborness and pride.  Thank you all


_____________________________

My ability to cope with BS is at an all time low - me

i may look like i'm doing nothing, but i'm very busy at a cellular level

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RE: Why's it so Hard? - 1/8/2007 5:56:56 PM   
ardelle


Posts: 63
Status: offline 		Greetings
 
quote:

  This is the second time i've heard about me having issues with pride.  LOL i'm going to really have to dicuss that with him.  Maybe he can help me lose it to make things go smoother or atleast give me some ideas on what to do. 


one never loses pride; it just shifts focus from one spectrum to another.

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i wish you well

josie

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RE: Why's it so Hard? - 1/8/2007 6:52:46 PM   
thetammyjo


Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline 		Fox goes through periods just like you do, though honestly not with talking back to me or debating an order, but with his feelings and mindset. I think it's probably just natural. He's changing and I'm changing, human beings change. Sometimes it is easier and sometimes harder.

One thing I did was really figure out what is truly important to me in terms of our authority dynamic and those are the things I insist on and enforce. The most important is that I'm not TammyJo to him, I am Mistress to him unless he has an emergency. He slips up, he gets ignored -- anything he wanted to say after my name if it's an emergency is literally tuned out and I walk away or turn away from him. He figures it out pretty quick an honestly he hasn't messed up within my recent memory.

On your side of things, analysis what is triggering these reactions, do some journaling and maybe find another friend who who can talk to about your feelings -- not to complain just to be a sounding board. Realize these things come and go and just promise yourself to push through when you feel down and be honest about how you feel.

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Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

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