RE: what do you do when you're owned by someone "unintentionally"?

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katerzkat -> RE: what do you do when you're owned by someone "unintentionally"? (1/11/2007 11:36:52 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross marking down another example of how being submissive does not equate to a person being strong and capable for the next time someone tries to make that claim it does seem like a bit of a self-contradiction, doesn't it..?

LuckyAlbatross -> RE: what do you do when you're owned by someone "unintentionally"? (1/11/2007 11:38:40 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: katerzkat quote: ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross marking down another example of how being submissive does not equate to a person being strong and capable for the next time someone tries to make that claim it does seem like a bit of a self-contradiction, doesn't it..? Not at all. Being any orientation doesn't suggest any other character trait more than another. Being a submissive doesn't make a person any more or less likely to be cheap/kind/tolerant/spiteful/weak/etc. This situation is easy because there's only one thing stopping you from fulfillment- and that's yourself. It's hard because you're the one you have to change.

katerzkat -> RE: what do you do when you're owned by someone "unintentionally"? (1/11/2007 11:44:26 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross quote: ORIGINAL: katerzkat quote: ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross marking down another example of how being submissive does not equate to a person being strong and capable for the next time someone tries to make that claim it does seem like a bit of a self-contradiction, doesn't it..? Not at all. Being any orientation doesn't suggest any other character trait more than another. Being a submissive doesn't make a person any more or less likely to be cheap/kind/tolerant/spiteful/weak/etc. This situation is easy because there's only one thing stopping you from fulfillment- and that's yourself. It's hard because you're the one you have to change. all true --- i feel kind of bad for saying that, now, actually[sm=frown.gif]

LuckyAlbatross -> RE: what do you do when you're owned by someone "unintentionally"? (1/11/2007 11:48:03 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: katerzkat all true --- i feel kind of bad for saying that, now, actually[sm=frown.gif] Boy you really do find tons of ways to feel bad about yourself don't you? How do you have the energy for anything else? Don't sweat it chica, it's a very common misconception, and you've got bigger problems.

katerzkat -> RE: what do you do when you're owned by someone "unintentionally"? (1/11/2007 11:50:46 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: desertdancer I have to say that reading this has made me sad. If this were a sister or girlfrined telling You this story and not you tell this story to us, what would you say to her? ~dancer i would definitely tell her she was nuts for ever allowing such a thing & try to help her [of course!]... it's so much easier when it's someone else :(

crouchingtigress -> RE: what do you do when you're owned by someone "unintentionally"? (1/11/2007 12:20:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: katerzkat quote: ORIGINAL: crouchingtigress kazerkat, what are you willing to do right now this minute to start the process? all this talk is great for motivation, but you also need action. what are you willing to commit to do today? what are you willing to commit to do tomorrow? i notice you answered everyone else who asked you things....but not me...is it because doing something and being held accountable is so hard to do? well that is true it is...welcome to the next level of your new found identity as a submissive....but this is the part where you begin to sculpt your natural orientation into something valuable for another to own. I'm sorry --- in all honesty, you're right: the reason i hadn't replied yet is because i'm not sure how to answer... i've been trying to figure out how to do this for almost as long as i've known this guy. i've tried cutting off contact; i didn't speak to him for over 2 months about a year ago [after a particularly bad incident], but i had the advantage of being at school, which is a couple of hours away... he also would only call once every 2 weeks or so, & i was usually in class when he did, so i can't really take much credit. eventually, he called when i happened to be drunk, so foolishly i answered; after that, things went back to their previous state as soon as the semester ended & i came back to this area. i know for a fact that, as long as i allow him to speak to me, he can talk [or harrass] me into [nearly] anything he wants --- i will definitely have to change my number, at the very least... i'll be leaving for school again in about a week & a half, but until then, if he can't call me, he'll just show up. he actually has no place of his own [he usually doesn't] & has been sleeping at my place for the last few nights --- he's stayed with me off & on since the very first night. as a result, there's always a bunch of his stuff lying around, giving him an excuse to come by... i've tried bagging it all up & telling him to come get it [the last day before i left, last semester], & he simply refused to do it [that same bag of stuff ended up in my dorm room. it's still there]. my biggest weakness is how lonely i get when he's not around. i know it's certainly no excuse, but no-one else pays the kind of attention to me that he does; it probably won't come as a surprise to anyone that i'm not great at making friends. i also have a lot things in my past [& present, for that matter] that i can't talk about with any of my school friends --- he is the only one who i know won't ever be shocked or walk away in disgust. as messed up as we are together, he is my best friend. i can call at any hour [as he often does to me]. his absense leaves a chilling void... i have trouble remembering the bad stuff & only remember the good [there are good times, too]... i'm not going to lie: i'm not sure what to do. wow, first thank you for replying with such a thoughtful and in depth reply, it really shows me that you are really trying to get this guy out of your house....and it shows me the depth that he has become "the worm of your apple" (awesome anaolgy celedane!) you are at the beginning of your journey and to be honest you are very lucky you are so young, many of us spent years with husbands of the ilk you describe before we realized how to harness our innate orientation to serve us... i think changing your phone number is awesome (have you done it yet?) i also think you can gather his belongings again and put them in a box and then call him to let him know he has 2 days to pick them up or else that will be considered discarded and will be thrown away....if you live in a safe neighborhood leave them on the porch. also tell him he is no longer welcome...(i know this is hard but you can do it) as to the loneliness, you are only going to be missing the idea of him, and i am not discounting that will be painful, but you wont be missing the reality of him, because you dont want to be used or abused... so remember that by clearing him out you are clearing the path for what you truly want in life. here is something that is going to be kind of hard to hear but if you dont hear it you will create this situation again....you were using him too...you were not a victim....he is not an evil guy.....nothing happens in a vacuum you were getting your needs met and acknowledging that will set you free. the loneliness will subside over time as you involve yourself in activity's and relationships that nourish you....and you will one day look back and be grateful to this person for everything he has tought you about yourself...[:)]

katerzkat -> RE: what do you do when you're owned by someone "unintentionally"? (1/11/2007 1:02:19 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: crouchingtigress here is something that is going to be kind of hard to hear but if you dont hear it you will create this situation again....you were using him too...you were not a victim....he is not an evil guy.....nothing happens in a vacuum you were getting your needs met and acknowledging that will set you free. this is absolutely true... i know he's not evil [you should hear how often i try to explain this to my mom, friends, etc...], but more importantly --- as difficult as it is to keep in mind! --- i know that there are things that i get out of this as well, & that it takes two. since he's been the one that i let see & hear the darker self that i keep from most other people, he's also had to put up with several less than fun emotional flip-out sessions, not to mention my typical moodiness... i don't always hand over what he wants without him having to suffer a bit, in his own way, first [i don't think i mean to do it, but i make him pretty miserable from time to time. he thinks it's intentional.] in the end, i suppose we've both tolerated [at least] a bit of misery in order to get certain needs or desires met [even if mine get met far less often than his do].

crouchingtigress -> RE: what do you do when you're owned by someone "unintentionally"? (1/11/2007 1:07:25 PM)
so have you changed you number yet?[;)]

katerzkat -> RE: what do you do when you're owned by someone "unintentionally"? (1/11/2007 1:32:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: crouchingtigress so have you changed you number yet?[;)] [sm=idea.gif] not just yet... i know this is going to sound like a really weak response, but i feel like changing it before i go back to school won't do much good --- he'll just show up here, & once he's standing right in front of me, he'll either turn on the charm or else just make a big, unpleasant scene. meaning: he'll probably just weedle the new number out of me... i want to say that, no, i will not give in! i will not give it to him, not under any circumstance!... but experience has sadly shown time & again that i really suck at that... once i'm at school, however, it'd be a pretty effective move since he doesn't even have a car anymore, & we have zero mutual friends or anything like that... there's very little chance he'd make the effort to go all the way up there. i would not be the first person to do this to him, either, so i think if i really changed my number while so far out of reach, he would just give up & start looking for someone else to fill in my role... i don't think it'll hurt him anywhere near as much as it is going to hurt for me --- my biggest fear is that i'm going to be the one to chicken out & call him the first moment i start to feel like i "need" him

LuckyAlbatross -> RE: what do you do when you're owned by someone "unintentionally"? (1/11/2007 1:37:58 PM)
Katzer- this is you. This is you making excuses and delaying and continuing to block yourself from progress. Any questions?

whisperedsighs -> RE: what do you do when you're owned by someone "unintentionally"? (1/11/2007 1:38:01 PM)
NO is a complete sentence.

crouchingtigress -> RE: what do you do when you're owned by someone "unintentionally"? (1/11/2007 1:54:21 PM)
you are not changing the number for him...you are changing the number for you...you are taking steps to put your life in order...you are reclaiming your self and your territory. change it...and if he widdels it out of you change it again....the idea is to continue going in the direction you want to go...not staying still, not going back....if you dont change you life...who will?

Zsuzsanna -> RE: what do you do when you're owned by someone "unintentionally"? (1/11/2007 2:04:52 PM)
"there's always a bunch of his stuff lying around, giving him an excuse to come by... i've tried bagging it all up & telling him to come get it [the last day before i left, last semester], & he simply refused to do it [that same bag of stuff ended up in my dorm room. it's still there]. my biggest weakness is how lonely i get when he's not around. i know it's certainly no excuse, but no-one else pays the kind of attention to me that he does; it probably won't come as a surprise to anyone that i'm not great at making friends. i also have a lot things in my past [& present, for that matter] that i can't talk about with any of my school friends --- he is the only one who i know won't ever be shocked or walk away in disgust. as messed up as we are together, he is my best friend. i can call at any hour [as he often does to me]. his absense leaves a chilling void... i have trouble remembering the bad stuff & only remember the good [there are good times, too]... i'm not going to lie: i'm not sure what to do." Dammit! I have been here too with my ex best friend. I would say tell him if he doesn't come get his shit then you will throw it out. And if he still doesn't, DO IT! He doesn't seem like he is going to just let you walk away. Take it laying down and all that. Give him an agressive action to let him know you mean business. You have to. For you and no one else, you have to. These days I am happier than I have ever been. If we were still together, I would still be under his control and miserable. Do you want to be happy? If the answer is yes, then you know what you have to do.

IndigoEris -> RE: what do you do when you're owned by someone "unintentionally"? (1/11/2007 2:58:14 PM)
Kat I'd like to suggest a book called "Codependent No More" by Melody Beattie. I've read it and re-read it over the years and it's helped me alot with this kind of attachment, self esteem, self worth, and self control, and even the grieving process when ending an unhealthy relationship. It's not a long or dry read. It's very insightful about these kind of relationships/attachments and why we stay in them and how to detach in a healthy way. And if you'd like someone to talk to who's open minded and not so judgemental mail me through CM. There really isn't anything you could say that I would find suprising or offensive. When you get down to it we're all human and we all do and think all kinds of things that we think we can't talk about.

slavejali -> RE: what do you do when you're owned by someone "unintentionally"? (1/11/2007 3:11:06 PM)
I can relate to that personality in relationship. I know I have it and i'm comfortable with it, it took me to be nearly dead (not only physically) to leave my first relationship. What I did learn from that though, was because of my personality it was really important that I chose my future partners wisely. The only thing I can suggest is, once you do leave, cut off every avenue he has to contact you, go immediately and find incredibly fun and interesting things to fill your time with..so you don't go back....

gretchenS -> RE: what do you do when you're owned by someone "unintentionally"? (1/11/2007 3:31:12 PM)
Before I had the guts to break up with my ex boyfriend, I did some mental destruction of his image for a week. That helped a lot. I would start reviewing any icky details of his person, something that I found stupid when he said it, or some pathetic little secret of his, or even enphasize the worst of his features when he was talking to me... it's a little of a "hating" excersise, but it truly helped me to get the courage to call it off. I remember saying "I am breaking up with you" with a little bit of a smile... Evil, I know, but it worked and forgeting about him was easy.

Celeste43 -> RE: what do you do when you're owned by someone "unintentionally"? (1/11/2007 4:29:35 PM)
Suggested ways to get out. Online, block and ignore. Caller ID and don't answer when he calls. Tell him never to darken your doorsteps again or you will tell the cops all you know about his criminal activities. Have your lawyer send him a letter threatening legal action if he contacts you again. Go to the police and say he is harassing you, get a restraining order, stalkers are not approved of - have your lawyer call ahead or go with you. Get therapy on why you pick users and learn ways to improve your sense of self esteem. Do volunteer work, learn a new skill, take lessons in a sport, do something that frightens you like parachuting. The stronger you make yourself, the easier you will find to get rid of him and other leeches like him.

katerzkat -> RE: what do you do when you're owned by someone "unintentionally"? (1/11/2007 4:34:26 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross Katzer- this is you. This is you making excuses and delaying and continuing to block yourself from progress. Any questions? quote: ORIGINAL: crouchingtigress you are not changing the number for him...you are changing the number for you...you are taking steps to put your life in order...you are reclaiming your self and your territory. change it...and if he widdels it out of you change it again....the idea is to continue going in the direction you want to go...not staying still, not going back....if you dont change you life...who will? i know, i know! you are both right --- i'm seriously not questioning that, at all... this is just really, insanely hard! another little facet to this that i'm concerned about is that he has no idea i'm actually considering anything like this, at all, right now. i've been alternately making threats & begging for him to walk away on his own at least once a week [usually more] for as long as we've known eachother [it didn't mean much to him in the beginning, & totally through my own fault, it truly means nothing by now] --- & it's automatically accepted that we bicker a lot at this point even on our best days... compared to the usual, we've been getting along better than normal most of the time, for about a week or so... i'm not mentioning any of this as a defense or argument; i'm just saying that for me to up & change my number at a time when i'm sure he's convinced everything is fine is going to confuse the hell out of him... don't you think i should at least let him know where i stand/why i'm ending our supposedly very important friendship/etc. first? i know he's not perfect, but after everything we've been through together, it seems like he deserves some kind of explanation before i up & cut him off... deep down, i know that mostly i'm just stalling, but he is still a human being, too... [before anyone even says it: yes, i know it seems like it should be obvious enough for him to figure it out on his own, but you don't understand the way this guy's head works --- or doesn't work. after an entire lifetime of living the way that he does (that is, off of manipulating/exploiting others), he's nearly incapable of comprehending how he's done anything wrong to me, at all. if i don't spell it out for him, he'll really never figure out what went wrong... i could just shrug this off as his problem & not mine, of course... or maybe write a letter..? i'm sorry; i realise i must sound very annoying & flaky with all of this, but before anyone decides to rip me apart over it, just try to remember that i love this person, & this really is a very big deal for me...]

katerzkat -> RE: what do you do when you're owned by someone "unintentionally"? (1/11/2007 4:42:16 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Zsuzsanna Dammit! I have been here too with my ex best friend. I would say tell him if he doesn't come get his shit then you will throw it out. And if he still doesn't, DO IT! He doesn't seem like he is going to just let you walk away. Take it laying down and all that. Give him an agressive action to let him know you mean business. You have to. For you and no one else, you have to. These days I am happier than I have ever been. If we were still together, I would still be under his control and miserable. Do you want to be happy? If the answer is yes, then you know what you have to do. i'm a little worried that if i try anything aggressive, he might retaliate --- that is a possibility with him. i know what you mean, though; the fact that he's come to take for granted that i won't stick up for myself in any significant way has become a serious problem

katerzkat -> RE: what do you do when you're owned by someone "unintentionally"? (1/11/2007 4:57:00 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: gretchenS Before I had the guts to break up with my ex boyfriend, I did some mental destruction of his image for a week. That helped a lot. I would start reviewing any icky details of his person, something that I found stupid when he said it, or some pathetic little secret of his, or even enphasize the worst of his features when he was talking to me... it's a little of a "hating" excersise, but it truly helped me to get the courage to call it off. I remember saying "I am breaking up with you" with a little bit of a smile... Evil, I know, but it worked and forgeting about him was easy. this is something i think i can probably do pretty easily ;) ...& i could see how it really would help, too..! thanks!

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