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Male supremacy or female supremacy - 1/15/2007 2:55:47 PM   
akbarbarian


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I'd like to see support for either male supremacy, female supremacy, or reasons to be against either one.  For anyone who cites historical advantages, please list specifics.  If one side did it wrong, show how the other side did it right.  If patriarchal society went wrong, did matriarchal society in practice really do it that much better in any specific examples historically?  And if the patriarchs had it right, why so and what ills did it prevent?  Has there been a society that didn't have our superior/inferior gender roles that worked well?  The USA is still struggling there so I'm not sure that would serve as any kind of example.  Also, by tolerating either male or female supermacy is that any different from tolerating white supremists or nazis?  Is there a kind of tolerance of supremists that is fine as long as they don't cross a certain line, and if so, what is the line?

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RE: Male supremacy or female supremacy - 1/15/2007 3:00:55 PM   
SimplyMichael


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How about this radical notion.  We all beat and fuck whomever and whatever turns us on and not worry about putting one on a higher or lower level?

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RE: Male supremacy or female supremacy - 1/15/2007 3:02:33 PM   
Rover


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In my opinion, there's nothing wrong with any kind of "supremacy" as it relates to one's own relationship dynamic.  And by contrast, I have a deep and intolerant issue with any kind of "supremacy" as it relates to all relationships (ie: that's portrayed as universal in nature).
 
John

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RE: Male supremacy or female supremacy - 1/15/2007 3:20:13 PM   
LaTigresse


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I am going to agree with both Michael and Rover on this one. 

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RE: Male supremacy or female supremacy - 1/15/2007 3:23:54 PM   
Aileen68


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I'm a straight female submissive.  Therefore I prefer to fuck a supreme male.
However, I do find strong women to be quite appealing on many levels, excluding sexual ones.  I think the world is nicely balanced with both types.

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RE: Male supremacy or female supremacy - 1/15/2007 3:28:59 PM   
slavejali


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I don't think there is such a thing as female or male supremacy. How can you say a  tiger is supreme to a lion? They are different animals and are both supreme in their own right, both have different qualities and similarities. One might have strengths over the other one in different ares, as with their weaknesses.

< Message edited by slavejali -- 1/15/2007 4:00:38 PM >


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RE: Male supremacy or female supremacy - 1/15/2007 3:29:49 PM   
mstrjx


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I'll make it currently unanimous.

I think that, regardless of orientation, my personal views are that we (whomever that might be) get together in either a play (top/bottom) setting or in a relationship dynamic (M/s, D/s) because the individuals involved have both the personal and joint inclination to do so, as well as the quality of relationship that allows that dynamic to hold up.

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RE: Male supremacy or female supremacy - 1/15/2007 3:33:01 PM   
akbarbarian


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Wow that's alot of votes for neither.  I know there are alot of people in this lifestyle, and on collarme, who lean for supremist of one sort or another.  Isn't anyone going to stand up and support their alternate view?

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RE: Male supremacy or female supremacy - 1/15/2007 3:34:11 PM   
LaTigresse


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No, because I know too many of either gender that are not superior for me to say the entire gender is one or the other.

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My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

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RE: Male supremacy or female supremacy - 1/15/2007 3:37:08 PM   
akbarbarian


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

No, because I know too many of either gender that are not superior for me to say the entire gender is one or the other.

Aka we all suck, destroy all humans?   

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RE: Male supremacy or female supremacy - 1/15/2007 3:38:55 PM   
LaTigresse


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No, I love the variety of the human race.

I don't see a need for everyone to be clearly defined or to neatly fit into a category. I love the messiness of life and humanity.

It makes life interesting.


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My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

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RE: Male supremacy or female supremacy - 1/15/2007 3:42:43 PM   
akbarbarian


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

No, I love the variety of the human race.

I don't see a need for everyone to be clearly defined or to neatly fit into a category. I love the messiness of life and humanity.

It makes life interesting.


Interesting, and I like order. 

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RE: Male supremacy or female supremacy - 1/15/2007 3:45:39 PM   
stef


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Get used to disappointment.

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RE: Male supremacy or female supremacy - 1/15/2007 3:57:01 PM   
littlesarbonn


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quote:

ORIGINAL: akbarbarian

Wow that's alot of votes for neither.  I know there are alot of people in this lifestyle, and on collarme, who lean for supremist of one sort or another.  Isn't anyone going to stand up and support their alternate view?


Probably not because every time someone does, they get attacked like rabid dogs going after a piece of meat.


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RE: Male supremacy or female supremacy - 1/15/2007 4:41:19 PM   
LadyEllen


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From where I'm sitting, its a hellishly crazy idea that there is anything much in terms of character, learned skills and behaviour, that one could isolate as either male or female - which one would surely need to do first, in order to know which might be superior?

The results of the Bems SRI (Sex role inventory), a psychological research into sex roles and gender identity and all that, produced results time and again, which showed that traits adjudged beforehand as male or female, were selected by both males and females as words they would use to describe themselves. That males selected as many female words as male, and females selected as many male words as female, was significant, and also associated with good psychological health to boot.

Of course, there are differences in socialisation. But how such artificially imposed environmental differences, even were they applied universally and constantly, could then be held to be grounds to distinguish superior/inferior I do not understand. One cannot call a Latino inferior, for not speaking English, if he has never heard a word of our language.

There are also differences in physical form; men are generally physically stronger for instance, but women can produce life from within themselves and feed it, which a man cannot. Difference in this area, does not make for overall superiority of either side. 1 + 2 + 3 = 3 + 2 + 1.

Meanwhile, out in the world we can see the result of supposed superiority of one sex. I dislike picking on the Muslim example, since they get a hard time of it already and theyre not all rabid fundies after all. But, the fundamental Muslim Wahabi creed is very clear that women are inferior - in all ways. And the Wahabis are wrong - in all ways, as I'd hope most here would concur. Such a social structure has no regard to the true natural order, which is not equality, for men and women are not equal in the sense of the same, but equitability. The Wahabi social structure is an offence to human rights, and will fail inshallah, simply because it dismisses half of its potential as inferior.

But, when it comes to playing games - hey, almost anything goes, as long as we all understand its only games after all.

E

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RE: Male supremacy or female supremacy - 1/15/2007 5:39:21 PM   
BlkTallFullfig


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quote:

ORIGINAL: stef
Get used to disappointment.
~stef
LOL Stef.

To the OP, since Rover stated my position best, I'll go with his description....
In my personal relationships, I'm a fem supremacist.   In life/general I would never accept supremacy as a rule, and I'm sure I would never grow big enough cojones to even think fem or black or whatever supremacist...  Let's face it, most people would tell me to get a grip.  
I believe none of the people on these boards who argue over this supremacist BS trully pay attention to the distinction between our roles as kinksters seeking our counterparts, vs social beings who must co-exist within the boundaries of the law and a relatively normal amount of mental health.     M

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RE: Male supremacy or female supremacy - 1/15/2007 5:41:04 PM   
thetammyjo


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quote:

ORIGINAL: akbarbarian

I'd like to see support for either male supremacy, female supremacy, or reasons to be against either one. For anyone who cites historical advantages, please list specifics. If one side did it wrong, show how the other side did it right. If patriarchal society went wrong, did matriarchal society in practice really do it that much better in any specific examples historically? And if the patriarchs had it right, why so and what ills did it prevent? Has there been a society that didn't have our superior/inferior gender roles that worked well? The USA is still struggling there so I'm not sure that would serve as any kind of example. Also, by tolerating either male or female supermacy is that any different from tolerating white supremists or nazis? Is there a kind of tolerance of supremists that is fine as long as they don't cross a certain line, and if so, what is the line?


*YAWN* These questions I fear are just a play into another thread that deteriorates into bashing on both sides. Plus I think this has been bashed to death in multiple forums and multiple times since I've been on this site.

My come back question is this: Why does anyone feel the need to try and find some grand superiority?

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RE: Male supremacy or female supremacy - 1/15/2007 6:35:09 PM   
MzMia


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quote:

ORIGINAL: littlesarbonn

quote:

ORIGINAL: akbarbarian

Wow that's alot of votes for neither.  I know there are alot of people in this lifestyle, and on collarme, who lean for supremist of one sort or another.  Isn't anyone going to stand up and support their alternate view?


Probably not because every time someone does, they get attacked like rabid dogs going after a piece of meat.



Bingo

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RE: Male supremacy or female supremacy - 1/15/2007 7:09:32 PM   
demistress


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I'm a me supremacist.... this is not to say I am better then others in the 'regular' world at large, but that in MY world, I am queen, and I reign supreme.  Anyone who does not agree is welcome to leave my world :)

In general, I think one's race, gender, IQ, EQ, degree, profession, collar color, etc. do not entitle them to feel superior to anyone else.  The world is just too beautifully chaotic.

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RE: Male supremacy or female supremacy - 1/15/2007 9:04:08 PM   
Jauque


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quote:

ORIGINAL: thetammyjo

quote:

ORIGINAL: akbarbarian

I'd like to see support for either male supremacy, female supremacy, or reasons to be against either one. For anyone who cites historical advantages, please list specifics. If one side did it wrong, show how the other side did it right. If patriarchal society went wrong, did matriarchal society in practice really do it that much better in any specific examples historically? And if the patriarchs had it right, why so and what ills did it prevent? Has there been a society that didn't have our superior/inferior gender roles that worked well? The USA is still struggling there so I'm not sure that would serve as any kind of example. Also, by tolerating either male or female supermacy is that any different from tolerating white supremists or nazis? Is there a kind of tolerance of supremists that is fine as long as they don't cross a certain line, and if so, what is the line?


*YAWN* These questions I fear are just a play into another thread that deteriorates into bashing on both sides. Plus I think this has been bashed to death in multiple forums and multiple times since I've been on this site.

My come back question is this: Why does anyone feel the need to try and find some grand superiority?






I would think one tries to find a grand superiority in the simple idea that the human race, as a general rule, likes conformity.  You take one person and they are an individual.  You take 20 people and put them together they will form a more broad collective of individuals, but forming a sorta mosaic. 

So...the idea of the one sex being superior to the other, or rather the desire to find one, is in fact the desire to simpily this concept.  Its very easy to say that Man is superior to woman, beause a man IS superior to a woman, rather then say that a Man is Superior to a woman unless that woman is Angelina Jolie, in which case she is superior to Men....

etc...etc.

We humans as a general rule do not desire to complicate our lives, which is one reason (in my opinion) a D/S relationship is so apealling.  It takes out the complications that arise from a more tradtionally 'equal' relationship.

...in a personal relationship it needs to be based on personal preference.

...on the broader sense, in a more political view, men and women can fuck up the world quite well, regardless of their gender.  You asked for historical references...I would say for a Patriarchal society you can look to the presentday and ask yourself, 'is it idea?'...I'll leave you with that thought...

...as for a Matriachal society...well.  I can't think of one off the top of my head, but I would like to offer this as food for thought.

I think we can all agree that at one point in our distant past it was women who ruled.  This is no longer the case (or for the majority socio-political enviroment it is the case..)  Now...the idea is that something changed.  It was a shift from Matri to Patri.  Why?

The nature of all social change is discontent.

~J





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