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When i was a child - 3/1/2005 1:03:29 PM   
wholesubmission


Posts: 5
Joined: 2/21/2005
Status: offline
Over the years i have stumbled across polls and surveys showing a connection between masochism and child abuse. This makes me wonder about Dominance. Do You have a story?
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RE: When i was a child - 3/1/2005 1:53:43 PM   
BlkTallFullfig


Posts: 5585
Joined: 6/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: wholesubmission
Over the years i have stumbled across polls and surveys showing a connection between masochism and child abuse. This makes me wonder about Dominance. Do You have a story?

I don't have an interesting story, but am interested as you are... I'd love to know if there is connection between submissive men and "an abnormal (excessively abnormal)" connection with their moms too. M


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""Touching was, and still is, and will always be, the true revolution" Nikki Giovanni

(in reply to wholesubmission)
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RE: When i was a child - 3/1/2005 2:18:09 PM   
perverseangelic


Posts: 2625
Joined: 2/2/2004
From: Davis, Ca
Status: offline 		Never abused as a child. Hell, never even -spanked- as a child.

Fairly heavy masochist.

Such is the case for every masochist I've ever spoken to. (Granted this is about 20 people, which is statistically unsignificant)

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RE: When i was a child - 3/1/2005 2:35:10 PM   
MissP


Posts: 103
Joined: 10/1/2004
Status: offline 		I too have noticed a very high number of subs/masos that were victims of child abuse.

As for doms - well, no story here. I just do it because I enjoy it. And he clothes are cool

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http://www.mistress-p.co.uk/

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RE: When i was a child - 3/1/2005 4:27:15 PM   
LadyAngelika


Posts: 8070
Joined: 7/4/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: perverseangelic
Never abused as a child. Hell, never even -spanked- as a child.
Fairly heavy masochist.
Such is the case for every masochist I've ever spoken to. (Granted this is about 20 people, which is statistically unsignificant)


I am not sub at all but medium to heavy masochist. There was absolutely no corporal punishment in the house I grew up in, which made me like an alien where I grew up! All these other kids were getting spanked and then could go on with their lives whereas I got grounded! How vile dragging out the punishment over time! But the idea of corporal punishment really fascinated me. I was playing discipline games with a friend of mine during sleepovers. We were seven. I used to order her to spank me. And then I would tell her that it was my turn to spank her. She would ask me to stop and I would say no, she had not had enough. She probably could have used a safeword.

As for my primary Domme/Top/Sadistic side, I think that this is an inherent state of being for me. I have a few memories I guess. One is very early, five or six, when we lived in a townhouse complex and I insisted all boys and the two girls in my complex call me Queen. They were to bring me presents like cookies from their house or stickers or something like that. They always complied otherwise they would find themselves ostracised by the others. I even had one shine my patent leather shoes once.

I remember my dad telling me: "Nobody likes a bossy girl". Ha!!

- LA

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Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

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RE: When i was a child - 3/1/2005 5:43:39 PM   
ShiftedJewel


Posts: 2492
Joined: 12/2/2004
Status: offline 		I was abused as a child, so was my little sister. I ended up being the protector or her. I protected her not only from the abuser, but from anyone at school that messed with her (at least until I found out she was picking fights then running to me). As I got older I took on the role as protector for my older sister as well. My brother always said that he was the big brother until I got older. So I've always been a tomboy and a fighter, hell, I even have a heavy bag hanging in the corner of the computer room. But, I did start out this lifestyle as a sub/slave and simply found that it didn't suit me. I can say the same for my little sister, she started out as a sub, couldn't stand it, now she is happy with her role as a Domina and enjoys her submissive.

I have often wondered the same thing, if an abusive childhood "breeds" a submissive... but looking back on it I don't see any correlation between the two, it happens all the time, but then again how many abused children grow up to be totally vanilla?

Jewel

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RE: When i was a child - 3/1/2005 7:04:52 PM   
onceburned


Posts: 2117
Joined: 1/4/2005
From: Iowa
Status: offline 		Wholesubmission, this is an interesting question. Would you mind sharing some of the polls and surveys that you mentioned?

I am not sure if any scientific studies have been conducted that look at the possible link between masochism and abuse as a child.

There is an unpublished B.A. paper on the web which used a a small, non random sample. Based upon the bibliography, I think the paper was written around 2000.

The college student author, Monica Grajales, was unable to find any empirical research on this topic, so she conducted her own.

N=45

Abused - 48%
Not abused - 52%

Abused males 33%
Abused females 67%

Non-abused males - 83%
Non-abused females - 17%

Abused males and identity
Dominant - 71%
Switch - 29%
Submissive - 0%

Non-abused males and identity
Dominant - 53%
Switch - 42%
Submissive - 5%

Abused females and identity
Dominant - 14%
Switch - 21%
Submissive - 64%

Non-abused females and identity
Dominant - 0%
Switch - 25%
Submissive 75%

http://www.leatherquest.com/education/gdc.htm

Now I don't want to make too much of a deal out of such a small unrepresentative sample in an college student's BA paper. But it would seem to suggest child abuse leads to -less- masochism/submission (the paper groups these together) and increased dominance.

And actually that would seem to fit the theory that child abuse survivors are attracted to BDSM so they can subconsciously confront their victimization and overcome it. How better to overcome it than by being the dominant partner?

The student researcher asked her respondents who had been abused whether they felt their past victimization had affected their particpation in or attraction to BDSM. And about half agreed - but there might be methodological problems with leading questions skewing results.

M mentions an interesting theory about male submissives and their relationship to their mothers. I have never heard this theory before and despair at finding a good test of it. So if anyone has anecdotal evidence they would like to share I think it would be most welcome.

< Message edited by onceburned -- 3/1/2005 7:06:02 PM >

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RE: When i was a child - 3/1/2005 7:19:42 PM   
LadyAngelika


Posts: 8070
Joined: 7/4/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: onceburned

Non-abused females and identity
Dominant - 0%


Hey! I fall in the 0% category!

Then again, how do they define someone as "abused"? Is it perceptual or are there strict criteria? Does it have to be repeated abuse or can a one time event qualify?

I have never been abused by my parents or by anyone else on a long term basis. I've had to deal with a bully or two and had a few asshole boyfriends, even a mega bitch girlfriend, one who even got a swing in (one, and only one). I had a few moments where boys tried to force themselves on me, one who managed to rape me.

But overall, I don't identify as someone who was abused. I lived moments of abuse. We all have moments of abuse throughout our lives. I feel fortunate that I had less. My heart goes out to those who have had to endure any amount.

- LA

_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

(in reply to onceburned)
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RE: When i was a child - 3/1/2005 7:27:07 PM   
LadyAngelika


Posts: 8070
Joined: 7/4/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: onceburned
M mentions an interesting theory about male submissives and their relationship to their mothers. I have never heard this theory before and despair at finding a good test of it. So if anyone has anecdotal evidence they would like to share I think it would be most welcome.


Lemme see... somewhere I read a study on boys and their mothers... In fact, yes! I remember. I believe his name was Dr Sigmund Freud... ;)

In all honesty, the relationships we have with our parents do shape the people we are. I saw my mother as overall strong in some areas but weak in others. I strived not to be weak in those. My father.... well that could be a 10 page response! He's a good man deep down inside but he has issues with strong women. And on many levels, my aggressivity and confrontational nature from a very young age was a major problem for him. Unlike many girls, I don't know what it's like to be "daddy's little girl". It was an issue for a while but I've gotten beyond that now.

- LA


_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

(in reply to onceburned)
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RE: When i was a child - 3/1/2005 7:44:13 PM   
Dave8544


Posts: 49
Joined: 7/23/2004
Status: offline 		I'm sort of submissive, Mom was the dominate one, Dad was passive, But Dad was the spanker and yes I got my fair share, when you made Mom angry, Dads army belt came off, and He whipped your tail, had many a bruised rear end. Don't think it has anything to do with my submissiveness though. Dave

(in reply to LadyAngelika)
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RE: When i was a child - 3/1/2005 8:50:51 PM   
mantis65


Posts: 456
Joined: 12/27/2004
Status: offline 		My mother was dominant , we were spanked when bad but not excessively. No abuse that I can recall
mantis

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RE: When i was a child - 3/1/2005 9:42:12 PM   
craftywulf


Posts: 35
Joined: 2/15/2005
Status: offline 		hmmmm my pants were pulled down every day and i got the willow switch.Thoes thoughts have never left my mind and i still need that today

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RE: When i was a child - 3/1/2005 9:43:17 PM   
craftywulf


Posts: 35
Joined: 2/15/2005
Status: offline 		oooooooooo yes i am very submissive to this day

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RE: When i was a child - 3/1/2005 11:37:17 PM   
mantis65


Posts: 456
Joined: 12/27/2004
Status: offline 		i think i got spanked more as an adult than a kid
mantis

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RE: When i was a child - 3/2/2005 12:37:42 AM   
GordonFreeman


Posts: 30
Joined: 1/10/2005
Status: offline 		There is massive variation in almost all aspects of human character and behaviour. Trying to pin one effect to one cause is definitely a useless endevour. Having said that, the trend i have observed with my gfs over the years -

childhood abuse = narrow definition of sexuality as adult

loving and abuse free childhood = openess to sexual experimentation as an adult

(in reply to wholesubmission)
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RE: When i was a child - 3/2/2005 7:55:08 AM   
BlkTallFullfig


Posts: 5585
Joined: 6/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika
quote:

ORIGINAL: onceburned
M mentions an interesting theory about male submissives and their relationship to their mothers. I have never heard this theory before and despair at finding a good test of it.

Lemme see... somewhere I read a study on boys and their mothers... In fact, yes! I remember. I believe his name was Dr Sigmund Freud... ;)

In all honesty, the relationships we have with our parents do shape the people we are. I saw my mother as overall strong in some areas but weak in others. I strived not to be weak in those. My father.... well that could be a 10 page response!
- LA

LOL, Thanks Lady Angelika, for the Sig Freud reply... I suppose I was wondering about more recent experiences, especially among kinksters.

I can identify with you on the strong mom thing, my dad however was a lot more understanding of strong women/independent people generally. M




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""Touching was, and still is, and will always be, the true revolution" Nikki Giovanni

(in reply to LadyAngelika)
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RE: When i was a child - 3/2/2005 8:04:58 AM   
WulfMan


Posts: 115
Status: offline 		Sure I was abused as a child, I admit it, but I really don't think that had anything to do with me being submissive. Granted I'm not sure I'd truely call myself a submissive, I'm pretty dominate when it comes to my professional and public life. I probably just like to call myself "loving", or perhaps just human.

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RE: When i was a child - 3/2/2005 11:08:29 AM   
slave4mzpatti


Posts: 39
Joined: 10/20/2004
Status: offline 		I think my childhood lacked discipline and structure that is one reason I am turned on by a good discipline session. I also feel the way I enjoy pleasing my mistress by doing the housework and cooking is how I used to please my mother. We are all the sum of our past. We sometimes don't see the connection right away.

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RE: When i was a child - 3/2/2005 12:47:07 PM   
wholesubmission


Posts: 5
Joined: 2/21/2005
Status: offline 		thank You for taking the time to share Your story, i do appreciate it. W/we are shaped by early childhood conditioning, i was really curious to hear a story like this. As to an actual debate in regards to a direct correlation in masochism and child abuse, numbers are numbers, facts are facts, and as an even wiser person once said, "The truth is irrelevant, its all a pile of lies and historical revisionism. There is nothing close to the truth, its all in your mind." (William S. Burroughs).

i guess i will have to be extremely specific when i post questions in this "Ask a Mistress" message board. i should have rephrased the question to look something like this:

Are their any Female Mistress's whom can find the conditioning aspect in early childhood that could possibly explain why they are Dominate?

Thank You again LadyAngelika

(in reply to LadyAngelika)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: When i was a child - 3/2/2005 1:58:42 PM   
sting516


Posts: 505
Joined: 9/4/2004
From: long island, ny
Status: offline 		my own situation is that my childhood too lacked discipline and structure...i basically did what i wanted when i wanted...this is part of why i feel ownership is what i seek...will i rebel a bit at first, i have no doubt of this...but this is because discipline is not something i've ever been used to, not because it's not something i crave.

Additionally, i don't fit in to the model above regarding the abused and their bdsm orientation...as i'd made the mistake of hitchhiking one time and was molested by the one who picked me up...so i guess i blow that zero percent right out of the water.


sting

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