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RE: Commitment - 2/2/2007 12:28:30 AM   
gregor2001us


Posts: 37
Joined: 1/28/2007
Status: offline 		Food for thought:

Definition:  com·mit·ment (kə-mĭt'mənt) n.
1.
The act or an instance of committing, especially:  The act of referring a legislative bill to committee.
Official consignment, as to a prison or mental health facility.
A court order authorizing consignment to a prison.
2.
A pledge to do.
Something pledged, especially an engagement by contract involving financial obligation.
The state of being bound emotionally or intellectually to a course of action or to another person or persons: a deep
commitment to liberal policies; a profound commitment to the family.

Quotes:
When you make a commitment to a relationship, you invest your attention and energy in it more profoundly because
you now experience ownership of that relationship.  - Barbara De Angelis

A person with half volition goes backwards and forwards, but makes no progress on even the smoothest of roads.  -
Thomas Carlyle

(in reply to RumpusParable)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Commitment - 2/2/2007 4:49:41 AM   
swtnsparkling


Posts: 1738
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
Commitment is doing  what you said you'd do
long after the moment you said it in
 is gone


_____________________________

Never make anyone a priority who treats you as an option 2003

Walk in Peace
A "No" uttered from deepest conviction is better than a "Yes" uttered merely to please



(in reply to gregor2001us)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Commitment - 2/2/2007 4:50:48 AM   
dawntreader


Posts: 3045
Joined: 11/23/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: swtnsparkling

Commitment is doing  what you said you'd do
long after the moment you said it in
 is gone



That is good!

_____________________________

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There is a war going on for your mind...if you are thinking, you are winning~
Flobots

(in reply to swtnsparkling)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Commitment - 2/2/2007 6:14:41 AM   
asassylilslave


Posts: 93
Status: offline
quote:

Vanilla folk tend to have standard expectations regarding their commitments

they do ? You must know some pretty boring vanilla people.
quote:

though we know that relationships in the BDSM world often require a great deal more negotiation.

Really? That's funny, I never thought that those in such a world were any different than those on the outside. It must take alot of work maintaining a stance of believing that you are different from anyone else in regards to relationships.
quote:

How important is commitment to you, both personally and within the boundaries of a relationship?

Commitment is important in ALL relationships that I maintain; from ones that are sexual, to ones that I have with my young-ins.
quote:

What role does commitment play in your own dynamic?

My relationships are just that: relationships; there is not special 'dynamic" that occurs.
 

(in reply to Stephann)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Commitment - 2/2/2007 6:25:05 AM   
MaryT


Posts: 553
Joined: 12/8/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Wulfchyld

Whatever your definition of D/s is it should still allow you to feel that sense of Awe over your Dominant as well as a Sub.


This is close to my thinking.  For me, a partner's sense of excitement about a relationship is even more important to me than monogamy.  Some doms put on an air of cool detachment, and some probably some find that appealing.  I find great appeal in a parnter who is as excited about 'us' as I am.

(in reply to Wulfchyld)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Commitment - 2/2/2007 7:12:39 AM   
BlkTallFullfig


Posts: 5585
Joined: 6/25/2004
Status: offline 		Commitment to me means 2(for us monogamy-seeking-types) or more (poly comitted folks) people working within a relationship toward a mutual goal of marriage, cohabitation, collaring, etc...

In my previous vanilla lifetime, I would always enter a relationship with the goal of marrying him, because that is how a man honors a woman with whom he's having sex in my vernacular.   Having been there and done the marriage thing, I no longer feel strongly that a relationship should have a day of walking to the altar or justice of the peace for legal binding.   This however does not diminish my desire and need for a committed relationship; my goal/the commitment I seek is to at some point share the same living space and promising to be there for one another through beautiful and ugly times.
I hope that makes sense in response to your question.   M

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(in reply to Stephann)
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RE: Commitment - 2/2/2007 7:35:37 AM   
Dnomyar


Posts: 7933
Joined: 6/27/2005
Status: offline 		In'st comunicating the same as negotiating?

(in reply to RumpusParable)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Commitment - 2/2/2007 7:38:47 AM   
Dnomyar


Posts: 7933
Joined: 6/27/2005
Status: offline 		BlkTallFulfig. Cant you commit to just a friendship. Why does marriage have to enter into it?

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Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Commitment - 2/2/2007 7:44:09 AM   
thetammyjo


Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline 		For me comittment means that both people (or all people depending on the number) value the relationship even to put in equal amounts of work to help it continue in the fashion they mutually desire.

For my husband and I, this primarily involves making joint decisions about big things and long-term things, considering each other's needs first but giving each other support to become strong individuals.

For my slave and I it is somewhat similar. The difference is that I have the authority to make all decisions but I choose not to do so and my slave puts my names and desires first (not considers, there is a difference here), and focuses it helping my career more than his own.

We each must work to make these happen. If we are not willing to do this work, we lack committment.

_____________________________

Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

(in reply to Stephann)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Commitment - 2/2/2007 7:47:24 AM   
BlkTallFullfig


Posts: 5585
Joined: 6/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Dnomyar
BlkTallFulfig. Cant you commit to just a friendship. Why does marriage have to enter into it?
I have friends and family to whom I'm committed to be sure, but I'm talking about (male/female since I'm hetero) relationships here.   I know people play with friends, and people have friendly relationships especially within wiitwd.    My goal in a D/s relationship or any type of relationship with a man is long term togetherness, not friendship...  Don't get me wrong, I love friendships, but I don't call that a commitment at all; I call it a friendship, based on comfort and convenience up to a finite point for me.   M

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""Touching was, and still is, and will always be, the true revolution" Nikki Giovanni

(in reply to Dnomyar)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Commitment - 2/2/2007 7:55:39 AM   
Stephann


Posts: 4214
Joined: 12/27/2006
From: Portland, OR
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: asassylilslave

quote:

Vanilla folk tend to have standard expectations regarding their commitments

they do ? You must know some pretty boring vanilla people.
quote:

though we know that relationships in the BDSM world often require a great deal more negotiation.

Really? That's funny, I never thought that those in such a world were any different than those on the outside. It must take alot of work maintaining a stance of believing that you are different from anyone else in regards to relationships.
asassylilslave,

These issues fall under a somewhat different topic, briefly I'll just mention that I was speaking in generalities.  The average vanilla couple doesn't generally sit and discuss safe words, speech restrictions, or polyarmorous relationships (though certainly any good relationship is dependant on good communication, and 'vanilla' folk aren't always necessarily monogamous.)  Certainly, your milage will vary.

BlackTallFullfig,

Thank you for your thoughts.  I do understand what you are driving at.  From my own perspective, I used to feel the same; that I needed to know where my romantic relationship was going, to feel that the relationship was healthy and fulfilling.  After a great deal of introspection, I'm starting to question that assertion.  I don't know that I want to sit down with a woman I love, to say "We are heading to Lat XXX and Long XXX" - but neither do I wish to remain standing still.  I think we all know of people who are in a bigger rush to get married or live with or fall in love with 'someone'  when in reality, they mean 'almost anyone.' 

So, in terms of 'artificial bond' I wasn't trying to suggest that the bond wasn't genuine, only that the statement of that bond (i.e. the "she's my girlfriend" or "he's my husband") could be artificial.  If two people are in love, and happy together, how does a declaration of being (or not being) married/boyfriend/girlfriend/lover/slave/owner make the relationship stronger?  What impact does having these titles have on the relationship?

Stephan


_____________________________

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"The blade itself incites to violence" - Homer

Men: Find a Woman here

(in reply to asassylilslave)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Commitment - 2/2/2007 7:59:10 AM   
mstrjx


Posts: 2045
Joined: 11/27/2005
Status: offline 		I'm no longer quite the believer in marriage as I once might have been.  I personally see it as being more about 'business' than relationships and commitment.  The recent study showing that married people are now a minority seems to agree with that.

I work very hard at relationships.  As I said before, their course after that could be determined by a lot of things.

As far as the 'f' word, I'll take a pass.  Thanks.

Jeff

_____________________________

Know thyself. It's the best gift you can ever give yourself.

(in reply to gregor2001us)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: Commitment - 2/2/2007 8:02:25 AM   
BlkTallFullfig


Posts: 5585
Joined: 6/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

So, in terms of 'artificial bond' I wasn't trying to suggest that the bond wasn't genuine, only that the statement of that bond (i.e. the "she's my girlfriend" or "he's my husband") could be artificial.  If two people are in love, and happy together, how does a declaration of being (or not being) married/boyfriend/girlfriend/lover/slave/owner make the relationship stronger?  What impact does having these titles have on the relationship?

Stephan
Call it the human need for coalition building...  Call it the human need to see a linear correlation between now and later.  It's a security thing.    I personally find that I need to know we are working toward a similar goal to feel more respected and secure within a relationship...   I like to dream of more of the same or new ways to implement routines within my relationship, and I would feel it's a waste of time and energy if he weren't working on building the same future togetherness.

I feel lost and empty after great/intense moments if I don't know he's mine to rule over tomorrow and next year.   This doesn't presume shit doesn't happen, but hope is what gives most people the drive to try harder, and seek love (I think).   M

_____________________________

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""Touching was, and still is, and will always be, the true revolution" Nikki Giovanni

(in reply to Stephann)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Commitment - 2/2/2007 8:04:52 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Stephann
married/boyfriend/girlfriend/lover/slave/owner make the relationship stronger?  What impact does having these titles have on the relationship?

Stephan

Ah well that's a different question altogether.

Names are important.  Names have power.  The process of naming something is very deep and affects people on a very deep and personal level.

By co-naming eachother, you are establishing a bond, you are making a private arrangement into a public stance, you are showing a solidarity to the world and you have mutually agreed that there is some commitment that did not exist previously.

How many of us have known relationships that had the issue of "Are we together?  Is he my dom?  I don't know where we are!"  Or freaking out because one partner used "girlfriend" and the other partner wasn't ready for it?

It is just a symbol, and as such, its meaning is mostly with the people who agreed to the symbol, and as a SYMBOL of the relationship, does not mean much towards the RELATIONSHIP itself.

But symbols have power, and can be very useful and effective.

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"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to Stephann)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Commitment - 2/2/2007 8:17:06 AM   
DiurnalVampire


Posts: 8125
Joined: 1/19/2006
From: Nashville, TN
Status: offline 		I'll chime in briefly on the declaration of the title bit myself.  Ive been dealing with this part for abit here, so I do have an opinion on it.
Refering to someone as your boyfriend/girlfriend so on so forth does not make your personal bond tighter necessarily.  It does, owever, show both your partner and those around you that you are in fact comited to the person you are referencing.  It works as a reinforcement that there is in fact an important connection there. 
In our case, refering to one another as boyfriend/ girlfriend has 2 effects. First, it lets the group we are with know that neither of us are looking anymore.  The other is that we are proud to acknowledge that we are together, and want the rest of our friends to know we are happy that way.  Our bond wasnt any weaker with regardsto one another when we were long dstance for 7 months and we didnt refer to one another that way.  In the eyes of our friends, however, there is a relationship now that didnt exist previously.

DV

_____________________________

I will be your Dominate if you will be my submit - Fox

Snarko Ergo Sum
If you cannot change your mind, how are you so sure you still have one? -proverb

*Owner of Fox - collared 10/13/07*
VampiresLair

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Commitment - 2/2/2007 11:33:32 AM   
BeingChewsie


Posts: 1633
Joined: 10/27/2005
Status: offline
quote:

If two people are in love, and happy together, how does a declaration of being (or not being) married/boyfriend/girlfriend/lover/slave/owner make the relationship stronger?  What impact does having these titles have on the relationship?


I think being married makes it stronger. It would for me. It depends on what those things *mean* to the people in the dynamic. For me, marriage is the ultimate form of ownership, for my owner marrying someone is commiting to them forever, it means he plans on keeping them for the rest of their lives, hence the reason he has never done it...That is pretty serious stuff. So it isn't the titles it is the beliefs that make up our definitions and view on marriage. The titles alone mean nothing, it is the beliefs behind the words that mean everything.

_____________________________

"In fact, it is my contention that most women are accepting of way less than optimal circumstance constantly, and are lucky to be 'snagged' by the right man, if ever. But it is more by happy accident than by their design. "
~Ron and Hup

(in reply to Stephann)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Commitment - 2/2/2007 11:34:04 AM   
losttreasure


Posts: 875
Joined: 12/17/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

Names are important.  Names have power.  The process of naming something is very deep and affects people on a very deep and personal level.

By co-naming eachother, you are establishing a bond, you are making a private arrangement into a public stance, you are showing a solidarity to the world and you have mutually agreed that there is some commitment that did not exist previously.

How many of us have known relationships that had the issue of "Are we together?  Is he my dom?  I don't know where we are!"  Or freaking out because one partner used "girlfriend" and the other partner wasn't ready for it?

It is just a symbol, and as such, its meaning is mostly with the people who agreed to the symbol, and as a SYMBOL of the relationship, does not mean much towards the RELATIONSHIP itself.

But symbols have power, and can be very useful and effective.


What an insightful observation, LA... thank you!  You've helped me to recognize one of my own troubles while stumbling around with the awkward moments of trying to name what FirmHandKY and I are to one another for the benefit of those we know.  I see now that while it does not change the relationship that we enjoy, it is a symbol that we need to agree upon and I've been reluctant to make that decision on my own.

Edited to add:

quote:

ORIGINAL: MaryT

quote:

ORIGINAL: Wulfchyld

Whatever your definition of D/s is it should still allow you to feel that sense of Awe over your Dominant as well as a Sub.


This is close to my thinking.  For me, a partner's sense of excitement about a relationship is even more important to me than monogamy.  Some doms put on an air of cool detachment, and some probably some find that appealing.  I find great appeal in a parnter who is as excited about 'us' as I am.



MaryT, this is much how I feel, as well.  Passion holds a place of great importance to me when it comes to relationships.  After all, it's hard to be bored with something that you are passionate about. 


< Message edited by losttreasure -- 2/2/2007 11:39:51 AM >

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Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Commitment - 2/2/2007 11:48:06 AM   
RumpusParable


Posts: 1923
Joined: 7/7/2005
From: NYC now!
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Stephann


So, in terms of 'artificial bond' I wasn't trying to suggest that the bond wasn't genuine, only that the statement of that bond (i.e. the "she's my girlfriend" or "he's my husband") could be artificial.  If two people are in love, and happy together, how does a declaration of being (or not being) married/boyfriend/girlfriend/lover/slave/owner make the relationship stronger?  What impact does having these titles have on the relationship?

Stephan



LA expressed a good bit about it.

Also, for some they are not so much concerned with the actual relationship but looking/thinking they are in one that one or more of those labels apply to.  Some do indeed care less about finding someone who truly fits them than being able to tell others that they have relationship X, for many reasons.

On the person angle, calling a partner of any of those types by the appropriate label, stating it to another person/other people, doesn't create any form of bond.  It expresses and explains, at least to a surface level, whatever bond there is between us to those who it would effect or may wish to interact with us using knowledge of our connection as a starting point.

< Message edited by RumpusParable -- 2/2/2007 11:49:28 AM >

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Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Commitment - 2/3/2007 6:30:29 AM   
gregor2001us


Posts: 37
Joined: 1/28/2007
Status: offline 		I think part of the power of labels and such is that, to the extent that everyone has the same understanding about what they mean, they help assure a set of shared expectations.  For instance if I am in a relationship but have not articulated what it means by labeling, then does my partner in that relationship have the same expectations?   What if I assume she is my steady girl friend, but she thinks of it as a casual dating arrangement?  Of course discussion about it would be better for the couple involved....but the label is better for a wider audience because they all have a shared set of expectations without having to have long discussions with each individual.  Hopefully.

(in reply to RumpusParable)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Commitment - 2/3/2007 6:36:03 AM   
adaddysgirl


Posts: 1093
Joined: 3/2/2004
From: Syracuse, NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: swtnsparkling

Commitment is doing  what you said you'd do
long after the moment you said it in
 is gone



i like this.
 
And to add....Commitment is doing what you said you'd do even when you don't feel like doing it.  And that could encompass any kind of commitment.
 
Thanks for the thought 
 
DG

(in reply to swtnsparkling)
Profile   Post #: 40
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