Collarspace Discussion Forums


Home  Login  Search 

RE: Since everyone is talking about monogamy....


View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
 
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> General BDSM Discussion >> RE: Since everyone is talking about monogamy.... Page: <<   < prev  2 3 4 [5] 6   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
RE: Since everyone is talking about monogamy.... - 2/18/2007 1:16:14 PM   
GeekyGirl


Posts: 905
Joined: 8/21/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: reamer

Geeky:

You have made more than several posts/threads involving the "committment" angle of the male. And now this thread.

Monog is generally something desired more by the female than the male, no matter what the male says at the outset of any potential relationship (even tele-evengelists preaching against adultery have been caught out; men whom cry out for monog can't be trusted simply by dint of their crying out for such).

But for most males(at least honest ones), monog means "giving something up".  It's like being asked to buy a house with a mortgage rather than rent until the dream house comes along.  I'm NOT saying that is right, or fair, just the way it is.  And when you throw throw throw the risks of kink into the mix, it becomes more so than for Nilla relationships.

But even in those types of transactions, a man knows what he GETS in return for what he gives up, for being "locked in".

so with YOU, if a man gets locked in with monog, WHAT does he "get"?

How is that "SOMETHING" better than what he might get elsewhere, by "renting"/poly?

You've told us YOUR side of the story, the female side.  What was HIS side?  Since I feel there is something from that side we are NOT reading in this thread.  Was there a particular sexual act that he likes/loves/needs that he found out that you were inexperienced in or generally unwilling to engage in?

Maybe yes, maybe no, but if so, if there was something that HE defined (in HIS words, not what you have chosen to share with us) as something he needed - sexually and in kink, on a daily or weekly basis - that you gave any indication might be a "maybe" versus something you'd give him as a monog dom as he liked and needed, well, THAT's the "trade-off", and if you indicated that stuff would be a "maybe" while presenting monog as a "must have", then sorry, you had no right to ask for monog.

So if what he needed (maybe) was anal (HARD) at least once a week and if he were to be able to enjoy that he'd be monog happily, and you somehow indicated that "you might consider that", it's not a fair deal, sorry, and he'd HAVE to look at other partners and not be monog with you.  Same with real spanking versus mamby pampy hand-shit or feather floggers.  Same with a LOT of things.

So as YOU asked for monog, what did HE ask for, PHYSICALY and anatomically? 



He did not ask for ANYTHING I wasn't willing to give. We had a long talk about sex and liked alllll the same things. We were getting along perfectly. He made the date, set the time and place, and less than two minutes later "confessed" that he preferred poly. I don't think it had anything to do with me...I think he was starting to really like me and realized that he better come clean before the actual meeting.

He even made the comment that , "I'm sorry the poly thing is such a big deal with you...You seem so perfect for me."

And just for the record not all men like or desire poly. I have met plenty of truly monogamous men in my life. Why is it that poly men refuse to accept the fact that some men are truly monogamous? I've met oodles of monogamous men...we always broke up for reasons that had nothing to do with sex.

I happen to be willing to anything at all in the bedroom as long as it is legal and doesn't involve needles or scat (and neither of those have ever been an issue with my partners.)

You're argument is that if you can't get EVERYTHING you want from a person, you should be poly...That's ridiculous. No one gets EVERYTHING they want in a partner. It's called compromise. Unless you're so spoiled that you can't be happy without having every desire of your heart fulfilled, in which case I wouldn't want to be involved with that kind of a person anyway. Anything worth having involves a degree of sacrifice.

I believe that some people are poly by nature and some are monogamous by nature...both male and female. Again, this isn't what the thread is about. The thread is about honesty.

On a side note, I have met more than one man who experimented with poly and came back to monogamy, citing a need for "something deeper" and something "special, a permenant bond shared between two people only."




< Message edited by GeekyGirl -- 2/18/2007 1:28:12 PM >

(in reply to reamer)
Profile   Post #: 81
RE: Since everyone is talking about monogamy.... - 2/18/2007 2:52:37 PM   
meatcleaver


Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: novicecourtesan

I don't think monogamy means forever. I wish it did and I always enter into it thinking that it does. But relationships--poly, monogamous, d/s, vanilla, gay, straight--break up all the time, for various reasons, no matter how long people have been together and what they've shared. If security and family and longevity is really important to you in a relationship then there are going to be struggles no matter what lifestyle choices you make.



Serial monogamy isn't so hard. Afterall, when you have had enough you just move on. It does stop one having to broach the sticky subject of poly with a partner so while technically not poly, it is only shades away and allows one to have ones cake and eat it too. As does cheating. Commitment I'm impressed with, though I see little evidence of it. I have several acquintences whose partner believes they are faithful, I have two business clients who I know their partner's are unfaithful. Now perhaps because of my business and life style I might bump into this sort of thing more than someone working a 9-5 and living in the suburbs, I doubt I meet an abnormal cross section of the population. Thinking about it, I wonder how many of those 40% that remain married actually are faithful throughout their marrige, my guess is not many. Maybe I've been unfortunate with the women I've met but I've often found the ones that demand monogamy the most, are the first into someone elses bed should a man comes along that gives them an itch. Of course they were and are monogamous, after all, its only one at a time. It's not that I have a problem with that but I'm just baffled by those that don't see serial monogamy as polyamory of sorts. However, my own guess is that these women have to somehow circumvent their morals and this requires a certain amount of mental acrobatics.

< Message edited by meatcleaver -- 2/18/2007 2:54:36 PM >

_____________________________

There are fascists who consider themselves humanitarians, like cannibals on a health kick, eating only vegetarians.

(in reply to novicecourtesan)
Profile   Post #: 82
RE: Since everyone is talking about monogamy.... - 2/18/2007 2:54:43 PM   
GeekyGirl


Posts: 905
Joined: 8/21/2006
Status: offline 		Not all women are cheaters...I have never once had the slightest desire to cheat on anyone, including my ex husband. I am passioantely devoted to the man in my life and would rather go without sex than cheat on him. I'm just not that kind of person. Sounds to me like you've had bad experiences and are allowing them to cloud your judgement.

Now if you see serial monogamy as a sort of polyamory, that's your business...I disagree. I believe in being faithful to the person I am with, and when that person no longer fulfills me, I move on. I have no desire to split my affections between two people at once though, nor do I desire my partner to split his affections between me and another. If I'm not fulfilling him, he needs to leave me and move on.


< Message edited by GeekyGirl -- 2/18/2007 2:56:40 PM >

(in reply to meatcleaver)
Profile   Post #: 83
RE: Since everyone is talking about monogamy.... - 2/18/2007 2:59:15 PM   
meatcleaver


Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GeekyGirl

Not all women are cheaters...I have never once had the slightest desire to cheat on anyone, including my ex husband. I am passioantely devoted to the man in my life and would rather go without sex than cheat on him. I'm just not that kind of person. Sounds to me like you've had bad experiences and are allowing them to cloud your judgement.


I've only ever been surprised by one woman and she did it big time but maybe I am more cynical than most. I've had relationships with several women who claimed they are monogamous and though it made little difference to me because I wasn't looking for a serious relationship and was quite happy when they did hop into bed withs someone else, I couldn't help but smile to hear them in my head saying the same thing to the next man in their lives.

< Message edited by meatcleaver -- 2/18/2007 3:00:20 PM >

_____________________________

There are fascists who consider themselves humanitarians, like cannibals on a health kick, eating only vegetarians.

(in reply to GeekyGirl)
Profile   Post #: 84
RE: Since everyone is talking about monogamy.... - 2/18/2007 3:02:09 PM   
GeekyGirl


Posts: 905
Joined: 8/21/2006
Status: offline 		I'm sorry you had that experience...I tend to be a bit obsessive/compulsive and I have never cheated nor left one man for another...though I have left men in order to be alone because said man wasn't making me happy. I tend to be the kind who clings to a man and makes him the center of my universe and I find the idea of cheating on him to be repulsive. It's called loyalty...and I know it's an uncommon trait. I've been faithful to men who cheated on me and treated me poorly because they were my man and I couldn't stomach the thought of being with another, regardless of the circumstances.

< Message edited by GeekyGirl -- 2/18/2007 3:03:55 PM >

(in reply to meatcleaver)
Profile   Post #: 85
RE: Since everyone is talking about monogamy.... - 2/18/2007 3:32:03 PM   
novicecourtesan


Posts: 116
Joined: 2/11/2007
Status: offline 		it's interesting to see serial monogamy as polyamory, and I think it can be in many instances. For example, I have a friend who doesn't want children and doesn't like seeing more than one person at a time. She doesn't expect or plan to get married, and she doesn't believe that relationships automatically last forevers, so she sees her future as serial monogamy.

I, for better or worse, am a romantic. I don't date a person I don't think I could be serious about, and I am always uselessly hopeful that this will be The One. I don't plan on serial monogamy, but that might be my fate in the case of a divorce or death or other separation. I hope for monogamy with one person, and hope it lasts forever, knowing it may not.

I think the monogamists who end up cheating or in trouble are ones who maybe haven't given the subject much thought and just land on monogamy and vanilla marriage as the only option, or the default. But I bet the same is for polyamorists who don't think about the emotional complications of those relationships, and just think it's being allowed to sleep around.

(in reply to GeekyGirl)
Profile   Post #: 86
RE: Since everyone is talking about monogamy.... - 2/18/2007 5:20:18 PM   
MasterC70


Posts: 68
Joined: 1/31/2007
Status: offline 		Well mankind is a member of the primate family.  Many forms of cimians I believe are harem based.  The razorback gorilla is an example I think.  And at one time (biblical days) poly was more the rule than the exception.  I don't know if it's hardwired into our genes, but one man/many wives was more common back in the past.  I believe more in monogamy myself.  I certainly want my slave to be faithful to me, and if I were to be unfaithful to her (thereby risking bringing something into our relationship) I don't think that would be fair either. 


quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

Most men if they are honest would choose poly over mono. Well at least for themselves and not necessarily for their partners. We are hypocrites, nature made us that way, it's all about procreation and never being sure if a child is theirs. Whatever a man's intellectual stand point he can't get rid of his genes and he has no desire to cut off what is in his jeans either.

(in reply to meatcleaver)
Profile   Post #: 87
RE: Since everyone is talking about monogamy.... - 2/18/2007 6:04:30 PM   
adaddysgirl


Posts: 1093
Joined: 3/2/2004
From: Syracuse, NY
Status: offline 		Ya know meatcleaver, some people are looking for more than just sex.  i split up with my last dom 2 years ago this month.  Since that time, i have had no sex, vanilla or otherwise.  my choice.  i had one date which didn't go any further than sharing a few drinks at a local restaurant.  Could it have if i wanted to?  Absolutely!
 
i don't get into a relationship with someone thinking that if it doesn't work, i can just go jump in bed with someone else.  It isn't about i am monogamous until the next sexual opportunity arises.  i am monogamous because i require (yes, require) a commitment to one person, and i do not take that commitment lightly.  With any partner i have been with, i have also expected long term....as in forever.  Unfortunately, it doesn't always work that way....but that breakdown can happen in any relationship. 
 
So the thought that someone is only monogamous until they are done with a relationship then they can jump in with someone else is really a bunch of BS.  If that were the case, i would be screwing someone right now.  Instead, i will wait for a partner i can be loyal to and hope that it works in the long run.
 
i know you have issues with exclusive, monogamous, LT relationships.  i am sorry for you.  But your constant attempts at trying to convince others that since you see no validity in such, it really doesn't exist is well....just pretty much like your attempt to convince others there is no god....because that is what you believe.  Maybe someday you will just accept that others are on a different path than you and nothing you're going to say is going to sway them to see your 'true way'.
 
DG

(in reply to GeekyGirl)
Profile   Post #: 88
RE: Since everyone is talking about monogamy.... - 2/18/2007 6:10:28 PM   
GeekyGirl


Posts: 905
Joined: 8/21/2006
Status: offline 		Great post DG. I agree completely....Yes, I have been a serial monogamist but not for sexual reasons...I move on when I no longer feel as though I am being treated fairly and appropriately. I could find sex partners any day of the week...I choose to be alone after a break up until I can find someone who I feel I have at least a chance of finding something long term with.

I respect that long term monogamy is not for everyone...but it IS for some and I do not understand why polygamist insist that we are only deluding ourselves. If that were true, there wouldn't be so many happily married old couples out there!

DG's "god" example is good...I do not believe in God but I don't feel the need to sway others to my side. I recognize that different people are fulfilled by different things.

(in reply to adaddysgirl)
Profile   Post #: 89
RE: Since everyone is talking about monogamy.... - 2/18/2007 6:24:40 PM   
adaddysgirl


Posts: 1093
Joined: 3/2/2004
From: Syracuse, NY
Status: offline 		GeekyGirl and novicecourtesan, i really have to laud your posts here.  Not just because they mirror my own, but because you are willing to stand up for something you believe in and in so doing, suffer possible attack because you are in a minority.  When involved in a lifestyle where poly or at the least, involving others in the relationship either for play or sex, is pretty much the expectation.....monogamy and desiring to be with one person sounds like you might as well be from Mars.
 
GeekyGirl....monogamy isn't about low self esteem.  Irrational jealousy is about low self esteem.  If every time your partner even looks at another girl and that upsets you, then that might indicate low self esteem.  But there isn't a therapist in the world who if you talked to and said you expected a partner to only be with you....would say you have low self esteem.  If that's the case, then every couple who gets married has low self esteem partners. 
 
i really don't care why others agree to monogamy.  Some may out of social pressure.  But for me, i am beyond that.  i do what comes natural to me....and that is being with one partner at a time....and it isn't because i can't be out screwing someone else....but rather it is a commitment i need, and desire, both in my partner and myself. 
 
That is not a bad thing and anyone who tries to make you feel it is...is just an idiot.
 
DG

(in reply to novicecourtesan)
Profile   Post #: 90
RE: Since everyone is talking about monogamy.... - 2/18/2007 6:33:30 PM   
KnightofMists


Posts: 7149
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GeekyGirl
....I do not understand why polygamist insist that we are only deluding ourselves.


I find it Ironic that you make a similiar over-generalization that many close-mind poly individuals do.

Maybe you should take the chip off your shoulder.

_____________________________

Knight of Mists

An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

(in reply to GeekyGirl)
Profile   Post #: 91
RE: Since everyone is talking about monogamy.... - 2/18/2007 6:38:04 PM   
GeekyGirl


Posts: 905
Joined: 8/21/2006
Status: offline 		Knight, at no point in this thread have I insulted poly people or implied that what they are doing is wrong or unnatural...yet several poly people have tried to insist that my way is wrong and theirs is the right or "natural" way. Now who looks like they have a chip on their shoulder?

I have many poly friends and have absolutely no problem with poly...but it seems there are an awful lot of poly folks who can't just say "different strokes for different folks" and leave it at that.

This thread was never meant to become a breeding ground for debating the righteousness of poly or mono. It was about being upfront about your beliefs, whatever they may be and understanding that if you are not upfront about them, people may be hurt or disappointed.


< Message edited by GeekyGirl -- 2/18/2007 6:40:01 PM >

(in reply to KnightofMists)
Profile   Post #: 92
RE: Since everyone is talking about monogamy.... - 2/18/2007 7:01:39 PM   
KnightofMists


Posts: 7149
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GeekyGirl

Knight, at no point in this thread have I insulted poly people or implied that what they are doing is wrong or unnatural...


So... you don't consider it insulting to make the over-generalization that polygamist insist that monogamist are only deluding themselves.

Interestingly... I am one person that lives a poly lifestyle that doesn't insist that monogamist are only deluding themselves.  There is also more than a few other poly-minded individuals that also think highly of a individuals right to live a monogamist lifestyle if that is what they are choosing.

so.. I would have to disagree about not insulting poly individuals...  Secondly... I didn't suggest that you implied or said in that what we do is wrong or unnatural.  I simply state.. that you attack those that make stupid over-generalizations of monogomist by your own stupid over-generalization of polygamist.  Again.. it's ironic that you can't see that truth

_____________________________

Knight of Mists

An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

(in reply to GeekyGirl)
Profile   Post #: 93
RE: Since everyone is talking about monogamy.... - 2/18/2007 7:05:00 PM   
GeekyGirl


Posts: 905
Joined: 8/21/2006
Status: offline 		Reread the thread. You may not have stated that monogamy was unnatural and that monogamist are deluding themselves but a LARGE number of people did, therefore I felt justified in saying that MOST polygamists I've met insult monogamy.

(in reply to KnightofMists)
Profile   Post #: 94
RE: Since everyone is talking about monogamy.... - 2/18/2007 7:12:59 PM   
SimplySubmissive


Posts: 216
Joined: 1/2/2004
Status: offline 		It's just that sometimes assumptions are made about those choosing monogamy that they have not looked inside themselves.. analyzed why they want this, dealt with jealousy issues...etc etc.
Kind of like if only they worked on themselves a bit they could reach that "higher plane" of poly.


(in reply to GeekyGirl)
Profile   Post #: 95
RE: Since everyone is talking about monogamy.... - 2/18/2007 7:15:24 PM   
GeekyGirl


Posts: 905
Joined: 8/21/2006
Status: offline 		That's the vibe, yes...which I consider insulting as I have tried poly and was miserable with it. I'd be an idiot to put myself back into that situation. It only made my jealousy issues worse than they were to begin with.

ETA: I could say the same thing about poly..that they have not looked inside themselves enough to deal with their fear of committing to one person and making a long term monogamous relationship work. I could say that if they worked on their insecurities , they could dedicate themselves truly and reach the higher plane of monogamy.

I WOULDN'T say that because it's not how I feel...I feel poly is just how some people were made to be. But you get the point...

< Message edited by GeekyGirl -- 2/18/2007 7:18:06 PM >

(in reply to SimplySubmissive)
Profile   Post #: 96
RE: Since everyone is talking about monogamy.... - 2/20/2007 7:04:02 AM   
adaddysgirl


Posts: 1093
Joined: 3/2/2004
From: Syracuse, NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GeekyGirl

Reread the thread. You may not have stated that monogamy was unnatural and that monogamist are deluding themselves but a LARGE number of people did, therefore I felt justified in saying that MOST polygamists I've met insult monogamy.


i think i have to agree that a large number feel this way but obviously, as you say, not all.  i think KoM is one of those because i don't ever recall him insulting monogamists in any way.  But i think we are not talking only about polys here....i think we can are also talking about many non-monogamists (those who include others but don't actually live a poly lifestyle)  feeling the same way (again not all).
 
But i also wanted to add something here Geeky (god that sounds funny...lol).  i once started a thread on monogamy because a dom i talked with long ago said he was monogamous, but he played with other subs.  He said that he only had sex with his primary partner so he considered himself monogamous. 
 
When i started that previous thread on monogamy, i was surprised (at first) to see all the different ways the term was defined.  It really was quite interesting.  But my point is this....i don't think it's only important to find out if a potential partner is monogamous....but to find out what that means to him as well.  You just might be surprised.
 
Great thread btw 
 
DG

(in reply to GeekyGirl)
Profile   Post #: 97
RE: Since everyone is talking about monogamy.... - 2/21/2007 7:43:15 PM   
HatesParisHilton


Posts: 3513
Joined: 12/27/2006
Status: offline 		One of the reasons I am so critical of monog is that I AM  a serial monogamist, and for me, all that means is if the attempt at a relationship is going nowhere or going bad, it's bad for both people, and better to try again with someone else.  Now, have I done poly?  Yes, when the WOMAN stated she did not want monog (yes this happens).  And the definition of monog, by my own yardstick, is too fast and loose these days.

If you have said you ROMANTICALLY LOVE SOMEONE and they said the same back, then by MY yardstick, if you play with another woman (or she plays with another man), if you TONGUE KISS, then you just crossed a boundary, sorry.  I have no probs with Bill Clinton but his 'tood of oral sex ain't sex is BULLSHIT.  He cheated on Hillary, full stop.  Just like Fundamentalist Preachers against him that took hand jobs from people other than their wives in their limo's; same thing.

The problem is that in our day and age, the legal risks of monog are greater, especially in a kinky relationship where anyone can anonymously text message their partner's employer or parent or worse the moment they feel slighted or scorned for any reason, not to mention the legal ramifications, so sadly, ladies, monog has a MUCH higher "risk factor" in kink life than nilla life.  And when you look at a certain female astronaught travelling cross country in a diaper with weapons and anti-rape spray ready to attack her rival?

Men think of these things, whether they admity it on a message board or not.

If a lauded and applauded national/international femal HERO will go this nutbag, we need some grerater reassurances from the female populace, especially in "kinkworld", sorry.

_____________________________

I am (now) "Hiltie", hear me ROARRRRR! And have a cuffy cake, they're nice.

(in reply to adaddysgirl)
Profile   Post #: 98
RE: Since everyone is talking about monogamy.... - 2/21/2007 7:50:31 PM   
SusanofO


Posts: 5672
Joined: 12/19/2005
Status: offline 		I've come to believe that Poly is one of those things people can either do or they can't. I do believe people can change their minds about this (I did, but it was a gradual thing, not an overnight revelation).

The situation I really have a hard time with is when the man is actually the one who's Poly, but the woman isn't (or one partner isn't anyway, regardless of their gender), and is just playing along to make the other one happy (because usually the one doing that is miserable).

I actually am feeling like I am Poly (or very willing to try it), and would not be the person receiving any "short end of the stick" in a Poly relationship - because if it's good for the goose, it's good for tha gander, I think. But - if my partner wanted me to remain Monogamous, I would do that out of respect for him (I really would - I am not "married" to the idea of being Poly).

If you can't do Poly (meaning, you really hate the idea and it goes against every grain in your soul) then him telling you "it could work", or "you might find out you like it", or "it's too bad you're so against Poly, you seem so perfect for me" is (IMO) not a great idea, even if it seems to him like it could be true (IMO).

If you've tried Poly and decided it's not for you, then it's not for you (or even if you haven't actually tried it, and still decided it's not for you). Neither is better or worse than the other (IMO), but trying to talk someone into it, just ain't gonna produce a happy end result for everyone, I don't think.

- Susan

< Message edited by SusanofO -- 2/21/2007 8:08:15 PM >

_____________________________

"Hope is the thing with feathers,
That perches in the soul,
And sings the tune without the words,
And never stops at all". - Emily Dickinson

(in reply to HatesParisHilton)
Profile   Post #: 99
RE: Since everyone is talking about monogamy.... - 2/21/2007 7:52:16 PM   
FukinTroll


Posts: 6277
Joined: 2/6/2007
From: Under a bridge
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SusanofO

I've come to believe that Poly is one of those things people can either do or they can't.



Just like parallel parking.

_____________________________

I'm the guy your girl is thinking about when she is fucking you!

TrollTopia
Greedy Groupie!

The Mods have me on speed Spank!! Gotta luv'em.

(in reply to SusanofO)
Profile   Post #: 100
Page:   <<   < prev  2 3 4 [5] 6   next >   >>
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> General BDSM Discussion >> RE: Since everyone is talking about monogamy.... Page: <<   < prev  2 3 4 [5] 6   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy

0.109