RE: where is the outrage? [rant enclosed] (Full Version)

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ferryman777 -> RE: where is the outrage? [rant enclosed] (3/13/2007 10:49:47 PM)

What planet are you from? 
Not for Oil? Oh please, get real. Oil is the lifes blood of every country on earth. Control of it, and you control the world. Get your head out of your ass.




ArizonaSunSwitch -> RE: where is the outrage? [rant enclosed] (3/14/2007 12:14:35 AM)

If it was about oil we would do something like this:

1). Deploy our forces around the pipelines and oil fields.

2). Encourage the shia and sunni to blow each other up, watch with glee as one reaches victory and genocides the
other.

3). Kill the victor.

4). Split the oil revenue with the kurds, grant them independance by giving them the whole country to pay back turkey for
it's betrayals.

5). Suggest to the members of the Iranian and Syrian governments that they and their families might live longer happier lives in exhile someplace that would appreciate them, say DC or Boston.

This conflict is about sharia law and birth demographics and making a moral attempt to show them a more enlightened path before they become so threatening to us that our choices will become limited to 1). submitting to sharia law or 2). embarking on world war III. I won't get into this as it'll piss off all the people here that refuse to believe the situation is anything more complicated than "bush is a moron" and "haliburton is evil" and "global warming is a greater threat".

You should worry more about your 5 year old daughter getting drafted than your 18 yr old son enlisting.





meatcleaver -> RE: where is the outrage? [rant enclosed] (3/14/2007 2:06:36 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

Nope. That's not correct. The American colonists first off never attacked civilians. If anything it was the Brits that were doing that. Second, the colonists formed a uniformed standing army that engaged the Brits on the battlefield.

These terrorsts today are targetting civilians. They are such cowards that they don't dare engage our army on the battlefield. They have to use women and children as shields. Did America's founding fathers do that, hell no!

To compare those animals to the America's founding fathers is an insult to everyone that has died for this country.


The American war of independence was in many ways a civil war and civilians were targeted by both sides and one of the main reasons for the war was the Proclaimation line where the Brits wanted to protect Indian lands which the land hungry colonists wanted.

The idea the war of independence was a righteous war is a nonsense, I'm struggling to think of a war fought for noble reasons. The founding fathers were a mirror image of conservative Parliamentarians back in London. They were greedy and ambitious and wanted to fill their coffers. Like their counterparts in London, they didn't pay tax or at least very little, that was why it was Britain that bankrupted itself fighting the seven years war to protect the colonies and that is why they wanted to impose a stamp duty on imports into the Americas. There were also over 100,000 colonists that fled to Canada after the war because Washington's side didn't believe in targeting civilians.




krys -> RE: where is the outrage? [rant enclosed] (3/14/2007 4:36:47 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: mixielicous

Damn you generation X, you lazy stoned assholes. our parents in their hay day would have never let this happen, but their getting old. Why arent the young kids standing up and protesting?

why is protesting suddenly viewed as useless and ineffective?

i am ashamed of my peers and their laziness. [:(]



Well first I just have to say I love being referred to as a "young kid" but us Gen Xers are in our 30s now.  And we are more likely to make our voices heard through our buying power at the stores and our voting power at the polls than marching around.  Its hard to get a sitter and time off from work. 

If the current administration is happily going about doing whatever the hell it wants regardless of the law, what would a bunch of kids with placards accomplish?  The real backlash, the protest you are looking for, is there.  Its not in the streets with signs, its in the November election (and will hopefully be very evident in the '08 election).  Its in the current approval ratings.  Its there every time someone takes a moment to write to their local elected officials and to go to the polls and try to make thier voice heard.  (I say try 'cause I am from Florida, so whether my vote counts is debateable.) 




meatcleaver -> RE: where is the outrage? [rant enclosed] (3/14/2007 4:51:30 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: krys

Its not in the streets with signs, its in the November election (and will hopefully be very evident in the '08 election). 


When has the establishment lost an election? One set of puppets or another always gets in.

Tony Benn, a British politician pointed out that every major reform or decision in society is won outside the legislature before it is rubber stamped by politicians. Take your choice, slavery, female sufferage or more appropriate to Iraq, the withdrawal from Vietnam.




mixielicous -> RE: where is the outrage? [rant enclosed] (3/14/2007 7:57:50 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: pollux


Btw, when was the last time you had your civil rights violated, or lost some form of choice. Has the government tied you down & forced you to have a baby lately? Are any of your neighbors being "disappeared" by government death squads?

Inquiring minds want to know.


picking up a phone in the airport that has a sticker on it reading "this phone is being monitored thanks to the pat act" is not good enough? how about the impeding "real id"? how about if that psycho ninny gets any more control of this country, YES i would be forced to have a baby. it doesnt have to directly happen to me, you should be outraged that your muslum neighbors down the street have a tapped phone or that the morning after pill is only available if you beg your doctor for it. passive attitudes do NOT invoke change.




mixielicous -> RE: where is the outrage? [rant enclosed] (3/14/2007 8:00:36 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: krys
(and will hopefully be very evident in the '08 election).


just like it was heard in '04, right? see the difference this year is, bush CANT return. too bad the voting power didnt help with that earlier.




ferryman777 -> RE: where is the outrage? [rant enclosed] (3/14/2007 8:44:27 AM)

Hello, pardon my 1/2 cent worth. You are so very correct. Awhile ago, I had a client, the project was Washington and The Revolution. The Client wanted to tell the real story, not the official school textbook myth. So.....research was gathered, from rather somewhat obscure publications (the clent had access to orginal documents).

What you say is correct, also let me add..... B.Arnold was a businessman, and Was pressed into service by Gen.Washington, basically Arnold's payments were either nil, or very late, and in part at very best, in fact Arnold had to fund the escapades with his own money, supply the wagons, supplies etc., and with only a verbal promise of payment. Arnold was being bankrupted, the Brits came with an offer, and paid with ready money. Arnold did what any businessman would have done, decided it was folly to be a traitor to his country......England.

Consider this....The colonies paid taxes to the Brits, it took a year or so, for the ship to arrive in England.  A year or so goes by, no payments, okay, send an embassary to the Americas, see what is happening, another year, embassary returns, another year, message delivered, the Colonys have revolted, declared independance. Another year or so to raise an army and set matters right. A year or so transportation of the army. Over simplfied, I know, but a time frame none the less.

There was no Email back then.

Our so-called Revolutionary War, was in fact a Civil War. There were no Americans then, everyone was a British Subject.

We were told the war was, in part, over the taxation by England, without representation, and to be free of taxes. Not true, Washington and cronies decided why pay the King these taxes, when the collected taxes could be theirs. Taxation did not stop, only transferred to Washington et al.

It was Washington and the founding fathers who were the traitors (to their country - England). Now research what became of the signers of the declaration of Independance. Civilians were indeed targeted, hunted, hung, families made desitute, etc.

Al Pacino made a film years ago - Revolution. Very interesting, the producers must have gleemed their info from some of the same sources my client did.

The project.......the original intent was abandoned, and, another text book myth was the end result. The truth could not be sold.

I find it amazing all the rage against Iraq, Iran, etc; as a people, Americans think, for the most part, that they are the only pure humans, and.... can,... have the god given right to impose their beliefs on the world at large, irregardless of the cultures, traditions, belief systems of other peoples which have been in place for centuries. It's a rather arrogant posture, don't you think? To have an enemy......the enemy MUST be different; in appearance, belief and idealologies.

but...what do I know.




thompsonx -> RE: where is the outrage? [rant enclosed] (3/14/2007 8:51:23 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

Nope. That's not correct. The American colonists first off never attacked civilians. If anything it was the Brits that were doing that. Second, the colonists formed a uniformed standing army that engaged the Brits on the battlefield.

These terrorsts today are targetting civilians. They are such cowards that they don't dare engage our army on the battlefield. They have to use women and children as shields. Did America's founding fathers do that, hell no!

To compare those animals to the America's founding fathers is an insult to everyone that has died for this country.


The American war of independence was in many ways a civil war and civilians were targeted by both sides and one of the main reasons for the war was the Proclaimation line where the Brits wanted to protect Indian lands which the land hungry colonists wanted.

The idea the war of independence was a righteous war is a nonsense, I'm struggling to think of a war fought for noble reasons. The founding fathers were a mirror image of conservative Parliamentarians back in London. They were greedy and ambitious and wanted to fill their coffers. Like their counterparts in London, they didn't pay tax or at least very little, that was why it was Britain that bankrupted itself fighting the seven years war to protect the colonies and that is why they wanted to impose a stamp duty on imports into the Americas. There were also over 100,000 colonists that fled to Canada after the war because Washington's side didn't believe in targeting civilians.


meatcleaver:
This is not my quote it belongs to cyberdude.
thompson




meatcleaver -> RE: where is the outrage? [rant enclosed] (3/14/2007 9:28:43 AM)

Sorry thompson. I shouldn't try to work and read the threads at the same time.




ferryman777 -> RE: where is the outrage? [rant enclosed] (3/14/2007 9:32:33 AM)

If this is what you want to believe......fine. However, we ARE depolying troops at oil fields, doing MORE than just that. Saddam was warned NOT to destroy any of the oil fields, BTW.

We encourage the civil strife; we want all the conflicts. It serves the US interests to have choas......create the chaos then bring the solution;  Divide and conquor.  Ancient history.

So.....we don't follow the money then? We do not care what enities are making untold profits. Okay then; but don't complain when a gallon of gas is costing 5 bucks and upwards. Don't complain when your taxes are raised to pay for this debalical, social services are cut even more drastically; your rent and/or house payments are beyond reach.  Simply put......do not complain about anything, just accept what is nice to hear and read. All we want is for everyone to get along.

Oil is not just about fuel at the gas pump. Every country depends on oil for its very existence, in industries as well . World economies are all ...oil based. The Iraqis, and all of that region need the oil as well, their economies are dependant upon oil; the revenues it brings them. They are all prisoners of the oil as is all the rest of the world; and there is fortunes to be made because of this. But, we are there and everywhere out of the goodness of our concerned hearts, right?

Just how do you think those fortunes are going to be made? Who is going to pay for what?

What you must mean then is......accept what we do, is for their own good, that we kill them and take their homeland resources, destroy their buildings, temples, cultures etc.; dictate the governments they will have; it is only a humanitarian effort. We, unprovoked, invaded a soveregin country, ousted the dictator, hung him after a fair trial; the people are now free and so.......then we should leave them to their freedoms. Why isn't the humanitarian army gone? Mission accomplished.

There are none so blind as those who choose not to see.

Believe what you choose, I could not care less.




ferryman777 -> RE: where is the outrage? [rant enclosed] (3/14/2007 9:55:29 AM)

Yeah, Florida never happened. His brother never was there.

Think about this.......If Kellogs offers up a contest, for a Schwinn Bike, let's say. How come, in the rules of the contest it ALWAYS reads, in any contest anywhere, by anyone; that employees of the company, and/or relatives, employed by the company cannot participate in the decisions of the winning entry.

I know, I know, what does Kellogs have to do about that.

The point I attempt to make is this.......The Office of Presidency of the Greatest, most powerful Nation on the planet, which has ever existed...is the Ultimate contest.

If a simple bike contest has to state, out of fairness to all applicants and aspiring candidates for the prize; that no relative employed by the awarding company can make a decision as to the winner......how can Florida be the deciding factor?  I mean, the govenor is the brother? Florida had the deciding faction.

Hey, but it was a fair unbaised decision. Right?




Sinergy -> RE: where is the outrage? [rant enclosed] (3/14/2007 5:46:09 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: mixielicous


quote:

ORIGINAL: krys
(and will hopefully be very evident in the '08 election).


just like it was heard in '04, right? see the difference this year is, bush CANT return. too bad the voting power didnt help with that earlier.


I suspect he is kicking himself for not getting his running-dog patsy Congressmen to change the term limits laws.

While I hear your certainty, I would not be overly surprised if something doesnt happen between now and the next election and Monkeyboy tries to invoke martial law.

Sinergy




mixielicous -> RE: where is the outrage? [rant enclosed] (3/14/2007 6:51:22 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy

quote:

ORIGINAL: mixielicous


quote:

ORIGINAL: krys
(and will hopefully be very evident in the '08 election).


just like it was heard in '04, right? see the difference this year is, bush CANT return. too bad the voting power didnt help with that earlier.


I suspect he is kicking himself for not getting his running-dog patsy Congressmen to change the term limits laws.

While I hear your certainty, I would not be overly surprised if something doesnt happen between now and the next election and Monkeyboy tries to invoke martial law.

Sinergy


my father actually thinks this too and has been land shopping over seas for the past year "just in case"




dcnovice -> RE: where is the outrage? [rant enclosed] (3/14/2007 8:30:08 PM)

quote:

I would not be overly surprised if something doesnt happen between now and the next election and Monkeyboy tries to invoke martial law.


Terrifying thought.




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