RE: Pulling submissive teeth?

RE: Pulling submissive teeth? (Full Version)

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CDOM3 -> RE: Pulling submissive teeth? (4/15/2007 6:14:06 PM)
Ah.....The 'Whatever pleases you' response. I have always considered and put in to practice as a part of My sub learning Me, that they are My resource for information. When I don't have a preferance or simply don't care, I ask 'What options do I have.' This way I make the decission yet don't have to 'think' about it. Hope this helps. This also helps Me learn My sub/slave as it is human nature to respond in a way that what they are intgerested in, will come across.

jayded34 -> RE: Pulling submissive teeth? (4/15/2007 6:31:43 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Sinergy quote: ORIGINAL: petdave quote: ORIGINAL: behindmirrors Hehe, this has happened to us many, many a time. Usually when related to what we want to eat when both of us are hungry. "Where do you want to go for dinner?" - "Umm...I don't know, what are you in the mood for?" "I don't know!" - "Well...I don't know either. I'm just hungry. Pick something?" (and it goes on, and on, and on...) I might ask, but I refuse to be in this sort of confused limbo. Not to decide is to decide. (I hope you like sushi) Sinergy I love sushi......unagi is my favorite!

Elorin -> RE: Pulling submissive teeth? (4/15/2007 8:27:23 PM)
When Sir or anyone for that matter says "What do you want to eat?" and my answer is "I don't know" it means nothing in particular comes to mind. Which means that if they make suggestions, they should be prepared to hear "no, that doesn't sound good'. But if I say "I don't care" then making suggestions is a bad plan, and I get emotionally overwhelmed by a barrage of suggestions if I am too stressed out at the time. Learning the distinction was hard for Sir but he has come to understand it; subs have picked it up because I realized more clearly what the distinction was and have been able to point it out at the beginning, and then later say "I said I don't care. You pick." However, with my submissives, I expect them to realize - I am an empowered woman. I am FULLY capable of saying "no, I don't want to do that." When I ask for their opinions, I expect them to be honest about what they want, and to then accept that we will only be doing something that I want to do or find acceptable. I've done the teeth pulling thing, and if I'd wanted to be a dentist I'd have gone to school for it. My solution to this problem has been to make it clear - if I ask for your opinion, I want your opinion. Express it. If you repeatedly refuse to express an opinion, there will be consequences. Trust ME that if I put a choice into your hands and you choose something that I do not like, I will make it clear that I do not like it so that you know my preferences for the future. But you will NOT be punished or chastised for your choice at this point. And in the future, if I say "you pick, but make sure it's something I'd like" don't pick this again. If I just say "you pick" then pick what YOU WANT and understand that I want you to have your preference ~not mine~ tonight. ~E

DawnFire -> RE: Pulling submissive teeth? (4/15/2007 8:35:58 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BeachMystress quote: ORIGINAL: MistressDiane Sooooo....it's cooks choice around here. Like it or fix it yourself. LOL, that wouldn't fly around here. Since the sub is the cook in my relationship, his saying like it or fix it yourself would result in some painful remedial training. grins Lol, that's great. Imagines that exchange and laughs.

Suleiman -> RE: Pulling submissive teeth? (4/16/2007 11:07:52 AM)
My wife hates that about me. For the most part, I have no opinion about stuff like what movie to watch or where to go out to eat. I've spent so much of my life dirt-poor, the only way I've been able to survive is to teach myself not to want stuff, so that I don't have to deal with not being able to have it. It translates in my adult life to a profound case of indifference. Over the years, I've learned to tell when she's too burnt out to make a decision, at which point I will step in with something that I'm pretty sure we can agree on, but for the most part when asked something like that, I just sort of shrug and mane a vague noise of "i dunno".

daddysprop247 -> RE: Pulling submissive teeth? (4/16/2007 2:15:41 PM)
have to admit, i'm guilty of this as well. it sort of reminds me of that Eddie Murphy movie, "Coming to America"...the bit where he meets the wife who was trained from birth only to serve and please him, and he is attempting (fruitlessly) to get to know her. him: "what do you like to do" her: "whatever you like" him: "well what do you like to eat" her: "whatever you like to eat" and on and on, lol. tho i'm not quite that bad, my first instinct when he asks me a question regarding my preferences or desires is to say "whatever you want." this is how it typically goes with us: Him: "what do you want to eat/do/see?" me: "whatever you want," Him: "I know I can do whatever I want, and I will. I want to know what YOU want," me: "umm....i don't know...whatever you want?" lol. this is because i am naturally afraid of making a choice that he does not like...what if i want italian, while he wants indian. or i want to see the new indie film, while he wants to see the new action flick. i would much rather do something HE wanted, even if it wasn't my personal cup of tea, because his happiness is always paramount to me. i don't buy that "oh it doesn't matter, I don't care," line...he must care, even if to a small degree. the other reason why it's natural for me to give the "whatever you want" response is because in my mind what i want/like/desire is irrelevant in this relationship, as i am the slave and he is the Master. so no matter how many times he may say he genuinely wants to know what i like, what i want, etc., i'm so used to thinking that my desires are irrelevant that it's often difficult for me to even KNOW what those desires are. this does seem like a common problem amongst submissives, and i'd be interested to learn of any potential solutions.

Stranger1 -> RE: Pulling submissive teeth? (4/16/2007 2:19:04 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: daddysprop247 have to admit, i'm guilty of this as well. it sort of reminds me of that Eddie Murphy movie, "Coming to America"...the bit where he meets the wife who was trained from birth only to serve and please him, and he is attempting (fruitlessly) to get to know her. him: "what do you like to do" her: "whatever you like" him: "well what do you like to eat" her: "whatever you like to eat" and on and on, lol. tho i'm not quite that bad, my first instinct when he asks me a question regarding my preferences or desires is to say "whatever you want." this is how it typically goes with us: Him: "what do you want to eat/do/see?" me: "whatever you want," Him: "I know I can do whatever I want, and I will. I want to know what YOU want," me: "umm....i don't know...whatever you want?" lol. this is because i am naturally afraid of making a choice that he does not like...what if i want italian, while he wants indian. or i want to see the new indie film, while he wants to see the new action flick. i would much rather do something HE wanted, even if it wasn't my personal cup of tea, because his happiness is always paramount to me. i don't buy that "oh it doesn't matter, I don't care," line...he must care, even if to a small degree. the other reason why it's natural for me to give the "whatever you want" response is because in my mind what i want/like/desire is irrelevant in this relationship, as i am the slave and he is the Master. so no matter how many times he may say he genuinely wants to know what i like, what i want, etc., i'm so used to thinking that my desires are irrelevant that it's often difficult for me to even KNOW what those desires are. this does seem like a common problem amongst submissives, and i'd be interested to learn of any potential solutions. This becomes a non-issue, when it is made clear to the bottom that the question is asked as a matter of knowing more about what makes him or her tick. Knowing is also part of owning. To avoid answering shows disrespect for the interest of the owner.

Aswad -> RE: Pulling submissive teeth? (4/16/2007 3:42:58 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: azzmaster whew! i m glad dis was jus a metaphor... was worried someone was ACTUALLY n2 pulling their sub's teeth... Not me, but I can certainly see it, and I think I've heard of a few instances. That said, there was supposedly a maso here in Norway that got off on having a root canal done with no anaesthetic once. I'm kind of inclined to write that off as an urban legend, in the community but I don't have enough experience dealing with masochists to be sure.

Stranger1 -> RE: Pulling submissive teeth? (4/16/2007 3:45:49 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Aswad quote: ORIGINAL: azzmaster whew! i m glad dis was jus a metaphor... was worried someone was ACTUALLY n2 pulling their sub's teeth... Not me, but I can certainly see it, and I think I've heard of a few instances. That said, there was supposedly a maso here in Norway that got off on having a root canal done with no anaesthetic once. I'm kind of inclined to write that off as an urban legend, in the community but I don't have enough experience dealing with masochists to be sure. Iv'e seen dental play in the local scene-needles stuck in gums. I was terribly amused at how many really heavy impact players were totally upset by it.

Aswad -> RE: Pulling submissive teeth? (4/16/2007 3:59:11 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: behindmirrors (Fast reply) Hehe, this has happened to us many, many a time. Usually when related to what we want to eat when both of us are hungry. "Where do you want to go for dinner?" - "Umm...I don't know, what are you in the mood for?" "I don't know!" - "Well...I don't know either. I'm just hungry. Pick something?" (and it goes on, and on, and on...) This seems familiar. And even vanillas have this problem. I think it'd be a good idea to have a default answer, or an inspiring list of meals, for this exact purpose... regardless of whether you're a M/s, D/s or vanilla. Why not just use the fact that one is in control to implement such a solution and break the stalemate quickly? And, if one suspects the other party is holding back their opinion, while one doesn't have one themselves, one could just come up with a really boring suggestion that gets old real fast. One quickly gets cravings for something specific. The practical realities of food can quickly overcome some people's inhibitions; I know it would work for me, but then again I'm both the M and the cook. [:D]

Aswad -> RE: Pulling submissive teeth? (4/16/2007 4:06:51 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: blushingflower Sometimes when a woman says "I don't care", she wants to start a negotiation, so sometimes I mean that, and sometimes we read that into others (men who know this read it into the women they're with, women who mean this read it into men). I've been annoyed at this ever since I figured it out, so I pointedly take it as if they meant what they say. What's up with lying to start negotiations? Why not just say "I'd rather we talk about it", or "I'm not sure, let's figure it out together"?

Griswold -> RE: Pulling submissive teeth? (4/16/2007 4:10:27 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BeachMystress As a Dominant, I'm expected to make all the decisions and my will should reign supreme. right? Well, some times I just do not CARE about an issue, such as what we have for dinner or what movie we watch. It can be a real chore to get my sub to actually express an opinion at such times. He and I have had discussion after discussion about the fact that if I say I do not care about an issue I expect him to let me know his preferences on the subject. Well.. we're still working on it. LoL. How many other subs hesitate to express their opinions or preferences? How many other Dominants have run into getting a sub to express a preference or want to be like pulling teeth? Excellent question. A former Domme....we dated for a while....now we're friends...(kind of...I'm still in love with her...it's a mixed blessing)....she'll cuddle with me when I visit her (I'm on a different coast....but I still stop by on occasion...or she comes here)....and I freeze. I don't know what to do. It's like a first date...only worse. Don't assume he's fitting some protocol....or assume that he is. You are the power...obviously you control the game. Consider offering more latitude....unless of course that also freaks him out. Domme/sub....kind of like Anita Bryant.... It's not just for breakfast anymore.

BeachMystress -> RE: Pulling submissive teeth? (4/16/2007 6:47:04 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: daddysprop247 i am naturally afraid of making a choice that he does not like...what if i want italian, while he wants indian. or i want to see the new indie film, while he wants to see the new action flick. i would much rather do something HE wanted, even if it wasn't my personal cup of tea, because his happiness is always paramount to me. i don't buy that "oh it doesn't matter, I don't care," line...he must care, even if to a small degree. This is one of the issues that he has mentioned when we've discussed this problem. He is more than just a submissive. He is a pleaser. He wants so badly to please me, that he is afraid of saying he wants to go somewhere I'll not enjoy. His feeling is also that he'd rather do something that interests me, because the fact that I like it is means it is interesting to him. This is a personality trait rather than a submissive one. While my husband and I are very alike in many respects (both of us testing out as (INFJ) on the same personality test ) I, unfortunately, do not share this personality trait.

juliaoceania -> RE: Pulling submissive teeth? (4/16/2007 7:06:05 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Aswad quote: ORIGINAL: blushingflower Sometimes when a woman says "I don't care", she wants to start a negotiation, so sometimes I mean that, and sometimes we read that into others (men who know this read it into the women they're with, women who mean this read it into men). I've been annoyed at this ever since I figured it out, so I pointedly take it as if they meant what they say. What's up with lying to start negotiations? Why not just say "I'd rather we talk about it", or "I'm not sure, let's figure it out together"? I agree that for women it is often a way of negotiating to say "what do you want to do" and respond to their female friend "I don't know, what do you want to do?" So they can make sure they are on the same page. At least I have had these conversations with female friends. Now I do not communicate with men this way, but with women it seems to be somewhat in our way of relating. Women are often into building consensus, bridging gaps in communication, and we do try to find common ground. Lets face it, women just use more words than men do by and large, and we use them on conversations that seem inane and useless to you.

zumala -> RE: Pulling submissive teeth? (4/16/2007 7:13:41 PM)
I used to really have big troubles making up my mind when around other people. I'd get so flustered by them waiting for my decision (generally an order at a fast food joint or some similar scenario), that I couldn't even think. I'd just stare at the menu in panic and blush. My relationship with my husband has really helped with that. He's managed to draw me out of my shell and confirm to me that I can and should have an opinion. I don't have trouble like ordering food now, although sometimes I may have difficulty offering an opinion in other instances. I can still be shy. zuma

BalletBob -> RE: Pulling submissive teeth? (4/16/2007 7:19:08 PM)
I have no problem about voicing what I like or would want to do. Now if it is done, that is another story. MADAM always asked what I would like to try, and I had no problem telling her. That is how I got to try the Riding Crop, Candle Wax and Plastic Wrap. Miss MADAM and all, Sub BalletBob

Arpig -> RE: Pulling submissive teeth? (4/16/2007 8:20:43 PM)
I have experienced it as well. And it is frustrating

MMMMudd -> RE: Pulling submissive teeth? (4/16/2007 11:08:34 PM)
HA!!! I learned early on that "I don't care" is not an answer my lover wants to hear. Usually he gives me a choice of things, "do you want eggs or a muffin." the right answer to this is the first one. "I want eggs" for the most part I don't care, but it's important I have an opinion, so I always go with the first one. Of course he knows I do this and it's been a running joke with us for years. [:)] Mudd

Aswad -> RE: Pulling submissive teeth? (4/17/2007 12:38:16 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: juliaoceania I agree that for women it is often a way of negotiating to say "what do you want to do" and respond to their female friend "I don't know, what do you want to do?" So they can make sure they are on the same page. How does lying bring people to the same page? Especially given how women often say this to men as well, and I don't know any men who picked it up first time around. Most of the ones I know get seriously pissed at this behaviour, seeing it as irrational and sometimes deceitful. quote: At least I have had these conversations with female friends. Now I do not communicate with men this way, but with women it seems to be somewhat in our way of relating. Women are often into building consensus, bridging gaps in communication, and we do try to find common ground. I get this. I try to do this myself. For instance by saying "Well, I'd like X, but what would *you* like?", or "Why don't we talk about that?", or "Let's discuss it". I don't lie by saying I don't care and then arguing (which is what the men I know perceive it as when it follows an "I don't care") about it. I say I'd like to talk about it, and then do so. Never had a problem with negotiations not following. quote: Lets face it, women just use more words than men do by and large, and we use them on conversations that seem inane and useless to you. Very few conversations I've heard women have seem inane and useless to me. Or, rather, exactly as many as I've heard men have. Whether it's football, makeup or getting drunk this weekend, there's plenty of topics I don't see any attraction to, although that doesn't mean I write people off for talking about them. Women make good friends to talk to; men can take a bit more work to get used to being as verbal as I prefer to be. And I don't see how using more words has anything to do with saying "I don't care" when you know it isn't the case. FWIW, about half the men I know are as verbose as women.

juliaoceania -> RE: Pulling submissive teeth? (4/17/2007 8:24:28 AM)
quote: How does lying bring people to the same page? Especially given how women often say this to men as well, and I don't know any men who picked it up first time around. Most of the ones I know get seriously pissed at this behaviour, seeing it as irrational and sometimes deceitful. I think you are reading too much into something that women do as a communication device. It is not lying, we know exactly what we mean when we talk like this. I prefer not to talk like this myself, but when I hear women say things like this I know exactly what they mean. So perhaps men are from Mars and women Truly are from Venus?

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