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What if... - 3/24/2007 6:39:47 PM   
gypsygrl


Posts: 1471
Joined: 10/8/2005
From: new york state
Status: offline 		...I just want to be bad?

Sometimes I get that feeling.  Never in my entire life have I really acted on it, but the feeling is persistant enough that I can imagine acting on it. 

And I do really get tired of being "good" all the time and most the time it doesn't really seem to get me anywhere.  (I'm in a bit of a funk lately because of a lot of things but mostly because I'm feeling like I'm stuck with a lot of responsibilities and I'd really like to say fuck that, and just be plain irresponsible.)

Those of you in relationships, do you ever get into this kind of mood and just want to disobey for the sake of disobeying, just to be bad, (and not for the punishment)?

I'm not in that kind of situation now and I don't have any orders to willfully disobey, but I'm kind of wondering if other submissives get this way and what kind of outlets they have for it.  Is it something you address in the negotiating phase of the relationship?  Or, is it a feeling that just has to be repressed?  Or is this a feeling that submissives don't have?


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“To be happy is to be able to become aware of oneself without fright.” ~Walter Benjamin

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RE: What if... - 3/24/2007 8:38:33 PM   
Wildfleurs


Posts: 1650
Joined: 9/24/2004
From: Connecticut
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: gypsygrl

...I just want to be bad?

Sometimes I get that feeling.  Never in my entire life have I really acted on it, but the feeling is persistant enough that I can imagine acting on it. 

And I do really get tired of being "good" all the time and most the time it doesn't really seem to get me anywhere.  (I'm in a bit of a funk lately because of a lot of things but mostly because I'm feeling like I'm stuck with a lot of responsibilities and I'd really like to say fuck that, and just be plain irresponsible.)

Those of you in relationships, do you ever get into this kind of mood and just want to disobey for the sake of disobeying, just to be bad, (and not for the punishment)?


No (I'm being absolutely honest).

quote:


I'm not in that kind of situation now and I don't have any orders to willfully disobey, but I'm kind of wondering if other submissives get this way and what kind of outlets they have for it.  Is it something you address in the negotiating phase of the relationship?  Or, is it a feeling that just has to be repressed?  Or is this a feeling that submissives don't have?



I get in funks sometimes or in bad moods.  I find going to the gym, talking it out, sometimes writing it out very helpful.

C~


_____________________________

"Just because you've always done it that way doesn't mean it's not incredibly stupid." -despair.com

~~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
The heart of it all - http://www.wildfleurs.com
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RE: What if... - 3/24/2007 8:44:28 PM   
Quivver


Posts: 1953
Joined: 11/27/2004
Status: offline 		I think ~bad~ is relitive.  And I also think that if you have a ~bad~ streak it will show it's head long before you wear any collar so it shouldnt be a huge surprise.  

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The problem with communication ... is the illusion that it has been accomplished. ~George Bernard Shaw

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RE: What if... - 3/24/2007 9:01:02 PM   
curiouslyseeking


Posts: 924
Joined: 1/11/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: gypsygrl

...I just want to be bad?

Sometimes I get that feeling.  Never in my entire life have I really acted on it, but the feeling is persistant enough that I can imagine acting on it. 

And I do really get tired of being "good" all the time and most the time it doesn't really seem to get me anywhere.  (I'm in a bit of a funk lately because of a lot of things but mostly because I'm feeling like I'm stuck with a lot of responsibilities and I'd really like to say fuck that, and just be plain irresponsible.)

Those of you in relationships, do you ever get into this kind of mood and just want to disobey for the sake of disobeying, just to be bad, (and not for the punishment)?

I'm not in that kind of situation now and I don't have any orders to willfully disobey, but I'm kind of wondering if other submissives get this way and what kind of outlets they have for it.  Is it something you address in the negotiating phase of the relationship?  Or, is it a feeling that just has to be repressed?  Or is this a feeling that submissives don't have?



It's not a thing I'm proud of, but I occasionally find the bad streaks and dive right into them....
 
These streaks are basically caused by my curiosities.(which note have been much more tempered now than ever before) and often times because I don't look at the big picture of what the outcome or consequences of my immediate actions will be...
 
I will say  happily I dont have the bad streaks anymore to get punished or to feel control.  At the beginning of my journey almost 9 years ago..I was a total brat..I wanted to feel control and I didnt know how to get it, other than pushing for it (intentionally being bad). 
 
Over the years, I've learned that the control I needed to feel was much more pleasant to receive by simply giving control (hope that makes sense)....
 
So, the bad for me is just natural curiosities..going wrong..and oh, yes, those streaks happen...and so do the stripes when they do!

Edited to add...staying on a stricter regimen of day-to-day living, adding the gym, or additional journal writing, or writing stories, all things  focusing around my Master  helps the idle curiosities and aids me in avoiding the bad syndrome.

< Message edited by curiouslyseeking -- 3/24/2007 9:06:43 PM >

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RE: What if... - 3/24/2007 9:01:22 PM   
hisannabelle


Posts: 1992
Joined: 12/3/2006
From: Tallahassee, FL, USA
Status: offline 		i agree with wildfleurs. i personally don't experience this in my own relationship and don't know if i could have the kind of relationship that i do if i did experience it. that's not to say that there aren't submissives who do, or beneficial relationships where it's welcomed and not repressed, though.

i think the best way to learn how to handle this within relationship is to talk to your dominant about it and to let him know that this is a big issue for you. he may be able to answer more of your concerns with disobeying in the relationship itself, and there may be some ways to constructively act out this urge.

i agree with wildfleurs also that for me, going to the gym, writing, and finding other ways to express myself when in funks can be very helpful. (i also tend to clean a lot when i'm in a funk, which is odd for me, hehehe.)


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i have the kind of beauty that moves...

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RE: What if... - 3/24/2007 9:05:21 PM   
MasterNdorei


Posts: 658
Joined: 10/8/2005
Status: offline 		Anytime i have wanted to be "bad" it was for something more than just to experience being "bad". It would be like eating something i am not supposed to eat because i actually craved the food, etc. There has to be something that is tempting me to move from being "good", i am most comfortable being a "good" girl.

Master's dorei

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RE: What if... - 3/24/2007 9:13:09 PM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline
quote:

Those of you in relationships, do you ever get into this kind of mood and just want to disobey for the sake of disobeying, just to be bad, (and not for the punishment)?


Yes, but I do not do it. It is not like I really want to be bad, it is more like I imagine what being bad would feel like. Sometimes just imagining being bad brings a smile to my face. It is enough to contemplate it, I do not actually need to do it. You have to understand, I resent authority in most aspects of my life, and I bristle when someone I have not agreed to respect their authority over me orders me around. I am also somewhat rebellious. It is these qualities that I think he likes to be honest. I would not submit to just anyone.. and sometimes I secretly desire to be bad... kinda like when I was a little girl... but I obeyed my parents too, I respected them, even if there was a little devil on my shoulder at times


_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

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RE: What if... - 3/24/2007 9:20:57 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline 		Ask for permission to be bad.

I find that takes care of everything just fine.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

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RE: What if... - 3/24/2007 9:30:31 PM   
Wildfleurs


Posts: 1650
Joined: 9/24/2004
From: Connecticut
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: hisannabelle

i agree with wildfleurs. i personally don't experience this in my own relationship and don't know if i could have the kind of relationship that i do if i did experience it. that's not to say that there aren't submissives who do, or beneficial relationships where it's welcomed and not repressed, though.

i think the best way to learn how to handle this within relationship is to talk to your dominant about it and to let him know that this is a big issue for you. he may be able to answer more of your concerns with disobeying in the relationship itself, and there may be some ways to constructively act out this urge.

i agree with wildfleurs also that for me, going to the gym, writing, and finding other ways to express myself when in funks can be very helpful. (i also tend to clean a lot when i'm in a funk, which is odd for me, hehehe.)



Thanks, btw its Wildfleurs :-)

C~


_____________________________

"Just because you've always done it that way doesn't mean it's not incredibly stupid." -despair.com

~~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
The heart of it all - http://www.wildfleurs.com
~~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~

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RE: What if... - 3/24/2007 9:31:42 PM   
Wildfleurs


Posts: 1650
Joined: 9/24/2004
From: Connecticut
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

Ask for permission to be bad.

I find that takes care of everything just fine.


Thats an interesting solution, but I'm having problems seeing where a dominant would actually grant permission.

C~

_____________________________

"Just because you've always done it that way doesn't mean it's not incredibly stupid." -despair.com

~~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
The heart of it all - http://www.wildfleurs.com
~~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~

(in reply to Wildfleurs)
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RE: What if... - 3/24/2007 9:33:41 PM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

quote:

Those of you in relationships, do you ever get into this kind of mood and just want to disobey for the sake of disobeying, just to be bad, (and not for the punishment)?


Yes, but I do not do it. It is not like I really want to be bad, it is more like I imagine what being bad would feel like. Sometimes just imagining being bad brings a smile to my face. It is enough to contemplate it, I do not actually need to do it. You have to understand, I resent authority in most aspects of my life, and I bristle when someone I have not agreed to respect their authority over me orders me around. I am also somewhat rebellious. It is these qualities that I think he likes to be honest. I would not submit to just anyone.. and sometimes I secretly desire to be bad... kinda like when I was a little girl... but I obeyed my parents too, I respected them, even if there was a little devil on my shoulder at times



"Zoot has been bad.  She lit the grail shaped beacon.  She must be punished.  First you must tie her up.  Then you must spank her.  Then the oral sex..."

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


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RE: What if... - 3/24/2007 9:36:35 PM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline 		Now there is some motivation to be really really bad

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

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RE: What if... - 3/24/2007 9:41:23 PM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

Now there is some motivation to be really really bad


As the movie pointed out, if I punish you for lighting the grail shaped beacon, everybody else will insist they helped.

Who has time?

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


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RE: What if... - 3/24/2007 10:42:43 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Wildfleurs
Thats an interesting solution, but I'm having problems seeing where a dominant would actually grant permission.

C~

My first example would be forceplay- permission to fight/yell/scream against the dom.

Perhaps it's just some pent up stuff and if she's allowed to physically get it out TO the dom within a safe environment, it can be bled away while working TOGETHER and even STRENGTHENING the dynamic they have.  Bonus!

I'm hesitant to say this without further information, but there might be a miscommunication or lack of communication on exactly what responsibilities are being pushed, the level of being able to handle those responsibilities and burn out.  If you push a slave to the burn out point, it is only natural the slave would begin to rebel.  And since most people suck at communicating, the rebellion would show itself through indirect methods.

But again I have nothing solid on that at all so it might not apply here whatsoever.

Asking permission also forces the sub to say "OK I'm feeling out of sorts, I know it's weird, but I want you to know it and I want permission to a) have these feelings b) know that you're ok with me having these feelings c) giving me a safe outlet WITH you to express them."

Whether it's "Yes you have permission to not take the trash out tomorrow" or "Yes you have permission to go stay in bed until noon with donuts and the paper"- a master allowing a slave to "misbehave" can be a fabulous gift or reward.

And IMO by asking permission, everyone understands that this is a special exemption without making it a big deal on any end.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

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RE: What if... - 3/24/2007 11:00:33 PM   
AquaticSub


Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: gypsygrl

...I just want to be bad?

Sometimes I get that feeling.  Never in my entire life have I really acted on it, but the feeling is persistant enough that I can imagine acting on it. 

And I do really get tired of being "good" all the time and most the time it doesn't really seem to get me anywhere.  (I'm in a bit of a funk lately because of a lot of things but mostly because I'm feeling like I'm stuck with a lot of responsibilities and I'd really like to say fuck that, and just be plain irresponsible.)

Those of you in relationships, do you ever get into this kind of mood and just want to disobey for the sake of disobeying, just to be bad, (and not for the punishment)?

I'm not in that kind of situation now and I don't have any orders to willfully disobey, but I'm kind of wondering if other submissives get this way and what kind of outlets they have for it.  Is it something you address in the negotiating phase of the relationship?  Or, is it a feeling that just has to be repressed?  Or is this a feeling that submissives don't have?



Sometimes I'm in a bad mood and I don't feel like being told what to do, even if it's what I really want. *shrugs* We just kinda work through it.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

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RE: What if... - 3/24/2007 11:03:22 PM   
ownedgirlie


Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline 		No I do not ever want to be or think about being bad.

But that was not always so.   In my development of giving more and more over to him, it seemed as though just before every major growth spurt I would feel and sometimes act rebellious.  This typically came from a place of subconscious fear - knowing I was just about ready to give over even more yet wanting one last taste of "self" even though I had not yet realized that my real self was a slave who gave everything over.

This is an excerpt from a website I read through several years ago, and while I may not agree with all of their methodologies, I found this section quite interesting.  From www.BestSlaveTraining.com -

"A slave,  like all humans, seeks homeostasis and equilibrium in her life.  she want stability and any change rocks that boat.  It is human nature to resist change.  A master needs to understand that in most cases a slave's resistance is not personal or even directed at him but instead is a human reaction to anxiety caused by a threat perceived from change.   In many cases she may very well see that she needs to do what her master asked to deepen her slavery and even want to but this knowledge  and desire does not  always reduce her anxiety."

This was found under the "Resistance" section.   They claim anxiety to change and loss of freedoms tend to be the major reason for resistance.  It's an interesting theory and seemed to adequately reflect where I seemed to be coming from at times.  It wasn't until I let go of the last parts of self that I stopped having these issues.

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RE: What if... - 3/25/2007 12:10:31 AM   
jauntyone


Posts: 543
Joined: 2/27/2007
From: Anchorage Alaska
Status: offline 		Greetings gypsygrl
 
I would never, and have never disobeyed just for the sake of disobeying. Master would never stand for such behavior and I can say quite honestly that if I were to do so, our relationship would be over. No discussions; just over.
 
As for the feelings of just once in awhile wanting to be bad; sure, I get those, but not because I want to disobey him. Frustrations build, it is normal. However, with Master and I, we both practice martial arts and anytime I feel the need for a good match, he is more than willing to accommodate me on this
 
I wish you well
 
melissa

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RE: What if... - 3/25/2007 2:46:13 AM   
agirl


Posts: 4530
Joined: 6/14/2004
Status: offline 		Yes, I do feel like that and I do do that. I find being owned a challenge at the best of times. I'm wilful and stubborn, I have always been wilful and stubborn and I have never liked being told what to do. None of it is a surprise to M, and he's never had a problem handling it.

I'm not like it the entire time; the majority of the time my collar sits well and is comfortable, even when it chafes I know it's the best thing for me.......but there are definitely times when I want to rip it off and fling it.

M is far more wilful, stubborn and determined than I am.

agirl  

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RE: What if... - 3/25/2007 5:09:37 AM   
Celeste43


Posts: 3066
Joined: 2/4/2006
From: NYS
Status: offline 		Bad is a loaded word. Do I not want to do what I should? Of course. What I do is talk to him about my feelings.

You sound as though you are feeling taken for granted. You do what you are supposed to and don't get what you need anymore. If he's ignoring you, and not caring that you're unhappy, you need to talk about it now. Immediately is not too soon. Because this is causing a rift between you and it will not get any better for being unaddressed. Resentment builds and that's destructive to any relationship.

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RE: What if... - 3/25/2007 5:43:30 AM   
ShiftedJewel


Posts: 2492
Joined: 12/2/2004
Status: offline
quote:

And I do really get tired of being "good" all the time and most the time it doesn't really seem to get me anywhere.  (I'm in a bit of a funk lately because of a lot of things but mostly because I'm feeling like I'm stuck with a lot of responsibilities and I'd really like to say fuck that, and just be plain irresponsible.)


As far back as I can remember I've been a rebel. I rebelled because I could I guess. My parents were bigots so I embraced all races, they were Baptists so I embraced Druidism. I even wore flowers in my hair for a while. When I got older I heard something that to me was very profound. One of my nephews (adopted) was having some extreme difficulties from a previous abusive parent and seeing a shrink. My sister used to tell him that he better keep his shit together or they were gonna lock him up. (a very bad thing to do, no, her and I don't get along)... anyway, the shrink told my sister that it's impossible to keep you act together all the time, you can't always be "good", you can't always be "responsible", the pressure is too much even for people without mental or emotional issues. That statement really hit me, I don't know why, but it did.
 
I've lived my life and been fairly happy with one ideal.... Sometimes you just have to say "fuck it all" and go fishing. House needs to be cleaned? Fuck it, go fishing. Amazingly enough it will still need cleaning and will not have fallen down around it's foundation by the time you get back and you'll feel better and more relaxed. That isn't being "bad". It's taking care of you. All the responsibilities will still be there but you'll feel better and be more able to deal with them.
 
By "go fishing" I mean go do something you really enjoy doing. Get your hair done, go for a long drive, have a picnic by a lake even if it's by yourself. Screw the cell phone, pagers and local news. Lose the responsibility for the afternoon, go to a play ground and act like your 6 again. There isn't a human being alive that doesn't need that occasionally. Seriously, just say fuck it and go fishing, trust me, the world will continue to revolve and the sun will rise in the morning.
 
Jewel

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