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RE: What The Hell is Happening To America? - 4/17/2007 10:55:18 AM   
Sinergy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: sambamanslilgirl

what the hell is happening to America? every generation has been asking that question

it's a downward spiral to the eve of destruction.



Hunter S. Thompson made a quote which I will try to remember completely.

"If you stand in a high place in Las Vegas, and gaze west with the right kind of eyes, you can see where the wave of brotherhood and liberalism and the desire to build a brighter future broke on the shore, and rolled back into the sea."

Sinergy

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RE: What The Hell is Happening To America? - 4/17/2007 11:12:06 AM   
LotusSong


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Oh Arpig!!  Remember when something like this would go down it was the national guard that was called in?  Why? Because that was our homeland defense...the attack was not wonder boy's fault..the lack of protection in our own country is..
 
But hey, don't let me interrupt your one soapbox  moment of the day :)

< Message edited by LotusSong -- 4/17/2007 11:17:12 AM >


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RE: What The Hell is Happening To America? - 4/17/2007 11:14:33 AM   
passtheline


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What  has happened is the popular main stream culture our children have been swimming in is raw sewage.

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RE: What The Hell is Happening To America? - 4/17/2007 11:15:56 AM   
cjenny


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Okay yes the site is juvenile looking, but the info is good.
This is not new stuff going on. This is just one example of something similiar/worse that happened long ago when the world was still 'perfect'.

http://home.nycap.rr.com/useless/bath/index.html

Edited to add, this is a pretty interesting bit o info as well and comes from a much better source:
http://www.lib.msu.edu/harris23/crimjust/school.htm

< Message edited by cjenny -- 4/17/2007 11:18:02 AM >


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RE: What The Hell is Happening To America? - 4/17/2007 11:19:58 AM   
LotusSong


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cjenny

Okay yes the site is juvenile looking, but the info is good.
This is not new stuff going on. This is just one example of something similiar/worse that happened long ago when the world was still 'perfect'.

http://home.nycap.rr.com/useless/bath/index.html

Edited to add, this is a pretty interesting bit o info as well and comes from a much better source:
http://www.lib.msu.edu/harris23/crimjust/school.htm


Good link cjenny.:)
 
 
Now I'd like to know why we do not learn from our pasts?
 

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RE: What The Hell is Happening To America? - 4/17/2007 11:23:30 AM   
texancutie


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Actually this stuff has been going on for a very long time.  We just have short memories, and love to romanticize the past.  I think the reason we are aware of things more than previous generations, is due to the technological advances that have been made.  News travels fast and gets everywhere now.  It also is pounded into our memory by over zealous talking heads on TV. 

I remember doing research for a class in college, when I came across a book on newspaper articles from the 1800s from a Wisconsin county.  It was a fascinating read and there were a lot of murders, usually by ax or by gun.  There were a number of articles on men or women that killed their whole family.  There were crazy people that wandered the roads from county to county, and town to town.  I think it's always been like this, and am sure if one does go way back in time and does research, one would find incidents of mass homicide as well.  Maybe not on the scale of what happened the other day.  But I really don't know.

One thing I do know, is that there was a mass school homicide in Michigan in 1927 called The Bath School Disaster.  It is the deadliest school mass murder in US history.  Granted it was a gradeschool and not a college campus, but truly horrifying none the less.  A school board member killed 45 people and injured 58 more.  Most of his victims were in the 2nd to 6th grades.  I couldn't remember how many there were, and had to Wikipedia it.  The means he used to accomplish it, was to blow the school up with explosives.

Hey jenny, guess we were on the same page with this. Thanks for the link.  I was typing while you posted. 


< Message edited by texancutie -- 4/17/2007 11:26:03 AM >

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RE: What The Hell is Happening To America? - 4/17/2007 11:43:47 AM   
cjenny


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Yup we mind melded hehehe. I agree with you, it has always gone on.

We live in a world of instant media so the moment something happens it flashes in our faces. Brutal words and pics fill our newshours.
Imagine for a moment, if we did not have the immediacy to current events that we 'enjoy' would things be different?

LotusSong if I knew why we don't (as a whole) remember the past or learn from it. I guess that every generation sorta blocks the lessons from the previous one and just stumbles their way through life. As individuals we can learn from the past and change but as a group.. it seems to be impossible.

I still love the world, people & life. Events sadden and make me ache inside because I cannot change things, but I will never see the world as spiraling into evil. At least I hope I don't ever become that unhappy or blind. There is such beauty still to be seen.

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RE: What The Hell is Happening To America? - 4/17/2007 11:51:50 AM   
outlier


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quote:

Devilslilsister

Yeah there are problems.. and the world is going to hell in a handbasket........... but hasnt it always?  Whats new?


quote:

darcyinshadows

The term 'going to hell in a handcart' springs to mind,....


"People say the world is going to hell in a handbasket, they are wrong.
You cannot get a handbasket of that quality anymore."     Steve Allen

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RE: What The Hell is Happening To America? - 4/17/2007 11:58:39 AM   
outlier


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quote:

cjenny

...if I knew why we don't (as a whole) remember the past or learn from it. I guess that every generation sorta blocks the lessons from the previous one and just stumbles their way through life. As individuals we can learn from the past and change but as a group.. it seems to be impossible.


"Those who Cannot Remember the Past are Condemed to Repeat it."
- George Santayana

Outlier

< Message edited by outlier -- 4/17/2007 12:07:19 PM >

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RE: What The Hell is Happening To America? - 4/17/2007 3:05:00 PM   
MadRabbit


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Hmm...

Maybe because we're a culture constantly being corrupted by capitalism where the old ethical standards of Right and Wrong are being replaced with Profit and Non Profit?

Maybe cause a whole generation of youth is being morally twisted by a genre of music that has become an entire culture in itself...Hip Hop Culture that glorifies the objectivity of women for money, violence, and deprativity and has made a large number of neighborhoods increasingly dangerous to live in?

Maybe because no one is responsible for anything anymore?

Maybe because half of the crew in the restaurants I've worked in is running down to Mexico with boatloads of tax free money while I am working two jobs so I can maybe start school and wondering how the hell I am going to work the inflated gas prices into my already stretched budget when I do finally start school and quit a job?

Maybe because we've become a huge group of tissue grabbing enablers when it comes to the problem of obesity? Its socially acceptable to "be fat." I wonder sometimes if we as a society were to approach obesity and exercise in the same aggressive way that we approached smoking, what the results would be...

Maybe because anyone of my friends will throw me an odd look when I shut off my PS2 to read a book on philosophy?

Maybe because my entire generation just kind of sucks and half asses anything we start?

Maybe because I can flip threw 70% of television and not find ANYTHING that shares information that would somehow in someway lead to me living a more productive, healthier and richer life?

Maybe because people know everything about Sangia (or however you spell that fuckheads name) on American Idol but cant do basic math or locate all the states on a map?

Maybe because we have made our public school system so poltically correct and babyish that kids are graduating with absolutely no sense of reality and are being set up to fail before they even get out of college? There are winners and losers, you have to earn things, and you only feal good about yourself AFTER you accomplish something (When exactly did everything start thinking that you needed to feal good about yourself BEFORE you ever got off your ass and did anything?)

Maybe because we're robbed men of their masculality sooo much that we cant even want to have sex without fealing gulity about it and like we're objectifying women?

Maybe because in addition to the fact that my generation is a bunch of half ass slackers, its now twice as hard to survive and finish college without a trust fund as opposed to the generations before us?

Maybe because our news is more propagandic then the Nazi's in WW2? (Oh my god...look out...its a terrorist in that bush over there...he's got giant beady terrorist eyes and sharp teeth!)

Maybe because we're the new Roman empire and gonna crumble the same way they did? 

Ok thats why America is going to hell...as far as the notion of the good old days...people have been going nuts and killing people since the first cavemen went beserk and smashed three other cavemen's heads in with a rock because his blood sugar was low from not eating for a week. The only difference is our toys are getting better. Our toys are getting so better so fast and we, as human beings, on a mass social and moral level are advancing so slowly, that we'll eventually blow ourselves up.

< Message edited by MadRabbit -- 4/17/2007 3:11:51 PM >


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RE: What The Hell is Happening To America? - 4/17/2007 3:17:42 PM   
asubmissiveheart


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quote:

ORIGINAL: lockedaway

What the hell does "American Imperialism" have to do with this crap?  What does "Is the new American way of life working?" mean?  The guy that shot the students at Va.Tech was a chinese national here on a visa.  I wish the new American way of life was to give out 75% fewer Visas but we're not that bright in this country.

Sure society has changed terribly.  Let me give you a few examples.  In my opinion, NAFTA put a whole bunch of American folks out of work, raised the living standard for the rest of the world and lowered ours' collectively.  We have fewer jobs and almost zero manufacturing that goes on in the country.  The U.S. has largely been relegated to the position of a "middle man" in marketing the world's goods.

In most families, both spouses HAVE to work in order to make ends meet.  Why?  Doesn't anyone, other than ME, say that it is in large part because of the government and the way we are being taxed?  Ronald Reagan sought to simplify the tax code in the 1980's.  He wiped out a number of write offs like the "hobby farm" etc. and he reduced the top tax bracket to 24% and reduced the lower tax brackets as well.  The goal was not to increase tax revenue from any bracket but simply to reduce the size of the tax code.  Fast forward to Slick Willy scumbag Bill Clinton (you may have to look at some of my other posts to under the myriad reasons why I detest this guy sooooo much.)  Clinton comes in and bumps all of the tax brackets up and increases the maximum tax bracket to 38% and that is with all of the tax write offs still no longer applicable.  The result is the highest peace time tax rate in our nation's history.  Bush comes in and reduces taxes in all brackets and the highest bracket is now 34%.  Do the math.  Even with the tax cuts Bush made, we are still 10% higher than during Reagan or Bush Sr.'s administration.  The democrats have already said that they intend to raise taxes to Clinton levels and possibly higher.  Are you ready for that?  Tell me who supports that kind of tax increase and why.

We spend more on public schools than any country in the world and our public school system is seriously wanting.  We are plagued by liberal teaching administrations and an emasculation of male students.  Tons of books written on this if anyone wants to google it.  The point that I'm making is that with each addition of another principal or vice principal or teacher raise or the creation of some new committee or re-zoning, or any increase in school beaurocracy, you get an increase in your property taxes.  More money going to the govt and less to you.

At the end of the day, take a moment and think about what taxes you will pay this year in the form of income tax to the Fed, state income tax, some state sales tax, federal sales taxes on alcohol and tobacco and gasoline, property taxes, registration fees and more.  Out of every dollar you make, how much goes to taxes?  For many of you, it is about 50% and for some of you it might even be a little bit more.

Yes, our society has changed.  We are taxed to death.  We have a huge problem with illegal immigration which makes us taxed even more: illegals have no health insurance but get all medical services, pay no property taxes but get all police, fire, sanitation and educational services provided.  In fact the only taxes paid by illegals are sales taxes which is why Forbes' idea of a 10% flat income tax with sales taxes on EVERYTHING you buy makes sense.  It gets out hidden society to pay taxes, it doesn't over tax families and it is still revenue positive.  HOWEVER, it still doesn't address that illegals will not pay into health care or social security.

So, while we work to "get by" who is watching the kids?  I'll leave it to the rest of you to discuss other societal changes that come from tv and cable programming, drugs and unsupervised access to the internet.  But suffice it to say that our society has changed radically and there is no end in sight.


I agree with every point you made and that is rare.
What an informative post to read especially on tax day.
Over taxation is destroying the American dream for many people.
Soon if you are not making over $50,000 in most areas, you are living in poverty.
Many 2 income wage earners are far from being able to buy a home in many housing markets.
We are all paying heavily to subsidize the illegas in our country, no doubt.
Welcome to the beginning of the end.

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RE: What The Hell is Happening To America? - 4/17/2007 3:20:13 PM   
asubmissiveheart


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Wonderful post MadRabbit.

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RE: What The Hell is Happening To America? - 4/17/2007 3:26:38 PM   
asubmissiveheart


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quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

There was organized crime in New York and Chicago with shoot outs and keystone cops way back when... remember the Zoot Suits and prohibition, the Valentine's Day Massacre? These things are nothing new. Before that there were bank robberies and train robberies. Then before that there were the Vikings... there truly were never any days that man was not out killing man... accurate weapons do make it easier though


I disagree with this post.  The magnitude of incidents like Columbine and the UVATech murders, and
similar occurrences where unheard of in years gone by.
I don't see how you can compare gangsters to what is going on in schools like the incident that happened yesterday.
Read some history and let me know anything remotely similar that has happened like the incident yesterday on
American soil, ever.
Even the news stated this could be the worst mass murder in American history, to compare it to zoot suits and
keystone cops makes little sense to me.
The OP asked what the hell is happening in America? the answer is we are going straight to hell and quickly. 

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RE: What The Hell is Happening To America? - 4/17/2007 3:31:03 PM   
pahunkboy


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wow- this thread lit up like a christmas tree.

the ruling class- [be it of any flag] will always protect its pot of gold. if this means shock- titalation- changing rules that get in the way of profit- the ruling class will do- any and everything necessaary to keep its status.

if a bunch of us are discusted by tvs version of today- all teh better for the ruling class.

if everyone from teh 3rd ward here- and your locality- and jooohn does locale- marched down to city hall- and said- we no longer wish to be globalized. then that is  a threat to the status quo.

one job- i had- in construction- they would say- ok- everyone is overtime today. they pulll this and other tactics so as the men would swing the hammer harder and be productive.

--cam over to the tv set.

it like- pratically everything in the modern world serves a function- namely control of blank.

so many good points were brought up in this board. so- how is that- is it only a fraction of a per cent that see thru the glitter??

i miss teh days- i sat out on the porch with the neighbor. 

alot of us are are the same page- but not at a concurrent time.

if today were my last day on earth- did i right all my wrongs? did i call a loved one? did i write a letter?  did i even simply say "i love you" and engross in the moment?

nope.




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RE: What The Hell is Happening To America? - 4/17/2007 3:36:41 PM   
iwannapullurhair


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When someone was crazy in the 1700s, it was harder to massacre 30 people with a single shot musket. Now you can have a semi-auto weapon with reloadable magazines. All the victims are unarmed and can't fight back. Your average person is soft now too, so they aren't likely to fight back.

The killer had "Ismail Ax" on one arm-that is an Islamic reference to Abraham's Sacrifice(In the Hebrew version, Isaac is to be sacrificed). The angel stops Abraham at the last second.

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RE: What The Hell is Happening To America? - 4/17/2007 3:41:31 PM   
farglebargle


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quote:

ORIGINAL: asubmissiveheart

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

There was organized crime in New York and Chicago with shoot outs and keystone cops way back when... remember the Zoot Suits and prohibition, the Valentine's Day Massacre? These things are nothing new. Before that there were bank robberies and train robberies. Then before that there were the Vikings... there truly were never any days that man was not out killing man... accurate weapons do make it easier though


I disagree with this post. The magnitude of incidents like Columbine and the UVATech murders, and
similar occurrences where unheard of in years gone by.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Whitman

Charles Joseph Whitman (June 24, 1941 – August 1, 1966) was a student at the University of Texas at Austin and a Marine, who is known for having ascended The University's 27-story tower on August 1, 1966, and shooting passersby in the city and on the campus below, after having killed his mother and his wife the night before. In all Whitman killed 15 people and wounded 31 others before he was shot dead by Austin police. (Some accounts allege 16 or 17 victims, citing a later suicide stemming from the attacks, and a pregnant woman who subsequently miscarried.)

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RE: What The Hell is Happening To America? - 4/17/2007 3:43:05 PM   
MadRabbit


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quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

it like- pratically everything in the modern world serves a function- namely control of blank.



I really agree with this.

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RE: What The Hell is Happening To America? - 4/17/2007 3:45:35 PM   
Absintheur


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On of the biggest problem is the fact the US has become a welfare state. There are now 3rd and 4th generation welfare families, families where no one has ever worked. It has become a way of life and the number of these families is increasing daily. We reward unwed teen pregnacies by giving these teens housing and money, We reward a lack of morality.

As far as violence, in many places crimes against people is on the decline actually but when there is a large outbreak the media blows it way out of size in order to boost their ratings. There were mass muderers in the past...just wasn't something we publised to death 50 years ago.

This subject is a touchy one but there are ways to cure things...but the cure would make the politicians involved very unpopular and anyone trying to cure the problems would be commiting politcal suicide so the effort is not being made.


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RE: What The Hell is Happening To America? - 4/17/2007 3:56:37 PM   
pahunkboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

it like- pratically everything in the modern world serves a function- namely control of blank.



I really agree with this.


teh grocery store- arranges product to slow u down. so that u buy more.

when i call teh phone co, why do they ask if they may access my records??

try barging into a ceos office or home. see how fast security stops u.

as  citezens we accept much of this mindless crap.  a huge % have no clue how there congressman is.

even tho the US has public space- if you really got comfy on it- you risk being shooed away.

why do i need a bonus card to buy groceries?

why do they over paakage stuff when they KNOW it is bad.

why are "full service" grocers now mostly self check out?

u are aware of the upc code- well- ok- whats nnext- per plans per rfids????


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RE: What The Hell is Happening To America? - 4/17/2007 4:24:11 PM   
Griswold


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

What changed here in America?   100 years ago we didnt have massive shootings,

(well....100 years ago we also didn't have "massive people" either)

Hordes of psychos (trust me...they existed...in their numbers...proportionately so).  

Is it the food we eat, social degeneration (I'm a degenerate...and I don't think it's fair to label everyone with the same moniker), or what?   American imperialism. Is the new american way of life working?  (It's working for me)

Whats causing all this?  (I swear to GAWWWWD....it's that motherfucking Bush) 

Whats the social science at the roots of it all?  (There's no science in this country anymore....what are you smoking?...share)

Did our parents give us a better world than they had (Yes...this is news?) and are we giving our children a better world then we have? (No....this is news?)

Where have we been and where are we going?

(Hmmmmm....I'm thinking that would be "someplace else")


< Message edited by Griswold -- 4/17/2007 5:21:39 PM >

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