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RE: Micro Management, what does it mean to you? - 5/7/2007 9:23:39 AM   
BeingChewsie


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quote:

ORIGINAL: daddysprop247

quote:

ORIGINAL: BeingChewsie

To me it means I make no independent decisions, everything is dictated by him or through paramters he has set, so he doesn't have to be involved all the time. It means I have no freedom to make a choice on anything except pre-determined things...like eggs or fruit for breakfast..I can't decide to have pancakes, he didn't leave that as an option. So none of my decisions are based on what I want, that is why I consider it micro-managed. He orders(and decides what I will eat) for me in restaurants, decides where we will vacation, go, etc. He wouldn't have it any other way, so anbody who thought they were going to be independent and self-deciding/governing on very much or anything would not be with him.




hmmm...well if that is micromanagement, then i suppose i might be more micromanaged than i thought. i just have this image of a Master breathing down the neck of his sub or slave every second of the day, having to always ask permission to stand or walk or pee when someone says the word micromanagement. but that might just be brain going to extremes again.

but like you BeingChewsie, throughout my day everything i do is either directed by or permitted by him, and must be done within the paramaters he has set. food, exercise, online communication, tv watching, etc. but there is still some leeway...like if chores are done by the specified time, it doesn't matter so much what order i do them in. or if he tells me to make chicken for dinner, about 50% of the time he'll leave it up to me how exactly to prepare the chicken. but if something comes along that is unprecedented...some new situation that he's never specified exactly what i'm supposed to do...i'm not permitted to take any action without getting his direction first. but is that so uncommon?



Well my owner doesn't breathe down my neck all day, but everything is guided and dictated by his parameters if he isn't right there to ask or more to the point to tell me what to do. It helps that my owner works from home when he isn't traveling so he is available a good chunk of the time. I just see micro-managment as having no or little freedom to think or do things independently, like I can't decide to run to the store, or decide to buy a magazine if I'm out, you don't realize how much freedom you have in life until you have pretty much none. So I do consider my life micro-managed.

< Message edited by BeingChewsie -- 5/7/2007 9:24:34 AM >

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RE: Micro Management, what does it mean to you? - 5/7/2007 9:28:10 AM   
WhiplashSmile


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quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterFireMaam

Micromanagment means to control HOW a process is done as well as controlling the outcome. If I'm just doing the latter, I'd simply say, "Change the oil in my car." If I'm going the former, I'd say the same thing, then hand them a list of instructions that I expected them to follow in order to get it done.

Micromanaging is work. The only thing that I really micromanage is how to fold my t-shirts. I have a way that reduced the wrinkles, but people seem to have a problem with it. Perhaps it's easy for me 'cause I've been doing it for 20 years?

Master Fire


Great example here.   If somebody does not understand how to "Change the oil in a car",  I will lay out a couple of options for them...

A. Take Car to service center have somebody do it.
B. Do it yourself, Go to store buy new Oil and Filter and do it yourself.

If they want to do B.. I will spend time Teaching them if they don't already know it.  However, after I have invested time in training them how to do B.  I expect not to stand over and micromanage the task at hand again.

This is what Training is all about is it not?  Where you train or teach somebody how to do something, where you don't have to micromanage everything all the damn time?

I don't mind micromanagement when it's for the sake of training, teaching, instruction or checking up on progress.  It all depends upon the skill set and confidence of the sub/slave in completing the tasks.

Both A and B get the oil changed in the car.  There is a difference between these two in terms of the skills and amount of work involved for the sub/slave.    You'd be suprised though the sense of self esteem one can gain for doing B, when they have never done it before or felt they would fuck it up.   When you get one to do something they thought they never could do before.  A little micromanagement for teaching somebody something should always be a reward.

The thing people misunderstand about Micromanagement is that you are giving the sub/slave a deeper level of time and attention, it actually makes them feel more accepted, wanted and cared for at times.  Also even if they know how to change the Oil in a car, if you make your presense known from time to time... it's gives the sub/slave a chance to show off for you while they are doing it.    There is a short of show off factor for the sub/slave.   Think of it like having a little kid saying look mommy or daddy at what I can do.. see me doing it.   

Call me twisted but when you give somebody wings to fly with at times, it's a beautiful sight seeing them fly and having them show off what they finally have learned to do.  Should make both the Dom/me and submissive proud and happy.

Too many people think Micromanagement involves a lot of time, when it can only involves part of your time.  You don't have to stand over their shoulder 24/7 you know, all you have to do is check up on them from time to time.  Show an interest in the how well they are completing the tasks you've assigned.   Compliments and praise for good job, and simply train teach or encourage them to improve or be better at the tasks you've given them.

I think many people have many Negative preconceptions about Micromanagements and what it involves. 

There are many Dom/mes out there that want no Part in micromanagement and it sets the sub/slave up for disappointment if they don't or can't complete the tasks well or fail to do so.

It's not fun seeing the look of shame and self disappointment a sub/slave has when they simply knew they did not do a good job.   It's does piss me off for the Dom/me types that are mean orges about this crap too.  Why? Because they did not take the required time initially micromanage for training.   Also, many sub/slaves start to feel the tasks become Thankless or meaningless because the Dom/me never takes an interest in what they are doing...

Just some food for thought on this subject..   

< Message edited by WhiplashSmile -- 5/7/2007 9:33:21 AM >

(in reply to MasterFireMaam)
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RE: Micro Management, what does it mean to you? - 5/7/2007 1:38:54 PM   
MasterFireMaam


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterFireMaam
Micromanaging is work. The only thing that I really micromanage is how to fold my t-shirts. I have a way that reduced the wrinkles, but people seem to have a problem with it. Perhaps it's easy for me 'cause I've been doing it for 20 years?

Master Fire

Well we all have quirks, I haven't met a dom yet who didn't have SOMETHING they needed to micromanage.  My partner has a thing about towels and tshirts as well so I just let him go for it.


True. I actually would let it go if someone could show me that their way works just as good as mine...and I don't want them hung up. What I need is one of those people who can do the japanese shirt folding....*chuckle*

Master Fire


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RE: Micro Management, what does it mean to you? - 5/7/2007 1:48:11 PM   
earthycouple


Posts: 4462
Joined: 2/19/2006
Status: offline 		For me, micromanaging is adding work to my plate when my slave is supposed to be making my life a bit easier.  I am, like MasterFireMaam, picky about how I want my tshirts folded, but once that is taught.  It is taught.  I tell every slave that walks through this door: "I don't care how you get it done, as long as it gets done".  I had a sub bring me money to pay for a maid service and he set up the appointment for her to come out.  He did his work as far as I was concerned.

Of course if he had (in my opinion) NEEDED to perform that work for me, for whatever reason, then that's what would have happened.

Micromanaging equals blech!

D~

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RE: Micro Management, what does it mean to you? - 5/7/2007 1:49:08 PM   
TigressFL


Posts: 239
Joined: 6/8/2006
Status: offline 		I do not have the time, energy or desire to micro-manage.

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RE: Micro Management, what does it mean to you? - 5/7/2007 1:54:16 PM   
mstrjx


Posts: 2045
Joined: 11/27/2005
Status: offline 		If I'm feeling REALLY micromanagerial, it goes something like this:

You have the right to breathe.  I'm not going to tell you when to breathe in and breathe out.

Depending on the person, I can be all over the board.  Like others have mentioned, true micromanagement is a lot of work; too much work.  In some cases, it isn't always a bad thing, but in others it's overboard.

Sure, I like my towels folded a certain way; I'm funny about my laundry and how it gets done.  But if it's not working out 'just so', I rather just suck it up and do it myself.

Going towards the other extreme seems better, again depending on the partner.  This is how I like things done, it's not rocket science, please do it this way.  Over time, understanding my patterns and behaviors leads to 'anticipation of needs'.

Far fewer words spoken.  Poetry in service, however.  Shouldn't that be the life?

Jeff

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RE: Micro Management, what does it mean to you? - 5/7/2007 2:46:35 PM   
daniL


Posts: 46
Joined: 4/12/2007
Status: offline 		For me, micromanagement would have to be a constant activity to be called micromanagement. I have had times where my girl was particularly emotional, and telling her every detail like 'go wash your face, change your clothes, at six o'clock call this person to solve this problem and tell them X' was necessary. I've had times where, just for shits and giggles, my girl and I enjoy those specific orders. Other times, if I am teaching her something, I may have to be very specific, moreso than some other people might think necessary, but I know that's how my girl learns sometimes. Now, if I had to do that 24/7, I would honestly start to wonder what was so scary to her that she needed that sort of strictness. I love micromanagement for fun [and I wish for profit] and some people naturally fall into relationships that resemble micromanagement. I would think less of the situation if I-- after long term exposure to a couple or a relationship or a dynamic, obviously-- felt as if the sub/slave was using the micromanagement as a way to avoid living their own lives, or the dom/me/Master was being obsessive over the micromanagement [something else that changes from relationship to relationship]

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RE: Micro Management, what does it mean to you? - 5/7/2007 3:07:34 PM   
AquaticSub


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cjenny

Micro management. What is it to you and how do you feel about it? Do you look at those that need micro management in a negative way?


I think it probably makes too much work for the dominant.

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RE: Micro Management, what does it mean to you? - 5/7/2007 3:14:34 PM   
shyinini


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cjenny

Micro management. What is it to you and how do you feel about it? Do you look at those that need micro management in a negative way?


I was micromanaged for 6 months.  I had to call from 1200milews away EVERY fucking 2 hours.  Had to be on cam every moment of the day I was home.  Then one day I could NOT contact him.  I panicked big time.  I was scared for him cause I knew he went on drinking binges and rode an Indian Spirit.  For 36 there was NO contact from him.  Then he blamed me for the scenerio that went bad.  He called me disobedient and uncaring, totally let me hanging for 6 months.
 
I am fucking 5o yrs old...pay my own self employment taxes, own my own home and have survived 49 yrs WITHOUT  him...... 
 
THank God Sir does NOT micromanage.   Thats just my story.
I am accountable and he is responsible and vice versa.

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A Man who always seeks to be the best He can be for you
is the only Man truly worthy of being called Sir.


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RE: Micro Management, what does it mean to you? - 5/7/2007 3:17:09 PM   
cjenny


Posts: 1736
Joined: 11/27/2006
Status: offline 		There are some areas in my life where I need micro managed & I freely admit that. One of the things that brought this question into my mind were some of the discussions about doms/masters that are so involved with their subs that they read all email & co-orespondence. Or doms that have everything filtered through them first. I was actually kinda surprised that no one mentioned those.
That to me is more what I think micro management (mm) means. Not my dom making sure I paid xyz bills this week or changed my oil lol.

It is interesting too, how many detest the very words! Out of all the responses very few seemed to even tolerate the concept. Of all, WhipLash hit closest to how I personally see it. Not as an onerous burden but instead as a control and teaching tool.

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RE: Micro Management, what does it mean to you? - 5/7/2007 3:18:11 PM   
windchymes


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Status: offline 		The only time in my life that I needed to be micro-managed was to be told whether to put the gun to my own head or to the head of the one who thinks I need to be micro-managed.

I have worked for people, "managers", who seemed to feel that they needed to tell me to turn the light on when I opened the office, to answer the phone when it rang, and to pick up the phone receiver when answering it, who edited all my emails and written correspondence, and on and on.  Some people just seem to take an unholy joy in telling everyone else what to do and how to do it and watching them constantly to make sure they do it exactly according to their pre-conceived plan.  Remember that bossy neighborhood kid who was always making up the rules, as the game went along, and single-handedly enforcing them?  This is who they grew up to be.

Please, respect my intelligence and maturity and life experiences and find someone else to micro-manage if you have such an innate need.

_____________________________

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RE: Micro Management, what does it mean to you? - 5/7/2007 4:02:47 PM   
WhiplashSmile


Posts: 1472
Joined: 6/8/2004
Status: offline 		I've been thinking about this topic a little more today.   In terms of Micromanagement, I don't honestly believe it's an effective day to day tool or on going dynamic for a relationship.   It's great in terms of training or teaching, but after that it can become toxic.    Hell, everybody has watched personal make over shows.. where people really need help with makeup, clothing, personal organization or otherwise intervention!   I don't see a problem in doing the same..  where it's helpful thing.   However, once the mission has been accomplished.. it's best to let go of playing micromanager and see what takes hold.

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RE: Micro Management, what does it mean to you? - 5/7/2007 4:05:11 PM   
WhiplashSmile


Posts: 1472
Joined: 6/8/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: windchymes

The only time in my life that I needed to be micro-managed was to be told whether to put the gun to my own head or to the head of the one who thinks I need to be micro-managed.

I have worked for people, "managers", who seemed to feel that they needed to tell me to turn the light on when I opened the office, to answer the phone when it rang, and to pick up the phone receiver when answering it, who edited all my emails and written correspondence, and on and on.  Some people just seem to take an unholy joy in telling everyone else what to do and how to do it and watching them constantly to make sure they do it exactly according to their pre-conceived plan.  Remember that bossy neighborhood kid who was always making up the rules, as the game went along, and single-handedly enforcing them?  This is who they grew up to be.

Please, respect my intelligence and maturity and life experiences and find someone else to micro-manage if you have such an innate need.

Yikes, now this is rather extreme.  Micromanagement Nazi's from Hell...  I'd hope somebody would shoot me if I ever started down this path.

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RE: Micro Management, what does it mean to you? - 5/7/2007 4:07:18 PM   
soulfulkitten


Posts: 27
Joined: 1/9/2005
Status: offline 		To me micro-management is being told what to do, how to do it, when to do it, etc.

I have been micro managed at times...it is not always an easy thing.

It can be thought of as a break from reality...I know I just need to do what I'm told.

It is not something I have done often, I would agree to it again, if asked.

Different strokes for different folks I guess.

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RE: Micro Management, what does it mean to you? - 5/7/2007 4:38:07 PM   
Sirandlittle1


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Joined: 12/22/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: cjenny

Micro management. What is it to you and how do you feel about it? Do you look at those that need micro management in a negative way?


What is it to me?
where everyday tasks/or unusual tasks are given to me, in infinate detail of how i must achieve them in order to demonstrate his control of how i perform these tasks.
For us, we met when i was in my 40's. I really did not think that i required him to take over my life in such a way, it was not something i needed, or would probably be able to handle over long periods of time.
I enjoy the micro management that involves prep for a play session though. It all helps me focus and can turn me on.
I do not nor would not, enjoy someone, telling me how to pay 'my' bills, with 'my' money, or what to sell 'my' house for.
Micro management is not a need for either of us, we cannot be bothered as it gives us little in return in terms of emphasising our dynamic.
On a time ltd basis it might, but after a hour, id be pissed off, he'd be bored as hell.
But as with everything, each to their own.
little1

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RE: Micro Management, what does it mean to you? - 5/7/2007 4:49:10 PM   
cjenny


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Joined: 11/27/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: WhiplashSmile
Yikes, now this is rather extreme.  Micromanagement Nazi's from Hell...  I'd hope somebody would shoot me if I ever started down this path.


Most of the responses feel on the extreme side to me. Maybe I need less 'mm' than I thought if what I'm reading is really the definition.
I'm horrible with remembering things even those I do routinely & he is patient enough to continuously remind me. Hello I just had a 'duh' moment. I feel stupid lol. I do need a different type than I'm reading because of my frequent cognitive processing difficulties. He keeps me on schedule every day.. but *bear with me please I'm thinking as I go* it is less 'mm' than it is just needing actual help.

It's less an emotional need for me than it is an actual need. Ah heck who knows. I'm just glad that I'm his and he cares enough to make sure that I'm on the right track. 'Nuff thinking tonight I'm exhausted and probably typing balderdash

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RE: Micro Management, what does it mean to you? - 5/7/2007 5:42:34 PM   
Areflectionofyou


Posts: 258
Joined: 4/4/2006
Status: offline 		micromanagement usually  occurs moreso in  relationships until established expectations are met.  It doesn't bother me all that much.

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RE: Micro Management, what does it mean to you? - 5/7/2007 5:53:24 PM   
slaveish


Posts: 1086
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quote:

ORIGINAL: cjenny

Micro management. What is it to you and how do you feel about it? Do you look at those that need micro management in a negative way?


It's a matter of degree. In small doses it can be fun and pleasant. In large doses it's just a pain in the ass. What constitutes "small" and "large" is in the eye of the person who feels the pain first.

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You only lose what you cling to. ~~Gautama Sidharta

If we have no peace, it is because we have forgotten that we belong to each other. ~~Mother Teresa

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RE: Micro Management, what does it mean to you? - 5/7/2007 6:42:10 PM   
WhiplashSmile


Posts: 1472
Joined: 6/8/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: cjenny

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhiplashSmile
Yikes, now this is rather extreme.  Micromanagement Nazi's from Hell...  I'd hope somebody would shoot me if I ever started down this path.


Most of the responses feel on the extreme side to me. Maybe I need less 'mm' than I thought if what I'm reading is really the definition.
I'm horrible with remembering things even those I do routinely & he is patient enough to continuously remind me. Hello I just had a 'duh' moment. I feel stupid lol. I do need a different type than I'm reading because of my frequent cognitive processing difficulties. He keeps me on schedule every day.. but *bear with me please I'm thinking as I go* it is less 'mm' than it is just needing actual help.

It's less an emotional need for me than it is an actual need. Ah heck who knows. I'm just glad that I'm his and he cares enough to make sure that I'm on the right track. 'Nuff thinking tonight I'm exhausted and probably typing balderdash


I can honestly say, I've fit into the role of being a reminder and being patient.  Not for the sake of being a micromanager itself, but just as a steady beacon of light that is there to help keep things on track.   The one thing that I value with these types of interactions is that the submissive may take the opportunity to remind me of something has well.   Call this a reminder checkup between both parties at the time.  I actually got into the habit of simply running down through the whole list for both myself and a submissive for the day, to see if either one of us forgot something important that needed to be done.   Even sit down and make out shopping or to do lists together, slice and dice up the tasks at hand.   Small little routine habits like this keep everything running smooth at home.   Instead of having to deal with Emergeny crisis.. like a clogged drain late at night.. and Damn it.. we are out of Draino again..   Micromanagement has it's place and value at times. 

Many people somehow believe task lists take too much work, when in fact they can save ass.  We all have Dugh moments, Dom/mes including subbie slave types...   In important aspect is how us Dom/mes can micromanage our own asses and get in the habit of doing things on a routine basis.   It takes work to get into a routine and it does involve micromanagement, however once you've made it through the curves... it actually frees up more time and there's less work involved.   Micromanagement has it's place for various degrees and duration of times.

Some people get to carried away from making lists and micromanagement that it turns into a totally negative thing.   In terms of having a submissive answer phones and whatnot, if I can't get to the phone I will shout out for her to answer it, letting her know I can't get to the phone.   If I'm busy with a project, I'll just let her know what I'm up to... if somebody calls for me to take a message instead of trying to track me down and bring me the phone.   I just look at these things as part of day to day living.

Also if she's going to busy with something to have her let me know, so I know I'm responsible for answering the phone.  Call this part of training.  If you are going to be busy let me know so I know how to deal with incoming phone calls from people.  You'd be amazed at the number of people that are clueless to doing these things, where they need to be reminded, asked, informed, instructed or get into the habit of doing this.   Makes life a lot easier though..

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RE: Micro Management, what does it mean to you? - 5/7/2007 6:47:21 PM   
Aswad


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cjenny

Micro management. What is it to you and how do you feel about it? Do you look at those that need micro management in a negative way?


To me, it is the constant or near-constant management of details of the other person's life, such as deciding what they will wear on a daily basis, or having to ask permission for every little thing.

I feel that it is something I could do in the context of a specific scene, though the rest of the interaction would have to make up for the effort involved, as I'd find it boring. In the context of a lifestyle, I would go insane if I had to micromanage someone.

I also think it would diminish the impact of those times I do make a decision about something. It might serve some to remind them of their relative status, but for me it just involves lots of effort spent for no benefit to me.

I don't look negatively on those who need it, although I question whether there might be mental health reasons for it in some (many?) cases, depending on the extent of the micromanagement.

As for those Doms who do it, it depends on its specific nature. If it's just the thing that happens to rock their boat, who am I to say no? But quite a few of the cases I've seen appear to have more than a hint of pathology about them, although I wouldn't say that has to be the case, nor that people with pathologies don't have the same right to the lifestyle as everyone else.

Edit: Just thought I'd forestall the inevitable flames by pointing out that I'm not talking about making decisions for the sub/slave, but constantly managing the details of things, needing to have everything just so, and probably checking in on it. Basically, stuff that takes more effort than just doing it yourself.


< Message edited by Aswad -- 5/7/2007 6:55:21 PM >

_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


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