RE: Christians pray for the Jews. (Full Version)

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Owner59 -> RE: Christians pray for the Jews. (7/27/2007 7:49:34 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveluci

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59
But these wackiest of the wackos, the christian right


quote:

They truly believe that "THEY",will see the "end times".This bunch,today`s(as in 2007) Christian right,think that they`ll be "blessed" enough,lol to witness Jesus` 2nd coming.They believe the conflict in Iraq is god`s plan,and bush is god`s agent on earth.(I know,weird)


quote:

They believe that for the "second coming"to happen,Israel must be destroyed(b/c the bible tells them so.I`m not making this up,folks.They truly feel that all Jews will then" come to Christ",so it will be  "all good in the hood",and Israel`s destruction won`t matter,cause we`ll all be in heaven next to Jesus anyway


quote:

The christian right is so arrogant,and so supremely selfish,that they`ll  force "Armageddon" on us,even if god really has plans for it for an other time.That ain`t good enough for this bunch of powerful nuts.That`s why they`re for the bombing of Iran,lol,not for US security,but to bring on Armageddon!!Get it?Their interst is in promoting war,creating chaos and mayhem.Not in peace and living peacefully.They want to bring this thing on,so that they selfishly get to see it happen in person,lol

Owner59,
With all due respect, I would like to point out to you that all Christians - even all evangelical ones - do NOT believe exactly the same and certainly do not all believe or advocate all the things you've outlined above.  Maintaining that "they" all believe this or that is about as sensible as saying all Muslims think exactly alike.  I think we all know that isn't so.  For instance, not all Muslims advocate violently killing all the infidels.  Therefore, please accept the notion that not ALL Christians are "wacko," "right wing," or "nuts."  This "bunch" of "arrogant" individuals you have spoken of above certainly does not include all of us who identify as followers of Christ.  To even think that all Christians wish to "bring on" Armageddon and that their interests lie in "promoting war, creating chaos and mayhem" not in living peacefully is very ignorant.  Please open your mind enough to see there are variations within Christianity just as there are within any race, gender, religion or other group of people of any kind. 

Peace (not war, mayhem, and  chaos) to you[:)] ...luci



I agree with everything you said ,dear.

I tried to qualify everything I said,by identifying my subjects as "the Christian Right".I guess I failed at doing that.

I should have spent a few sentences saying that I wasn`t speaking about average church goers.Next time I`ll be more mindful,and clearer.

I like that our country is one of the most religious in the world.

We have so much freedom with religion here,and hopefully the freedom to escape it,if we choose to.

I like the Yankee tradition ,of keeping my faith a private matter.I dis-like those who wear their religion on their shirt,like an official merit badge and cram it down other people`s throats.I loath people who feel they`re superior,because of religion.

I know evangelicals(mostly black friends)who jump,sing and shout about their love for Jesus,they have a blast.In their church,they play the most rock`n blues gospel music you`ve ever heard.Full out electric guitar and bass,drums and a horn section(it`s killer),singing their heads off.People really feel the spirit.

But they`re nice about it.
They`re not pushy or arrogant.They`d rather share Jesus ,than impose him.

They`re not try`n to pass laws say`n that we have to pray every day,etc.The "black church", makes up part of  the most conservative democratic block, in the party.There`s room for everyone`s traditions and ways to pray.
Even conservative republicans who fear Jesus, for the most part ,don`t impose their dogma on the rest of us.I respect that.

However,....the folks you saw in that film,are the weird ones,the ones who mix politics and religion,in the worst way. Jerry Falwell/Pat Robertson/Ted Haggard, the guy in this film,all are very powerful,and are connected to Washington DC.They have way more influence then they`re entitled to,and use their power and influence for selfish purposes.One example,after Katrina,the government web site listed two places to send donations,1.the Red Cross,the other was Pat Robertson,who received millions,and hasn`t accounted for it.That was a bone bush threw to Robertson,and real wrong.

Religion ,at it`s best is the spiritual food of billions of folks.I don`t want to insult you or anyone .But I do need to point out the bad faith players.These bad faith players are influencing our policy in the middle east,and that`s real wrong.

Again luci, don`t think I was referring to you,or normal regular believers.I was talking about the christian-right.

Peace



Vendaval -> RE: Christians pray for the Jews. (7/27/2007 11:56:05 PM)

You are thinking of Meryl Streep in The Devil Wears Prada. 
Glenn Close has played the villianess in Dangerous Liasions and Fatal Attraction and 101 Dalmations.



quote:

ORIGINAL: philosophy

...i thought the Devil was Glenn Close.......wearing Prada.....



Real0ne -> RE: Christians pray for the Jews. (7/28/2007 4:27:27 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: philosophy

buh...buh....but Kittinsol, the only religious extremists are Muslims. To suggest otherwise is, well, unamerican. Or at least, un-the-official-poltical-line.


Muslims?
Nah just the fucked up christians.


This study is based on the Jewish-authorized Babylonian Talmud.

We have published herein the authenticated sayings of the Jewish Talmud. Look them up for yourself. We publish the following irrefutable documentation in the hope of liberating all people, including Jewish people, from the corrosive delusions and racism of this Talmudic hate literature, which is the manual of Orthodox and Hasidic Jews the world over. The implementation by Jewish supremacists of Talmudic hate literature has caused untold suffering throughout history and now, in occupied Palestine, it is used as a justification for the mass murder of Palestinian civilians. The Talmud specifically defines all who are not Jews as non-human animals.

Where a Jew Should Do Evil

Moed Kattan 17a: If a Jew is tempted to do evil he should go to a city where he is not known and do the evil there.


Penalty for Disobeying Rabbis
Erubin 21b. Whosoever disobeys the rabbis deserves death and will be punished by being boiled in hot excrement in hell.


Hitting a Jew is the same as hitting God
Sanhedrin 58b. If a heathen (gentile) hits a Jew, the gentile must be killed.

O.K. to Cheat Non-Jews
Sanhedrin 57a . A Jew need not pay a gentile ("Cuthean") the wages owed him for work.
Jews Have Superior Legal Status
Baba Kamma 37b. "If an ox of an Israelite gores an ox of a Canaanite there is no liability; but if an ox of a Canaanite gores an ox of an Israelite...the payment is to be in full."


Jews May Steal from Non-Jews
Baba Mezia 24a . If a Jew finds an object lost by a gentile ("heathen") it does not have to be returned. (Affirmed also in Baba Kamma 113b). Sanhedrin 76a. God will not spare a Jew who "marries his daughter to an old man or takes a wife for his infant son or returns a lost article to a Cuthean..."


Jews May Rob and Kill Non-Jews
Sanhedrin 57a . When a Jew murders a gentile ("Cuthean"), there will be no death penalty. What a Jew steals from a gentile he may keep. Baba Kamma 37b. The gentiles are outside the protection of the law and God has "exposed their money to Israel."

Jews May Lie to Non-Jews
Baba Kamma 113a. Jews may use lies ("subterfuges") to circumvent a Gentile.


Non-Jewish Children are Sub-Human
Yebamoth 98a. All gentile children are animals. Abodah Zarah 36b. Gentile girls are in a state of niddah (filth) from birth. Abodah Zarah 22a-22b . Gentiles prefer sex with cows.

Insults Against Blessed Mary
Sanhedrin 106a . Says Jesus' mother was a whore: "She who was the descendant of princes and governors played the harlot with carpenters." Also in footnote #2 to Shabbath 104b of the Soncino edition, it is stated that in the "uncensored" text of the Talmud it is written that Jesus mother, "Miriam the hairdresser," had sex with many men.

Gloats over Christ Dying Young
A passage from Sanhedrin 106 gloats over the early age at which Jesus died: "Hast thou heard how old Balaam (Jesus) was?--He replied: It is not actually stated but since it is written, Bloody and deceitful men shall not live out half their days it follows that he was thirty-three or thirty-four years old."

Jesus in the Talmud:
Horrible Blasphemies Against Jesus Christ
While it is the standard disinformation practice of apologists for the Talmud to deny that it contains any scurrilous references to Jesus Christ, certain Orthodox Jewish organizations are more forthcoming and admit that the Talmud not only mentions Jesus but disparages him (as a sorcerer and a demented sex freak). These orthodox Jewish organizations make this admission perhaps out of the belief that Jewish supremacy is so well-established in the modern world that they need not concern themselves with adverse reactions. For example, on the website of the Orthodox Jewish Hasidic Lubavitch group--one of the largest in the world--we find the following statement, complete with Talmudic citations:
"The Talmud (Babylonian edition) records other sins of 'Jesus the Nazarene':
1) He and his disciples practiced sorcery and black magic, le

snip


Here is a word from a nice jewish boy:


The Israeli Terrorist State and its Mossad Assassins
by Dr. Israel Shahak
Editor's Note: The Campaign for Radical Truth in History welcomes Dr. Israel Shahak to our web pages. Dr. Shahak is a resident of Jerusalem. He is professor emeritus at Hebrew University. He relocated to Palestine at age 12 in 1945, after four years incarceration in Bergen-Belsen concentration camp. He is the author of the landmark book, Jewish History/Jewish Religion (Pluto Press).
There is nothing new in the fact that Israel is a terrorist state which, almost from its inception, has used one of its intelligence agencies, the Mossad, to carry out violence or terror, including assassination, it considers necessary for its ends. The Israeli terrorism in Lebanon was exhibited in the "Accountability" and "Grapes of Wrath" operations, for example, when so many people were ordered to leave their homes on a day's notice lest they be bombed to death. Such state terrorism was even worse than the assassination of specific individuals. In fact, however, all Israeli governments have carried out terroristic acts and all Zionist parties support them in principle. To be specific, when he was prime minister, Shimon Peres ordered the assassination of Yehya Ayyash n Area A, supposedly under the sole control of the Palestinian Authority, an act which, according to Hamas, triggered the retaliatory suicide bombings of February-March 1996. (Although I personally doubt this Hamas explanation, there is little doubt that those suicide bombings contributed to the thin majority of votes which elected Binyamin Netanyahu and defeated Peres in the May 1996 election.) [1] A few months earlier,Yitzhak Rabin ordered the assassination of Fathi Shikaki, head of the Palestinian Islamic Jihad organization, in Malta. One could also cite other acts of terrorism whi

This article is reprinted with permission from the Jan./Feb. 1998 issue of The Washington Report on Middle East Affairs.http://www.revisionisthistory.org/essay8.html




What the Talmud Really Says About Jesus


“What exactly is so scandalous? How about Jesus punished in Hell for eternity by being made to sit in a cauldron of boiling excrement? That image appears in early manuscripts of the Babylonian Talmud, as does a brief account of Jesus’ trial and execution—not by the Romans but by the Jewish high court, the Sanhedrin.”  http://www.davidduke.com/general/what-the-talmud-really-says-about-jesus_2196.html


Yep thats definitely taking the high road!

Booohoooohoooo why doesnt anybody like me???????

Its great to be an atheist!  LOL



Owner59 -> RE: Christians pray for the Jews. (7/28/2007 5:51:43 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

quote:

ORIGINAL: philosophy

buh...buh....but Kittinsol, the only religious extremists are Muslims. To suggest otherwise is, well, unamerican. Or at least, un-the-official-poltical-line.


Muslims?
Nah just the fucked up christians.


This study is based on the Jewish-authorized Babylonian Talmud.

We have published herein the authenticated sayings of the Jewish Talmud. Look them up for yourself. We publish the following irrefutable documentation in the hope of liberating all people, including Jewish people, from the corrosive delusions and racism of this Talmudic hate literature, which is the manual of Orthodox and Hasidic Jews the world over. The implementation by Jewish supremacists of Talmudic hate literature has caused untold suffering throughout history and now, in occupied Palestine, it is used as a justification for the mass murder of Palestinian civilians. The Talmud specifically defines all who are not Jews as non-human animals.

Where a Jew Should Do Evil

Moed Kattan 17a: If a Jew is tempted to do evil he should go to a city where he is not known and do the evil there.


Penalty for Disobeying Rabbis
Erubin 21b. Whosoever disobeys the rabbis deserves death and will be punished by being boiled in hot excrement in hell.


Hitting a Jew is the same as hitting God
Sanhedrin 58b. If a heathen (gentile) hits a Jew, the gentile must be killed.

O.K. to Cheat Non-Jews
Sanhedrin 57a . A Jew need not pay a gentile ("Cuthean") the wages owed him for work.
Jews Have Superior Legal Status
Baba Kamma 37b. "If an ox of an Israelite gores an ox of a Canaanite there is no liability; but if an ox of a Canaanite gores an ox of an Israelite...the payment is to be in full."


Jews May Steal from Non-Jews
Baba Mezia 24a . If a Jew finds an object lost by a gentile ("heathen") it does not have to be returned. (Affirmed also in Baba Kamma 113b). Sanhedrin 76a. God will not spare a Jew who "marries his daughter to an old man or takes a wife for his infant son or returns a lost article to a Cuthean..."


Jews May Rob and Kill Non-Jews
Sanhedrin 57a . When a Jew murders a gentile ("Cuthean"), there will be no death penalty. What a Jew steals from a gentile he may keep. Baba Kamma 37b. The gentiles are outside the protection of the law and God has "exposed their money to Israel."

Jews May Lie to Non-Jews
Baba Kamma 113a. Jews may use lies ("subterfuges") to circumvent a Gentile.


Non-Jewish Children are Sub-Human
Yebamoth 98a. All gentile children are animals. Abodah Zarah 36b. Gentile girls are in a state of niddah (filth) from birth. Abodah Zarah 22a-22b . Gentiles prefer sex with cows.

Insults Against Blessed Mary
Sanhedrin 106a . Says Jesus' mother was a whore: "She who was the descendant of princes and governors played the harlot with carpenters." Also in footnote #2 to Shabbath 104b of the Soncino edition, it is stated that in the "uncensored" text of the Talmud it is written that Jesus mother, "Miriam the hairdresser," had sex with many men.

Gloats over Christ Dying Young
A passage from Sanhedrin 106 gloats over the early age at which Jesus died: "Hast thou heard how old Balaam (Jesus) was?--He replied: It is not actually stated but since it is written, Bloody and deceitful men shall not live out half their days it follows that he was thirty-three or thirty-four years old."

Jesus in the Talmud:
Horrible Blasphemies Against Jesus Christ
While it is the standard disinformation practice of apologists for the Talmud to deny that it contains any scurrilous references to Jesus Christ, certain Orthodox Jewish organizations are more forthcoming and admit that the Talmud not only mentions Jesus but disparages him (as a sorcerer and a demented sex freak). These orthodox Jewish organizations make this admission perhaps out of the belief that Jewish supremacy is so well-established in the modern world that they need not concern themselves with adverse reactions. For example, on the website of the Orthodox Jewish Hasidic Lubavitch group--one of the largest in the world--we find the following statement, complete with Talmudic citations:
"The Talmud (Babylonian edition) records other sins of 'Jesus the Nazarene':
1) He and his disciples practiced sorcery and black magic, le

snip


Here is a word from a nice jewish boy:


The Israeli Terrorist State and its Mossad Assassins
by Dr. Israel Shahak
Editor's Note: The Campaign for Radical Truth in History welcomes Dr. Israel Shahak to our web pages. Dr. Shahak is a resident of Jerusalem. He is professor emeritus at Hebrew University. He relocated to Palestine at age 12 in 1945, after four years incarceration in Bergen-Belsen concentration camp. He is the author of the landmark book, Jewish History/Jewish Religion (Pluto Press).
There is nothing new in the fact that Israel is a terrorist state which, almost from its inception, has used one of its intelligence agencies, the Mossad, to carry out violence or terror, including assassination, it considers necessary for its ends. The Israeli terrorism in Lebanon was exhibited in the "Accountability" and "Grapes of Wrath" operations, for example, when so many people were ordered to leave their homes on a day's notice lest they be bombed to death. Such state terrorism was even worse than the assassination of specific individuals. In fact, however, all Israeli governments have carried out terroristic acts and all Zionist parties support them in principle. To be specific, when he was prime minister, Shimon Peres ordered the assassination of Yehya Ayyash n Area A, supposedly under the sole control of the Palestinian Authority, an act which, according to Hamas, triggered the retaliatory suicide bombings of February-March 1996. (Although I personally doubt this Hamas explanation, there is little doubt that those suicide bombings contributed to the thin majority of votes which elected Binyamin Netanyahu and defeated Peres in the May 1996 election.) [1] A few months earlier,Yitzhak Rabin ordered the assassination of Fathi Shikaki, head of the Palestinian Islamic Jihad organization, in Malta. One could also cite other acts of terrorism whi

This article is reprinted with permission from the Jan./Feb. 1998 issue of The Washington Report on Middle East Affairs.http://www.revisionisthistory.org/essay8.html




What the Talmud Really Says About Jesus


“What exactly is so scandalous? How about Jesus punished in Hell for eternity by being made to sit in a cauldron of boiling excrement? That image appears in early manuscripts of the Babylonian Talmud, as does a brief account of Jesus’ trial and execution—not by the Romans but by the Jewish high court, the Sanhedrin.”  http://www.davidduke.com/general/what-the-talmud-really-says-about-jesus_2196.html


Yep thats definitely taking the high road!

Booohoooohoooo why doesnt anybody like me???????

Its great to be an atheist!  LOL



Not sure why you posted that,but it`s very  fucked up of you.

Why don`t you post passages from The Protocols of the Elders of Zion.

Or better yet,feed the fear, hate and loathing by quoting from The Turner Diaries .

This is not at all clever or useful,rather something to be ashamed of.

Maybe you posted this as a joke or for some innocent reason.I hope so.

Could you let us know why?

Also,could you email my CM account w/ your phone number? I have a few things to say,that are best said  personaly.



Level -> RE: Christians pray for the Jews. (7/28/2007 6:21:29 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne


What the Talmud Really Says About Jesus


“What exactly is so scandalous? How about Jesus punished in Hell for eternity by being made to sit in a cauldron of boiling excrement? That image appears in early manuscripts of the Babylonian Talmud, as does a brief account of Jesus’ trial and execution—not by the Romans but by the Jewish high court, the Sanhedrin.”  http://www.davidduke.com/general/what-the-talmud-really-says-about-jesus_2196.html


Yep thats definitely taking the high road!

Booohoooohoooo why doesnt anybody like me???????

Its great to be an atheist!  LOL



Is that the same David Duke that was a grand wizard in the klan, and convicted felon?



Satyr6406 -> RE: Christians pray for the Jews. (7/28/2007 6:24:13 AM)

Actually, Owner, I'm pretty sure he posted it to prove that it isn't only the Muslims or the Christians but, that EVERY faith has some extremists and has texts that many of them hold dear that suggest some horrible things.

I won't speak for Real One, anymore but, your response to him could easily have been posted to the OP and been just as fitting. The only difference is: There's a bias (quite a few of them) in operation, here. A black comedian can make fun of white people but, if a white comedian does the same thing, they're a racist. Someone who was raised Jewish can slam the Christians but, if a Christian says anything derrogatory about a Jew, they're automatically an anti-semite. It's plain, un-diluted bullshit!

Instead of feeding into the negativity and adding more fuel to the fire, why don't we see where we can all agree about certain things? Why don't we focus on what makes us similar instead of what continues to divide us?





Peace and comfort,





Michael



slaveluci -> RE: Christians pray for the Jews. (7/28/2007 7:06:41 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

I agree with everything you said ,dear

Now if I could just get everyone to say that[;)].....
quote:

I tried to qualify everything I said,by identifying my subjects as "the Christian Right".I guess I failed at doing that

No, I think you did identify your subjects as the Christian Right.  I still say that not all of the Christian Right thinks exactly the same.  I know lots of good folks who identify as conservatives and probably believe some of the things you mentioned.  I don't think they necessarily "want" Armageddon, they just believe that it is going to take place. 
quote:

I should have spent a few sentences saying that I wasn`t speaking about average church goers.Next time I`ll be more mindful,and clearer

Thank you.  There really IS a difference.  As I said, these guys who are in the spotlight represent the views of all church goers about like Osama Bin Laden represents the views of all Muslims.  They don't.
quote:

I like the Yankee tradition ,of keeping my faith a private matter.I dis-like those who wear their religion on their shirt,like an official merit badge and cram it down other people`s throats.I loath people who feel they`re superior,because of religion

As does God.  Isaiah 65, verses 1 -5 is one of my favorite passages : "I have spread out my hands all the day unto a rebellious people.....which say, 'Stand by thyself, come not near to me; for I am holier than thou.  These are a smoke in my nose, a fire that burneth all the day.'"  Even God doesn't approve of "holier than thou" types[;)].  I agree with you that feeling superior because of religion is wrong.  But, then again, I feel that feeling superior because of education, financial worth, or anything else is wrong too.
quote:

I know evangelicals(mostly black friends)who jump,sing and shout about their love for Jesus,they have a blast.In their church,they play the most rock`n blues gospel music you`ve ever heard.Full out electric guitar and bass,drums and a horn section(it`s killer),singing their heads off.People really feel the spirit.
But they`re nice about it.
They`re not pushy or arrogant.They`d rather share Jesus ,than impose him

Exactly!  That's how I would classify my own behavior.  Attending services at churches like you just mentioned leaves me feeling like I KNOW I've been to church....lol...it's not dry and ritualistic - the Spirit really moves there.  But, just as you said, the point is to share your faith, not force it onto others.  Christ Himself never did that, why should Christians?  But then, sadly, so many "Christians" don't seem to have a really good grasp on just what He did and did not do or approve of.  Another of my favorite verses is I Peter 3:15: ".....be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear."  This indicates to me that Christians need to be ready to explain their faith/why they believe to others who ASK and to do it with meekness, not sledgehammer them and condemn them if they don't instantly share that faith. 
quote:

They`re not try`n to pass laws say`n that we have to pray every day,etc.The "black church", makes up part of  the most conservative democratic block, in the party.There`s room for everyone`s traditions and ways to pray.
Even conservative republicans who fear Jesus, for the most part ,don`t impose their dogma on the rest of us.I respect that

As do I. 
quote:

However,....the folks you saw in that film,are the weird ones,the ones who mix politics and religion,in the worst way. Jerry Falwell/Pat Robertson/Ted Haggard, the guy in this film,all are very powerful,and are connected to Washington DC.They have way more influence then they`re entitled to,and use their power and influence for selfish purposes.One example,after Katrina,the government web site listed two places to send donations,1.the Red Cross,the other was Pat Robertson,who received millions,and hasn`t accounted for it.That was a bone bush threw to Robertson,and real wrong

I couldn't agree more.
quote:

Religion ,at it`s best is the spiritual food of billions of folks.I don`t want to insult you or anyone .But I do need to point out the bad faith players.These bad faith players are influencing our policy in the middle east,and that`s real wrong

Again, totally agreed.  This unholy marriage between politics and religion bothers me as well.  Bush - who professes Christianity but who seems to always do the exact opposite of what Scripture teaches on any issue - seems to hide behind Christianity and use it as an excuse for lots of his decisions.  Unfortunately, so many professing Christians are totally Biblically illiterate and don't know enough about Scripture to call Bush on his BS.  If he says God leads him to do what he does, so many just accept that and never question the fact that what he does is in direct opposition to what Scripture teaches.  That's what's insulting. 
quote:

Again luci, don`t think I was referring to you,or normal regular believers.I was talking about the christian-right

Thank you, Owner59.  I do understand.  As always, you and everyone else has the right to say anything they please here.  I wasn't insulted or angry (and so what if I was, I know[8D]) but I just wanted to pipe up and say that not all of us Christians are right-wing wackos sitting around praying for Armageddon to crash down on us.  It seems you are already very well aware of that.  I thank you very much for showing a lot of class in your response to me.  So often, people just get angry and...especially when speaking about religion, politics, abortion and certain other hot-button issues....take that as license to totally dismiss opinions that don't match their own.  It's easy to degrade and mock that which we don't understand or feel disdain for.  You did not do that.  That shows maturity and class and I commend you for that.  Thanks for the intelligent, thought-provoking exchange............luci 

Peace



Owner59 -> RE: Christians pray for the Jews. (7/28/2007 7:30:16 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Satyr6406

Actually, Owner, I'm pretty sure he posted it to prove that it isn't only the Muslims or the Christians but, that EVERY faith has some extremists and has texts that many of them hold dear that suggest some horrible things.

I won't speak for Real One, anymore but, your response to him could easily have been posted to the OP and been just as fitting. The only difference is: There's a bias (quite a few of them) in operation, here. A black comedian can make fun of white people but, if a white comedian does the same thing, they're a racist. Someone who was raised Jewish can slam the Christians but, if a Christian says anything derrogatory about a Jew, they're automatically an anti-semite. It's plain, un-diluted bullshit!

Instead of feeding into the negativity and adding more fuel to the fire, why don't we see where we can all agree about certain things? Why don't we focus on what makes us similar instead of what continues to divide us?





Peace and comfort,





Michael


But everything he posted was hateful lies and bullshit.That was all made up and a shameful deception,designed to do harm.  It didn`r represent any kind of truth,or any interpretation of truth,accept  the that of the lunatic fringe and the white supremacists.It wasn`t written by Jews or a part of anything they believe.Not even with the most generous interpretation(generous to the lunatic fringe),can explain this.Sorry,dude,putting my foot down ,here.That was pure hate,re-posted by either a dope,or a very scary person.If you don`t see the evil nature of this,no one`s going to be able to explain it to you.

I`m hoping Realone posted that to mock David Duke and his ilk.

The only difference is: There's a bias (quite a few of them) in operation, here. A black comedian can make fun of white people but, if a white comedian does the same thing, they're a racist.

Stop with the psycho-babble.I watch "Comic View" on BET all the time.I`ve seen plenty on white,asian,and indian comedians tell very racy and racial jokes.Years ago when I 1st started watching "Comic View",I saw a white guy win the contest for who gets to host the show for a year.Yup,a white comedian hosting a black comedy show.He made jokes about the black community,about himself,about the tension between the races,and he was funny.So it is possible to do.But not everyone can pull it off,it takes finesse and context.

To be fair to you,can you point out where a white comedian has been bashed for making fun of black people?If you mean Don Imus,you`re out`a luck.That was no joke,though he was laughing.

Someone who was raised Jewish can slam the Christians but, if a Christian says anything derrogatory about a Jew, they're automatically an anti-semite. It's plain, un-diluted bullshit!


Again, I`d need an example of this happening,do you have any?Or is this your personal analysis and opinion?

If pointing out who the assholes are, is feeding into the negativity,how else do we keep them from writing our laws or starting illegal wars?Should we hope everyone behaves,and stay silent when they don`t?

Politics is messy,and not always about happy things.A citizen`s responsibility to the US,is like a parents responsibility to their child.You praise them when they behave,and scold and correct them when they don`t.Parenting isn`t alway fun and happy,just like politics.

Peace



Satyr6406 -> RE: Christians pray for the Jews. (7/28/2007 7:37:27 AM)

Owner, I'd respond to you but, your mind's made up.
 
 
 
 
 
Peace and comfort,
 
 
 
 
 
Michael



Owner59 -> RE: Christians pray for the Jews. (7/28/2007 8:03:21 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Satyr6406

Owner, I'd respond to you but, your mind's made up.
 
 
 
 
 
Peace and comfort,
 
 
 
 
 
Michael


No,no.... I`m open minded.I want to hear your arguments.Please,back up what you said.I`ll listen.



Owner59 -> RE: Christians pray for the Jews. (7/28/2007 8:38:26 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveluci

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

I agree with everything you said ,dear

Now if I could just get everyone to say that[;)].....
quote:

I tried to qualify everything I said,by identifying my subjects as "the Christian Right".I guess I failed at doing that

No, I think you did identify your subjects as the Christian Right.  I still say that not all of the Christian Right thinks exactly the same.  I know lots of good folks who identify as conservatives and probably believe some of the things you mentioned.  I don't think they necessarily "want" Armageddon, they just believe that it is going to take place. 
quote:

I should have spent a few sentences saying that I wasn`t speaking about average church goers.Next time I`ll be more mindful,and clearer

Thank you.  There really IS a difference.  As I said, these guys who are in the spotlight represent the views of all church goers about like Osama Bin Laden represents the views of all Muslims.  They don't.
quote:

I like the Yankee tradition ,of keeping my faith a private matter.I dis-like those who wear their religion on their shirt,like an official merit badge and cram it down other people`s throats.I loath people who feel they`re superior,because of religion

As does God.  Isaiah 65, verses 1 -5 is one of my favorite passages : "I have spread out my hands all the day unto a rebellious people.....which say, 'Stand by thyself, come not near to me; for I am holier than thou.  These are a smoke in my nose, a fire that burneth all the day.'"  Even God doesn't approve of "holier than thou" types[;)].  I agree with you that feeling superior because of religion is wrong.  But, then again, I feel that feeling superior because of education, financial worth, or anything else is wrong too.
quote:

I know evangelicals(mostly black friends)who jump,sing and shout about their love for Jesus,they have a blast.In their church,they play the most rock`n blues gospel music you`ve ever heard.Full out electric guitar and bass,drums and a horn section(it`s killer),singing their heads off.People really feel the spirit.
But they`re nice about it.
They`re not pushy or arrogant.They`d rather share Jesus ,than impose him

Exactly!  That's how I would classify my own behavior.  Attending services at churches like you just mentioned leaves me feeling like I KNOW I've been to church....lol...it's not dry and ritualistic - the Spirit really moves there.  But, just as you said, the point is to share your faith, not force it onto others.  Christ Himself never did that, why should Christians?  But then, sadly, so many "Christians" don't seem to have a really good grasp on just what He did and did not do or approve of.  Another of my favorite verses is I Peter 3:15: ".....be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear."  This indicates to me that Christians need to be ready to explain their faith/why they believe to others who ASK and to do it with meekness, not sledgehammer them and condemn them if they don't instantly share that faith. 
quote:

They`re not try`n to pass laws say`n that we have to pray every day,etc.The "black church", makes up part of  the most conservative democratic block, in the party.There`s room for everyone`s traditions and ways to pray.
Even conservative republicans who fear Jesus, for the most part ,don`t impose their dogma on the rest of us.I respect that

As do I. 
quote:

However,....the folks you saw in that film,are the weird ones,the ones who mix politics and religion,in the worst way. Jerry Falwell/Pat Robertson/Ted Haggard, the guy in this film,all are very powerful,and are connected to Washington DC.They have way more influence then they`re entitled to,and use their power and influence for selfish purposes.One example,after Katrina,the government web site listed two places to send donations,1.the Red Cross,the other was Pat Robertson,who received millions,and hasn`t accounted for it.That was a bone bush threw to Robertson,and real wrong

I couldn't agree more.
quote:

Religion ,at it`s best is the spiritual food of billions of folks.I don`t want to insult you or anyone .But I do need to point out the bad faith players.These bad faith players are influencing our policy in the middle east,and that`s real wrong

Again, totally agreed.  This unholy marriage between politics and religion bothers me as well.  Bush - who professes Christianity but who seems to always do the exact opposite of what Scripture teaches on any issue - seems to hide behind Christianity and use it as an excuse for lots of his decisions.  Unfortunately, so many professing Christians are totally Biblically illiterate and don't know enough about Scripture to call Bush on his BS.  If he says God leads him to do what he does, so many just accept that and never question the fact that what he does is in direct opposition to what Scripture teaches.  That's what's insulting. 
quote:

Again luci, don`t think I was referring to you,or normal regular believers.I was talking about the christian-right

Thank you, Owner59.  I do understand.  As always, you and everyone else has the right to say anything they please here.  I wasn't insulted or angry (and so what if I was, I know[8D]) but I just wanted to pipe up and say that not all of us Christians are right-wing wackos sitting around praying for Armageddon to crash down on us.  It seems you are already very well aware of that.  I thank you very much for showing a lot of class in your response to me.  So often, people just get angry and...especially when speaking about religion, politics, abortion and certain other hot-button issues....take that as license to totally dismiss opinions that don't match their own.  It's easy to degrade and mock that which we don't understand or feel disdain for.  You did not do that.  That shows maturity and class and I commend you for that.  Thanks for the intelligent, thought-provoking exchange............luci 

Peace




"I know lots of good folks who identify as conservatives and probably believe some of the things you mentioned.  I don't think they necessarily "want" Armageddon, they just believe that it is going to take place."


That is true and valid.I would never say that someone couldn`t or shouldn`t believe that,or any part of the good book.If you believe in Jesus,you believe in the predictions.I`m ok with that, and support a person`s right to believe.

Did you hear what Tom Delay said,though(I`m para phrasing here)He said he believed in the end times and wanted then to come soon.I`ve heard these nuts speculate we are in the "end times" now,today.And that what we`re seeing now, is in the bible.They are in the highest ranks of the government and of the republican party.

I believe these people are trying to create the end days,so as to fulfill their destiny as Christians, in a Christan nation.I believe that decisions about the middle east are being made in order to bring about this twisted plan.I`m not making this stuff up.

The bush administration has no interest in peace making in the middle east.IMO Every move and decision has produced death and suffering.No effort at all in finding common ground or moderate voices.Just war and threats of war.

My rant wasn`t even about the Christian dogma,but rather how it`s possibly being used politically.






DomKen -> RE: Christians pray for the Jews. (7/28/2007 9:30:43 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

But everything he posted was hateful lies and bullshit.That was all made up and a shameful deception,designed to do harm.  It didn`r represent any kind of truth,or any interpretation of truth,accept  the that of the lunatic fringe and the white supremacists.It wasn`t written by Jews or a part of anything they believe.Not even with the most generous interpretation(generous to the lunatic fringe),can explain this.Sorry,dude,putting my foot down ,here.That was pure hate,re-posted by either a dope,or a very scary person.If you don`t see the evil nature of this,no one`s going to be able to explain it to you.

I`m hoping Realone posted that to mock David Duke and his ilk.

Unfortunately unrealone has a history of quoting aprovingly from anti semitic sources in between the tax evasion lies, the 9/11 conspiracy bs and the various other bunk he peddles.

As to the specific claims the racist felon made quoted in the above post this is functionally the same outrageous lies made up in the 1200's by supporters of the Spanish Inquisition. It was lies of the most base and venal sort then and remain so today.



slaveluci -> RE: Christians pray for the Jews. (7/28/2007 10:32:42 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59
I`ve heard these nuts speculate we are in the "end times" now,today

I won't get into that particular debate.  Suffice it to say that believing that does not necessarily make one a "nut"[image]http://www.collarchat.com/image/s3.gif[/image].
quote:

They are in the highest ranks of the government and of the republican party

Agreed - as well as many other places.
quote:

I believe these people are trying to create the end days,so as to fulfill their destiny as Christians, in a Christan nation.I believe that decisions about the middle east are being made in order to bring about this twisted plan.I`m not making this stuff up

No, I know you're not.  I believe that is indeed happening.
quote:

The bush administration has no interest in peace making in the middle east.IMO Every move and decision has produced death and suffering.No effort at all in finding common ground or moderate voices.Just war and threats of war

Agreed as well.
quote:

My rant wasn`t even about the Christian dogma,but rather how it`s possibly being used politically

I see.....it definitely is being used politically (at least some version of said dogma is, not my version[;)])..............luci



luckydog1 -> RE: Christians pray for the Jews. (7/28/2007 2:07:28 PM)

Owner59, It is Termn8tor, who posts quotes to us form the "Protocols of the Elders of Zion", and I am not sure, but also think he graces us with some of the Turner Diaries periodically.

Interstingly(appalingly, disgustingly, what word am I looking for?), he insists it doesn't matter if the "Protocols" are real or not...



Shanghaid -> RE: Christians pray for the Jews. (7/28/2007 3:10:37 PM)

This is some scary shit.

I couldn't watch it all either. I switched off after they began talking about preemptive nuclear strikes and the audience cheered and waved flags.

The horror...



NorthernGent -> RE: Christians pray for the Jews. (7/28/2007 3:30:18 PM)

Church-goers and those subscribing to organised christianity will be over the moon with this sort of PR. They look positively normal and legitimate in comparison.







Owner59 -> RE: Christians pray for the Jews. (7/28/2007 3:40:03 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

But everything he posted was hateful lies and bullshit.That was all made up and a shameful deception,designed to do harm.  It didn`r represent any kind of truth,or any interpretation of truth,accept  the that of the lunatic fringe and the white supremacists.It wasn`t written by Jews or a part of anything they believe.Not even with the most generous interpretation(generous to the lunatic fringe),can explain this.Sorry,dude,putting my foot down ,here.That was pure hate,re-posted by either a dope,or a very scary person.If you don`t see the evil nature of this,no one`s going to be able to explain it to you.

I`m hoping Realone posted that to mock David Duke and his ilk.

Unfortunately unrealone has a history of quoting aprovingly from anti semitic sources in between the tax evasion lies, the 9/11 conspiracy bs and the various other bunk he peddles.

As to the specific claims the racist felon made quoted in the above post this is functionally the same outrageous lies made up in the 1200's by supporters of the Spanish Inquisition. It was lies of the most base and venal sort then and remain so today.


True, there is a history of this kind "social cancer" in Europe,and consequently,here in the states too.The "Passion" play,was written to marginalize Jews, and blame them for the death of Jesus.The Protocols of the Elders of Zion   was probably the 1st conspiracy theory in history.It used existing myths and mis-understandings, along with outrageous claims and theories,to create alarm in the minds of the gullible.

During the early 80s,when a pretty bad recession hit the mid-west,the white supremacists were leafleting neighborhoods and communities ,saying that rich jewish bankers were causing them to lose their farms.As hard times get harder,this kind of hate gets fed and watered.

So I guess I won`t be getting real1`s phone number.damm

Though not new to boards,I`m relitively new to this one.I`m still getting a feel for the personalities and quirks.

Thanks for the head`s up, Ken.

Peace

<note to self, realone is a loser>



slaveluci -> RE: Christians pray for the Jews. (7/28/2007 3:50:45 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent
Church-goers and those subscribing to organised christianity will be over the moon with this sort of PR. They look positively normal and legitimate in comparison

I know I am.  It's so nice to finally be considered "normal" and "legitimate" for exercising my religious/spiritual beliefs[8|].

This is one church-going Christian who isn't "over the moon with this sort of PR."  As I stated earlier, it's nothing short of sad and embarrassing and causes the uninformed and/or closeminded to assume all Christians feel this way.  Sad indeed............luci



NorthernGent -> RE: Christians pray for the Jews. (7/28/2007 4:02:24 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveluci

quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent
Church-goers and those subscribing to organised christianity will be over the moon with this sort of PR. They look positively normal and legitimate in comparison

I know I am.  It's so nice to finally be considered "normal" and "legitimate" for exercising my religious/spiritual beliefs[8|].

This is one church-going Christian who isn't "over the moon with this sort of PR."  As I stated earlier, it's nothing short of sad and embarrassing and causes the uninformed and/or closeminded to assume all Christians feel this way.  Sad indeed............luci


I never questioned or commented on your personal or spiritual beliefs.

My comment relates to organised christianity and the church (as per my original post). Ultimately, the past and present provides evidence that the church and organised christianity is irretrievably linked with power, absolutism and ultimately a one true answer that herds people behind a banner with the intention of killing for this one true answer.

A personal relationship with god is excluded from the above comments.



slaveluci -> RE: Christians pray for the Jews. (7/28/2007 4:23:29 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent
I never questioned or commented on your personal or spiritual beliefs

Not knowing what they are, of course you didn't.  However, you did say "churchgoers" and "subscribers to organized Christianity."  I happen to be both.  That would be why I thought you were referring, albeit indirectly, to me[;)].
quote:

My comment relates to organised christianity and the church (as per my original post). Ultimately, the past and present provides evidence that the church and organised christianity is irretrievably linked with power, absolutism and ultimately a one true answer that herds people behind a banner with the intention of killing for this one true answer

True.  You meant that but what you said was "churchgoers" and "subscribers..."  That's why I thought that.  I do agree with the preceding paragraph very much, though.
quote:

A personal relationship with god is excluded from the above comments.

Understood.  Thank you for clarifying........luci



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