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losttreasure -> RE: A Good Dom... (2/10/2007 12:57:21 PM)
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Thank you all for your comments. [:D]
I think it is beneficial to consider the point KnightofMists has been so wise to raise; we all bring to these discussions our history, our fears, and our hopes and dreams... in essence, who we are will influence how we interpret what we read. Communication can be difficult in the best of times among friends that we know well, but even more precarious when you must rely solely on the written word between virtual strangers.
If we approach these threads with the understanding that what we comprehend may not be what was intended, and that what we intend may not be what is perceived, it’s possible that we can grow from merely the exposure to different viewpoints and an exchange of ideas. But in the end, as many have said, take what you want and leave the rest.
That being said...
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ORIGINAL: NorthernGent
... A little bit of give for a lot of reward is common sense from where I'm standing.
A sage piece of advice for consideration... you reap what you sow.
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ORIGINAL: RavenMuse
Well looks like its the Brits that are breaking the Domly ranks here. If the OP is looked at as 'rules' then yes I can see where there could be some complaint, but for general tone and some of the tools Doms use to keep things running smoothly... no problems with it AT ALL.
And I applaud you...
Not for “agreeing” with the content of the OP but for having the confidence to openly consider it and not feel threatened... and for having the wisdom to recognize that the validity of the OP for you is solely dependent upon how you interpret it might or might not apply to you.
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ORIGINAL: SirDominic
losttreasure, here is one Master who thought your OP was a hoot! As you say, a perfect tongue in cheek response to the Good Wife thread. Both concepts are silly beyond words. Don't Dom's these days have a sense of humor anymore?
Thank you, SirDominic. [;)] Humor often depends upon context... and some humor is humorous because it contains enough truth that we recognize our own folly. Often though, the truths contained within will strike a discord for some. It doesn’t mean that they have no sense of humor, just that the contention they feel overrides any sense of frivolity others might see.
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ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael
One can spot sarcasm and humor when people don't get defensive when it is dissected.
Perhaps, Michael. But sometimes in explaining humor, it loses its effectiveness.
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ORIGINAL: KatyLied
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you can't have fractional people
If you spend any amount of time on the forums, you'll quickly understand that there are people with half a brain or less, from now on I will consider them fractional people.....because it makes me giggle.
I stand corrected. [:D]
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ORIGINAL: Bandit25
... Whether or not someone subscribes to what treasure has written (and she says that it was simply a companion piece to the good wife thread), anyone with an ounce of sense HAS to realize that for something to work long term, there has to be give and take on both sides.
You know... I could just kiss you. [;)]
I think that often people view the expression "give and take" as an automatically equal proposition. I submit that sometimes it is not. While those in a D/s relationship might be equal partners, the control might not be equal and even the "give and take" might not be equal. It's simply a matter of what degrees that you agree upon when entering that relationship.
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ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael
The OP wasn't about "give and take" which is why I objected to it.
It was "do it my way and I will submit" but all couched in touchy-feely BS. This is a more sophisticated version of "I need 3 days of aftercare because you spanked me" crap.
To borrow a phrase common with female dominants when dealing with overly whiny and demanding male submissives "I am NOT a fetish delivery device".
You are right, Michael... the OP wasn’t about “give and take” specifically. But it also wasn’t about “do it my way and I will submit” either. It actually was just what it was and what I said it was when I introduced it... my attempt to create a complimentary article to the “Good Wife” article.
My take on our exchange is that you had a knee-jerk reaction to how the OP made you feel. You presented your objections in the form of snippy one-liners. I responded by mimicking your style and used equally snippy one-liners in an attempt to cause you to reconsider your reactions. It simply is what it is... neither right or wrong, but an exchange of ideas and food for thought.
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ORIGINAL: Wildfleurs
See to me once someone has become my owner I've already taken the time to get to know them quite well and already know how they fit into my life and personality over time. Once they are my owner I think if I still have to watch over him and continue to hold him to my standards then I just didn't spend enough time getting to know him beforehand. From my perspective I'm not the one steering the boat... err relationship so I'm not the one who's standards should be guiding things.
Wildfleurs, I don’t disagree with what you’ve said. What I’d like for you to consider is that in accepting your owner, you’ve already measured his standards and found them to be in agreement with your own... that part where you say that you’ve “...already taken the time to get to know them quite well and already know how they fit into my life and personality over time.”
I suspect that if during that time where you got to know him, if his standards were not ones that you essentially agreed with and could not live with, you would not have agreed to become his. In the end, while he is the one steering the relationship, the standards by which he is guiding things are not only his standards, but also yours by default.
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ORIGINAL: CreativeDominant
Now, MY Take.............
Like these two, this dominant also took this as a "tongue-in-cheek" mirror piece to "The Good Wife"...a humorous, satirical piece. As with most satire, there are grains of truth in it, as aptly noted by Raven.
For myself, in any dynamic I would choose to be in, trying to follow the piece line by line, as if it were a "true" instruction manual wouldn't work. Then it would become, as SM noted, too much like the submissive running the show...but again, that's if I was to take the piece seriously line by line. However, the idea of cultivating respect and courtesy in my submissive by showing her courtesy and consideration makes perfect sense to me in MY world. Am I always courteous? No, sometimes a measure of terseness is called for. But given that I don't want to be terse all the time, then that leaves me with being courteous while still being dominant or just out and out domineering. I choose the former.
I could just kiss you, too, CD. [:D]
It tickles me to see the dominants who are able to look past the exterior to see the essential truths contained within. A dominant may not necessarily agree with how those truths are presented... and I agree that it is certainly up to him, by virtue of his position, to determine how those truths are applied in his relationship with his submissive. But by acknowledging the existence of those truths and giving careful consideration of how he wishes to approach them, I see evidence of a man who is both wise and prudently contemplative.
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ORIGINAL: KnightofMists
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ORIGINAL: losttreasure
A good dom always knows his place.
mmmmmmmmmm all a person needs to do is read this...
and know to continue reading this thread would be a waste of time.
*laughs* Of course. But I suspect that you are also aware that being open to consideration of other thoughts and ideas is sometimes not a waste of time.
But you know... I wonder how many read that line, “a good dom always knows his place” and really thought about what it means and of the different ways it can be interpreted.
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ORIGINAL: cjenny
I don't understand why so many are upset over a piece of satirical writing . To me it was just an amusing counterpoint to the 50s Good Wife, and like that one this one also contains some practical advice. *that sentence looks weird*
It seemed pretty clear to me as I read it, that the piece was not meant to be taken to heart line by line. Now I am left wondering at the cry of outrage by so many Doms.
Don’t fret over it, jenny... the impression you got is similar to my intent and there is nothing wrong with that. Satire can contain practical truths, and as evidenced by the comments, those truths are not hidden to some. How each wants to interpret the piece is perfectly fine. In the end, we take what we want and discard the rest.
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ORIGINAL: Wildfleurs
... If it was supposed to be humour that we were supposed to laugh at, why isn't it in the humour section? Putting it in the General BDSM Discussion section usually means its going to be....discussed.
Actually, I placed it in the BDSM section because that is where the “Good Wife” thread is that this one was intended to mirror. Though it might be humorous, I do think it should be thought provoking. Discussion is a good thing. [;)]
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ORIGINAL: MaryT
A couple sniggles:
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ORIGINAL: losttreasure
Smile and be gracious when she tries to engage you in conversation.
When I was working FT with two unmentionables, they got a hug and hello, but the rule was that they gave me a full 20 minutes of "no talking" when I first got home. It was just too hard to switch gears, and I was more able to deal with whatever they had going on after some downtime. I extend the same to my Dom, and if he needs more quiet time than that, I can certainly spare it.
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ORIGINAL: losttreasure
Set aside time for her to share her day with you and to discuss any issues that she may need to bring to your attention.
I'm not a fan of highly-structured enviroments and don't the understand need for it. Can't you just talk when you're talking anyway ... at dinner or whatever? He likes it loose and relaxed too and would hate the idea of a time set aside, separate from anything else we might discuss, for my issues. He would dislike being told how to behave anyway.
I’m very similar, MaryT. When my three were little and at home, there was an understanding that at certain times, I did not wish to be engaged in conversation... in particular, when I was driving. The point where my original comments from the “Good Dom” piece could be applied to me is that, where I carefully cultivated that understanding with my children, if they sought to have a conversation at a time when I was not open to it, I did not scowl at them and belittle them for their attempt. A smile and a “not right now, sweetheart” with a gentle touch went a long way toward protecting their feelings and engendering respect for my desires.
I’m not a fan of high-structure, either, but do you consider the example you gave with your children to be highly-structured? I wouldn’t, but it would seem to fit with the idea that there is an understanding of when it is appropriate to talk and when it isn’t. Whether relaxed or structured, I would consider it up to the dominant to decide on timing... but I do appreciate knowing that I’m given the opportunity to express myself.
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