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How long is aftercare required? - 3/5/2007 8:53:55 AM   
bellanotte


Posts: 125
Joined: 4/27/2006
From: Tornado Alley, USA
Status: offline 		I have recently begun doing more intense scenes such as needleplay, singletail, etc; and they have pushed me into uncharted waters of subspace. While this is wonderful, it also seems to be changing what happens when I "drop."

I have been able to handle it relatively well before: rest, fluids, chocolate, talking with the Dom, just taking care of myself. But during these scenes I find I am still reacting strongly even a couple of days later.

The Dominant I played with suggested I post this as part of my learning process, as I had (after becoming a lil weepy and needing some touch), said I was embarrassed that "it was still going on." He told me that aftercare is sometimes needed, in his experience, even up to three days later, depending on sub & scene.

What are your thoughts on how long aftercare is needed? How long is it needed? why is it needed for however long? And what form does it take?

Thank you in advance.
Profile   Post #: 1
RE: How long is aftercare required? - 3/5/2007 9:01:08 AM   
WhiplashSmile


Posts: 1472
Joined: 6/8/2004
Status: offline 		As long as it takes.  Both physically and mentally.  Be it a couple days, a week.. however long it takes.  It varies from person to person.  Communication is important for the mental aspects of it..  If you have fully healed physically, and mentally feel rested.. and still are down and out... you might need to seek out medical attention with testing.   You may have an internal infection going on or something else may be wrong..  All depends upon the activities going on.  Just because you look phyiscally healed on the outside does not mean you are on the inside..

(in reply to bellanotte)
Profile   Post #: 2
RE: How long is aftercare required? - 3/5/2007 9:01:15 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline 		Your body needs to adjust first and foremost, that can take a few days.

And then the emotional processing can take a lot longer.

Over time, it won't be so bad because you'll be able to recognize the symptoms, take care of them and process them quicker.  It still might occasionally surprise you, but the good news is that no one has ever died from subdrop.

For me it really depends on the scene.  Most times I don't need more than an hour or so to really come back to normal state.  It might take a few days to process out what happened, but it doesn't affect my mood or abilities. 

For me the most important thing is to learn from the experience, make sure you communicate your needs to whoever you play with BEFORE the scene starts, and remember that tops need aftercare too!!

http://www.collarchat.com/m_772983/mpage_1/key_aftercare/tm.htm#773055
how much is "too much" aftercare?

http://www.collarchat.com/m_725006/mpage_1/key_aftercare/tm.htm#725011
aftercare, the top side?

http://www.collarchat.com/m_598726/mpage_1/key_aftercare/tm.htm#599129
aftercare in ltr and casual play

http://www.collarchat.com/m_495421/mpage_1/key_aftercare/tm.htm#496775
aftercare- when to offer it and how much?

http://www.collarchat.com/m_491455/mpage_1/key_aftercare/tm.htm#492065
aftercare


http://www.collarchat.com/m_743958/mpage_1/key_sub%252Cdrop/tm.htm#744221
sub drop please help

http://www.collarchat.com/m_649399/mpage_1/key_subdrop/tm.htm#649697
Coming down from the glorious heights

http://www.collarchat.com/m_522013/mpage_1/key_sub%252Cdrop/tm.htm#522021
sub drop, definitions, causes, cures, and prevention

http://www.collarchat.com/m_512884/mpage_1/key_sub%252Cdrop/tm.htm#513003
Your insight is needed please

http://www.collarchat.com/m_487853/mpage_1/key_sub%252Cdrop/tm.htm#488083
sub drop (2)

http://www.collarchat.com/m_460639/mpage_1/key_subdrop/tm.htm#460834
regaining balance after deep subspace

http://www.collarchat.com/m_202168/mpage_1/key_sub%252Cdrop/tm.htm#202459
sub-drop what is it?

http://www.collarchat.com/m_345419/mpage_1/key_sub%252Cdrop/tm.htm#345462
highs and lows

http://www.collarchat.com/m_398653/mpage_1/key_sub%252Cdrop/tm.htm#399164
subdrop or what?

Is it drop or am I kidding myself?

Depression after a scene

Sub Drop

Nervous sub seeks reassurance

sleeping...


_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to bellanotte)
Profile   Post #: 3
RE: How long is aftercare required? - 3/5/2007 9:05:26 AM   
WhiplashSmile


Posts: 1472
Joined: 6/8/2004
Status: offline 		I swear you have the library at your finger tips, LA!

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RE: How long is aftercare required? - 3/5/2007 9:36:53 AM   
SimplyMichael


Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline 		I brought a munch to a halt the other day when I made the comment that anyone who needs five days of aftercare after an average scene isn't ready to really do BDSM.

I am curious what people like LA think about that.

(in reply to WhiplashSmile)
Profile   Post #: 5
RE: How long is aftercare required? - 3/5/2007 9:40:04 AM   
Mercnbeth


Posts: 11766
Status: offline
quote:

What are your thoughts on how long aftercare is needed? How long is it needed? why is it needed for however long? And what form does it take?


bellanotte,
You may be at a "crossroad". At some point, "going deeper" requires a deeper relationship.

It is not necessarily the same activity for all. To you it may be a more intensity needle session to someone else it may be the first time a spanking generates tears. The desire to "get there" may be a driving force, but if you, or if your relationship, isn't set up to support you at the destination it can end up being a very scary place.

What happens to each person is an individual reaction. Endorphins contribute to what happens immediately. Chocolate, water, a hug while being placed in a warm blanket; serve chemically and environmentally for immediate comfort. Long term, when a "normal" chemical balance returns to your body and the endorphins are gone; the memory of the intensity of the scene can return. Being alone when it happens isn't desirable.

Ideally, everyone would have a situation where they live with, or are at least nearby their partner for support. I found that "subspace" can and does occur long after the scene. There maybe even a inverse proportionality relativity to the distance from the partner and time between getting together. Loneliness is sad state in and of itself. Loneliness combined with a passion to again feel the intensity of session can take you very "deep".

Of course there is a solution of only participating in these scenes when the duration of time spent with the Dom can be extended, but how practical is that? At minimum you have the benefit of knowing they occur. Plan for it, schedule activities that will put you in the company of people who you enjoy being around or, better yet, participate and understand in what you are going through.

The crossroad decision is that now that you know what lies beyond the sensation do you only go through it when time spent with the person can be extended, or do you live with the consequence alone better equipped with the expectation?

(in reply to bellanotte)
Profile   Post #: 6
RE: How long is aftercare required? - 3/5/2007 9:45:05 AM   
scottjk


Posts: 335
Joined: 4/18/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: WhiplashSmile

I swear you have the library at your finger tips, LA!


I nominante LA for FAQ management!

<dives for the bunker>

_____________________________

Thou art fertile ground and I will plant a garden in thee.

(in reply to WhiplashSmile)
Profile   Post #: 7
RE: How long is aftercare required? - 3/5/2007 9:53:31 AM   
Phoenix2raven


Posts: 347
Joined: 10/14/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bellanotte

I have recently begun doing more intense scenes such as needleplay, singletail, etc; and they have pushed me into uncharted waters of subspace. While this is wonderful, it also seems to be changing what happens when I "drop."

I have been able to handle it relatively well before: rest, fluids, chocolate, talking with the Dom, just taking care of myself. But during these scenes I find I am still reacting strongly even a couple of days later.

The Dominant I played with suggested I post this as part of my learning process, as I had (after becoming a lil weepy and needing some touch), said I was embarrassed that "it was still going on." He told me that aftercare is sometimes needed, in his experience, even up to three days later, depending on sub & scene.

What are your thoughts on how long aftercare is needed? How long is it needed? why is it needed for however long? And what form does it take?

Thank you in advance.
My experience with needle play is that the rapid drop of endorphins is much more than a average sceen. Any time I do any kind of edge play it always requires more aftercare. If the submissive is still having trouble after 3 days there is something wrong with the aftercare.

(in reply to bellanotte)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: How long is aftercare required? - 3/5/2007 9:53:46 AM   
Wildfleurs


Posts: 1650
Joined: 9/24/2004
From: Connecticut
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

I brought a munch to a halt the other day when I made the comment that anyone who needs five days of aftercare after an average scene isn't ready to really do BDSM.

I am curious what people like LA think about that.


I'm not LA, but I agree with that.

C~


_____________________________

"Just because you've always done it that way doesn't mean it's not incredibly stupid." -despair.com

~~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
The heart of it all - http://www.wildfleurs.com
~~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~

(in reply to SimplyMichael)
Profile   Post #: 9
RE: How long is aftercare required? - 3/5/2007 10:08:34 AM   
Dnomyar


Posts: 7933
Joined: 6/27/2005
Status: offline 		This is inspiring me to start a different thread.

(in reply to Wildfleurs)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: How long is aftercare required? - 3/5/2007 10:14:48 AM   
bellanotte


Posts: 125
Joined: 4/27/2006
From: Tornado Alley, USA
Status: offline 		Thank you, LA, for the links. You are one of CM's treasures!

WhiplashSmile: Right now, I am fine physically except for the cold (see below); emotionally, I am lucky in that the Dominant (my Protector) is extremely supportive. He encourages me in every way. (I actually would not have thought to write this topic on the board, but he suggested I do it to get varying views and further my knowledge as to what people think on aftercare.)

I had not thought of the possibility of the sub getting an infection before, but I suppose it does happen. Proper safety measures (i.e., cleanliness) might or might not prevent that. I think it's like the condom being 99% effective; that also means it guarantees pregnancy 1% of the time.

This isn't the 5th day after the scene or even the 3rd *quirky smile*, but I thank you, SimplyMichael, for your response. I think it's necessary to see all points of view on a topic - this is why my Protector suggested I post.

I have a severe cold, as does my Protector; we were scheduled to go to a dungeon party Saturday night (it is Monday noon right now), but did not for two reasons: 1) not wanting to spread the cold; and 2) the "energy" with the same people the night before just didn't feel right. So we played privately instead.

I think Mercnbeth (I think Merc was writing?) was right when guessing that I might be at a crossroads. I am in two senses, I think. The first sense being that I am transitioning from playing with "lighter" things to things many people classify as more "hardcore," such as needleplay, knifeplay, various whips, etc. That in itself is a big transition on one road for me.

The other road, the one that would truly make a crossroads, is the emotions involved. When I play in this situation (with this Dominant, who btw is local), I know I am safe and am able to let go in a manner I have not been able to before, as I was in an extremely abusive D/s relationship and had been rather "gunshy" for awhile. It's odd, but I think the fact that I am finally feeling safe enough to let somebody know my inner self a bit is what may be getting me to feel the "subdrop" more, that I'm more self-aware as I feel I am learning in a structure, safe atmosphere.

What throws a kick into this whole "subdrop" thing is that I also have fibromyalgia. This is a chronic pain disease that keeps me in "bad pain" pretty much 24/7/365, though it varies from day to day, etc. I've actually found that scening helps me with the pain in a sense, in that during and for a considerable time after a scene, I don't feel the bad pain in the same way.

I believe this is probably because of the endorphins, but I am not sure if there is another aspect to it.


(in reply to Wildfleurs)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: How long is aftercare required? - 3/5/2007 10:22:37 AM   
Shylahgirl


Posts: 167
Joined: 8/28/2006
Status: offline 		Aftercare is  required for as long as it take to make the bottem whole again. Factors to conciter are, how intence you played (was blood drawn, can the bottem stand up, are they feeling sick), weather or not the play brought out any past emotional trama, or how much clean up of the bottem is required.

How long it lasts verys from person to peoson and what they need verys as well... I like to be held and cuddeled, a friend of mine likes to go off in the corner alone and bring her self down no matter how hard she's played.

There should be no set limit to how long aftercare should last... with inreasion of course (4 hours of aftercare isn't required for wax play... or soft play like that.)

Also you need to take into account that aftercare is as much for the top as the bottem, a good top always wants to make sure their bottem is ok and will want to play again ;)

Shylah


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Profile   Post #: 12
RE: How long is aftercare required? - 3/5/2007 11:09:46 AM   
SimplyMichael


Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline 		To clarify a point.  I would do what I felt was beyond the call of duty ONCE to take of someone even if I thought they were being a drama queen and using the "need" for aftercare to get attention long after the real need had passed.

I would however reevaluate my interest in playing with them if I felt that the amount of aftercare was due to unresolved issues more than our play.

(in reply to Shylahgirl)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: How long is aftercare required? - 3/5/2007 11:12:46 AM   
bellanotte


Posts: 125
Joined: 4/27/2006
From: Tornado Alley, USA
Status: offline 		I'm not sure I understand your response. Where did drama and unresolved issues come into the picture?

(in reply to SimplyMichael)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: How long is aftercare required? - 3/5/2007 11:14:47 AM   
FukinTroll


Posts: 6277
Joined: 2/6/2007
From: Under a bridge
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: WhiplashSmile

As long as it takes.  Both physically and mentally.  Be it a couple days, a week.. however long it takes.  It varies from person to person.  Communication is important for the mental aspects of it..  If you have fully healed physically, and mentally feel rested.. and still are down and out... you might need to seek out medical attention with testing.   You may have an internal infection going on or something else may be wrong..  All depends upon the activities going on.  Just because you look phyiscally healed on the outside does not mean you are on the inside..


Yep! What he says.

Dude... how did you steal my thunder from azz?

_____________________________

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Greedy Groupie!

The Mods have me on speed Spank!! Gotta luv'em.

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RE: How long is aftercare required? - 3/5/2007 12:57:27 PM   
ShiftedJewel


Posts: 2492
Joined: 12/2/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bellanotte

I'm not sure I understand your response. Where did drama and unresolved issues come into the picture?


I think the point he is trying to make is that there are some people that will "milk" it for all it's worth. A week later they may still be claiming to be suffering from sub drop just to get additional attention. And there are also some that have unresolved issues that really need to be dealt with prior to "scening". Emotional difficulties that come to the surface (in a bad way) when they hit subspace. Am I close Michael?
 
Jewel

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Don't ask, trust me, you won't like the answer... no one ever does.

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Profile   Post #: 16
RE: How long is aftercare required? - 3/5/2007 1:23:14 PM   
pagansub77


Posts: 137
Joined: 3/5/2005
Status: offline 		It's a very personal thing, to my way of thinking. I've played lightly with someone I was emotionally connected to, and it's taken a couple of days to feel 'normal' again.
I've played hard with someone that I trust and respect but don't have the emotional connection to, I was up and cleaning up the play area for the next user in 5 minutes and grinning from ear to ear for days.

So many things can affect 'sub-drop', intensity, time of month, atmosphere etc....

I think the most important thing is to not be afraid to ask for what you need.

YMMV



_____________________________

ps77
In the end everything will be okay.
If everything is not okay, then it's not the end.
Madness takes its toll...exact change only

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Profile   Post #: 17
RE: How long is aftercare required? - 3/5/2007 2:06:40 PM   
spankmepink11


Posts: 1310
Joined: 9/28/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Wildfleurs

quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

I brought a munch to a halt the other day when I made the comment that anyone who needs five days of aftercare after an average scene isn't ready to really do BDSM.

I am curious what people like LA think about that.


I'm not LA, but I agree with that.

C~




Ditto

(in reply to Wildfleurs)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: How long is aftercare required? - 3/5/2007 2:34:57 PM   
LadyPact


Posts: 32566
Status: offline 		Kudos to your Dominant for having you post the question here.  Not only are you learning, but others of us are as well.  Much appreciation for the topic and those who have participated in the discussion.
 
Aftercare last as long as it is needed.  Period.  I take the Protector part of My role very seriously.  What was stated about aftercare being needed by the Dom/me as well as the sub is very true for a lot of us.  In My case..... I take them there, which means I want to be part of the process in bringing them back.  It is a very intimate, nurturing time for Me, that strengthens the bond.  Reassurring the sub they were in the palm of My hand all along speaks volumes.

(in reply to spankmepink11)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: How long is aftercare required? - 3/5/2007 2:48:32 PM   
kyraofMists


Posts: 3292
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline 		Personally, I do not need much aftercare because of play.  Sit me down, make sure any bleeding has stopped, cover me up, water and a little something sweet and I am happy as can be.  Of course, about 15 - 30 minutes later, I get horny and all I want is to have sex.  The more intense the scene the more I crave sex.

The only times that I have wanted more aftercare than that is when I have been in a bad head space prior to play, during play or after play.  I do not attribute the negative headspace to the play itself; it is mostly a product of what is going on in my life outside of play.

The emotions are what kicks me in the ass and if I am managing my emotions effectively then aftercare is not needed and not really wanted.

Knight's kyra

_____________________________

"Passion... it lies in all of us. Sleeping, waiting, and though unbidden, it will stir, open its jaws, and howl. It speaks to us, guides us... passion rules us all. And we obey..." ~Angelus

(in reply to bellanotte)
Profile   Post #: 20
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