RE: Pro-stitute? (no flames please)

RE: Pro-stitute? (no flames please) (Full Version)

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LightHeartedMaam -> RE: Pro-stitute? (no flames please) (5/13/2007 12:03:44 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Alumbrado Hmmmm..... 6 pages of 'your kink isn't my kink, so it must be wrong' bigotry, and several sets of 'what double standard?' blinders.... Just another day at Collarme [:D] I've noticed the "bigotry" card gets played when a point to the contrary is proved beyond dispute. A topic was presented and discussed is all that I can see. Opinions are opinions and all the discussion in the world isn't going to dissuade anyone from doing what they enjoy.

MstrssScarlet -> RE: Pro-stitute? (no flames please) (5/13/2007 12:16:12 PM)
Quote from curiousexplorer in answer to one of my comments: "If being a dominant isn't in you, all the acting in the world isn't going to help." I see you have a very low opinion of actors. Nothing could be farther from the truth. At one time I worked as a phone sex operator. I WAS an actress in this case. (an underpaid one at that) Because I was a domme in real life, phone requests for domination were often funnelled to me. I quickly found it difficult and unrewarding. Kudos to those on this site that can manage it. Now I do it r/t. HUGE difference. My sessions flow because I don't have to act like a dominant, I simply do what comes natural. Yes, I do cater somewhat to my clients because not all of them want the same thing, but that's why my interests are listed. If I'm interviewing someone who obviously isn't going to give me enough reign to work with, I simply tell them that I'm not the right pro domme for them. Part of the problem I see over and over again is that people in our own lifestyle categorize us as sex workers. Does that mean that everyone on this site 'soliciting' for a BDSM relationship is only looking for sex? Most (if not all) will tell you absolutely not. I do not engage in any sexual activities with my clients, so what suddenly makes me different? I think that perhaps some of the hard feelings that people have against pro dommes is the fact that we're taking something that (to them) is a lifestyle and we're making a profit from it instead of a long term relationship. Well, my clients don't want a long term relationship. They want to be tied up and spanked or (insert your fetish here) and then return to their vanilla lives. It's a very specialized service for payment, nothing more or less. And if you've read some of my previous posts, the payment is not necessarily monetary. Mistress Scarlet

Alumbrado -> RE: Pro-stitute? (no flames please) (5/13/2007 12:25:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LightHeartedMaam I've noticed the "bigotry" card gets played when a point to the contrary is proved beyond dispute. A topic was presented and discussed is all that I can see. Opinions are opinions and all the discussion in the world isn't going to dissuade anyone from doing what they enjoy. Bigotry has a definition, just like prostitution... it means an utter intolerance for differing viewpoints. Or in this case, differing kinks. If the shoe fits....

LightHeartedMaam -> RE: Pro-stitute? (no flames please) (5/13/2007 12:40:00 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Alumbrado quote: ORIGINAL: LightHeartedMaam I've noticed the "bigotry" card gets played when a point to the contrary is proved beyond dispute. A topic was presented and discussed is all that I can see. Opinions are opinions and all the discussion in the world isn't going to dissuade anyone from doing what they enjoy. Bigotry has a definition, just like prostitution... it means an utter intolerance for differing viewpoints. Or in this case, differing kinks. If the shoe fits.... I don't wear shoes :) (nor lables nor live iu a pigeon hole.) LOL. No intolerance here that I see, only a discussion. Perhaps a lack of a cheering section speaks louder than anything.

brandx29 -> RE: Pro-stitute? (no flames please) (5/13/2007 12:47:20 PM)
tthis is an interesting topic. To be honest i have thought of going to see a professional domme. I still think of doing so. That being said do i think of it as i would if i was paying for an escort Yes. Even the rates on such activities are similar. Would i think of it like i was seeing a prostitute. No, even the rates are different here. That being said an escort you do pay to have sex with, only it isnt rushed. its more of the whole experiance there instead of a rushed orgasm then your gone. You pay anywhere from 30-80$ for a blowjob or sex for one two or threee women. You pay 200$ an hour for an escort. You pay 150-250 an hour for a dominatrix. To be totaly honest though my biggest problem is i dont feel an hourly rate should be nessisary. If you are looking to seperate the men who only want sex versus the men who want to submit to you then charge a one time fee, to be honest with the number of men going to escorts and prostitutes thease days charging a fee isnt going to really segregate anytthing....

LuckyAlbatross -> RE: Pro-stitute? (no flames please) (5/13/2007 2:43:33 PM)
Sorry to have left good questions hanging- I've been busy with out of town guests this weekend. :) My situation was entailing that the sub comply in order for them to meet. There are many male doms out there who REQUIRE the sub to dress a particular way when they meet. If the sub is not willing to do so, the meet does not occur. I don't see this as any different than a dom requiring a sub to provide a monetary or physical object. Both are saying "In order for us to meet, I need you to give me something."

brandx29 -> RE: Pro-stitute? (no flames please) (5/13/2007 2:52:41 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross Sorry to have left good questions hanging- I've been busy with out of town guests this weekend. :) My situation was entailing that the sub comply in order for them to meet. There are many male doms out there who REQUIRE the sub to dress a particular way when they meet. If the sub is not willing to do so, the meet does not occur. I don't see this as any different than a dom requiring a sub to provide a monetary or physical object. Both are saying "In order for us to meet, I need you to give me something." maybe so but would a dom require that per hour.... a per hour amount says to me that i am employing that person if thats the case what is their job title?

ICGsteve -> RE: Pro-stitute? (no flames please) (5/13/2007 3:05:33 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross I don't see this as any different than a dom requiring a sub to provide a monetary or physical object. Both are saying "In order for us to meet, I need you to give me something." In one case what the Dom primarily wants is financial profit, in another it is sexual experience, in another it is to be part of a relationship. What is asked for betrays motive and hence the emotional investment the Dom has in the experience. "I am interested in you so long as you show up hot" is so very far from "I am interested in you so long as I get my money".

LuckyAlbatross -> RE: Pro-stitute? (no flames please) (5/13/2007 3:09:56 PM)
Are you guys talking about a pro dom who specifically is paid for a length of time but since ridiculous laws are in place cannot simply ask for money as any other normal adult profession but must use the ridiculous term "tribute"? Or are you guys talking about a dom who simply requests some form of tribute when meeting but is seeking a long term committed intimate relationship? I'm talking about the latter.

ICGsteve -> RE: Pro-stitute? (no flames please) (5/13/2007 3:31:35 PM)
Some are saying that the distinction matters, others not. I say not. Since we can not get into anothers head and know their motivation I say if a Dom uses their Domination skills to get people to give them cash then they are whores, it does not matter if it is $10 or $10 K. Demanding any money at all shows that they are motivated by a desire for financial reward, if this is not their motivation then they should not act like it is. For some people whoring is their hobby job, they make their living some other way, but they are still whores.

brandx29 -> RE: Pro-stitute? (no flames please) (5/13/2007 3:36:36 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross Are you guys talking about a pro dom who specifically is paid for a length of time but since ridiculous laws are in place cannot simply ask for money as any other normal adult profession but must use the ridiculous term "tribute"? Or are you guys talking about a dom who simply requests some form of tribute when meeting but is seeking a long term committed intimate relationship? I'm talking about the latter. Either... I could easily understand a one time tribute or like a tribute a session that is resonable to make sure that there is genuine intentions, but some others, and im talkin about dommes here, want an absorbinant abount, as an example 250 an hour... that gets steep ya know

MadRabbit -> RE: Pro-stitute? (no flames please) (5/13/2007 3:38:55 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Eldritchdancer Good day, forum readers. I had a conversation with a few friends this week and something they asked me was profound enough for me to ponder it. And, as I like to think with other people, I figured I'd post this to the Forums. I'm not posting this to the Ask a Mistress/Master area because it affects us as a whole, by perception. I ask that people not send flames, as this is a legitimate query from some folks who are relatively new and seeking answers. The question I was asked is: "If a Dominant, be they male or female, demands tribute to meet with them at all... how are they different from a prostitute/giggilo? In both cases you are giving something of value just for the pleasure of their company." That one threw me for a loop. I'd never thought of it that way, really, as I don't ask for tribute. I LOVE meeting new people. So, I thought I'd put it out to the forums to discuss, rationally, so I can show the thread to the questioners. Master Darkmoon P.S. As a side note, this is my 25th posting, so I lost my Vanilla Cone. lol (well, I thought I'd lose my cone) To be frankly honest, I dont care about the difference. In fact, I dont care at all when it comes to the two opposing sides in these threads. This is just another example of people hanging their high hats and shoving their own moral values down other people's throats. Because...if it didnt come down to moral values and judgements based on them, nobody would care about the difference. Just like nobody really cares about the difference between a "garbage man" and a "waste disposal techinician" But when it comes to the difference between a "Dominatrix" and a "prostitute", its a huge flaming deal worthy of a thread one gazillion pages long and everyone in the local communities curling up their noses and stating an opinion. If I want to pay a girl $100 to give me a blowjob and we both agree, then please explain to me how this has any effect on anyone? If a male submissive wants to pay a Mistress a cash tribute for their company or a scene or session, it has no effect on me and more power to them both? The differences in what I choose to "label" them or they "label" themselves has as much merit as the differences in a "slave" and a "submissive" I find it highly ironic that probably a good number of people here who are "labeling" pro dommes as "whores" and "prostitutes" will take a very politically correct stance against "labeling" people as "bottoms" or "submissives" when that recurring BDSM debate #133 pops up. Further more, the stances that pro dommes are preying on male submissives with their demand for money or tribute has as much merit as the argument that sex shouldnt be part of the lifestyle because it "hurts" the female submissive's fealings. Taking that kind of stance instantly turns someone from being a "consenting adult" into a child who isnt responsible for their own decisions.

chiaThePet -> RE: Pro-stitute? (no flames please) (5/13/2007 3:51:33 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MadRabbit quote: ORIGINAL: Eldritchdancer Good day, forum readers. I had a conversation with a few friends this week and something they asked me was profound enough for me to ponder it. And, as I like to think with other people, I figured I'd post this to the Forums. I'm not posting this to the Ask a Mistress/Master area because it affects us as a whole, by perception. I ask that people not send flames, as this is a legitimate query from some folks who are relatively new and seeking answers. The question I was asked is: "If a Dominant, be they male or female, demands tribute to meet with them at all... how are they different from a prostitute/giggilo? In both cases you are giving something of value just for the pleasure of their company." That one threw me for a loop. I'd never thought of it that way, really, as I don't ask for tribute. I LOVE meeting new people. So, I thought I'd put it out to the forums to discuss, rationally, so I can show the thread to the questioners. Master Darkmoon P.S. As a side note, this is my 25th posting, so I lost my Vanilla Cone. lol (well, I thought I'd lose my cone) To be frankly honest, I dont care about the difference. In fact, I dont care at all when it comes to the two opposing sides in these threads. This is just another example of people hanging their high hats and shoving their own moral values down other people's throats. Because...if it didnt come down to moral values and judgements based on them, nobody would care about the difference. Just like nobody really cares about the difference between a "garbage man" and a "waste disposal techinician" But when it comes to the difference between a "Dominatrix" and a "prostitute", its a huge flaming deal worthy of a thread one gazillion pages long and everyone in the local communities curling up their noses and stating an opinion. If I want to pay a girl $100 to give me a blowjob and we both agree, then please explain to me how this has any effect on anyone? If a male submissive wants to pay a Mistress a cash tribute for their company or a scene or session, it has no effect on me and more power to them both? The differences in what I choose to "label" them or they "label" themselves has as much merit as the differences in a "slave" and a "submissive" I find it highly ironic that probably a good number of people here who are "labeling" pro dommes as "whores" and "prostitutes" will take a very politically correct stance against "labeling" people as "bottoms" or "submissives" when that recurring BDSM debate #133 pops up. Further more, the stances that pro dommes are preying on male submissives with their demand for money or tribute has as much merit as the argument that sex shouldnt be part of the lifestyle because it "hurts" the female submissive's fealings. Taking that kind of stance instantly turns someone from being a "consenting adult" into a child who isnt responsible for their own decisions. "I don't care"-3 words This "care" package-Over 300 words You care, but that's a good thing. With Love and Respect, chia* (the pet)

TheDiva -> RE: Pro-stitute? (no flames please) (5/13/2007 3:53:10 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LightHeartedMaam quote: ORIGINAL: TexasMaam I guess this means that our Physicians, who charge an office fee just for seeing them, Doctors, Surgeons, Psychiatrists, Psychologists, ENT's, ALL are prostitutes, too. We already knew Lawyers were. Oh, that makes Accountants, Veterinarians, Ski Intructors, Art Teachers, Piano Teachers, and anyone else who charges a fee for teaching their expertise a slut and a prostitute as well. What amount of college/university tuition does a Prodomme have to pay for her education to be a Prodomme? Or prostitute a prostitute? I see no comparison. Actually, what I feel is probably more offensive than anything is a fee to be paid from another human just wanting attention :( Kinda sad actually IMO. But then I'm a humanist. (hu·man·ist [hyoo-muh-nist or, often, yoo-] –noun ) 1. a person having a strong interest in or concern for human welfare, values and dignity. Well, if there´s a market for it and a service is being provided, I don´t see the big deal. If someone´s making barbeque, I don´t care whether or not they went to school for it. I´ll go to the guy on the corner with the huge grill on wheels and pay $10 rather than wait til I can get some for free. Likewise, it doesn´t matter if someone went to school to do hair. If I know they do a great job, I´ll pay them instead of trying to do it myself. Some might think there´s no particular talent or skill set involved. That may be true in some cases. But I guess it´s actually worth what the market will bear. If you think $5 is too much for a cup of coffee, you don´t go to Starbucks. You don´t expect them to change their prices or their way of thinking. Or maybe you call them by some derogatory name. I don´t think namecalling bothers either Starbucks or a ProDomme too much, as long as money´s being made. I think going to a Pro makes sense if you have a particular fetish that you want satisfied in a certain matter. Or if you want a certain ambience. Or if you want to be able to shop around for a Domme with the looks and physique that you find attractive. Or if you don´t have the time to invest in developing a D/s relationship. Sure, it doesn´t have the aura of 'pureness´ because it involves a monetary transaction, but if you´re not that type of purist, you don´t care. And if you are, then you´re not likely to be a paying customer. As long as the Dominant is being upfront about the services offered and what is expected in return, it´s between them and the client IMO. Others may have their own opinion regarding how appropriate or tasteful or ´real´ it is, but disliking something doesn´t make it go away.

MadRabbit -> RE: Pro-stitute? (no flames please) (5/13/2007 3:55:22 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: chiaThePet quote: ORIGINAL: MadRabbit quote: ORIGINAL: Eldritchdancer Good day, forum readers. I had a conversation with a few friends this week and something they asked me was profound enough for me to ponder it. And, as I like to think with other people, I figured I'd post this to the Forums. I'm not posting this to the Ask a Mistress/Master area because it affects us as a whole, by perception. I ask that people not send flames, as this is a legitimate query from some folks who are relatively new and seeking answers. The question I was asked is: "If a Dominant, be they male or female, demands tribute to meet with them at all... how are they different from a prostitute/giggilo? In both cases you are giving something of value just for the pleasure of their company." That one threw me for a loop. I'd never thought of it that way, really, as I don't ask for tribute. I LOVE meeting new people. So, I thought I'd put it out to the forums to discuss, rationally, so I can show the thread to the questioners. Master Darkmoon P.S. As a side note, this is my 25th posting, so I lost my Vanilla Cone. lol (well, I thought I'd lose my cone) To be frankly honest, I dont care about the difference. In fact, I dont care at all when it comes to the two opposing sides in these threads. This is just another example of people hanging their high hats and shoving their own moral values down other people's throats. Because...if it didnt come down to moral values and judgements based on them, nobody would care about the difference. Just like nobody really cares about the difference between a "garbage man" and a "waste disposal techinician" But when it comes to the difference between a "Dominatrix" and a "prostitute", its a huge flaming deal worthy of a thread one gazillion pages long and everyone in the local communities curling up their noses and stating an opinion. If I want to pay a girl $100 to give me a blowjob and we both agree, then please explain to me how this has any effect on anyone? If a male submissive wants to pay a Mistress a cash tribute for their company or a scene or session, it has no effect on me and more power to them both? The differences in what I choose to "label" them or they "label" themselves has as much merit as the differences in a "slave" and a "submissive" I find it highly ironic that probably a good number of people here who are "labeling" pro dommes as "whores" and "prostitutes" will take a very politically correct stance against "labeling" people as "bottoms" or "submissives" when that recurring BDSM debate #133 pops up. Further more, the stances that pro dommes are preying on male submissives with their demand for money or tribute has as much merit as the argument that sex shouldnt be part of the lifestyle because it "hurts" the female submissive's fealings. Taking that kind of stance instantly turns someone from being a "consenting adult" into a child who isnt responsible for their own decisions. "I don't care"-3 words This "care" package-Over 300 words You care, but that's a good thing. With Love and Respect, chia* (the pet) Clarification : I dont care about the actual argument. Just the circumstances around the argument [:D]

ICGsteve -> RE: Pro-stitute? (no flames please) (5/13/2007 4:06:41 PM)
When I read the thread I don't see most people taking this as a question of ethics, but as a question of honesty about the transaction. Terms such a whore have negative value connotations in the general society but they do not apply in this community. Take the label "slave" for another example, or hell, even "submissive".

MadRabbit -> RE: Pro-stitute? (no flames please) (5/13/2007 4:12:43 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ICGsteve When I read the thread I don't see most people taking this as a question of ethics, but as a question of honesty about the transaction. Terms such a whore have negative value connotations in the general society but they do not apply in this community. Take the label "slave" for another example, or hell, even "submissive". I see the same thing too, but I also see the whole question of honesty behind the label itself having to do with the question of ethics. Hence...if there wasnt the question of ethics, the question of honesty regarding the label would be rather irrelevant. If I were to start a thread that went "What is the difference between a "garbage man" and a "waste disposal techinician" if they both pick up trash?", I can safely say the majority of the replies would be along the lines of "Who cares?" As far as the examples, there is a big difference between someone saying "I am a slave because I do X, Y, and Z" and someone else saying "You are a slave and not a submissive because you do X, Y, and Z".

LadyIce -> RE: Pro-stitute? (no flames please) (5/13/2007 4:16:00 PM)
I agree with the MadRabbit on this one. If two people agree to have fun together, session or whatever, it is their business. If the guy wants to pay $200 to spend 2 hours with a Dominatrix, that is his choice. Why are so many worried and concerned about what consenting adults want to do with their money and their life?

ICGsteve -> RE: Pro-stitute? (no flames please) (5/13/2007 4:20:18 PM)
Our brain works primarily by sorting into categories, breaking down big bits into small bits so that we can make sense of our experience. You are objecting to the process of awareness when you object to label making. Labeling, defining, and categorizing are critical to getting everything we can out of the BDSM experience. I am all with you if you object to small minded ethical judgments of a particular label, but if you object to labels in general then you are throwing the baby out.

MadRabbit -> RE: Pro-stitute? (no flames please) (5/13/2007 4:27:40 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ICGsteve Our brain works primarily by sorting into categories, breaking down big bits into small bits so that we can make sense of our experience. You are objecting to the process of awareness when you object to label making. Labeling, defining, and categorizing are critical to getting everything we can out of the BDSM experience. I am all with you if you object to small minded ethical judgments of a particular label, but if you object to labels in general then you are throwing the baby out. No, I am not objecting to the labels themselves at all. I can go "Well my definitions of slave, bottom, and submissive are X, Y, and Z and this is how I categorize people." Now if I were to take my definitions and try and force them on other people and say "Your not a slave, but a bottom because of this definition!" that would be flawed. Because they can go "Well I am a slave because of this definition!" Hence the difference between someone going "I am a Pro Domme because of X, Y, and Z" and me going "No, your just a whore!" Our brains sort things into categories for OUR OWN definitions, but to think that these categories apply universally to others outside of our own brains is a flawed premise. Like saying, "Well, hate mongers arent really Christians" Well the hate mongers will say "Well your not really Christians because you dont agree with our views!"

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