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[Poll]

Gas prices

I've cut back already

54% (40)

I won't cut back even if it's $10.00 a gallon lol

6% (5)

$4.00 a gallon is when I slow down

1% (1)

$5.00 a gallon is when I slow down

2% (2)

I need a @#$%! bicycle

10% (8)

I need a rickshaw pulled by a subbie

24% (18)

Total Votes : 74

(last vote on : 2/21/2008 4:19:52 PM)
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RE: Gas prices - 5/23/2007 6:19:47 PM

TheHeretic

Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

Rich:
As I am sure you are aware the internal combustion engine is just not that complicated of a device. Since he has taken it to the experts who know that the first thing you do is pull the plugs and see what kind of fire is in the combustion chamber,,,rich, lean or somewhere in between. If the plugs read "correct mixture" there is nothing wrong with the engine. Consequently it would have no problem passing smog here in California. If brake wear and chassis mounted bearing wear is normal this would limit the problem to optimistic ink on the widow sticker, which has been documented to exist in abundance.
thompson

Or my other possible diagnosis, a loose nut behind the wheel. It's truly amazing how often that is the underlying problem.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

(in reply to thompsonx)

Post #: 121

RE: Gas prices - 5/23/2007 6:27:39 PM

TheHeretic

Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy

True.

Dont quit your day job. I do this sort of thing professionally.

Me too. And I wouldn't worry about following you.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

(in reply to Sinergy)

Post #: 122

RE: Gas prices - 5/23/2007 6:37:15 PM

TheHeretic

Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy
If I go the retrofit route, I will probably get an 80s deisel car (like a Rabbit or a Mercedes) and have it converted to run vegetable oil. Keep a few 5 gallon cans from Costco in the trunk for long drives.

       Conversion for vegetable oil basically involves the addition of heated fuel lines, no big deal. Diesel electric is a whole different issue.

     Honda has announced they have developed a new generation of diesel engines which will meet CA standards for passenger vehicles and light trucks. Since I pretty much need to own a pick-up, I'm hoping to keep my Soob going until I can get one of those in a Ridgeline.

    You really can't beat the mileage of a diesel if you drive long highway trips, but for stop and go, around town, a hybrid will be your best bet. Also look into CNG if you are thinking propane. You can have a device to fill your car set up at your home and never visit a gas station again.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

(in reply to Sinergy)

Post #: 123

RE: Gas prices - 5/23/2007 6:49:53 PM

farglebargle

Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline

And diesel engines are simpler. I tend to, not being an Apocalyptic Evangelical, think past the Rapture. If we're not going to go back to clean, efficient, Public transportation ( and the Co-incidence of the Death of American Values with the Death of Trolley Network is a whole other topic.... ) then we really need to ( and I believe the auto manufacturers are on the ball with this, btw ) really re-work our basic assumptions about how cars are put together.

I favor either the fuel-cell/off-grid generator combination, or a simple, clean diesel-electric.

I *prefer* the fuel-cell, because you just put in electricity, and we *COULD HAVE* all of that we would ever need, for less than the war in iraq has cost TO DATE.

But hey, Exxon-Mobil call the tune, so we're always going to be paying at the pump. That means diesel.

Sorta like the problems with the Recording Distribution industry. Technology has made them to a very great deal obsolete, but they ain't going to let go, and the Feds have the States so pussy-whipped, it's not going to change.

Damn Hamiltonians.

_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to TheHeretic)

Post #: 124

RE: Gas prices - 5/23/2007 8:02:20 PM

thompsonx

Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Archer

Rise of a Stock value goes onto the company's ballance sheet. and thus is recorded as profit.

And yes I do believe the savings on embedded taxes would be passed on to the consummer.
Competition would end up making it nessisary the first time a company decided to try to snag another .05 market share from it's compeditors they would drop their price and the rest would have to follow suit or lose market share.

ROFLMAO
thompson

(in reply to Archer)

Post #: 125

RE: Gas prices - 5/23/2007 8:20:57 PM

thompsonx

Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy
If I go the retrofit route, I will probably get an 80s deisel car (like a Rabbit or a Mercedes) and have it converted to run vegetable oil. Keep a few 5 gallon cans from Costco in the trunk for long drives.

      Conversion for vegetable oil basically involves the addition of heated fuel lines, no big deal. Diesel electric is a whole different issue.

    Honda has announced they have developed a new generation of diesel engines which will meet CA standards for passenger vehicles and light trucks. Since I pretty much need to own a pick-up, I'm hoping to keep my Soob going until I can get one of those in a Ridgeline.

   You really can't beat the mileage of a diesel if you drive long highway trips, but for stop and go, around town, a hybrid will be your best bet. Also look into CNG if you are thinking propane. You can have a device to fill your car set up at your home and never visit a gas station again.

Rich:
The link I left for Sinergy explains the problems involved in running veggie oil in a diesel.
My preference is for propane..it is 105 octane no matter where you buy it and it will store indefinitely. It pushes my forty year old pick up down the road at 20 mpg and somewhat better on the highway...that old 318 dynod at a skosh over 400 hp and 350 ft pounds of torque at 2200 rpm...propane is 44 degrees below zero so it is not easy on your lips if you try to siphon it out. Oh yes and best of all what comes out of the tail pipe is cleaner than what went in the intake and it is only $1.55 per gallon.
thompson

(in reply to TheHeretic)

Post #: 126

RE: Gas prices - 5/23/2007 9:33:28 PM

TheHeretic

Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
My preference is for propane..it is 105 octane no matter where you buy it and it will store indefinitely. It pushes my forty year old pick up down the road at 20 mpg and somewhat better on the highway...that old 318 dynod at a skosh over 400 hp and 350 ft pounds of torque at 2200 rpm...propane is 44 degrees below zero so it is not easy on your lips if you try to siphon it out. Oh yes and best of all what comes out of the tail pipe is cleaner than what went in the intake and it is only $1.55 per gallon.
thompson

I'm curious how you handle cooling it (and yourself) out in your neck of the woods. All the propane engines I've dealt with ran hot. Can you drive it when that big-ass thermometer beside the freeway is lit to the top?

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

(in reply to thompsonx)

Post #: 127

RE: Gas prices - 5/23/2007 10:04:45 PM

Archer

Posts: 3207
Joined: 3/11/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

you make 10% per year on profits from dividends, the corp writes that off as a payout.

And the "payout" gets recorded on the individual shareholder's income taxes.

(in reply to Real0ne)

Post #: 128

RE: Gas prices - 5/23/2007 10:56:03 PM

thompsonx

Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
My preference is for propane..it is 105 octane no matter where you buy it and it will store indefinitely. It pushes my forty year old pick up down the road at 20 mpg and somewhat better on the highway...that old 318 dynod at a skosh over 400 hp and 350 ft pounds of torque at 2200 rpm...propane is 44 degrees below zero so it is not easy on your lips if you try to siphon it out. Oh yes and best of all what comes out of the tail pipe is cleaner than what went in the intake and it is only $1.55 per gallon.
thompson

I'm curious how you handle cooling it (and yourself) out in your neck of the woods. All the propane engines I've dealt with ran hot. Can you drive it when that big-ass thermometer beside the freeway is lit to the top?

Rich:
You are absolutely right. The reason is, that most propane conversions are nothing more than putting a propane carburetor on the vehicle and propane fuel tank and drive. The results are an engine that gets poor fuel economy and wont have enough power to pull the slack out of your suspenders.
What we are dealing with here is a fuel that is 105 octane. Gasoline is about 87 octane and runs about 8:1 compression so that the fuel does not pre- ignite. That is not a problem with the high octane propane. So we just go back to muscle car mentality. Crank the compression up to about 12:1 go a couple of heat ranges cooler on the plugs get thicker spark plug wires and a distributor that you can change the advance curve on like an MSD or a Mallory. Change the cam to deal with the higher octane fuel.
Open the heads up so they will flow and put in some big valves to get the fuel in the hole quicker. Don't forget to replace the iron exhaust manifolds with tuned headers and some free flowing mufflers. I always have about a ton of crap in my pick up so I need torque so I went with a cam that puts the torque at the low end of the RPM range. With all that extra power from the engine you no longer need those short gears in the rear end so change the ring gear down into the 3. something range. Swap out the box for an overdrive transmission and put a gear vendors in and out overdrive behind that. Add to that tires that have the largest circumference.
For cooling I use a two core standard radiator with a pair of electric fans that are controlled by a thermo-switch. Seventy mph at a tad under 2200 RPM in double overdrive. The temp gage hangs steady at 180 no matter what that pole in Baker says
thompson

(in reply to TheHeretic)

Post #: 129

RE: Gas prices - 5/24/2007 10:56:56 AM

petdave

Posts: 2479
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
What we are dealing with here is a fuel that is 105 octane. Gasoline is about 87 octane and runs about 8:1 compression so that the fuel does not pre- ignite. That is not a problem with the high octane propane. So we just go back to muscle car mentality. Crank the compression up to about 12:1 go a couple of heat ranges cooler on the plugs get thicker spark plug wires and a distributor that you can change the advance curve on like an MSD or a Mallory. Change the cam to deal with the higher octane fuel.
Open the heads up so they will flow and put in some big valves to get the fuel in the hole quicker. Don't forget to replace the iron exhaust manifolds with tuned headers and some free flowing mufflers. I always have about a ton of crap in my pick up so I need torque so I went with a cam that puts the torque at the low end of the RPM range. With all that extra power from the engine you no longer need those short gears in the rear end so change the ring gear down into the 3. something range. Swap out the box for an overdrive transmission and put a gear vendors in and out overdrive behind that. Add to that tires that have the largest circumference.
For cooling I use a two core standard radiator with a pair of electric fans that are controlled by a thermo-switch. Seventy mph at a tad under 2200 RPM in double overdrive. The temp gage hangs steady at 180 no matter what that pole in Baker says
thompson

Geez, until i saw the reference to Baker i thought you were an Aussie... don't see many propane conversions in the States. Interesting tech... might bear further investigation. What kind of range do you get with that? Ever have it dyno'd?

The problem with electric and IC/electric conversions continues to be batteries. Lifespans. Heavy metals (mining, disposal, shortage). Energy density. Crashworthiness. There's no free lunch.

(in reply to thompsonx)

Post #: 130

RE: Gas prices - 5/24/2007 4:24:19 PM

thompsonx

Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: petdave

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
What we are dealing with here is a fuel that is 105 octane. Gasoline is about 87 octane and runs about 8:1 compression so that the fuel does not pre- ignite. That is not a problem with the high octane propane. So we just go back to muscle car mentality. Crank the compression up to about 12:1 go a couple of heat ranges cooler on the plugs get thicker spark plug wires and a distributor that you can change the advance curve on like an MSD or a Mallory. Change the cam to deal with the higher octane fuel.
Open the heads up so they will flow and put in some big valves to get the fuel in the hole quicker. Don't forget to replace the iron exhaust manifolds with tuned headers and some free flowing mufflers. I always have about a ton of crap in my pick up so I need torque so I went with a cam that puts the torque at the low end of the RPM range. With all that extra power from the engine you no longer need those short gears in the rear end so change the ring gear down into the 3. something range. Swap out the box for an overdrive transmission and put a gear vendors in and out overdrive behind that. Add to that tires that have the largest circumference.
For cooling I use a two core standard radiator with a pair of electric fans that are controlled by a thermo-switch. Seventy mph at a tad under 2200 RPM in double overdrive. The temp gage hangs steady at 180 no matter what that pole in Baker says
thompson

Geez, until i saw the reference to Baker i thought you were an Aussie... don't see many propane conversions in the States. Interesting tech... might bear further investigation. What kind of range do you get with that? Ever have it dyno'd?

The problem with electric and IC/electric conversions continues to be batteries. Lifespans. Heavy metals (mining, disposal, shortage). Energy density. Crashworthiness. There's no free lunch.

petdave:
Yes it dyno'd at a bit over 400 hp and torque was 350 at 2200 rpm. The fuel capacity is 50 gallons so my range is about 1000 city and 1500 highway with about one ton of cargo.The pick up weighs about 6000 pounds empty. the reason it is so heavy is that it has a hydraulic lift gate and ultra heavy duty spring pac and a pretty serious front bumper. Oh yes it is two wheel drive.
thompson

(in reply to petdave)

Post #: 131

RE: Gas prices - 2/17/2008 6:37:43 PM

Sinergy

Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline

I finally got sick of feeding that stupid Honda that got 22 mpg, and with my upcoming surgery I wont be able
to drive a manual transmission, so I bought a Toyota Yaris with AC, an automatic, and satellite radio.

It is small. It is funky. It has more room inside than my stupid Honda had.

I put 10.8 gallons of gas in it today. On the 10.8 gallons I used, I drove 383 miles.

Life is good.

LowCarbonFootprintergy.

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle

(in reply to Sinergy)

Post #: 132

RE: Gas prices - 2/17/2008 9:44:41 PM

CuriousLord

Posts: 3911
Joined: 4/3/2007
Status: offline

My little brother burns about $220 in gas per month. I kid you not.

Or, did. I had a bit of a talk with him.. I hope he's taken it easy.

Personally, I burn about $5 in gas every two weeks, but that's because I live near where I study, work, eat, etc. So it's not exactly a fair comparison.

(in reply to Level)

Post #: 133

RE: Gas prices - 2/17/2008 9:46:31 PM

TheHeretic

Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline

Congrats on the new, more efficient ride, Sinergy. May it safely carry you and yours, and only break down on election day.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

(in reply to Sinergy)

Post #: 134

RE: Gas prices - 2/17/2008 9:49:26 PM

sweetnurseBBW

Posts: 2464
Joined: 1/26/2006
From: North Carolina
Status: offline

I live 45 miles from my place of work so I haven't cut down on gas. Unless I am willing to take a serious paycut and work for a less than grade hospital I will continue to drive 45 miles. There isn't much else around here to work at that is less than 30 miles.

_____________________________

Sir Pain's pain slut

(in reply to Level)

Post #: 135

RE: Gas prices - 2/18/2008 1:48:50 AM

SirRober

Posts: 364
Joined: 1/2/2006
Status: offline

screw the lib's in the u.s. I am going to live in a cave and create my own modifed humans as a super race.

(in reply to Sanity)

Post #: 136

RE: Gas prices - 2/18/2008 2:13:42 AM

Lordandmaster

Posts: 10943
Joined: 6/22/2004
Status: offline

Ah yes, those damned liberals...raising gas prices and spoiling the fun for all of us.

(in reply to SirRober)

Post #: 137

RE: Gas prices - 2/18/2008 3:44:03 AM

TheGorenSociety

Posts: 116
Joined: 2/13/2005
Status: offline

I apologize upfront this is going to be a long post. It is not meant to rant or rag on anyone. I currently have a small fleet of various makes n model of vehicles, of which I am in the process of scraping out the obsolete ones and converting most over to a diesel electric hybrid of my own design . I am halfway through the initial stages of converting a 1988 ford ranger xlt when I am done with it, my current estimates is 60- 90 mpg of bio diesel, that I currently make now for my one of my other vehicles. I mix a fuel additive into my fuel that has boosted my mileage with a 30 foot cargo trailer loaded to almost 30 mpg. I also make clean hydrogen and methane using sustainable processes and am currently building a larger new batch processor. I am not waiting for anyone else to do what I can do with my own two hands. If and when a economical fuel cell, that is affordable comes into serious production, I will convert further my current vehicles. Everyday for me is adventure, I on the side convert a vehicle every 60 days by myself. Slow but so far it has been very rewarding. Have a great day and live long. Battery technology in the near future will make driving electrics a better option to driving even hybrids. The big three have lost the battle to stop it. There is a growing grass roots movement now in place. We are gaining ground everyday the market place is steadily showing what America and the world wants. This time the powers that be cannot stop the global changes taking place. There are too many with the knowledge to make it happen. The price for oil and other energy related commodities will only go higher, too much pressure by other growing economies and the Arabs believe that oil should be at a price as high or higher then a ounce of gold is currently at. Just look at all of the refineries in the USA and the fact not one new has been built in over 20 years and increasingly more and more of the ones that are in operation go down due to a aging infrastructure.I know a few people who work in those industries. They said that the oil companies are not going to spend money on capital expenditures that has diminishing returns, increasing liabilities. They have learned that they can make just as much money or more by reducing capacity and increasing the demand with out losing one percent of their market.FYI most of the large solar manufacturing companies are owned by big oil and Arabs.

(in reply to Lordandmaster)

Post #: 138

RE: Gas prices - 2/18/2008 8:33:54 AM

thompsonx

Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheGorenSociety

Just look at all of the refineries in the USA and the fact not one new has been built in over 20 years and increasingly more and more of the ones that are in operation go down due to a aging infrastructur.

http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=3792

This cite by the Cato foundation explaines why there are no new refineries being built.
http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/bus/stories/121107dnbusrefinery.2894c91.html
This one cites an addition to an existing refinery and it will be the largest in the U.S.

I know a few people who work in those industries. They said that the oil companies are not going to spend money on capital expenditures that has diminishing returns, increasing liabilities. They have learned that they can make just as much money or more by reducing capacity and increasing the demand with out losing one percent of their market.FYI most of the large solar manufacturing companies are owned by big oil and Arabs.

(in reply to TheGorenSociety)

Post #: 139

RE: Gas prices - 2/18/2008 8:44:45 AM

LaTigresse

Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline

I haven't been able to get my most gas efficient vehicle out of the lane in about a month. We've mostly been driving the 2002 Prism, okay on gas but not great. It's got 226,000 miles on it and is showing it's age.

Unfortunately, especially for my pocket book, there have been many many days like today when the 4wheel drive Dodge Ram is the only thing that has a chance of getting out. I stopped and put $53.69 in gas this morning. It will probably get me through two days of driving to work out of the 5 this week. Ohhhh, how I wish I could work from home.....

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to Sinergy)

Post #: 140

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